Second Class citizens??

[bobpell]

Watching unmasked jam packed , boisterous sports fans yesterday in Edmonton and Toronto I began to ponder the restrictions placed on Canadian cruisers both going and coming back from something they love.

Doing time sensitive tests spiking stress levels while beer swilling strangers packed cheek to jowl makes me wonder why I have to show my vaccination status, my negative test results while other just jump into their cars or board crowded subway cars to return to their homes.

Consistency has left the building!!

I muse

Bob 

[RickT]

While I agree there are inconsistencies, I’m one of the people that is questioning how quickly restrictions are being dropped.  While I agree it’s a PITA at this point I’d rather have everyone on my flight tested and wearing masks.  Given what we’ve been through I’d prefer to play it safe until we see what happens in other countries that remove restrictions.

[gmbhardy]

Totally agree with the OP. I sent an email to Health Canada asking for the data that supports leaving cruising at the level four travel advisory (do not cruise). No reply so far. I’ve been on three cruises over the past couple months and the only time I felt unsafe was standing in a crammed line at Pearson waiting for an unnecessary COVID test. 

[ShopperfiendTO]

Using the term "Second class citizens" is a bit hyperbolic, describing people who can afford the time and money to travel and go on luxury cruises outside of the country...

 

Masks are required to be worn on subways in Toronto.

[waiting2retire]

I am surprised at the unmasked fans in Toronto. Why no masks unless it was outdoors where technically they are not required?  Still should be worn in outdoor crowds IMO, but I realize that is an unpopular opinion at this point. 
 

I agree that the testing on return to Canada is outdated and useless now. It may have been thought to be helpful in the beginning of Omicron to try to keep it out of the country, but obviously didn’t work. The only reason I can think arrival testing is alive and well is that the government has already paid for the testing contract and doesn’t want to appear wasteful. Hopefully the arrival testing will disappear soon. 

[broberts]

Traveling while contagious is always wrong, be it flu, ebola, meningitis, COVID or a host of other highly infectious diseases. The difficulty with COVID is that one can be infectious and not have any symptoms. Hence the need for testing.

 

The argument that Joey gets to do it never worked with my parents. Probably doesn't work for most of our kids and grandkids.

 

[ceilidh1]

18 minutes ago, broberts said:

Traveling while contagious is always wrong, be it flu, ebola, meningitis, COVID or a host of other highly infectious diseases. The difficulty with COVID is that one can be infectious and not have any symptoms. Hence the need for testing.

 

The argument that Joey gets to do it never worked with my parents. Probably doesn't work for most of our kids and grandkids.

 

I find this an interesting discussion and wish I had the medical knowledge to truly understand the reasoning behind it. I just returned from a cruise out of Miami. I had to take an antigen test to enter the states. Two days later, another antigen test to board the ship. Three days later, I took a PCR test to return to Canada. On arrival at Toronto I was randomly selected for another antigen test. In the space of 8 days, I have received four tests (ironic seeing as in BC we can't even get a test if we are actually sick...) The first three were obviously negative and I got the results right away. The arrival test results are "delayed" - I was able to carry on with my connecting flight to Vancouver and told to just continue with life as normal and the results should be emailed within 5 days. Well, if the results ARE positive, how many could have been infected in that time. I just don't see the logic? On the other "illogical" side - my travel buddy had Covid in December and was one of the last in BC to actually get PCR tested. Since she had her positive test result from then, she didn't need testing to get back into Canada - but we have seen many, many instances of reinfection so I don't see how that makes sense either>

 

To clarify, I am more than willing to follow rules and do whatever it takes to actually travel. If testing is required, so be it. I don't mind masks (been wearing them for work since day one - no work from home for my line of work) and I've been triple vaxxed. BUT, I would like to "understand" the purpose of some of the rules....

[broberts]

1 hour ago, ceilidh1 said:

I find this an interesting discussion and wish I had the medical knowledge to truly understand the reasoning behind it. I just returned from a cruise out of Miami. I had to take an antigen test to enter the states. Two days later, another antigen test to board the ship. Three days later, I took a PCR test to return to Canada. On arrival at Toronto I was randomly selected for another antigen test. In the space of 8 days, I have received four tests (ironic seeing as in BC we can't even get a test if we are actually sick...) The first three were obviously negative and I got the results right away. The arrival test results are "delayed" - I was able to carry on with my connecting flight to Vancouver and told to just continue with life as normal and the results should be emailed within 5 days. Well, if the results ARE positive, how many could have been infected in that time. I just don't see the logic? On the other "illogical" side - my travel buddy had Covid in December and was one of the last in BC to actually get PCR tested. Since she had her positive test result from then, she didn't need testing to get back into Canada - but we have seen many, many instances of reinfection so I don't see how that makes sense either>

 

To clarify, I am more than willing to follow rules and do whatever it takes to actually travel. If testing is required, so be it. I don't mind masks (been wearing them for work since day one - no work from home for my line of work) and I've been triple vaxxed. BUT, I would like to "understand" the purpose of some of the rules....

 

The logic behind arrival testing is political and to enable variant tracking. It certainly doesn't do much to mitigate spread. 

 

Those that have had COVID can test positive on subsequent PCR tests. I assume this is why an older positive test is acceptable. Now that antigen tests are acceptable I wonder if that exception will be removed.

 

As to the number of tests required, that is a known cost of leisure travel. The ship does not want to accept infected people. Nor do commercial air carriers. Nor do the governments of Canada and the US.

[gmbhardy]

2 hours ago, ceilidh1 said:

I find this an interesting discussion and wish I had the medical knowledge to truly understand the reasoning behind it. I just returned from a cruise out of Miami. I had to take an antigen test to enter the states. Two days later, another antigen test to board the ship. Three days later, I took a PCR test to return to Canada. On arrival at Toronto I was randomly selected for another antigen test. In the space of 8 days, I have received four tests (ironic seeing as in BC we can't even get a test if we are actually sick...) The first three were obviously negative and I got the results right away. The arrival test results are "delayed" - I was able to carry on with my connecting flight to Vancouver and told to just continue with life as normal and the results should be emailed within 5 days. Well, if the results ARE positive, how many could have been infected in that time. I just don't see the logic? On the other "illogical" side - my travel buddy had Covid in December and was one of the last in BC to actually get PCR tested. Since she had her positive test result from then, she didn't need testing to get back into Canada - but we have seen many, many instances of reinfection so I don't see how that makes sense either>

 

To clarify, I am more than willing to follow rules and do whatever it takes to actually travel. If testing is required, so be it. I don't mind masks (been wearing them for work since day one - no work from home for my line of work) and I've been triple vaxxed. BUT, I would like to "understand" the purpose of some of the rules....

Totally agree.

[bobpell]

I too have been wearing a mask since day one

I plan to wear a mask when indoors at an airport , on a plane and on a cruise

Why are televised sports fans indoors at a hockey game or a basketball game allowed to stand, cheer and give high fives to strangers in the next seat? are they tested to get in the building? NO Why are we tested multiple times between our homes and our cabins on a ship?

double standard

Bob

[broberts]

28 minutes ago, bobpell said:

I too have been wearing a mask since day one

I plan to wear a mask when indoors at an airport , on a plane and on a cruise

Why are televised sports fans indoors at a hockey game or a basketball game allowed to stand, cheer and give high fives to strangers in the next seat? are they tested to get in the building? NO Why are we tested multiple times between our homes and our cabins on a ship?

double standard

Bob

 

Because a 7 night cruise and 3 hour ball game are identical situations. 🙄

 

Please! So many spoiled children.

 

I don't agree with relaxing the rules for sporting & other spectator events and suspect that like the last time our hospitals will start to fill again. But moaning about fairness is pointless. 

[DirtyDawg]

1 hour ago, broberts said:

 

Because a 7 night cruise and 3 hour ball game are identical situations. 🙄

 

Please! So many spoiled children.

 

I don't agree with relaxing the rules for sporting & other spectator events and suspect that like the last time our hospitals will start to fill again. But moaning about fairness is pointless. 

Didn't we all learn life was not fair when we found out Santa was a fiction and the bad kids didn't get a lump of coal for Christmas? Far from it, lots of those kids got the better bike!

 

Oops, I hope I didn't spoil the Santa thing for some of my fellow CCer's. 🤫

 

 

 

 

[*Miss G*]

2 hours ago, DirtyDawg said:

Didn't we all learn life was not fair when we found out Santa was a fiction and the bad kids didn't get a lump of coal for Christmas? Far from it, lots of those kids got the better bike!

 

Oops, I hope I didn't spoil the Santa thing for some of my fellow CCer's. 🤫

 

 

 

 

 

I was over at my friend’s house one night when his small daughter came to tell him that Santa wasn’t real.  So he was consoling her saying “You’re right, honey.  Santa isn’t real.  Just like the Easter Bunny.”  All of a sudden she burst into tears crying “I still believed in the Easter Bunny!!” and went running off bawling her eyes out.  😂

[cmich068]

I think the rest of the world has decided to live with COVID and Canada has to be brought kicking and screaming into the new global reality. At this point in time, our testing and quarantine requirements for travel are out of step with our peer countries globally AND nearly all provincial and territorial health policies. It's not March 2020 anymore. We have vaccines and we have therapeutics. 

[broberts]

3 hours ago, cmich068 said:

I think the rest of the world has decided to live with COVID and Canada has to be brought kicking and screaming into the new global reality. At this point in time, our testing and quarantine requirements for travel are out of step with our peer countries globally AND nearly all provincial and territorial health policies. It's not March 2020 anymore. We have vaccines and we have therapeutics. 

 

If we want to affordably live with COVID, vaccinations will have to be mandated for anyone physically able to be inoculated. Otherwise the ongoing healthcare costs with periodic outbreaks may become intolerable.