Tipping tour guides in NZ and AUS

[NSWP]

More than a few restaurants in Sydney have provision for a tip/gratuity on the bill.

Even down here in Batemans Bay at more upmarket eateries and many more have ye olde tip jar on the counter, even the local bakery/cafes.

[Cruisers47]

32 minutes ago, Port Power said:

 

On ships, it is the American social norm as staff are poorly paid.  I am sorry you are pressured to tip on land in Australia, but unfortunately it is only because visiting Americans have previously tipped.  Some providers are simply greedy!  Australian prices are dearer because proper wages and taxation are included in the retail price.

I have tried to tell my husband that we pay the gratuities in our fares as that is Australian law.  Americans can actually reduce their gratuities at the guest services.   I have actually heard Americans doing this!   We can’t do this.   
 

the problem with men who used to have companies who paid for their tips find it hard when wife’s tried to limit costs!!  Ha ha

 

Eileen

[RobinBancs]

2 hours ago, BRANDEE said:

We were made to feel uncomfortable for not tipping.  We were told a few times at some restaurants that tips should be left as cash, not put on the charge card.  One taxi driver told us it wasn't true that they do not accept tips.  He would appreciate it in cash.  This happened more in Sydney since we spent a week there.  Of course, on our cruise part of the vacation, we were charged tips daily automatically.. All of our OBC was converted into AUD dollars one for one, but tips were charged as US dollars...that was Princess' policy..not Australia or NZ.

The truth here is that the service provider was trying to exploit you by making you feel guilty for not providing a tip.  They've learned that they can get away with it so they do.  Don't let them bluff you or make you feel uncomfortable when they are trying to exploit you.

[Aus Traveller]

41 minutes ago, Cruisers47 said:

I have tried to tell my husband that we pay the gratuities in our fares as that is Australian law.  Americans can actually reduce their gratuities at the guest services.   I have actually heard Americans doing this!   We can’t do this.   
 

the problem with men who used to have companies who paid for their tips find it hard when wife’s tried to limit costs!!  Ha ha

 

Eileen

Your comment that 'we pay the gratuities in our fares as that is Australian law' is not correct. This is proved by the timing of the introduction of GST (when this tax had to be included in the sales price) and the removal of auto-gratuities from Australian cruises. GST was introduced in July 2000 (when the 'sales tax' had to be included in the final price). The first cruise line to include gratuities in their fares was P&O Aust in 2008, followed by Princess on 1st May 2009. RCL followed later, but not all cruises out of Australia have the tips included in the fare.

[Port Power]

1 hour ago, NSWP said:

More than a few restaurants in Sydney have provision for a tip/gratuity on the bill.

Even down here in Batemans Bay at more upmarket eateries and many more have ye olde tip jar on the counter, even the local bakery/cafes.

That doesn’t make it right.  It is just learned behaviour from visiting Americans.  It is avarice and greed hoping for free, untaxed money. 

[Cruisers47]

1 hour ago, Aus Traveller said:

Your comment that 'we pay the gratuities in our fares as that is Australian law' is not correct. This is proved by the timing of the introduction of GST (when this tax had to be included in the sales price) and the removal of auto-gratuities from Australian cruises. GST was introduced in July 2000 (when the 'sales tax' had to be included in the final price). The first cruise line to include gratuities in their fares was P&O Aust in 2008, followed by Princess on 1st May 2009. RCL followed later, but not all cruises out of Australia have the tips included in the fare.

Which cruise lines do not include gratuities when the cruise is booked in Australia?

[Gwendy]

5 hours ago, BRANDEE said:

We were made to feel uncomfortable for not tipping.  We were told a few times at some restaurants that tips should be left as cash, not put on the charge card.  One taxi driver told us it wasn't true that they do not accept tips.  He would appreciate it in cash.  This happened more in Sydney since we spent a week there.  Of course, on our cruise part of the vacation, we were charged tips daily automatically.. All of our OBC was converted into AUD dollars one for one, but tips were charged as US dollars...that was Princess' policy..not Australia or NZ.

Talk about uncomfortable.  Years ago as Aussies we did a day trip around LA.  Before the bus even left, our guide announced.  There are some Aussies on board, we tip at least 10% here, don’t forget that.  We always follow local conventions wherever we are but to have it pointed out in this way was in my opinion plain rude.

[onlyslightlymad]

18 hours ago, Bubbeh said:

 Just out of interest, was part of the tour cost refunded based on how good it was?  Or, was the 'whip around' a way of shaming people into contributing?

I would hate it if they did that.  I wouldn't want to hand over a 'tip' and would be really angry to be backed into a corner like that.

[buchhalm]

I have to roll my eyes about comments that tipping (entirely damn VOLUNTARY!!!) is "evil" and not right for the reason that some people who work in certain industries should get a bit of "untaxed" money. That seems sour grapes to me....

That sort of people probably ask if the garage sale down the road is paying tax.

(Cue the haters....)

[lyndarra]

9 hours ago, Cruisers47 said:

Which cruise lines do not include gratuities when the cruise is booked in Australia?

Holland America and Celebrity are two. I can't recall if it was included for RCI.

[buchhalm]

9 minutes ago, lyndarra said:

Holland America and Celebrity are two. I can't recall if it was included for RCI.

Definately not so.

My upcoming celebrity cruise, booked and paid for in Australia,  include tips, drinks, Wi-Fi 

[Galesa]

Gosh this is a divisive subject.

 

Had a very ordinary meal in a "pub" in Zurich once. Unsurprisingly it was expensive. At the bottom of the bill was a space for including a tip. Your kidding right? The server is probably earning more than me!

 

About to do a tour to Finland and the instructions are to tip guides and drivers at E6 per day. Locals advise however that Finnish workers are well paid and to please not tip!

 

I share concerns from "non-tipping" countries about "tipping creep", where a voluntary process to reward exceptional service has been replaced by an obligation to tip regardless, as seems to be the case, in my experience, in North America.

[nnps]

11 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

Your comment that 'we pay the gratuities in our fares as that is Australian law' is not correct. This is proved by the timing of the introduction of GST (when this tax had to be included in the sales price) and the removal of auto-gratuities from Australian cruises. GST was introduced in July 2000 (when the 'sales tax' had to be included in the final price). The first cruise line to include gratuities in their fares was P&O Aust in 2008, followed by Princess on 1st May 2009. RCL followed later, but not all cruises out of Australia have the tips included in the fare.

While it may not be technically correct, in essence it is. the ACCC advises that businesses must "

• Businesses must display a total price that includes taxes, duties and all unavoidable or pre-selected extra fees." The price you pay is the complete and final price. Anything else is optional. Yes this did start back when GST was introduced, to stop the practice of adding "extras" such as GST, taxes, fees. From what I can read of the law, it is unequivocal, the final total at the bottom of the invoice is what you have to pay. All the rest is voluntary. I have had "gratuities" (God I hate that word) put onto my bill and had them removed at the desk with no issue on princess in Japan and NCL in Europe. Gratuities as they are now structured are simply a way of the cruise line paying their staff  by covert means. (I also have issues with the number of cruises I see advertised in the U.S. where gratuities are included in the fare as an incentive.. they're going to pay the staff the gratuities themselves? really?) To me the whole issue is smoke and mirrors.

[GUT2407]

I can only imagine the angst of shopping, going out etc, on a budget in some parts of USA. And come time to pay my carefully calculated spend is blown but state taxes, plus tips.

 

I have been in the position where a calculator was a shopping tool, or a visit to Pizza Hut for one of the kids birthdays was preceded by “only one Pizza and jug of drink between us”. But imagine then discovering that my carefully calculated sales tax and tip were out, by even just a couple of cents.

 

Even worse is who to tip, you must tip a barista but don’t tip at a McDonalds. Why?

 

Tip a hairdresser but not your mechanic.

[Cruisers47]

2 hours ago, lyndarra said:

Holland America and Celebrity are two. I can't recall if it was included for RCI.

I have booked several cruises on Celebrity and RCL IN Australia with Australian online booking sites.   All taxes and gratuities haven  always been included.   These cruises have been in Australia and overseas.   I again say I think that it is mandatory in OZ.   
 

 

[nnps]

11 minutes ago, GUT2407 said:

I can only imagine the angst of shopping, going out etc, on a budget in some parts of USA. And come time to pay my carefully calculated spend is blown but state taxes, plus tips.

 

I have been in the position where a calculator was a shopping tool, or a visit to Pizza Hut for one of the kids birthdays was preceded by “only one Pizza and jug of drink between us”. But imagine then discovering that my carefully calculated sales tax and tip were out, by even just a couple of cents.

 

Even worse is who to tip, you must tip a barista but don’t tip at a McDonalds. Why?

 

Tip a hairdresser but not your mechanic.

Or your teacher. (I'm a retired teacher).

[Bubbeh]

5 hours ago, onlyslightlymad said:

I wouldn't want to hand over a 'tip' and would be really angry to be backed into a corner like that.

I'd stand my ground too but, if he thought I wouldn't notice, Mr Bubbeh would cave as he's a nice bloke but I'm a hard woman.  😉

[buchhalm]

1 hour ago, nnps said:

Or your teacher. (I'm a retired teacher).

But you get chocolates, mugs, scented candles, bath bombs and handmade cards instead.

🙂

[Aus Traveller]

12 hours ago, Cruisers47 said:

Which cruise lines do not include gratuities when the cruise is booked in Australia?

I believe Holland America still charge gratuities separately from the cruise fare.

 

For interest, in 2016 Royal Caribbean followed the gratuities-included model used by P&O and Princess. The dates that these companies changed to this system proves that it was NOT because of Australian law requiring fees and taxes be included in the advertised price. All these cruise lines announced that it was because tipping is not usual (or popular) in Australia. If they had to include the gratuities, they would have done so from 2000 (or when their ships started cruising out of Australia).

 

The law in Australia requiring that fees and taxes are included means that the cruiselines cannot advertise a price, then add port fees and taxes later. I think it is likely they don't have to include gratuities in the final price because these can be regarded as optional. Because Aussies didn't like the extra tipping (and often removed the gratuities), the companies found it better to charge everyone by including it in the fares. The end result is the same, but I feel it is important to understand why gratuities are included in the fares.🙂

[buchhalm]

1 minute ago, Aus Traveller said:

I believe Holland America still charge gratuities separately from the cruise fare.

 

For interest, in 2016 Royal Caribbean followed the gratuities-included model used by P&O and Princess. The dates that these companies changed to this system proves that it was NOT because of Australian law requiring fees and taxes be included in the advertised price. All these cruise lines announced that it was because tipping is not usual (or popular) in Australia. If they had to include the gratuities, they would have done so from 2000 (or when their ships started cruising out of Australia).

 

The law in Australia requiring that fees and taxes are included means that the cruiselines cannot advertise a price, then add port fees and taxes later. I think it is likely they don't have to include gratuities in the final price because these can be regarded as optional. Because Aussies didn't like the extra tipping (and often removed the gratuities), the companies found it better to charge everyone by including it in the fares. The end result is the same, but I feel it is important to understand why gratuities are included in the fares.🙂

That last paragraph sums it up nicely.

In the case of Australian cruise prices, the "voluntary" gratuity is built into the fare. So we have no say in it, and can't remove it. Nothing "voluntary " about it then.

I highly doubt that anybody would even TRY to get this taken off the price....

 

[Aus Traveller]

2 minutes ago, buchhalm said:

That last paragraph sums it up nicely.

In the case of Australian cruise prices, the "voluntary" gratuity is built into the fare. So we have no say in it, and can't remove it. Nothing "voluntary " about it then.

I highly doubt that anybody would even TRY to get this taken off the price....

 

Agreed. When the gratuities are included in the fare, it is no longer voluntary. Several years ago we booked a Celebrity cruise. At the time, gratuities were additional, but we were told that because we are Aussies booking in Australia, we had to pay the gratuities at the time we paid the fare.

 

I do agree with a comment Les (NSWP) has sometimes made - gratuities are an automatic wage subsidy.

[boeckli]

31 minutes ago, Aus Traveller said:

I believe Holland America still charge gratuities separately from the cruise fare.

 

Correct, in US$ - with the option to pre-pay,  in A$ (at a very favourable exchange rate).

[arxcards]

18 hours ago, Gwendy said:

Talk about uncomfortable.  Years ago as Aussies we did a day trip around LA.  Before the bus even left, our guide announced.  There are some Aussies on board, we tip at least 10% here, don’t forget that.  We always follow local conventions wherever we are but to have it pointed out in this way was in my opinion plain rude.

We were on a tour from Denali Princess Wilderness Lodge, and the driver did not shut up for the whole trip while narrating the tour to everyone over the mic, all about Aussies not leaving tips. After the tour, I told him I didn't want to disappoint him by leaving a tip, and his narrative was offensive, obnoxious and otherwise spoilt a great day in the national park. It is the only time I have never left an appropriate tip while travelling overseas.

 

I sense that anyone speaking with an American accent while travelling in our capital cities or major tourist towns results in a heightened  sense of anticipation of some extra dollars - also noting a preference of cash tips so that it is not declared as income. 

[lyndarra]

Tips, or gratuities, as the ATO likes to call them, are definitely taxable, and need to be reported in personal tax returns. Whether tips are received directly from a customer or from the employer, you need to report all tips as taxable income. This means keeping manual records of the tips you earn, and reporting them when you do your tax return.

square.com

[Wombat706]

10 hours ago, buchhalm said:

Definately not so.

My upcoming celebrity cruise, booked and paid for in Australia,  include tips, drinks, Wi-Fi 

Cunard is another that does not include gratuities, booked in Aust in AUD.