Foods to avoided - to prevent illness

[ldubs]

14 hours ago, topnole said:

The reality is few really know what caused an illness.  One might think it was seafood that tasted odd when in reality it was a piece of lettuce that tasted normal.  Others might get one of many viruses (aka stomach bugs) that cause gastrointestinal illness, but attribute the sickness to something they ate.  It is almost always a guessing game and there can be a big lag between the cause and the consequences.  This makes it even harder to pin it down.  Typically it takes an outbreak of many people for them to know it was a certain food.  

 

I read or heard from some doc a long time ago that it generally takes food poisoning about 24 hours to "manifest" itself.  Same doc said folks who think they had stomach flu very likely could have had food poisoning.  For true food poisoning I would also think there would be many victims.  

 

Seems reasonable that individual tolerances are all over the board.  What might not sit well with one person would be fine for others.    

[topnole]

44 minutes ago, ldubs said:

 

I read or heard from some doc a long time ago that it generally takes food poisoning about 24 hours to "manifest" itself.  Same doc said folks who think they had stomach flu very likely could have had food poisoning.  For true food poisoning I would also think there would be many victims.  

 

Seems reasonable that individual tolerances are all over the board.  What might not sit well with one person would be fine for others.    

Correct.  And the ranges can vary.  So it could also take 48 hours+ for one to get sick while just 24 for another.   Plus, viruses and food poisoning symptoms can be identical.  
 

You could eat at a restaurant the night before your cruise and pick up a stomach bug or eat bad food and then later attribute it to something on the ship.  Or

eat or drink something in port and then attribute it to something you ate on the ship.  I suspect this is more common than it being caused from ship food.  
 

Reality is there are tons of false

attributions on this stuff.  Barring lab testing or obvious evidence such as everyone that ate something specific being ill (while others that didn’t aren’t),

you just don’t know.  
 

I was hospitalized many years ago for such an issue.  I remember the docs telling me the above info and the reality is they didn’t care what it was unless they started seeing many patients with the same issue.  Then they would notify the health department.  They checked me for appendicitis and beyond that they figured it was a virus or something I ate.  But treatment was the same either way and they don’t care to try to determine it.  I still don’t know what seemingly nearly killed me.  I have my suspicions,

but they are just that.   

[ldubs]

8 minutes ago, topnole said:

Correct.  And the ranges can vary.  So it could also take 48 hours+ for one to get sick while just 24 for another.   Plus, viruses and food poisoning symptoms can be identical.  
 

You could eat at a restaurant the night before your cruise and pick up a stomach bug or eat bad food and then later attribute it to something on the ship.  Or

eat or drink something in port and then attribute it to something you ate on the ship.  I suspect this is more common than it being caused from ship food.  
 

Reality is there are tons of false

attributions on this stuff.  Barring lab testing or obvious evidence such as everyone that ate something specific being ill (while others that didn’t aren’t),

you just don’t know.  
 

I was hospitalized many years ago for such an issue.  I remember the docs telling me the above info and the reality is they didn’t care what it was unless they started seeing many patients with the same issue.  Then they would notify the health department.  They checked me for appendicitis and beyond that they figured it was a virus or something I ate.  But treatment was the same either way and they don’t care to try to determine it.  I still don’t know what seemingly nearly killed me.  I have my suspicions,

but they are just that.   

 

I've had what the doc's say was food poisoning.   The focus was on the treatment as opposed to identifying the culprit.   

[donaldsc]

Fugu.  Look it up.

DON

[Mary229]

Mayo on the buffet, including salads with mayo.  Undercooked eggs, I like undercooked eggs but don’t risk it when away from home.  

[Joebucks]

On 4/15/2023 at 5:03 PM, SG65CB said:

I think the biggest risk is in the Windjammer, not a particular food. You use the same serving utensils as everyone else, then eat without washing your hands. This is not as big a risk now because they force everyone to wash their hands on the way in. But it still bothers me when someone uses a serving utensil and then places it in the tray of food with the handle touching the food. 

 

 

This is a busybody myth. You are many times more likely to get sick by cross contamination, undercooking, or other issues with the food source. 

[no1racefan1]

Orange juice. I actually think I had gotten a little seasick (my first cruise) but I associate the vomiting with the OJ, and now I just can't drink it.

 

We tend to avoid the buffet for all the previously mentioned reasons.

[navybankerteacher]

10 hours ago, ldubs said:

Okra is yucky!  😀

Everybody knows that.

[navybankerteacher]

3 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

This is a busybody myth. You are many times more likely to get sick by cross contamination, undercooking, or other issues with the food source. 

I think there is a greater likelihood of some unwashed yutz  of a passenger contaminating buffet food or utensils than the line serving contaminated or improperly prepared food..

[9tee2Sea]

Rare steak.  turns out, i can't tolerate it.  I can tolerate a well done ( no pink), but not rare.  

[mrgabriel]

I also think this is a completely self-evident question (if it looks or smells bad, don't eat it) but I wanted to add a couple of things.

 

- If a food makes you sick, truly sick, you need to have that checked out. I am allergic to a few foods (shellfish for one), and I have sensitivities to several others (can't eat carrots and dill at the same time). But those are all things that need to be diagnosed by a doctor ... if you're getting sick from food, especially really sick, that's a symptom of a bigger problem. 

 

- A food I now avoid in addition to everything else people have mentioned is fair foods. Someone very dear to me ate a sausage on a bun at a fair and wound up with food poisoning so severe that she almost died. If we eat fair food, it's absolutely well cooked and not sitting in a steam tray. 

[chengkp75]

On 4/15/2023 at 6:00 PM, Eli_6 said:

Caesar salad.  Anything that has something that could go bad (like Mayo) and has been sitting out too long on a buffet.

Here's the thing.  Anything on the buffet line has only been there for 4 hours, after which it must be discarded, even condiments.

[chengkp75]

On 4/15/2023 at 8:13 PM, resetjet said:

top # 1 answer on the board.....SUSHI.  Not only bacteria, but parasites,  Thats why all sushi sold in the USA must be frozen first, to kill all the parasites.  

And, all sushi on cruise ships sailing from the US has the same requirement.

[chengkp75]

18 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

This is a busybody myth. You are many times more likely to get sick by cross contamination, undercooking, or other issues with the food source. 

If this is a myth, why is noro so prevalent on cruise ships, as this is caused almost entirely by fecal/oral contamination, which is caused primarily by poor hand hygiene.

[sanger727]

Generally speaking, there's no way to know ahead of time if a food contains bacteria or has been contaminated by a virus. So, not sure where to really go with this question. I've had lettuce at my local kroger that was recalled for bacterial contamination.

 

What I avoid in general is any uncooked meat. I suspect there is more risk of contamination, plus since I don't eat I'm not sure it would sit well. I've never tried carpaccio because a family member has tried it a couple times at perfectly safe establishments and found it really disagreed with her system. 

 

We also were out for a day once after a family member ate and exceptionally spicy dish. We were in Asia and it was much spicier than we are used to. She likes spicy foods so decided to try it. She had an upset stomach for a couple days after that. 

 

 

[Toofarfromthesea]

18 hours ago, no1racefan1 said:

Orange juice. I actually think I had gotten a little seasick (my first cruise) but I associate the vomiting with the OJ, and now I just can't drink it.

 

We tend to avoid the buffet for all the previously mentioned reasons.

 

I had something similar happen to me years ago involving a college encounter with Southern Comfort.

[BAYA]

Shrimp cocktail in the MDR on a Celebrity ship. I was the only one in my party of 5 who had it at dinner. I felt better by the next night. I avoided shrimp cocktails on cruises for several years. On Jewel of the Seas last month I waited until the third night and after no one at our table of 8 had any bad reactions (many of them ate the shrimp) I went back to ordering it for a couple of nights and all was fine.

 

At a restaurant in FLL the night before a cruise I had a salad as my entree and was the only one in my party of 5 that got really ill. Since then I will never eat a salad before cruising just in case it might make me sick enough to miss the cruise. 

[hancock]

Had lunch in a 5 star hotel in Antiqua, Guatemala. They boasted that Bill Clinton had eater there. There were four of us.  One had fish and was OK,  Two shared a local sausage delicacy with their meal.  They were both violently sick for 2 days.  I had something but did not taste the sausage delicacy and was fine.  You can eat at any restaurant and get sick.

[ldubs]

On 4/15/2023 at 3:41 PM, Oceansaway17 said:

 

 

but on ships, almost never as I do the sniff test.  Your nose won't lie most of the time.

Plus I ask others I see as to how they like it.

 

x2 on the sniff test.  If it smells off, it probably is off.   

[Joebucks]

4 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

If this is a myth, why is noro so prevalent on cruise ships, as this is caused almost entirely by fecal/oral contamination, which is caused primarily by poor hand hygiene.

 

According to cruising.org which had data compiled by CDC

 

https://cruising.org/en/about-the-industry/policy-priorities/public-health-and-medical/nororvirus-on-cruise-ships

 

The most common places people get sick from noro

 

Health care facilities 62%

Restaurant 22%

Other 7%

School 6%

Private residence 2%

Cruise ship .18%

 

Worldwide Industry Facts

• Worldwide, norovirus is the leading cause of acute gastroenteritis. About 1 in 5 cases of acute gastroenteritis, which leads to diarrhea and vomiting, is caused by norovirus.

Incorrectly Called the Cruise Ship Disease

 

• Incidents of norovirus or other gastrointestinal (GI) disease are quite rare on cruise ships. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) reports that 20 million people on land in the U.S. come down with norovirus every year.
• In the U.S., the risk of getting norovirus each year is about 1 in 15; a cruise passenger has about a 1 in 5,500 risk of getting laboratory-confirmed norovirus during a shipboard outbreak.
• While global information on norovirus outbreaks is not available, the CDC runs the Vessel Sanitation Program (VSP), which collects the total number of GI illness cases on cruise ships before the ship arrives at a U.S. port, when sailing from a foreign port.
• As the only national or international body tracking norovirus outbreaks on cruise ships, the CDC reports favorably  on the cruise industry’s efforts toward minimizing the spread of outbreaks in its  Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report (MMWR), titled “Acute Gastroenteritis on Cruise Ships – United States, 2008-2014.”  A few highlights:
  • “Cases of acute gastroenteritis illness on cruise ships are relatively infrequent.”
  • “Collaborative efforts with the cruise industry have allowed VSP to provide more rapid support to cruise lines and ships experiencing higher than expected levels of acute gastroenteritis.”
  • “Fewer and less severe outbreaks are likely the result of earlier detection of acute gastroenteritis, along with cruise industry efforts to identify and control outbreaks.”

 

 

 

For someone as rooted in cruising facts as much as you are "noro so prevalent on cruise ships" is a CNN-worthy comment. Just because something makes the headlines more, doesn't gage its frequency.

 

What few people realize is fecal matter is EVERYWHERE. Cruises are one of the few places where they are actually cleaning. 

[chengkp75]

30 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

For someone as rooted in cruising facts as much as you are "noro so prevalent on cruise ships" is a CNN-worthy comment. Just because something makes the headlines more, doesn't gage its frequency.

 

What few people realize is fecal matter is EVERYWHERE. Cruises are one of the few places where they are actually cleaning.

Well aware of the relative incidence of noro in various locales.

 

Noro is not as prevalent on cruise ships because the CDC considers it to be a significant threat.  And, while the cruise ships clean, as you say, what the other poster was talking about is the passengers (who are not regulated by CDC for hand hygiene) touching utensils, and then another passenger touching those same utensils and becoming contaminated.  I've been trained by the USPH/CDC in cruise ship sanitation, and I know where the transmission vectors are, and they are primarily in the buffet line, which is why the self-service is the first casualty of a noro remediation plan.

[Joebucks]

On 4/17/2023 at 5:26 PM, chengkp75 said:

Well aware of the relative incidence of noro in various locales.

 

Noro is not as prevalent on cruise ships because the CDC considers it to be a significant threat.  And, while the cruise ships clean, as you say, what the other poster was talking about is the passengers (who are not regulated by CDC for hand hygiene) touching utensils, and then another passenger touching those same utensils and becoming contaminated.  I've been trained by the USPH/CDC in cruise ship sanitation, and I know where the transmission vectors are, and they are primarily in the buffet line, which is why the self-service is the first casualty of a noro remediation plan.

 

If it was up to the CDC, all cruise lines would likely be bankrupt by now as they didn't want cruises to resume when they did. It's the same as always the same fear-mongering. From the CDC:

 

Why are acute gastrointestinal illnesses including noroviruses associated with cruise ships?

• Health officials track illness on cruise ships. So outbreaks are found and reported more quickly on a cruise ship than on land.

 

So just because everyone is in and out on the same time, on a closed loop, in large amounts, makes cruising ripe for headline news. Look at the numbers of infection I posted above. Look at the number of people in buffets per day. How can anyone come to a conclusion that this is transmitting noro more than any other activity? The data is not there. 

 

Of course the cruise lines are going to clean. They obviously are under a microscope and want to protect their PR. And yes.... noro can spread. However, let's quit with the "cruises are petri dishes" because people read that online.

[chengkp75]

20 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

However, let's quit with the "cruises are petri dishes" because people read that online.

Never said, nor do I believe in this statement.  However, the prime transmission vector for noro on cruise ships, regardless of what percentage of people get noro on a cruise ship, is the buffet line.  Ask the CDC, they have a question answering service.

[Mary229]

3 hours ago, chengkp75 said:

Never said, nor do I believe in this statement.  However, the prime transmission vector for noro on cruise ships, regardless of what percentage of people get noro on a cruise ship, is the buffet line.  Ask the CDC, they have a question answering service.

I agree with you totally and if records were kept we would likely see the same results onshore, in our own hometowns