Learned Something New Regarding Award Tickets on American Airlines for Partner Airlines - at least my QANTAS experience

[Bo1953]

5 hours ago, SelectSys said:

So I just got off the phone first with QF, my credit card company and then finally AA.  QF told me that the ticket I had was now invalid and/or awaiting payment as my original reservation was taken over by the scammers.  The net effect of this is that I had no flight home from my cruise. That would have been a real shocker to show up at the airport or discover at check-in time that my reservation was garbage.

 

Next in talking with the credit card company I discovered that I didn't have any way of getting my money back as I had provided consent via an email.  This was my key error in terms of responding to the fake email and not seeing that the underlying email domain wasn't right.  So dumb...

 

Finally I called American and was able to cancel my first reservation that got hijacked and get the miles reinstated along with booking a very similar award ticket.  This included getting my seats reserved via the agent at no additional cost.  The American representative really went out of their way for me in getting the whole process of cancelling and rebooking handled. 

 

In hindsight, I should have recognized that the process was unlike any other airline call center experience I have ever had and that my award tickets are never result in a standby ticket.   What was I thinking?  Not much obviously...  

 

Finally, I want to thank everyone this board for questioning what was going on with my ticket.  This led me to finally discovering the fact that I had been duped by scammers.   I must confess as to feeling embarrassed by the whole episode but I suppose it could have been worse - like showing up at the airport and not being able to check in.  Hopefully at least one person here can learn something from my very hard lesson.

 

Do not feel embarrassed, it just points out that it can and will happen to many of us who do our best to be vigilant, to a fault...even.

 

Happy to read that you are getting back on track and will be getting your seats, shortly...

 

Good luck and bon voyage

[Zach1213]

6 hours ago, SelectSys said:

I must confess as to feeling embarrassed by the whole episode \

 

 

Don't worry, these **** are getting really good at what they do. It's way too easy for even the best of us to get fooled. I think you should call them back, tell them you'd like to upgrade a (fake) reservation to first class ($$$) and take up as much time of theirs as you can. At least, that's what I do...but maybe I have too much time on my hand and am too spiteful and petty 🙂

[BOB999]

Very sorry it happened to you.  I wouldn't feel embarrassed, it's not the first time it happened and sadly won't be the last. 

 

A couple of suggestions to think about:

 

• Depending on how much information about your AAdvantage account they got, you may want to call AAdvantage Customer Service, explain what happened and see if they suggest any way to further protect your account.  I think I've heard in the past where folks can add a PIN or something if you try and call and redeem miles.
• In spite of what the credit card company said, I would consider pursuing a chargeback.  The business misrepresented themselves to you as American Airlines or QANTAS, given that your original reservation still had issues they failed to deliver whatever "service" they were supposed to provide and if they did any kind of email spoofing then that is icing on the cake.

[6rugrats]

So sorry this happened. None of the story made any sense, so it’s good to know what happened.  It’s also a good illustration of how credit card chargebacks don’t always work.  I know that I have never been successful with Chase.  They are truly terrible.

[GeezerCouple]

This is indeed a good warning to all of us.

 

And as a sort of public service announcement, don't forget about similar chances for scams from an email or phone call.

 

Do NOT click on any link.

==>> But do NOT call any phone number in that email, either, no matter how "safe" that email may appear.

Either go to your regular account and log in the way you usually do to get your "message" OR to get the official phone number (or look at the back of your charge card for the number, if that's appropriate).

 

It drives me nuts when places like financial firms remind one to "never click on an email link", and then THEY send emails with something like, "there is new regulatory information about one of your mutual funds; please click here..."  And it IS the financial firm, not a scam.

But what about that directive?  They are actually sort of training their customers to play right into the hands of a scammer... 😱

 

And then there's the book by Gavin de Becker:  "The Gift of Fear".

He's a security expert, and the bottom line is to "trust your gut".  If something seems "off", don't just brush "that feeling" away...  I think he meant it more for physical safety, but financial safety is also an issue where one might think/feel... "this is odd..."

 

GC

[SelectSys]

Thanks to all that have responded with both advice and words of support!  I think without this group's support the outcome and financial loss could have been worse.  It was really @BOB999's comment about the phone that caused me to go back and look again. 

 

I have opened the dispute with my credit card company.  I am not optimistic, but you never know.   The original reservation certainly doesn't exist now so it is impossible for any service to be delivered.  I will consider the suggestion of putting a PIN on my AA account.  I am also thinking about changing my credit card number.

 

I looked up the number associated with my credit card charge and here is what I found:

https://www.scampulse.com/fly-vault-deals-reviews

https://www.bbb.org/us/tx/houston/profile/travel-agency/fly-vault-travels-0915-90065162/customer-reviews

 

The good news is that I now have everything confirmed for my trip.  I also decided to change my credit card # just to be sure.

Edited June 8, 2023 by SelectSys

[SelectSys]

I called AA and the only way to protect my miles is to change my FF number to something else.  I am deciding whether or not to do that as well.

[GeezerCouple]

1 minute ago, SelectSys said:

I called AA and the only way to protect my miles is to change my FF number to something else.  I am deciding whether or not to do that as well.

 

After what happened, why would you *not* change both your charge card number (the one you gave to the scammers) and your FF number?

Especially that FF number... do you have it memorized?  Is it on file at a bunch of vendors such that you'd need to update them?  (That's a bit of an annoyance for regular charge cards sometimes, but still... weighed against the aggravation if the card does get misused... by people you already know aren't quite so concerned with ethical behavior...)

 

GC

[SelectSys]

1 minute ago, GeezerCouple said:

Especially that FF number... do you have it memorized?

Sadly it is one of the few numbers that I remember and it has been with me for a long time.  I guess only my SSN and Drivers License numbers are older.  

 

3 minutes ago, GeezerCouple said:

but still... weighed against the aggravation if the card does get misused

True - I'll make that change as well as nothing lasts forever.

[aungrl]

20 hours ago, SelectSys said:

OMG - you are right.  I got scammed by looking up the # on the web.  I am glad I will have time to fix this.  I may be out the money and maybe the miles.  Now it is time to start trying to recover...  

 

First time something like this has ever happened to me...

So so sorry to hear this.  As a long-time (decades) AA flyer, I was following this thread closely and couldn't imagine how what you were describing could have happened.  I hate it for you that this what it turned out to be.  All good luck in getting it resolved, and please come back and let us know how it worked out.  

[aungrl]

Sorry, I thread jumped and didn't see all of your other posts before I wrote the one above.  I'm glad that you have been able to resolve so much of it so quickly, and I hope the credit card company gives you some satisfaction now that you've filed the dispute.     

[em-sk]

On 6/7/2023 at 11:39 PM, SelectSys said:

So I just got off the phone first with QF, my credit card company and then finally AA.  QF told me that the ticket I had was now invalid and/or awaiting payment as my original reservation was taken over by the scammers.  The net effect of this is that I had no flight home from my cruise. That would have been a real shocker to show up at the airport or discover at check-in time that my reservation was garbage.

 

Next in talking with the credit card company I discovered that I didn't have any way of getting my money back as I had provided consent via an email.  This was my key error in terms of responding to the fake email and not seeing that the underlying email domain wasn't right.  So dumb...

 

 

 

 

I would phone the credit card company again and talk to a different agent.  

 

Tell them it is not a legitimate merchant and you want to dispute the charge as you did not receive the service you were charged for.  

 

[6rugrats]

14 hours ago, em-sk said:

 

I would phone the credit card company again and talk to a different agent.  

 

Tell them it is not a legitimate merchant and you want to dispute the charge as you did not receive the service you were charged for.  

 

But, reading the posts, it appears OP did receive tickets?

[mickeysgal]

On 6/8/2023 at 2:39 AM, SelectSys said:

So I just got off the phone first with QF, my credit card company and then finally AA.  QF told me that the ticket I had was now invalid and/or awaiting payment as my original reservation was taken over by the scammers.  The net effect of this is that I had no flight home from my cruise. That would have been a real shocker to show up at the airport or discover at check-in time that my reservation was garbage.

 

Next in talking with the credit card company I discovered that I didn't have any way of getting my money back as I had provided consent via an email.  This was my key error in terms of responding to the fake email and not seeing that the underlying email domain wasn't right.  So dumb...

 

Finally I called American and was able to cancel my first reservation that got hijacked and get the miles reinstated along with booking a very similar award ticket.  This included getting my seats reserved via the agent at no additional cost.  The American representative really went out of their way for me in getting the whole process of cancelling and rebooking handled. 

 

In hindsight, I should have recognized that the process was unlike any other airline call center experience I have ever had and that my award tickets are never result in a standby ticket.   What was I thinking?  Not much obviously...  

 

Finally, I want to thank everyone this board for questioning what was going on with my ticket.  This led me to finally discovering the fact that I had been duped by scammers.   I must confess as to feeling embarrassed by the whole episode but I suppose it could have been worse - like showing up at the airport and not being able to check in.  Hopefully at least one person here can learn something from my very hard lesson.

 

Your last sentence says it all. Thank you for posting the result- please know that you have raised awareness and hopefully this will indeed help someone else. 
 

What an ordeal for you. So glad you figured out it was a scam now and got it straightened out instead of standing in the airport. 

[em-sk]

3 hours ago, 6rugrats said:

But, reading the posts, it appears OP did receive tickets?

 

They are not buying tickets, they are buying air travel.  If they are denied boarding or the airline tells them the tickets are not good that is sufficient to dispute the charge.

[6rugrats]

2 hours ago, em-sk said:

 

They are not buying tickets, they are buying air travel.  If they are denied boarding or the airline tells them the tickets are not good that is sufficient to dispute the charge.

I’m not going to debate semantics.  Seems quite silly.  
But none of that has happened.  

Edited June 11, 2023 by 6rugrats

[em-sk]

54 minutes ago, 6rugrats said:

I’m not going to debate semantics.  Seems quite silly.  
But none of that has happened.  

 

Perhaps I am miss reading the OP story but it sounds like, the OP was told her tickets had been changed and was not able to use them now.   

 

It is fairly simple, the OP paid for a flight from point A to point B.  If the airline is saying the ticket can't be used then the OP should be getting her money back.   

 

The details about how someone hijacked and repurposed the ticket is interesting but that is the airlines problem to solve not the OP.   Clearly the airlines does not have adequate safeguards in place.   

 

 

[Globaliser]

5 hours ago, em-sk said:

Perhaps I am miss reading the OP story but it sounds like, the OP was told her tickets had been changed and was not able to use them now.

 

No, that wasn't the problem. The OP inadvertently called a scammer, and inadvertently gave the scammer written permission to change the tickets and to take more money from their credit card. It's the written permission that the credit card company seems to be relying on in order to refuse to refund that money.

[em-sk]

17 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

No, that wasn't the problem. The OP inadvertently called a scammer, and inadvertently gave the scammer written permission to change the tickets and to take more money from their credit card. It's the written permission that the credit card company seems to be relying on in order to refuse to refund that money.

 

Perhaps banks behave differently in the US than what I am use to in Canada.  Banks have little desire to see money go into the hands of scammer and have no problem yanking it back from them.  If the OP signed some paper it should have said what it was for.  If they did not deliver then it is pretty clear justification to undo the transaction.  

 

Edited June 12, 2023 by em-sk

[SelectSys]

On 6/8/2023 at 5:22 PM, aungrl said:

So so sorry to hear this.  As a long-time (decades) AA flyer, I was following this thread closely and couldn't imagine how what you were describing could have happened.   

Well, I am a long time AA flyer too and my head just wasn't in the right place talking to the people.  They were good including fake transfers between QF and AA agents.

 

On 6/9/2023 at 9:31 PM, em-sk said:

 

Tell them it is not a legitimate merchant and you want to dispute the charge as you did not receive the service you were charged for.  

 

I have filed a dispute.  I cannot receive service as the ticket doesn't exist.

 

On 6/10/2023 at 12:11 PM, 6rugrats said:

But, reading the posts, it appears OP did receive tickets?

I actually had reward tickets issued by AA and then the scammers actually destroyed it trying to convert a reward ticket into a paid ticket as part of their seat assignment ploy.

 

On 6/10/2023 at 1:08 PM, mickeysgal said:

Your last sentence says it all. Thank you for posting the result- please know that you have raised awareness and hopefully this will indeed help someone else. 
 

What an ordeal for you. So glad you figured out it was a scam now and got it straightened out instead of standing in the airport. 

Yes, it would have been incredible showing up at the airport without a real ticket and needing to buy something at the last minute.

 

17 hours ago, Globaliser said:

 

No, that wasn't the problem. The OP inadvertently called a scammer, and inadvertently gave the scammer written permission to change the tickets and to take more money from their credit card. It's the written permission that the credit card company seems to be relying on in order to refuse to refund that money.

Yes, that is basically correct.  However the dispute has not been adjudicated as far as I know.  If it goes against me, I will appeal the decision as I only had 500 characters to write the explanation of what happened.

 

34 minutes ago, em-sk said:

 

Perhaps banks behave differently in the US than what I am use to in Canada.  Banks have little desire to see money go into the hands of scammer and have no problem yanking it back from them.  If the OP signed some paper it should have said what it was for.  If they did not deliver then it is pretty clear justification to undo the transaction.  

 

It is impossible for the scammers to deliver service as AA rescinded the original ticket, reinstated my miles and then reissued a completely new ticket.  

Edited June 12, 2023 by SelectSys

[Globaliser]

5 hours ago, em-sk said:

Perhaps banks behave differently in the US than what I am use to in Canada.  Banks have little desire to see money go into the hands of scammer and have no problem yanking it back from them.  If the OP signed some paper it should have said what it was for.  If they did not deliver then it is pretty clear justification to undo the transaction.

 

I have little doubt that in the UK, a credit card company would have quickly refunded the OP.

 

But I suspect that the problem here is that the scammers did what the OP gave them written permission to do, and paid them to do: to change the booking that the OP already had. So in a sense, the scammers did deliver what they had promised. Given that the scammers had the OP's written permission, it is not hard to see why a credit card company might not be quite so ready to refund immediately.

 

The scam seems to have been that the scammers pretended that they were the airlines concerned, when they were not, rather than them taking money but not delivering.

[SelectSys]

10 hours ago, Globaliser said:

But I suspect that the problem here is that the scammers did what the OP gave them written permission to do, and paid them to do: to change the booking that the OP already had. So in a sense, the scammers did deliver what they had promised.

Not really, the real QF said the ticket was invalid after the scammer took it over.  The ticket doesn't even exist anymore and no service can be delivered.

 

10 hours ago, Globaliser said:

The scam seems to have been that the scammers pretended that they were the airlines concerned, when they were not

This is true.  There charge on my bill says Qantas - probably not the real legal name in the US - and the detailed listing for the transaction on my account includes a website link that takes you to the QF website.

 

The dispute is supposed to be finalized by August 11th and if it does not go in my favor I will definitely shut down my account with Citi.

 

 

[taxatty]

7 hours ago, SelectSys said:

 

 

The dispute is supposed to be finalized by August 11th and if it does not go in my favor I will definitely shut down my account with Citi.

 

 

Citi was totally useless for us when Iberia refused to either refund our money or even issue a credit for a flight it cancelled during the height of COVID--we ultimately had to file a DOT complaint to get satisfaction on what should have been an easy Citi chargeback. Good luck to you.