Southwest Airlines seating nightmare

[frugaltravel]

The "cattle in a feed lot at the gate" syndrome isn't something restricted to airlines that don't have assigned seating. Every time I fly Delta, United, AA, etc, I find that most everyone forms a crowd around the gate area regardless of their boarding status. I can't count the number of times I've had a boarding status that allows me to board coach ahead of the majority of other passengers. But you still have to fight and weave your way through the crowd of people who are ticketed to board after you. So to me just about all airlines are cattle calls at the gate when ticketed in coach.

 

Ain't that the truth. I think it has gotten better since DL bought NW. But NW had a boarding process where first class went first, then their elites, then "everyone else" in no specific boarding order (just whoever got in line first). This was WORSE than Southwest, even with assigned seats, because so many people congregated near the podium hoping to get on and have room for their carryons before the rest of the plane lined up. Just terrible!

[kenish]

We were flying SEA-SNA on Alaska last summer. Boarding was organized and efficient but there was a long line going to the agent and reader (the other reader was broken). As we reached the front of the line a woman stepped right in front of us (darn near shoved me aside). The agent asked "Can I help you?" and the reply was "You need to take my boarding pass!". The unflappable agent glanced at her BP, handed it back, and pointed out the many people who were waiting in line. When the woman argued her row had already boarded, the agent replied that her row was included in at least 3 announcements. It was very clear the woman wasn't confused and simply rude. She started saying something about owning Alaska Airlines stock (loudly enough to make a scene). The agent cut her off and said (in an equally loud but polite voice) "Ma'am, you're delaying everyone who has been waiting in line and I have one question. Do you want to fly with us today or not? If you do, the end of the line is over there, if you don't please go to the Customer Service desk and they will rebook you on a flight tomorrow". Everyone in earshot applauded while woman stormed to the back of the line without a word. :)

[pyrrhus]

I am a road warrior and have had to recently fly SWA due to the location of my business.

 

SWA is a budget carrier, plain and simple. I do not like, nor have I ever liked having to stand like cattle in a feed lot in order to get on the plane and having no choice in who sits next to me (or being able to check for empty seats on a seat map).

 

And the 24-hour thing having to check in... I have checked in where it was too early and kept retrying over and over and as soon as was allowed to check in was already at number A50! I don't know how 35 other people got ahead of me. (For those that don't know, the Business Select customers get the first 15 seat numbers reserved for them.)

 

I'll only fly SWA when I absolutely must, but will make sure every other avenue is researched ahead of time where I can choose my seat and can continually make updates to my seat choice if I so choose. JMHO

 

 

What airline today are you not treated like Cattle? Even being a former Platinum flyer with first class seats I felt treated like cattle, noly more comfortable cattle.

 

Also, even in First Class I have arrived at the airport only to find a change in planes or some other issue that caused the seating plan to be rearranged and lose the person I am sitting next to (usually business reasons or my wife) because of it. At least with Southwest they are honest about the seats.

[Globaliser]

What airline today are you not treated like Cattle?

It might merely be a rhetorical question in relation to US airlines.

 

But there are plenty of airlines around the world on which you are not treated like cattle. You just have to get outside the US.

[pyrrhus]

It might merely be a rhetorical question in relation to US airlines.

 

But there are plenty of airlines around the world on which you are not treated like cattle. You just have to get outside the US.

 

I'll agree with you, especially the Asian Lines which seem to go above and beyond.

 

As far as the American air carriers, we need to face facts, the old models are dying. Airlines have lost 6 billion so far this year and for the most part only the budget airlines seem to be staying above or close to the water line. We will see how this shakes out, but it doesn't look pretty for the consumer.

 

 

Michael

[Keith1010]

I'll agree with you, especially the Asian Lines which seem to go above and beyond.

 

As far as the American air carriers, we need to face facts, the old models are dying. Airlines have lost 6 billion so far this year and for the most part only the budget airlines seem to be staying above or close to the water line. We will see how this shakes out, but it doesn't look pretty for the consumer.

 

 

Michael

 

The entire business model is flawed. And here is a challenge. The consumer always wants these very low prices. I see it all the time on Cruise Critic. But in the end all of these low prices have meant cutbacks from food to other services, charging for luggage, and basically the goal of filling the aircraft with passengers and minimizing the amount of luggage stored below so the aircrafts can carry commecial items. Anyway, at some point the consumer has to get realistic about ticket prices which are extremely low compared to many years ago when adjusted for inflation.

 

Keith

[frugaltravel]

The entire business model is flawed. And here is a challenge. The consumer always wants these very low prices. I see it all the time on Cruise Critic. But in the end all of these low prices have meant cutbacks from food to other services, charging for luggage, and basically the goal of filling the aircraft with passengers and minimizing the amount of luggage stored below so the aircrafts can carry commecial items. Anyway, at some point the consumer has to get realistic about ticket prices which are extremely low compared to many years ago when adjusted for inflation.

 

Keith

 

True, but pricing is the seller's (airlines') problem, not the customer's problem!

 

Airlines tend to think, "We will lose money on each seat but make it up on volume." :D

 

Airlines make money on their frequent flyer programs (i.e. selling miles). But they are very poor airline operators.

[Keith1010]

I'll agree with you, especially the Asian Lines which seem to go above and beyond.

 

As far as the American air carriers, we need to face facts, the old models are dying. Airlines have lost 6 billion so far this year and for the most part only the budget airlines seem to be staying above or close to the water line. We will see how this shakes out, but it doesn't look pretty for the consumer.

 

 

Michael

 

True, but pricing is the seller's (airlines') problem, not the customer's problem!

 

Airlines tend to think, "We will lose money on each seat but make it up on volume." :D

 

Airlines make money on their frequent flyer programs (i.e. selling miles). But they are very poor airline operators.

 

Yes, that is why I started off by saying that the whole business model is flawed. The airlines are their own worst enemy.

 

Then add to that the fact that the passengers expect dirt cheap prices.

 

Keith

[rzdj96]

Exactly! Look what happened to Peoples Express years back. That was the best cattle car going until they decided to expand and purchased Frontier Airlines. Frontier was a "Union" based airline and the purchase destroyed Peoples Express. I fail to see South Wests concept of not assigning seats. They know (or can ask) when you purchase your travel if there's a minor or a handicap situation or whatever. Then when folks check in, seating can go in order of check-in. Better yet, just have the T/A's on-board point out your seat in an orderly fashion, instead of being complacent about it. Without any control, they're just asking for problems. It's not like they don't know how full the aircraft will be or that some folks are just down right obnoxious and arrogant. 99% of their other passengers don't deserve that abuse. At a minimum, boarding would be orderly. JMHO

[shadgrimgravy02]

Has anyone else experienced the seating nightmare on Southwest? We thought that "chair hogs" were a problem until we experienced this air carrier. Upon boarding, we were "shot gunned" to fend for a seat. They specifically state that there's no assigned seats. One lady had 8 seats with packages on each of them. When trying to sit down, she stated that "these seats are mine and they're saved"! The stewardess commented that there's "No reserved seating"! At this time, the lady started all kinds of indignant comments and the stewardess turned and walked away (thus avoiding the confrontation). Another stewardess, when asked for assistance, ignored the passengers pleas. Just curious if anyone else experienced this "cattle car" seating dysfunction by Southwest Airlines!

I have flown with SW on numerous flights, having checked in online to get the "A" boarding pass, forgetting and checking in when I got there (resulting in either B or C boarding passes), and barely making it on the plane, thus taking what was left. BUT, I do have to say, that my flights have been either the first or second one of the morning.

It seems to me, that the persons who "hog" the seats feel it is there priviledge to hold seats, since they are the first ones on in their group. Sounds like something straight out of school days, when getting on the school bus first was a way to control who sat in the back.

And I don't think this only pertains to persons who don't fly frequently. My uncle and cousins are FF and they are constantly trying to control who sits next to them, even sometimes feigning a real person, so that the middle seat is empty the entire flight.

[6rugrats]

I fail to see South Wests concept of not assigning seats. They know (or can ask) when you purchase your travel if there's a minor or a handicap situation or whatever. Then when folks check in, seating can go in order of check-in. Better yet, just have the T/A's on-board point out your seat in an orderly fashion, instead of being complacent about it.

 

And, that's exactly what Southwest used to do. They had plastic colored boarding cards with numbers on them. When you checked in, you were given one of these cards. You boarded according to your number, and the GA just collected the cards as you got on the plane.

 

What's a T/A?

[kenish]

That reminds me of my first flight on WN years ago. I was miffed I couldn't select seats. When I got to the airport (early) and figured out their "take a number" system the brilliance hit me. Great incentive to check in promptly and be ready for boarding as numbers were called. (This was back in the days of paper tickets and OLCI was not even dreamed of!)

[maryr65]

SW will be starting to fly from Milwaukee to Orlando this fall. I researched airfare from both MKE and ORD and SW did have the most reasonable airfare. Since we're cruising and the bags fly free it seemed worth trying. I'm a little apprehensive now reading about the boarding scramble, but heck I'll try anything once. Does anyone know how the 24 hour window is calculated? I mean from what time zone.

[JLC@SD]

Thats bull doody, I would have plopped my bum down anyway.

 

I would have done this also.....and thank her for saving it for me....;)

[scottbee]

SW will be starting to fly from Milwaukee to Orlando this fall. I researched airfare from both MKE and ORD and SW did have the most reasonable airfare. Since we're cruising and the bags fly free it seemed worth trying. I'm a little apprehensive now reading about the boarding scramble, but heck I'll try anything once. Does anyone know how the 24 hour window is calculated? I mean from what time zone.

 

24 hours prior to departure. With an airline, everything internally is done in UTC (GMT), and converted to local time only for the general public to figure out. The control tower at the airport, and all ATC globally operates in UTC.

[time4u2go]

All of the seats arrive at the same time. Is it really that big of a deal?

[Keith1010]

All of the seats arrive at the same time. Is it really that big of a deal?

 

If many folks opt to pay the $10.00 and you don't then you might be in the last group boarding and if you are concerned about where you sit and also with carry on luggage it will be a big deal for you. Of course you can just pay the additional $10.00.

 

But as I mentioned earlier time will only tell. I am sure there are a lot of people who will not pay the fee.

 

So, I would not overeact to what they have announced. Rather, I would just see how this plays out.

 

Keith

[UpstateCruizer]

All of the seats arrive at the same time. Is it really that big of a deal?

 

 

It may be for some people. I have absolutely no issues flying as long as I'm in an aisle seat so for me it's not as much about when I board but more about being able to sit in an aisle seat. Parents with children who may have never flown before may find issues with having their children scattered in various rows should they get a later boarding zone.

[Clarkk W Griswald]

If many folks opt to pay the $10.00 and you don't then you might be in the last group boarding and if you are concerned about where you sit and also with carry on luggage it will be a big deal for you. Of course you can just pay the additional $10.00.

 

But as I mentioned earlier time will only tell. I am sure there are a lot of people who will not pay the fee.

 

So, I would not overeact to what they have announced. Rather, I would just see how this plays out.

 

Keith

 

What's with paying the additional $10?

[Keith1010]

What's with paying the additional $10?

 

 

If you pay the additional $10.00 you would be one of the first passengers to board the plane.

 

Keith

[shadgrimgravy02]

What's with paying the additional $10?

BTW, LOVE the name! :)

[Clarkk W Griswald]

If you pay the additional $10.00 you would be one of the first passengers to board the plane.

 

Keith

 

I never heard of that.:confused:

I know you get priority boarding when purchasing a "Business Select" ticket, but it costs more than $10 over their "anytime" or "wanna get away" fares.

[6rugrats]

I never heard of that.:confused:

I know you get priority boarding when purchasing a "Business Select" ticket, but it costs more than $10 over their "anytime" or "wanna get away" fares.

 

As usual, the airline's own webpage is a great source of information, or this is discussed right on the front page of this forum:

 

 

http://www.southwest.com/flight/early-bird-faq.html

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1052722

[jm1029]

I believe you can save a seat if you pay for the seat. I know someone who buys two seats. She is given a card to put in the seat next to her and the FA's do make sure the seat is not taken.

 

Difference is that she pays for the ticket for a passenger.

[Clarkk W Griswald]

As usual, the airline's own webpage is a great source of information, or this is discussed right on the front page of this forum:

 

 

http://www.southwest.com/flight/early-bird-faq.html

 

http://boards.cruisecritic.com/showthread.php?t=1052722

 

Wow, I missed both of them. But I don't go to SW page unless I'm purchasing a ticket.