Notifying Passengers of Port Time Changes

[Pet Nit Noy]

Seems to me that the other 95% might feel the same. and have no way to tell the rest of the world. Why would just CC people feel this way? The only way to really know is to look at the future bookings over the next few months.

 

You're so right when you write, "no way to tell the world." Of course they would feel the same way. No one wants to make plans for a vacation only to have those plans sandbagged so the cruise company can make more money.

 

I may be in the minority, but I'd happily pay somewhat more money so Oceania's ships could cruise at a slightly faster speed and port calls could remain meaningful and appealing in length.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Pet Nit Noy

[TravelerThom]

You're so right when you write, "no way to tell the world." Of course they would feel the same way. No one wants to make plans for a vacation only to have those plans sandbagged so the cruise company can make more money.

 

I may be in the minority, but I'd happily pay somewhat more money so Oceania's ships could cruise at a slightly faster speed and port calls could remain meaningful and appealing in length.

Gee, I considered that I ALREADY paid more money to sail on Oceania (versus say Celebrity et al) to get an itinerary that I wanted (okay and better food in the deal). Then fuel dropped significantly in price, but that addition to O's bottom line was apparently not sufficient, so there went my full day in Rio.

 

I hear lots of moaning from companies that they are hampered by too much regulation. When somebody finally steps in to regulate this crap I'll sure think that some companies brought it on themselves.

 

Thom

[Paulchili]

Seems to me that the other 95% might feel the same. and have no way to tell the rest of the world. Why would just CC people feel this way? The only way to really know is to look at the future bookings over the next few months.

 

 

It is sad to see what has become of O in the last month or so. From a great approval rating to a disaster. Sure hope this changes as their best customers will look elsewhere.

 

Let's keep it real and not make up numbers to fit one's point.

We know that CC members are a small minority of O cruisers and even of those CC members how many have firmly committed to not cruising on O again? Maybe 10? Or 20? We know how insignificant those numbers are in reality.

Not to mention that several of them were first time O cruisers and not their "best cruisers". There is a very large number of unhappy posts recently but not nearly that many different unhappy posters. Several posters posting over and over making it look like everybody who is cruising on O is unhappy with Oceania.

Let's see what the future brings as far as the overall experiences on all Oceania ships. Let's see what the next 30 or 50 reviews are like and let's see how the bookings will go. All of those are better indicators whether Oceania is pleasing or alienating the majority of its clients. As far as individuals go, we all have to decide for ourselves whether we want to stay or leave for whatever reasons(s).

[harryw]

I wonder how many cruise lines are guilty of the same port time issues...I've only sailed on four and never compared...

 

Harry

[wripro]

Let's keep it real and not make up numbers to fit one's point.

We know that CC members are a small minority of O cruisers and even of those CC members how many have firmly committed to not cruising on O again? Maybe 10? Or 20? We know how insignificant those numbers are in reality.

Not to mention that several of them were first time O cruisers and not their "best cruisers". There is a very large number of unhappy posts recently but not nearly that many different unhappy posters. Several posters posting over and over making it look like everybody who is cruising on O is unhappy with Oceania.

Let's see what the future brings as far as the overall experiences on all Oceania ships. Let's see what the next 30 or 50 reviews are like and let's see how the bookings will go. All of those are better indicators whether Oceania is pleasing or alienating the majority of its clients. As far as individuals go, we all have to decide for ourselves whether we want to stay or leave for whatever reasons(s).

 

Paul,

 

It really doesn't matter whether it's 5000 passengers or 5 who are complaining or if they are CC members or not. What O is doing is just plain WRONG.

[Paulchili]

Paul,

 

It really doesn't matter whether it's 5000 passengers or 5 who are complaining or if they are CC members or not. What O is doing is just plain WRONG.

 

Henry,

I can agree with that and I've said so (please see my post #58).

My post that you are responding to was in reply to assertions that there is (or will be) a massive exodus from Oceania of unhappy loyal and new customers (that perhaps as many as 95% of O customers are unhappy about how things are going). I don't see any evidence for that now based on what I've read here.

We'll see what the future brings - and that includes my future cruise line choices, based on my own Oceania experiences as well as how things go with Oceania in the near future.

Edited January 1, 2016 by Paulchili

[Travelcat2]

This thread is beginning to sound like NCL's board a few months ago where it was predicted that there would be a mass exodus from NCL....... it never happened and neither will this. I learned when Regent was going through changes and passengers were leaving for other cruise lines that "newbies" to Regent outnumbered those exiting (and many of those passengers learned that the grass is not greener on the other side and returned).

 

We only have two cruises on Oceania and there is nothing that I've read that concerns me about sailing on Oceania. All cruise lines have problems, some "bad" cruises, illness on board, skipped ports, etc. Sometimes I think that the people that complain the loudest are the most loyal passengers and it truly bothers them when things are not running correctly. If people new to Oceania have an issue, they may or may not report it on Cruise Critic and then go back to whatever line they were cruising. IMO, you care a lot if you take the time to complain in such detail.

[kazu]

I agree completely with TravelerThom. It's unconscionable too make these port time changes after final payment and not even notify passengers or their TAs. Sadly, except for a TA where ports don't matter I will not be booking O again.

 

The thing is, the port changes are not always made after final payment. They have been made and O just doesn't change the itinerary.

 

Case in point - Bermuda on our Nov. 18th TA had a departure time of 6 pm. When I contacted our private catamaran they told me we were leaving at 4 pm not 6 pm according to the harbour master website. I checked and they were correct. Contacted O and they said we were leaving at 6. I went by the tour guide's advice and the harbour's report and we planned for a 4 pm departure.

 

On board, we were told we were leaving at 3:00 or 3:30 so we still had to do some juggling. All for not, of course as Bermuda refused us entry.

 

Just the same, the port had been changed long before final payment. O just hadn't advised nor changed their itinerary. What I would recommend is that people check the actual ports to see the departure/arrival times to be on the safe side. O had always been designated to leave at 4 pm not 6 according to the website.

 

hope this helps those that are planning ;)

[ORV]

I don't know about "best customers" but it sure emphasizes the fact the CC participants are fewer than 5% of the total passenger load on each cruise -- seemingly, not a large enough group to impact Oceania's decisions.

 

 

Where can I find this fact? I see this discussed on a regular basis on CC and didn't realize that there is an actual quantified number.

 

Frankly I feel it's closer to 10% participants and at least double that lurkers & people that use CC as a resource.

[Cellen]

We have sailed mainly with Celebrity, and also with P&O, and have never had these changes with port times imposed before a cruise.

 

The exception was our last cruise with Celebrity in October 2015, where we embarked in Istanbul and our overnight and second day in Istanbul was cancelled for security reasons (terrorist threats etc), but we were notified in advance and received a refund of port taxes. This was a valid reason and Celebrity did the right thing by notifying us and refunding port taxes.

 

The changes O has made to our Far East cruise itinerary without notifying us or giving a valid reason is completely unacceptable and we would not risk an expensive long-haul holiday with them again. We cruise to see the places we visit, not just to spend even more time on the cruise ship!

[Mura]

As a long term Oceania loyalist (who has NOT been impacted negatively, at least not yet, in terms of port times) I am not prepared to bail. But I do understand why people, especially newcomers to the line, would say never again. To lose several hours (or even more) at a port, especially if you have made private plans, is beyond upsetting. I get that.

 

As I've said before, I do hope management is still monitoring these boards and taking note of the comments. I personally don't assume that the majority of passengers agree with the nay-sayers. But I certainly could be wrong!

 

It IS true that the majority of passengers (from my personal experience) are not aware of CC or other internet options for checking out lines and communicating with fellow passengers.

 

We were on a Viking cruise in October '03 where many people we met were former Renaissance passengers, as we were, but they had no idea that Oceania was in the offing or even that there were internet sources.

 

True, older passengers back then were far less likely to be internet users than now ... but even now, many are not. I can't number the people who expressed interest in these options but never specifically asked me how they could do so.

 

Even in recent cruises, we've met people who didn't have a clue that the internet can be a great resource in checking out cruiselines, meeting up with other passengers beforehand, etc.

 

Mura

[kazu]

As a long term Oceania loyalist (who has NOT been impacted negatively, at least not yet, in terms of port times) I am not prepared to bail. But I do understand why people, especially newcomers to the line, would say never again. To lose several hours (or even more) at a port, especially if you have made private plans, is beyond upsetting. I get that.

 

As I've said before, I do hope management is still monitoring these boards and taking note of the comments. I personally don't assume that the majority of passengers agree with the nay-sayers. But I certainly could be wrong!

 

It IS true that the majority of passengers (from my personal experience) are not aware of CC or other internet options for checking out lines and communicating with fellow passengers.

 

We were on a Viking cruise in October '03 where many people we met were former Renaissance passengers, as we were, but they had no idea that Oceania was in the offing or even that there were internet sources.

 

True, older passengers back then were far less likely to be internet users than now ... but even now, many are not. I can't number the people who expressed interest in these options but never specifically asked me how they could do so.

 

Even in recent cruises, we've met people who didn't have a clue that the internet can be a great resource in checking out cruiselines, meeting up with other passengers beforehand, etc.

 

Mura

 

Interesting post Mura and how experiences can differ.

 

I am trying to keep up with my roll call right now with all the new posters - many with their first post ever to CC.

 

Great way to start :)

 

CC has a lot of lurkers and a lot of readers.

 

Not everyone posts, but I think more people use the internet than they are being credited for.

 

I am always amazed at who does use the internet and who doesn't. In my experience, the "seniors" (and I guess I am one of those now) use it quite well ;)

[Mura]

Interesting post Mura and how experiences can differ.

 

I am trying to keep up with my roll call right now with all the new posters - many with their first post ever to CC.

 

Great way to start :)

 

CC has a lot of lurkers and a lot of readers.

 

Not everyone posts, but I think more people use the internet than they are being credited for.

 

I am always amazed at who does use the internet and who doesn't. In my experience, the "seniors" (and I guess I am one of those now) use it quite well ;)

 

I think these days they do. I remember on our first QE2 cruise in 2003 I went up to the internet cafe in hopes that they offered a discounted internet rate for more minutes (they did not). All the people there who were waiting to sign up for instructions were seniors (older than I was at the time) who had been ordered by their children to learn how to use the internet so they could email their grandkids ...

 

I suspect if I could go up to the QE2 internet cafe today, those people might not be there. Certainly not as many as were there then!

 

But even so, there are plenty of seniors who still are not internet-literate. My engineer husband is one of them! He uses me as his IT person ...

 

Mura

[kazu]

I think these days they do. I remember on our first QE2 cruise in 2003 I went up to the internet cafe in hopes that they offered a discounted internet rate for more minutes (they did not). All the people there who were waiting to sign up for instructions were seniors (older than I was at the time) who had been ordered by their children to learn how to use the internet so they could email their grandkids ...

 

I suspect if I could go up to the QE2 internet cafe today, those people might not be there. Certainly not as many as were there then!

 

But even so, there are plenty of seniors who still are not internet-literate. My engineer husband is one of them! He uses me as his IT person ...

 

Mura

 

LOL Mura - DH uses internet at work but here at home, I too am the go to person ;) too funny :)

[Mura]

LOL. I know we aren't alone!!!

 

Mura

[Pet Nit Noy]

Where can I find this fact? I see this discussed on a regular basis on CC and didn't realize that there is an actual quantified number.

 

Frankly I feel it's closer to 10% participants and at least double that lurkers & people that use CC as a resource.

 

 

I recall reading threads involving angry CC members who were told that Oceania would not set up official Meet and Greet parties for them since they represented a mere 5% of the passenger load (Even farther back, the number was typically cited as 3%). Now we all know that once on board, Oceania will make an effort to facilitate a CC Meet and Greet. However, the specific complaint was that Oceania kept refusing to label any CC Meet and Greet parties as an official function that might, for example, make the daily bulletin.

 

Incidentally, I would not be surprised to learn that some cruises have a much higher percentage of CC members. If someone told me that CC members make up 10% of Trans-Atlantic crossings or of itineraries that include a new and particularly desirable port of call for Oceania, I would not be surprised.

[TravelerThom]

As a long term Oceania loyalist (who has NOT been impacted negatively, at least not yet, in terms of port times) I am not prepared to bail. But I do understand why people, especially newcomers to the line, would say never again. To lose several hours (or even more) at a port, especially if you have made private plans, is beyond upsetting. I get that…

This is not just about losing several hours at a port (although that can be disappointing). I have lost not just hours, but entire port stops many times over the years, but always for operational issues not within the control of the company. Off the top of my head I can recall missing St. John’s NL (weather), Saint John NB (weather), Freeport (weather), Tangier (security threat), Casablanca (security threat), Fort-de-France (riots), Pointe a Pitre (riots), Cape Horn landing (weather; on this trip to Antarctica we missed 3 landings, but made 9 of 12 scheduled landings, plus one added one – this was much better than I was expecting), and Adamstown Pitcairn Island (medical diversion). Although momentarily disappointed, in every case I felt that the cruise line was making decisions to protect the safety of their passengers. I did the April 2013 Oceania Marina Papeete to Lima sailing specifically for Pitcairn and Easter Islands (I had been to French Polynesian and to Peru several times already), but someone broke a hip and we bypassed Pitcairn and proceeded immediately to Easter Island (which has a large airport landing strip supporting medical evacuations). Not to even see Pitcairn was disappointing, but the occurrence made me feel that Oceania was very concerned about their passengers.

 

The elimination of port times that Oceania is now doing is something entirely different than what I described above. In the absence of a better explanation from the company (and as far as I can tell Oceania is not even acknowledging that anything has ever happened), the elimination of port hours is purely for the convenience and profit of the company. My 28 Nov Marina sailing not only lost 4 hours in Rio, it also lost 2 hours in Lüderitz and 2 hours in Walvis Bay from the schedule after Final Payment (we also lost 1 hour in Jamestown St. Helena, but that was because the weather was changing and they needed to stop tendering before the swells got too bad – an operational safety issue, and I am NOT faulting the company for that). We had friends on the immediately preceding Marina cruise from Lisbon to Cape Town and they lost 23 (yes, twenty-three) hours of port time after Final Payment, so I guess I should consider myself lucky.

 

Oceania needs to make a profit to stay in business, but changing the product after Final Payment for no reason other than further increasing profit is not right (it may be legal, but that still doesn’t make it right). I accept that on this issue I am a “nay-sayer”, but I have a hard time understanding why the “cheerleaders” feel they have to wait until it happens to them for them to admit that a problem exists. Back in Msg #16 (26 Oct 2015)a cheerleader said “If port changes become an ongoing issue, I agree that Oceania's credibility would be in question; I just don't see evidence of that happening, as of yet.” It is now 2016, and port changes ARE an ongoing issue (see the comments above about Nautica 2016 cruises). You have been warned; if you refuse to see that Oceania is continuing to change schedules after Final Payment purely for their own bottom line at your expense, don’t expect any sympathy when it happens to you.

Thom

[Pet Nit Noy]

Gee, I considered that I ALREADY paid more money to sail on Oceania (versus say Celebrity et al) to get an itinerary that I wanted (okay and better food in the deal).

 

When people talk about the price difference between Oceania and other, the list certainly includes food but, often little else. I can think of several additional pluses for Oceania, all of which cost money:

 

o No photographers. (While I love, love, love the absence of photographers, I realize that photographs are a profit center for other cruise lines.)

o No art auctions. Same issue. Art auction are a profit center, too.

o High quality bed and bath linens and superior beds.

o High quality furniture and art in the public spaces.

 

Oceania continues to deliver in these areas, but the issue of shortened port calls after final payment is new and seemingly tied to profit rather than the sort of problems most people accept for skipping/shortening port time.

[ORV]

Traveler Thom, you wouldn't have stopped at Pitcairn Island anyway. Well you might have stopped, but you wouldn't have been able to go on the Island. What they do there is bring locals on the ship and they sell their wares and visit etc. There has been a lot of confusion about this in the past as people have Pitcairn on a bucket list and get all bent out of shape when they find out they don't actually get to go there.

[LHT28]

Those affected by the shortened port times should be sending letters of their dissatisfaction to Oceania H.O.

Bitching here will do no good

 

Didn't the last round of cuts get some port time reinstated after many people complained to head office ?

 

If they have many complaints ( in writing) it shows how passengers feel about it

Not a lot you can do after final payment unless you want to lose your $$ but you can choose with your wallet for future cruises

 

YMMV

[TravelerThom]

Traveler Thom, you wouldn't have stopped at Pitcairn Island anyway. Well you might have stopped, but you wouldn't have been able to go on the Island. What they do there is bring locals on the ship and they sell their wares and visit etc. There has been a lot of confusion about this in the past as people have Pitcairn on a bucket list and get all bent out of shape when they find out they don't actually get to go there.

While Pitcairn is NOW listed as "Pitcairn Islands [sic] Onboard Experience" (which is as you describe), in 2013 it was listed as a tender port. I was aware that tendering was very problematic at Adamstown, and was not going to be at all surprised if it turned into the "Onboard Experience" (or nothing at all), but we were promised the possibility of tendering in 2013 provided the weather cooperated. Are you saying that in 2013 Oceania knew that they were not going to make any attempt at tendering, but then totally mis-representied the situation in their sales literature?

 

Thom

Edited January 2, 2016 by TravelerThom

[wripro]

Henry,

I can agree with that and I've said so (please see my post #58).

My post that you are responding to was in reply to assertions that there is (or will be) a massive exodus from Oceania of unhappy loyal and new customers (that perhaps as many as 95% of O customers are unhappy about how things are going). I don't see any evidence for that now based on what I've read here.

We'll see what the future brings - and that includes my future cruise line choices, based on my own Oceania experiences as well as how things go with Oceania in the near future.

 

Sorry, Paul. I misread.

 

It's too bad that O is doing this as there are so many good things about the line. Too bad I'll never experience them again.

[RJB]

Traveler Thom, you wouldn't have stopped at Pitcairn Island anyway. Well you might have stopped, but you wouldn't have been able to go on the Island. What they do there is bring locals on the ship and they sell their wares and visit etc. There has been a lot of confusion about this in the past as people have Pitcairn on a bucket list and get all bent out of shape when they find out they don't actually get to go there.

Exactly what I have read and heard fore awhile.

[desertfolk]

We are on a Nautica cruise departing on March 4 th and have had one port ((Shangahi) changed from 2 whole days (8 AM one day to 5 PM the next day) to a half day each of the 2 days (arriving at noon one day, leaving at 1 PM the next day). That effects any private tours that passengers have for each of the two days. We found out about it from someone on our roll call noticing it on the website; our TA was notified about 5 days later.

 

It certainly seems to be a pattern to do this after final payment. It has happened to too many O cruises to be anything but a cost- saving measure.

 

I will have to keep watching the website to see if any other ports are affected between now and March. M

 

Nancy

[Kitchenercruiser]

Hi, I am new to CC, though I've perused it for years. My husband and I will be doing a back to back cruise beginning on January 8-Singapore to Hong Kong and Hong Kong to Bangkok.

I noticed that we are not docking anywhere close in either Ho Chi Minh City or Bangkok. Checking the online tours, they differ significantly from the printed brochures in that there are now cars/vans and drivers added for both ports. I know from doing lots of internet searching that the smaller ships dock much closer to the large city ports, and, in fact, Oceania Nautica normally did so before purchase by NC.

This is our 7th/8th cruise with Oceania and we have noticed a slight decline in quality over the last 2 cruises. We were on the Marina in the Baltic over the summer and for Riga, we docked at a cargo terminal at the last minute. Free shuttles arrived; however, long lines of passengers waited for more than an hour with no explanation from Oceania officials. There was almost a mutiny. Port times were also changed at the beginning of the cruise and final disembarkation in Southampton was a nightmare.

I suspect this will be our last Oceania cruise as we sailed on Crystal in November, on the advice of our TA and absolutely loved it. Their satisfaction survey is offered online at the END of the cruise, so no need to waste time on your cruise completing it. You may contact officials at any time during the cruise to offer suggestions or complaints. Not so with Oceania and I couldn't complain about the disembarkation process.

The posts I have just read confirm in my mind that NCL is taking Oceania in a different direction.