Grand injured

[p_mori7]

For the benefit of those on board, as of 3am Honolulu time, you have back tracked about 250 miles towards Hawaii. The tug referred to in the previous post is in the little blue square on the below map. Intention of tug unknown, it may or may not be waiting for you.

 

[rbt001]

I certainly find chengkp75's first post explaining the mechanical aspects and assessment of seaworthiness to be interesting. I'm glad he posted.

 

However when I got to posts from other CC members .. . "dogging" something or another... "steel plates," I just passed them.

 

But I SURE HOPE both the Captain and Chief Engineer read every word of those posts....

 

Because if they do... they'll have the whole thing fixed before they get to Hawaii!

 

Jan just needs to turn the company over to Cruise Critic!

[Underwatr]

I'm guessing they're trying to keep us calm and assured, which is great. As for 'not part of the watertight integrity'... uhhhh

I've never been on the Grand, but on my way to the tenders on other ships I've quickly observed the mechanisms and watertight integrity in that area (I'll surely look more closely with this incident in mind on my next trip).

 

I don't have good recollection of the specifics but it would make sense to have a watertight door (possibly similar to the one Mrs & Mrs posted a photo of) just inboard of the compartment where the tender platform attaches.

[Aquahound]

While the USCG will be the lead agency on this (and they can call on NTSB for expertise, but generally only do this for fatalities), you must understand the international nature of the industry. The USCG can inspect and investigate this incident to determine if something does not meet the standards of SOLAS (the international Safety of Life at Sea convention). But, since this ship is flagged in Bermuda, they are limited in what they can require. If the system, as designed, meets SOLAS, then the USCG can only "recommend" to the Bermudan Maritime Authority that changes be made, if the USCG feels that changes should be made.

 

The USCG in this instance is acting as a "port state" (a signatory to SOLAS where the ship is in port), and can inspect to see that repairs meet SOLAS. Since the incident happened in international waters, it is the flag state (Bermuda) who has responsibility for investigating the cause of the incident, but since the US was the closest land, and the majority of passengers is likely US citizens, the USCG can request "interested party" status with Bermuda to be included as observers of the Bermudan investigation.

 

You're spot on with this. One thing though...bilatral agreements are already in place for incidents like this and while Bermuda will be kept appraised, the USCG will assume PSC and complete all the inspections.

[chengkp75]

I've never been on the Grand, but on my way to the tenders on other ships I've quickly observed the mechanisms and watertight integrity in that area (I'll surely look more closely with this incident in mind on my next trip).

 

I don't have good recollection of the specifics but it would make sense to have a watertight door (possibly similar to the one Mrs & Mrs posted a photo of) just inboard of the compartment where the tender platform attaches.

 

Sometimes the tender port is segregated using a sliding hydraulic watertight door, that is commonly used to separate the watertight compartments along the length of the ship, and which many folks have probably seen when touring the laundry and provisions areas of the ship. When these things close, the hydraulics force the entire 2" thick steel door into a wedge shaped jamb, and there is no force on god's earth pushing on that door that will open it.

[chengkp75]

You're spot on with this. One thing though...bilatral agreements are already in place for incidents like this and while Bermuda will be kept appraised, the USCG will assume PSC and complete all the inspections.

 

Thanks, Paul. Good to know. I knew that many of the FOC countries would defer to USCG both for expertise as well as not having to maintain investigators.

[diane.in.ny]

The orange in the picture is part of a lifeboat. The photo is taken from an elevation above and outboard of the lifeboat. it is much higher than the waterline.

 

Whoever took the picture is probably on a balcony above the lifeboat, stuck their arm out as far as they could, aimed their camera at an angle downwards; and snapped a few pics to try and get the shot.

 

Thanks. That explains a lot. Because I was wondering about the opening I was seeing in the picture and then it finally dawned on me it couldn't be the tender platform opening because it is so much higher than the water line.

[diane.in.ny]

I think its a canvas cover of some sort on the lifeboats. See here:

 

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/5i3R5-TLaJU/maxresdefault.jpg

 

In that case, the pic was probably snapped on one of the balconies on deck 9.

 

Yup. Looks good.

 

And now I see that the opening is actually the promenade deck.

[elliair]

Since the ship is returning to Hawaii, the USCG will inspect the ship and instigate an incident investigation. The reports of all investigations are posted here:

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiX6cLd5dnQAhVk9IMKHZe8DdMQFggbMAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fcgmix.uscg.mil%2Fiir%2F&usg=AFQjCNEnWUW6ncgUp6n11G844uqqeRWAlg&bvm=bv.139782543,d.amc

 

But in many cases it takes months before a report is finalized, and months before it is posted on the website.

 

chengkp75: In situations like this there's always speculation going on, it's human nature. I was telling DH last night about the Grand and the first thing he said was "sabotage." He then started reminiscing about his Navy days and it was his job to check certain areas of the ship for safety. He said "the Grand was a breach of security, it just didn't happen, someone screwed up - intentionally or unintentionally." Will we ever know what really happened here?

[WupperAV]

Shows 11.4 K 12/60 0000 arrival time and there is a heavy tug NW of you but don't know where she's headed.

And why haven't any "EXPERTS" come forward with the fact that there is a outward swinging door on the inboard aft side of the platform?

 

Why did it fail in this exciting episode? Who want's to analyze it? :D

Edited December 4, 2016 by WupperAV

[TTFromSommersTown]

:D

 

And not to be testy, but "knots per hour" is repetitive, since a "knot" is a "nautical mile per hour", so that is a "nautical mile per hour per hour".

:D

 

Just to add some humour into the mix for what is a very serious issue.

 

Knots per hour is a term of acceleration, the same as gravity has an acceleration of 32 feet per second per second. If the Grand had accelerated at 11 nautical miles per hour per hour when the incident first occured, they would now be travelling at over 250 knots and would be well on the way to Australia. ;););)

[azbirdmom]

Well we just got a letter stating that "... a tender platform on the starboard side of the ship opened, for reasons yet unknown. The platform sustained damage such that it could not be closed. Although the [tender] platform is not part of the watertight integrity of vessel as a result of it opening the hull sustained minor localized damage which has been secured."

 

I'm guessing they're trying to keep us calm and assured, which is great. As for 'not part of the watertight integrity'... uhhhh

 

Did you hear anything back about your request to not be flown directly home? On Twitter, Princess had responded to someone that they would "...fly guests back to San Francisco including overnight accommodations and transfers as needed...". Certainly seems like a better option than having guests pay their own way and seek reimbursement later if they do not wish to return home immediately. This is where I saw it in case you need a reference for Passenger Services. https://twitter.com/PrincessCruises/with_replies

[Yehootu]

I am extremely surprised they are heading to Honolulu and not Hilo. From their present position as I write this, Hilo is 110nm closer than Honolulu. At 11 knots, that makes Hilo 10 hours closer (to see this, go to http://gcmap.com/ and enter 22.99245N 149.489W-HNL; 22.99245N 149.489W-ITO for the paths to be mapped - that will use the airports rather than marine ports but close enough at that distance).

 

As an airplane pilot, I am well aware of the concept of going to the "nearest suitable" when required. Years ago, an airline had a plane lose an engine three hours south of Hawaii. Being south, Hilo was the closest with Kona just a few miles further and Honolulu 150 miles farther. They went to Kona due to Hilo having terrain considerations that made it less suitable than Kona; Honolulu was never considered even though it would have been more convenient once on the ground as it made no sense to pass up a suitable airport and risk flying another 20 minutes just for convenience once on the ground.

I was in the jumpseat on that flight! ETOPs at its finest.

[pilot]

The period between after Thanksgiving & until the Christmas crush is the slowest time in Hawaii. So flights shouldn't be as difficult to get back to the Mainland & also hotels should be more readily available when they arrive in Honolulu.

 

I checked a Hawaiian Airlines flight on Tuesday morning from HNL to SFO and it's about a third empty plus HA flies to OAK & & SJC in the SF Bay Area.

 

Some wonder about going to the closest port in Hilo but the Chief explained why that might not be possible. Obviously safety is the top priority but obviously the captain & crew feel it's safe going to Honolulu. There are so few flights & hotels in Hilo and many, many more in Honolulu to get passengers home.

 

To the passengers who have posted from the ship, you have a great attitude about the situation...cheers!

 

I checked the Delta site. Delta does not fly from HNL to SFO, but has 3 or 4 flights a day from HNL to LAX depending on the day of the week. Tuesday Delta is showing approx. 260 seats available to LAX. On Wednesday and Thursday the flights are full.

 

It will take several large chartered aircraft to move 2500-3000 people out of Hawaii. It's going to be interesting to see how they handle it.

[geocruiser]

I am having trouble using ship tracker?vessel finder. Is any one else having trouble. It does not seem to load a full page. Yesterday it did. Can some one help me out and post a lint that works. Thanks

[Underwatr]

And why haven't any "EXPERTS" come forward with the fact that there is a outward swinging door on the inboard aft side of the platform?

 

Why did it fail in this exciting episode? Who want's to analyze it? :D

The watertight door is to the left of the opening in that video (I've only watched the first minute or two) and it swings out to close. You can see the gasket around the periphery of the door. That's why they're saying the watertight integrity isn't breached by the loss of the platform.

 

The large door to the right is inboard of the watertight door.

[triptolemus]

I am having trouble using ship tracker?vessel finder. Is any one else having trouble. It does not seem to load a full page. Yesterday it did. Can some one help me out and post a lint that works. Thanks

 

http://www.marinetraffic.com/en/ais/details/ships/shipid:370965/mmsi:310327000/vessel:GRAND%20PRINCESS

[Underwatr]

Here's a screengrab of the watertight door.

 

[triptolemus]

Here's a screengrab of the watertight door.

 

 

We do not appear to be talking about the same door or even the same deck... possibly not even the same ship.

Edited December 4, 2016 by triptolemus

[ansoninc]

I'm on the Grand and so far everything seems normal. Everyone staff and cruisers seem very pleasant. And I heard that there is a cruise critic meeting today on the fifth deck wish I knew where thanks for all the information everybody still haven't gotten my return Las Vegas info yet.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[lstone19]

I was in the jumpseat on that flight! ETOPs at its finest.

 

Yeehootu, if you would, email me at l a r r y @ s t o n e j o n g l e u x . com

[Underwatr]

We do not appear to be talking about the same door or even the same deck... possibly not even the same ship.

 

I was responding to post #210.

 

If that's a tender platform (not clear, but in my experience the platforms haven't opened directly to a large corridor like shown).

 

No one has suggested that it's the Grand as far as I can see.

Edited December 4, 2016 by Underwatr

[gooch47]

I'd be really upset if they flew me to my home address if my car was sitting at the port. We often drive to the port even though we live in Ohio.

[Underwatr]

If that's a tender platform (not clear, but in my experience the platforms haven't opened directly to a large corridor like shown).

I watched the rest and that's not a door to a tender platform. Probably an access to a higher deck, like the one that can be seen in

.

 

[Colo Cruiser]

I watched the rest and that's not a door to a tender platform. Probably an access to a higher deck, like the one that can be seen in

.

 

 

 

 

Pilot door.