Suggestion for HAL: swap Tamarind and Club Orange

[Fouremco]

2 minutes ago, twodjs said:

Don't see how suite-only perks "cheapen" the experience for the rest of the guests.

On a new ship, suite-only perks aren't an issue. The problem arises on existing ships, when an area once enjoyed by all passengers is repurposed for the pleasure of the very small number of suite guests. Yes, Celebrity's suite perks on the Edge may not ruffle any feathers, but go back and read the acrimony-filled threads from a few years ago when Celebrity started hiving off areas and rededicating their use to suite passengers only.

[wdw1972]

I've eaten many meals in Tamarind, on several ships - mostly at tables right by the window (view of the ocean).  That's part of the ambiance, so the Club Orange location would be a big step down - one that rightfully should draw numerous complaints.  I find the whole Club Orange thing ridiculous - there was nothing wrong with using Pinnacle for the suite breakfasts, and would prefer Club Orange remained either a cooking demo/dining venue or a pub-type option.  I haven't booked a Neptune since the Club Orange crap was deployed, but I sure as hell wouldn't be going there for any of my meals - it just has zero appeal to me, whether it's "included" in my fare or not.

 

Sue/WDW1972

[twodjs]

Sue - you rock! Could not have said it better myself!

[3rdGenCunarder]

16 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

On a new ship, suite-only perks aren't an issue. The problem arises on existing ships, when an area once enjoyed by all passengers is repurposed for the pleasure of the very small number of suite guests. Yes, Celebrity's suite perks on the Edge may not ruffle any feathers, but go back and read the acrimony-filled threads from a few years ago when Celebrity started hiving off areas and rededicating their use to suite passengers only.

 

Any perk that comes out of space that was once for the "general population" brings complaints. Remember the push-back against the reserved chairs for lanai cabins? HAL had to do that to give the lanai cabins value, but for people who loved to sit on the promenade deck, it was a negative change to their cruise experience. I feel that way about the retreat cabanas at the Lido pool. If HAL wants to offer cabanas on their own deck, fine. It may have been a public space before, but there's a lot of top-deck space, and I rarely see it getting lots of use. I don't think many people were inconvenienced by the "loss" of that area. But I do not like that cabanas by the Lido pool occupy previously public space that was very much in demand. 

 

[OlsSalt]

2 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

Celebrity and other cruise lines are not losing money on their suites.  Try booking a suite on X.  They are much more expensive than on HAL.

The reason HAL has to 'fire-sale' suites is the vast disparity between HAL perks and Celebrity perks.

 

You miss the point. HAL can do fine without competing with other cruise lines in the high-end suite classes. Some ships need  to sell their "suites" because their emphasis is on the onboard experiences, not the travel experiences.  You just need room and board when the emphasis is on cruising for traveling.  HAL can lead the pack on that one.

Edited February 23, 2019 by OlsSalt

[twodjs]

Yet almost all the complaints on the HAL threads have to do with the cheapening of HAL's onboard experience. Do away with Pinnacle, the library, the dance area and live performers in the bar areas and so much more. So I disagree - they need to up their game in the onboard area, or HAL will be left in the dust. 

[TAD2005]

24 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

Any perk that comes out of space that was once for the "general population" brings complaints. Remember the push-back against the reserved chairs for lanai cabins? HAL had to do that to give the lanai cabins value, but for people who loved to sit on the promenade deck, it was a negative change to their cruise experience. I feel that way about the retreat cabanas at the Lido pool. If HAL wants to offer cabanas on their own deck, fine. It may have been a public space before, but there's a lot of top-deck space, and I rarely see it getting lots of use. I don't think many people were inconvenienced by the "loss" of that area. But I do not like that cabanas by the Lido pool occupy previously public space that was very much in demand. 

 

I agree with you on the cabanas on the Lido pool deck, eliminating the long row of public use tables that are on many other HAL ships.   Because of the Dive-In located right in that area,  people who order lunch from the Dive-In many times can't find an open table in that area, especially around lunch time on a sea day.   When the indoor Lido buffet area is totally packed, it was nice to be able to grab a table out near the pool.   Those public tables that are available on other HAL ships to anyone are now being sold for a steep price.   

[bennybear]

On our cruise with Cunard the food in the MDR was definitely disappointing in comparison with HAL.   I think the grills passengers had much better food.  The buffet and high tea were excellent.  I just don’t care for the elitist class system.  Each to their own.

We have cruised in Neptune’s and the perks of the cabin, pinnacle grill breakfast and tendering were fine with us.  I don’t need to be separate from everyone else.  What happens is the general experience gets further watered down.  

 

[OlsSalt]

3 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

Celebrity and other cruise lines are not losing money on their suites.  Try booking a suite on X.  They are much more expensive than on HAL.

The reason HAL has to 'fire-sale' suites is the vast disparity between HAL perks and Celebrity perks.

 

The point it HAL needs to ditch the few Neptune suites they have and get out of that competition game with the larger frills cruise lines, based on this limited HAL  cabin category. It is not the bread and butter of the HAL cruise experience.

[OlsSalt]

18 minutes ago, twodjs said:

Yet almost all the complaints on the HAL threads have to do with the cheapening of HAL's onboard experience. Do away with Pinnacle, the library, the dance area and live performers in the bar areas and so much more. So I disagree - they need to up their game in the onboard area, or HAL will be left in the dust. 

 

No, HAL will not be left in the dust if they don't chase their tail trying to compete in Neptune Suite perks with the larger cruise lines that have little to offer beside their frill-riddled onboard experience.. Those Neptune cabins are a very limited part of their overall inventory and probably put too much strain on the rest of the overall experience drawing in the overly demanding passenger, that HAL is not generally geared up to satisfy.. 

[cruisemom42]

9 hours ago, Despegue said:

HAL needs to stop copying some Class-based lines like Celebrity and Cunard, and provide the same, excellent service, amenities and facilities to ALL its guests. Choice of cabin/suite and their prices should only be based on location and space.

 

I simply detest these “suite only” perks that are in fashion on more and more mainstream lines, they are actually cheapening the experience. HAL needs to seperate itself and focus on giving a better quality to all the guests.

a lounge, ok, a suite breakfast area, I can live with, but seperate decks and suite-only areas, well, we are not livingmin the 19th century anymore, if that would happen, I will take my money elsewhere. 

 

I was originally just going to "Like" this post, but I feel strongly enough to add to it.

 

Many if not most people here (at least on this forum) are all for HAL sticking to what it has traditionally done well. 

 

Some people seem to think that cruising has always been about a class system, but the recent history of most leisure cruise lines (not the earlier ocean liners) up until the last 5 years or so has been that you pay extra money for the space (and possibly for more personalized service a la a butler or concierge) of a suite, but that does not also entitle you to special or exclusive enclaves onboard ship. In other words, class-based cruising went out with the advent of modern cruising in the 1970s or so....

 

I am very much against this idea of a "ship within a ship" such as MSC offers, or (just as bad) the "land grab" that Celebrity is doing by taking away areas that in the past were open to all and making them exclusive to certain cabin categories.  

 

Also, frankly, I don't see the appeal. If I'm onboard a ship, I don't want to feel like I have to stay within a certain enclave to avoid rubbing shoulders with the hoi polloi. Perhaps it is a relic of the fact that I mostly have stuck with smaller ships and interesting itineraries in the past decade, butI have always enjoyed meeting a variety of people, and I have yet to feel that service has suffered (other than in the MDR) on the lines I've sailed with.

 

HAL should certainly NOT start carving up her smaller ships with space only for suite passengers. The only reason the concept might work at all on certain ships (e.g., MSC, Celebrity) is that they are considerably larger, so there is more available space to begin with.

 

On the other hand, if HAL's future is in larger ships with greater suite amenities, then all I can say is that HAL is not MY future.  I don't think I'm alone in this preference either -- I see a almost as much dissatisfaction as praise for Celebrity's recent direction. When you've got ships that routinely carry 2800+ passengers, you have to fill ALL of the cabins, not just the suites, to be profitable...

[oceanmom]

I like the idea of putting Canaletto into Club Orange space. Haven't tried Club Orange yet as our last cruise was a family cruise.

[Despegue]

Why not have a pop-up restaurant with real regionally and sourced cuisine, appropriate to the itinerary.

HAL tauts to be all about savouring the journey, well, let us savour that journey through a dedicated place where we can sample the local cuisine, maybe even prepared by guest chefs...

as far as I am aware, this has not been done yet on mainline vessels and it would be something unique.

[OlsSalt]

If a Neptune suite takes up the same real estate as two verandah cabins, that alone should justify its price for  those who want to pay for more space. Any fluff on top of that should not make or break the deal. 

[kazu]

11 minutes ago, Despegue said:

Why not have a pop-up restaurant with real regionally and sourced cuisine, appropriate to the itinerary.

HAL tauts to be all about savouring the journey, well, let us savour that journey through a dedicated place where we can sample the local cuisine, maybe even prepared by guest chefs...

as far as I am aware, this has not been done yet on mainline vessels and it would be something unique.

 

Now, this sounds like a good idea 🙂

 

We’ve had a bit of local cuisine on the P’dam.  It was great.  And fresh local tuna, etc on the Westerdam a few years ago.

 

this would be wonderful if they could pull it off.

I believe a couple of the luxury lines do offer something similar to  this but in the MDR with local food featured.  They even have tours where you go shopping with the chef.

[ithaca gal]

We are Foir Star cruisers who have been upgraded to a Neptune Suite once (always book verandas). Loved it!  Would we pay for a larger place to spend our cruise in?  No way!  Never understood it, even with the Neptune lounge and the pinnacle grill breakfast.   Only speaking for ourselves, we don’t spend time in our cabin or in a lounge without a view when we are on a cruise.   If that is what we preferred, we would take a land-based vacation.    We have always said that the smartest people on the ship are the ones who pay for the lowest-priced inside cabin and yet enjoy everything else on the cruise that people in verandas are enjoying!  

 

Having said this, leave the Tamarind alone!  Boy did HAL get that one right!!!  Talk about ambiance and cachet!  

 

Give whatever perks they want want to those willing to overpay for them, but don’t backtrack when you have a winner!

[3rdGenCunarder]

The pop-up with local cuisine sounds great. It would be something innovative, instead of HAL's incessant copy-cat moves that  leaves them chasing other lines.

 

I used to believe in getting a cheap cabin and enjoying the rest of the ship with everyone else. But as they have packed more and more people onto ships (not just HAL), I have become tired of the chair hogs and all the books and towels enjoying their time in the sun. I book a cabin with a balcony so that I know there will be some place where I can sit and have fresh air and a view of the ocean. 

 

Edited February 23, 2019 by 3rdGenCunarder

[RocketMan275]

19 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

The pop-up with local cuisine sounds great. It would be something innovative, instead of HAL's incessant copy-cat moves that  leaves them chasing other lines.

 

I used to believe in getting a cheap cabin and enjoying the rest of the ship with everyone else. But as they have packed more and more people onto ships (not just HAL), I have become tired of the chair hogs and all the books and towels enjoying their time in the sun. I book a cabin with a balcony so that I know there will be some place where I can sit and have fresh air and a view of the ocean. 

 

All these claims that Tamarind is a 'winner'.  On our cruise on NAM last Oct, there might have been three tables including ours when we dinned in Tamarind.  And, we weren't impressed with the food.  We did find the Tamarind Bar to be very nice.  All in all, an underused facility that would make a very nice suites dining and bar area.  

[rkacruiser]

1 hour ago, Despegue said:

Why not have a pop-up restaurant with real regionally and sourced cuisine, appropriate to the itinerary.

 

I like this idea as well.  Based on my MDR experience on Nieuw Statendam, HAL seems to be attempting to have on the dinner menu one or more choices that reflected the Caribbean where we were sailing.

[DeeniEncinitas]

😪😪😪 (Please leave The Tamarind alone. As a lot of said the ambiance 

location is key AND I LOVE MY SILK DEN ON EURODAM AND THE NIEUW AMSTERDAM!)

What a name OC! I first thought Orange County housewives,

Im very disappointed withHALS concept. Were 4 STAR love when we can get NS and love the PG for our breakfasts! The idea of eating in a sterile see through glass would make me think I’m the pet in the pet window display at a store!  No

romantic quite atmosphere in my opinion,

Sorry I needed to add my 2 cents

Denkse🤒

 

 

 

[igraf]

4 hours ago, twodjs said:

... - the suites area actually relieves pressure for loungers around the main pool and lessens the demand for tables in the MDR. Airlines have first-class seating and lounges, hotels offer upscale rooms with VIP areas - why should ships be different? This is not a class seperation, but rather options depending on the price you are willing to pay.

 

The fact is that a private lounge means less space for others as there is finite space available on a ship.  The flaw with your logic is that the suite passengers can use the common areas while their space in the reserved lounge goes unused.  What you say would only be if the suite people remained in their private lounges.

 

Airlines are in fact an example of why we should avoid a ship in a ship.  The sell is that first class costs more but provides more.  The reality is that the economy seats just get worse and worse.

 

igraf

 

 

Edited February 23, 2019 by igraf

[*Miss G*]

28 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

We did find the Tamarind Bar to be very nice.  All in all, an underused facility that would make a very nice suites dining and bar area.  

 

That would be amazing.

[OlsSalt]

Maasdam EXC InDepth cruises does have a local chef on board as part of the multi-part immersion programs. As part of the InDepth offerings, he put on a specialty local cuisine dinner on our Kontiki Voyager offering his more modern take on traditional Polynesian food items.

 

It was sadly very unsuccessful. Not sure why - was he a lousy chef to start with, were the ingredients compromised by HAL food sanitation requirements, was the prep space inappropriate, was the demand to upscale the recipes to multiple portions beyond his skill set if he was used to offering more individualized portions at his own Cook Island restaurant? 

 

All the more unfortunate ,because the local dishes we sampled in town on this extensive voyage were pretty fantastic.  So while this local cuisine can be a great idea, its execution is not always a sure thing if asked to be ramped up to banquet level offerings. Though in the past others have had high praise when this has been offered occasionally on other ships.  

 

Work in progress and a very good idea. Hope it gets looked into, and whatever happened on our voyage is avoided. 

Edited February 23, 2019 by OlsSalt
queqet

[3rdGenCunarder]

13 minutes ago, OlsSalt said:

Maasdam EXC InDepth cruises does have a local chef on board as part of the multi-part immersion programs. As part of the InDepth offerings, he put on a specialty local cuisine dinner on our Kontiki Voyager offering his more modern take on traditional Polynesian food items.

 

It was sadly very unsuccessful. Not sure why - was he a lousy chef to start with, were the ingredients compromised by HAL food sanitation requirements, was the prep space inappropriate, was the demand to upscale the recipes to multiple portions beyond his skill set if he was used to offering more individualized portions at his own Cook Island restaurant? 

 

All the more unfortunate ,because the local dishes we sampled in town on this extensive voyage were pretty fantastic.  So while this local cuisine can be a great idea, its execution is not always a sure thing if asked to be ramped up to banquet level offerings. Though in the past others have had high praise when this has been offered occasionally on other ships.  

 

Work in progress and a very good idea. Hope it gets looked into, and whatever happened on our voyage is avoided. 

 

Was the local cuisine done on a MDR scale? I can see that being difficult for a guest chef used to a smaller scale. But the suggestion made here was to do it in CO, a smaller space. OF course, a small space means not everyone could have it, and HAL would charge for it.

 

[OlsSalt]

3 minutes ago, 3rdGenCunarder said:

 

Was the local cuisine done on a MDR scale? I can see that being difficult for a guest chef used to a smaller scale. But the suggestion made here was to do it in CO, a smaller space. OF course, a small space means not everyone could have it, and HAL would charge for it.

 

 

It was offered in the Pinnacle dining room and it was a full house - pricey too.