Staffing Levels Diminishing?

[villauk]

1 hour ago, TeeRick said:

On our recent Edge sailing there was more than adequate staff on board.  We never felt neglected!  The staff in the Oceanview Cafe was IMO much better than any other Celebrity ship I have sailed.

 

 

Oh, that’s where they have all gone: to Edge 🤣!

[Armac]

We first cruised on Celebrity in the 90s, our room attendant had an assistant. Our waiters had time to talk to us and joke with our kids. Even with cutbacks I think the level of service is still very good, but the staff has to work harder now to try and maintain that level.

[Baron Barracuda]

5 hours ago, SleepingUgly said:

 

Don - We actually had these four people serve us in the MDR during our recent Silhouette cruise and they were all fantastic!  One thing I did notice - the maitre d' (or whatever the manager of his allotted tables would be called) came around to our table maybe only once during our 12-night cruise.  On our last Celebrity cruise, which was back in 2008, the maitre d' stopped by all his tables pretty much every night.  Plus, I remember he was always in a white tux jacket, and this time, our guy wore a boring brown or grey suit all the time.  I'm not complaining about that, believe me!  However, I did notice that the reason he couldn't make his rounds to all the tables was because it seemed a lot more people had things to complain about! 

 

I think staff members are also run a lot more ragged these days because more people feel entitled to a certain level of service, and they won't hesitate to voice their opinions.  For instance, there was a large table fairly close to us in the MDR with three loud, boisterous families most nights (who also wore t-shirts and hoodies and jeans on NYE / evening chic night, natch).  They weren't so close that we could hear them, but they were close enough that we noticed how they were constantly sending food back and ordering other things, and the maitre d' was at their table every single night.  Of course staff members won't have time for other guests if they have to pay so much attention to this one table.  I just don't remember people complaining and expecting so much in the past.  It seems that some people think that, just because they are on vacation, they are royalty all of a sudden and their demands take priority over everyone else's needs.  I would hate to work in the service industry these days, so my hat is off to anyone who does work in that industry and can still manage to have a smile on their face!

Your '08 sailing may have been before prepaid tips.  Back then one of the provided envelopes was for hw.  The smart ones stopped by our table to chat every night.

[angelhelly]

1 hour ago, villauk said:

 

 

Oh, that’s where they have all gone: to Edge 🤣!

Actually, it might not be a bad guess...

I was talking to one of the chef on board of the Edge, and they have a group of people that will go from ship to ship are they are launched. Their best people and such. And they have to come from somewhere...

 

I am not surprised that the level of the other ship suffered from all those best employees been pulled. 

[Baron Barracuda]

Couple of years back X switched from teams of cabin stewards handling 20 cabins to single steward responsible for around 14.  This theoretically reduced the required number of stewards by almost 30%.  Remaining stewards seem ok with the arrangement since their tips increased proportionally.  Downside for passengers is your cabin may no longer be cleaned before lunch.   

[hcat]

2 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Couple of years back X switched from teams of cabin stewards handling 20 cabins to single steward responsible for around 14.  This theoretically reduced the required number of stewards by almost 30%.  Remaining stewards seem ok with the arrangement since their tips increased proportionally.  Downside for passengers is your cabin may no longer be cleaned before lunch.   

 

Guess  we had one of the best...AQ Class on EDGE. He was very impressive!

[mazza]

The only thing I've noticed that annoyed me was the lack of drinks service in the OceanView Cafe. Our cruise last year saw a change in how they did things, and instead of a waiter getting your order, going to the bar and coming straight back, they got several orders and had them all filled at the same time. Once, when we ordered as we sat down, our drinks didn't arrive until we were on our feet walking out the door. I'd never seen that before. Apart from that, things have changed over the years - it was our 11th cruise with Celebrity - and there is more stress on the staff that's quite obvious, but 99.9% of them still greet you with a warm smile and a 'hello'. Tipping is baffling for we Australians but I have started tipping our room steward extra because I think they do an extraordinary job under great time pressure. Ultimately though, I'm on a cruise and that's what matters for me. 🙂

Edited March 7, 2019 by mazza

[Doubt It]

9 hours ago, Hlitner said:

You seem to have some mis understanding of economics.  It is the Corporation's Fiduciary responsibility to maximize profits for the benefit of their investors/stockholders.  However, cutting staff, services, etc. will not generally achieve this goal because the consumers/cruisers react to changes ("elasticity").   In simple terms, consumers will take themselves and their money to a different company that provides a better product.  And the beauty of Capitalism is that such a company will exist or be created to fill the vacuum.   Under many forms of socialism there may be no incentive to create a new and better product.  Or look at from a different point of view.  Would you be willing to go on a Venezuelan cruise line?  Oops.  Are there any Venezuelan cruise lines?

 

The system only fails when the consumer (cruiser) becomes "loyal" to a particular product (cruise line) and accepts a consistently diminished level of service.  So the fault lies not with the cruise lines, but with the customers that empower them by continuing to support the product "no matter what."   You are not getting the service that you are used to....because you are willing to settle for what you get.

 

Hank 

________________________________________________________

Hank, thank you very much for your excellent analysis - it is spot on and what you say seems to allude many consumers, cruise ship and elsewhere.

 

This is basic business 101.

 

Your business perspective I completely agree with. Many posters on CC seem to not realize they are being exploited when they accept the downgrades or poor service or missing ports on a constant basis, with out complaint.  No different than your fav restaurant that raises prices and diminishes the food.

 

Myself, I fire restaurants and cruise lines, amongst others..

 

Glad you are enjoying MSC, Hank. You seem passionate about this product.

 

 

[MasterNotCommander]

Perhaps it's all about competition and the direction of the cruise industry. This situation is not unique to Celebrity, all of the cruise lines are going through the same cost cutting. It's all about selling cruises at a price that increases cabin occupancy, once you have people onboard the revenue from other onboard streams is guaranteed. 
  

That said, it seems time and time again companies go too far and either destroy themselves or recover just in time. British Airways is an example of this at the moment, cost cutting to the absolute extreme until they start losing loyal customers and people specifically avoid them as the airline tries to imitate low cost carriers. It is now just starting to try and turn things around... too little, too late? 

[QueenofKrakatoa]

12 hours ago, Hlitner said:

You seem to have some mis understanding of economics.  It is the Corporation's Fiduciary responsibility to maximize profits for the benefit of their investors/stockholders.  However, cutting staff, services, etc. will not generally achieve this goal because the consumers/cruisers react to changes ("elasticity").   In simple terms, consumers will take themselves and their money to a different company that provides a better product.  And the beauty of Capitalism is that such a company will exist or be created to fill the vacuum.   Under many forms of socialism there may be no incentive to create a new and better product.  Or look at from a different point of view.  Would you be willing to go on a Venezuelan cruise line?  Oops.  Are there any Venezuelan cruise lines?

 

The system only fails when the consumer (cruiser) becomes "loyal" to a particular product (cruise line) and accepts a consistently diminished level of service.  So the fault lies not with the cruise lines, but with the customers that empower them by continuing to support the product "no matter what."   You are not getting the service that you are used to....because you are willing to settle for what you get.

 

Hank 

 

 

[Germancruiser]

Dear me - i hope this - very interessting-  discussion does not end up in a pro und contra of socialism.

I can´t say much of the present situation on board X- ships- since I gave them a rest five years ago. I am on board the Silhouette in five weeks- then I can tell more!

Quite honestly I don´t need the waiter to entertain me- I don´t need the waiter playing games with us with match sticks or whatever they come up with!

Then the waiters used to tell us about the upcoming day and the planed highlights for the next day!

Nice but- totaly unnecesary- we all get our Daily´s!

I also don´t need the captain in the pool playing games with passengers. THAT is not his job- of course he is forced to do so by the management. For entertainement purposes they have their Cruise Directors and his or her staff!

[miched]

18 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Your '08 sailing may have been before prepaid tips.  Back then one of the provided envelopes was for hw.  The smart ones stopped by our table to chat every night.

 

We noticed the same.   When the Matre D wasn’t included in the prepaid gratuities they made a effort to make the rounds especially on the last night, and many times that was the only time we seen him.

 

Happpy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

[artvlay]

After numerous cruise it is very evident that the cruise lines are cutting back staff. We see the waiters having more responsibilities and having to work much harder. They used to have an assistant to help, buy the assistant is also over taxed. This is also happening in other departments including the room stewards and at the bars.

[bEwAbG]

My favorite is when they were advertising a flight tasting in the daily to be held in the bar outside the restaurant, and the bartender there asked us to come back after 9pm because he was assigned to the dining room and didn't have time for it.  The poor man was running ragged.  The only time I've had decent drink service has been when in Luminae or a specialty restaurant.

[Baron Barracuda]

3 hours ago, artvlay said:

After numerous cruise it is very evident that the cruise lines are cutting back staff. We see the waiters having more responsibilities and having to work much harder. They used to have an assistant to help, buy the assistant is also over taxed. This is also happening in other departments including the room stewards and at the bars.

 

Gratuity charges have risen while staffing shrinks.  While waiters, stewards, etc may be working harder their compensation has also increased.  If they are unhappy they are free to work elsewhere, but given the large number of veteran crew we encounter on X most must be ok with the workload and compensation.

[mfs2k]

 

This thread is depressing.

 

I am booked on my first Celebrity cruise aboard Equinox in 2 weeks. 

[Luvcrusn]

Don't be depressed. Be excited. Some people love to complain. Nothing is the same as 20 years ago, the world is changing. Take a look at the Cruise Critic's Choice Awards. Celebrity ships did very well. You'll have a wonderful time.

[Ereggae]

On 3/7/2019 at 11:53 AM, grandgeezer said:

 I bet most of it goes in the pockets of the executives.

I concur and don't for one minute think that the staff is getting their fair share of the tips.  The dirty little secret is that tips are no longer status quo but based on merit.  If they don't get a perfect "10" on their review, their tips are reduced accordingly.  It's really sickening that they put so much pressure on them to the point that they have to beg for excellent reviews to get what they deserve.

[MizDemeanor]

23 minutes ago, Ereggae said:

I concur and don't for one minute think that the staff is getting their fair share of the tips.  The dirty little secret is that tips are no longer status quo but based on merit.  If they don't get a perfect "10" on their review, their tips are reduced accordingly.  It's really sickening that they put so much pressure on them to the point that they have to beg for excellent reviews to get what they deserve.

 

I’d hate for something like this to be conjecture. It makes no sense to me for it to be true since I am the one conveying the gratuity. There is no cruise line that would have the right to take the gratuity and misdirect it. 

 

These statements need a fact check. 

[Ereggae]

Got it straight from the horse's mouth

[sfaaa]

Increase productivity and cutting out excess fat are always a good thing. Every company and our government should do it more often.

[Luvcrusn]

53 minutes ago, Ereggae said:

I concur and don't for one minute think that the staff is getting their fair share of the tips.  The dirty little secret is that tips are no longer status quo but based on merit.  If they don't get a perfect "10" on their review, their tips are reduced accordingly.  It's really sickening that they put so much pressure on them to the point that they have to beg for excellent reviews to get what they deserve.

Crew do depend upon good review scores for promotions and for future contracts. However your statement above seems wildly accusatory. Did you base that statement on any direct knowledge or is it your belief? I strongly doubt that X or any other of the mainstream cruise lines would subject themselves to the liability that would come with misdirecting funds to employees that have contracts.

Edited March 8, 2019 by Luvcrusn

[tce40]

2 hours ago, Luvcrusn said:

Don't be depressed. Be excited. Some people love to complain. Nothing is the same as 20 years ago, the world is changing. Take a look at the Cruise Critic's Choice Awards. Celebrity ships did very well. You'll have a wonderful time.

 

Thank you, Luvcrusn!  I feel the same way.

[Baron Barracuda]

3 hours ago, Ereggae said:

I concur and don't for one minute think that the staff is getting their fair share of the tips.  The dirty little secret is that tips are no longer status quo but based on merit.  If they don't get a perfect "10" on their review, their tips are reduced accordingly.  It's really sickening that they put so much pressure on them to the point that they have to beg for excellent reviews to get what they deserve.

Do you know this for a fact?  X can certainly link survey scores to specific cabin stewards and waiters in Traditional, but unless passenger writes them up by name just how does X know which bartenders or waiters in Select and buffet are 10's?   And what becomes of the missing tips?  Are they reallocated or does LLP just pocket them?

[MizDemeanor]

3 hours ago, mfs2k said:

 

This thread is depressing.

 

I am booked on my first Celebrity cruise aboard Equinox in 2 weeks. 

 

For a reality check, there was only one time in the MDR that we found the service to be slow and that was on the first night when the staff had to get into a new groove with all of the new passengers. It was once and it did not ruin our experience, in fact the next night they apologized to no end becasue they realized it was a long wait for us (table for two) and we felt it was genuine. 

 

We have found it an be a tough time at the Martini Bar at certain times because it is such as popular venue and when the best of them are putting on their making multiple martini's show, it can be a good long wait. It ebbs and flows there depending on the time of the evening as many enjoy a cocktail before dinner and it gets very busy. So timing is everything and patience is a virtue.  

 

Just my two pennies.