Carnival's rules for leaving/rejoining ship in different port? (Hawaii)

[Buckimion]

Can anyone explain or point me at Carnival's rules for leaving the ship at one port and rejoining in a different port? Considering staying in Honolulu (originating/terminating in San Diego) and skipping a couple of nights. (the second being a tender port that I can't debark at due to using a wheelchair) and then rejoining the ship in Hilo on the third day.

[Essiesmom]

Sorry, you can't do that.  It would violate the PVSA (passenger vessel service act) because the ship would be transporting you from one US port (San Diego) to another (Honolulu) without visiting a distant foreign port, which would be one in South America.  Or Fanning Island in the Pacific.  Allowing you to rejoin the ship in Hilo and transporting you back to San Diego would again violate the PVSA.  So, don't even bother to ask.  EM

[WorkerBee74]

Your foreign port is likely Ensenada on this itinerary but the above does apply.

[Shmoo here]

52 minutes ago, WorkerBee74 said:

Your foreign port is likely Ensenada on this itinerary but the above does apply.

Ah, but it doesn't qualify for making a cruise from one US port to a different US port legal.  It has to be a DISTANT foreign port.  Ensenada is just a foreign port.  A distant foreign port is any port NOT "in North America, Central America, the Bermuda Islands, or the West Indies (including the Bahama Islands, but not including the Leeward Islands of the Netherlands Antilles, i.e., Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao"

 

 

[Auralee]

Thought Ensenada was the one foreign port they use often with hawaii from the us as they do with Victoria (definately not distant!!) when going to Alaska? But of course that only solves the problem for 1 leg of the trip. 

Edited April 16, 2019 by Auralee

[chengkp75]

Yes, as others have said, this would violate the PVSA, which is not a Carnival rule, but a federal law.  Even if you "happened" to miss the ship in Honolulu (which would automatically cost you $750 in fines), you would either not be allowed to rejoin in Hilo, or would be subject to a further $750 fine).  The cruise line is actually fined by the government, but the ticket contract you have with Carnival gives them the right to pass this fine on to you.

[Aplmac]

Looks like you're not going to be doing this..........

[Buckimion]

1 hour ago, Aplmac said:

Looks like you're not going to be doing this..........

I question some of the logic further above, but this pretty much sums it up. Thanks.

[Essiesmom]

3 hours ago, Buckimion said:

I question some of the logic further above, but this pretty much sums it up. Thanks.

 

The logic you should be questioning is the one that passed the law back in 1880 something.  And that $750 would be per person...EM

[chengkp75]

17 minutes ago, Essiesmom said:

 

The logic you should be questioning is the one that passed the law back in 1880 something.  And that $750 would be per person...EM

And the logic of the law still holds today, if you step out of the parochial viewpoint of cruises.

[crzndeb]

9 hours ago, Auralee said:

Thought Ensenada was the one foreign port they use often with hawaii from the us as they do with Victoria (definately not distant!!) when going to Alaska? But of course that only solves the problem for 1 leg of the trip. 

When the cruise is a closed loop, starting and ending in same US port, they only need to stop in a foreign port. It’s only when starting in one US port and ending in a different US port, that a distant foreign port comes into play. 

 

 

[NWACruiser]

Say on a 10 day Hawaiian Cruise, starting in Honolulu, stopping in Ensenada, and terminating in Long Beach, how does the cruise line avoid the PVSA fine, or do they include the fine in the fare? 

[tallyho8]

2 hours ago, NWACruiser said:

Say on a 10 day Hawaiian Cruise, starting in Honolulu, stopping in Ensenada, and terminating in Long Beach, how does the cruise line avoid the PVSA fine, or do they include the fine in the fare? 

That is exactly why they do not have any cruises that start in Honolulu and end in Long Beach. Most cruises to or from Hawaii and North America start or end in Vancouver.

[BlerkOne]

3 hours ago, NWACruiser said:

Say on a 10 day Hawaiian Cruise, starting in Honolulu, stopping in Ensenada, and terminating in Long Beach, how does the cruise line avoid the PVSA fine, or do they include the fine in the fare? 

 

When Carnival did similar cruises, they began or ended in Ensenada and you were bused to/from San Diego

[scapino]

17 hours ago, Shmoo here said:

Ah, but it doesn't qualify for making a cruise from one US port to a different US port legal.  It has to be a DISTANT foreign port.  Ensenada is just a foreign port.  A distant foreign port is any port NOT "in North America, Central America, the Bermuda Islands, or the West Indies (including the Bahama Islands, but not including the Leeward Islands of the Netherlands Antilles, i.e., Aruba, Bonaire, and Curacao"

 

 

Sorry, but you're wrong. The majority of round trip mainland-Hawaii cruises do use Ensenada as their foreign port. 

[scapino]

6 hours ago, crzndeb said:

When the cruise is a closed loop, starting and ending in same US port, they only need to stop in a foreign port. It’s only when starting in one US port and ending in a different US port, that a distant foreign port comes into play. 

 

 

 

[coevan]

2 hours ago, BlerkOne said:

 

When Carnival did similar cruises, they began or ended in Ensenada and you were bused to/from San Diego

 

 

This could be a nightmare, not a fun trip when the border is flowing well. 

[scapino]

I believe that is also incorrect. Look at one way cruises from Hawaii to The Mainland. They stop in Ensenada. 

[Shmoo here]

21 minutes ago, scapino said:

Sorry, but you're wrong. The majority of round trip mainland-Hawaii cruises do use Ensenada as their foreign port. 

Yes, because any cruise on a foreign-flagged ship must stop at a foreign port.

 

I was pointing out that a stop at Ensenada is not sufficient for a one way cruise beginning and ending in different US ports, as it's not a DISTANT foreign port.

 

17 minutes ago, scapino said:

I believe that is also incorrect. Look at one way cruises from Hawaii to The Mainland. They stop in Ensenada. 

Can you point me to a one way cruise FROM A US PORT to Hawaii?

[Jasalth]

The thing I think you are getting in most of these replies is the idea that you want to sail to Hawaii, get off mid-cruise, and then take another cruise back. 

 

I don't think that is what you want to do or at least it doesn't sound like it. According to Carnival I could do this in Europe if I wanted to, but I have to contact them just a few months before for real "permission" and then go through a bunch of steps on board. In the end it probably won't be worth it to us (still deciding) but because of your limited mobility I can understand your desire to and the want to maximize your time in Hawaii. 

 

The best thing to do honestly is call Carnival or your TA and ask for sure. It might be different since it is a US port, but they can't force you to get back on the ship. It might result in fines if not done properly though like was mentioned with the PSVA fine. 

[Shmoo here]

1 minute ago, Jasalth said:

The thing I think you are getting in most of these replies is the idea that you want to sail to Hawaii, get off mid-cruise, and then take another cruise back. 

OP is asking if they can cruise from San Diego to Honolulu, get off the ship for a couple of days, and rejoin the ship in Hilo to cruise back to San Diego.

 

Legally, the answer is "no".  The PVSA looks at where a passenger embarks onboard a ship and gets off the same ship.  In this case, getting on the ship in San Diego and getting off in Honolulu.  Then getting on the ship in Hilo and getting off back in San Diego.

 

Both of those cruises are illegal, due to the requirement that any foreign-flagged ship transporting a passenger from one US port to a different US port must stop at at DISTANT foreign port.  There is no DISTANT foreign port anywhere along the route of the SD/Hawaii/SD itinerary.  The closest DISTANT foreign port is Fanning Island (about 3 days south of Hawaii, each way).

 

Since the actual itinerary for that cruise is San Diego round trip, all that's required is a stop at any foreign port.  Ensenada fulfills that requirement.

[Kadeeu]

I would contact Carnival to make sure this is not allowed.  Those citing the PVSA might be confusing a temporary stay off the ship with permanently leaving the ship which the law requires for a violation from what I've read.  You are leaving and arriving from the same port on the same ship and same voyage.  You won't be taken off the ship's manifest.  Who knows if Carnival will even want to deal with the "paperwork", but I would check.    

[tallyho8]

You can check all you want but it won't do you any good. When you cruise from one US port to another US port and get off at that port and do not get back on at that port without visiting a far away foreign port first you have violated PVSA rules and there will be fines.

[Shmoo here]

8 minutes ago, Kadeeu said:

Those citing the PVSA might be confusing a temporary stay off the ship with permanently leaving the ship which the law requires for a violation from what I've read. 

As I noted, the PVSA only looks at where a passenger got on a ship and where the same passenger gets off that same ship.  In this case - getting on in San Diego, and getting off in Honolulu.  If you don't return to the ship when you get off in a port, that's considered "leaving" the ship.  

 

That's why B2B cruises like San Diego to Vancouver/Vancouver to Seattle are not allowed.  The passenger is getting on the ship in San Diego, and getting off the ship in Seattle, regardless of the fact that they are two different cruises.

 

 

[crzndeb]

2 hours ago, scapino said:

I believe that is also incorrect. Look at one way cruises from Hawaii to The Mainland. They stop in Ensenada. 

There are no one way cruises that originate in Hawaii to a US port. Now there are one way cruises to Vancouver, which is totally legal, since it is a foreign port.