CBD and cruising

[Toofarfromthesea]

7 hours ago, Byairorsea said:

WOW!  Getting far more feedback than I anticipated on this.  If a person takes orally (drops) or uses as cream/lotion on the pain areas of lower back or hip - that wouldn't be problem flying or going ashore from a ship.  ???  I'm assuming a dog in airport isn't going to stop someone from the smell on them?   Certainly the ship or destination police aren't going to make someone pee in a cup to see if they are a user?   I'm reading between the lines and guessing the only problem would be in HAVING the product (CBD oil or lotion) in their luggage?  Again, not me, and my friends have already decided not to cruise this year.  Will wait until next year and see how he feels, and if anything has changed in having this in his possession (checked luggage or his cabin).  Thanks

 

Depends on what you mean by problem.  Getting caught?  Breaking law/rules?  Dealing with fall-out if caught?

 

I'm a medical marijuana patient in CO and I vape THC oil.  I have no doubt that:

 

1- I could easily get it on the ship as it is highly concentrated and doesn't smell, and

 

2 - I could easily vape it in my cabin and no one would know because vaping thc or herb doesn't leave any residual smell.  In my apartment you could be in the other room while I Vaped and you wouldn't have a clue.

 

But I am too old (64) and have too nice a life to put it at risk by doing 1 and 2.  I suck it up, put up with the aches and pains, don't enjoy eating as much, and drink wine more than usual to help with sleep.  Getting entangled with law enforcement is on my anti-bucket list.

[evandbob]

4 hours ago, Elaine5715 said:

The cruiser found with CBD is responsible for its content.  Whether items are found on some random security screening (yes, unlikely)or found by Customs upon re-entry (more likely), the excuse "it says it doesn't contain THC" may not be sufficient to avoid consequences.  A person using legally purchased CBD products in my state can become intoxicated since there is no prohibitions here on THC levels.   

 

If a person brings 7 or 14 CBD capsules with them on a week long cruise, and they take 1 or 2 each day, they won't be bringing any back for USCBP to find.  All gone!  Not an issue!

Edited March 7, 2020 by evandbob

[leaveitallbehind]

6 minutes ago, evandbob said:

 

If a person brings 7 or 14 CBD capsules with them on a week long cruise, and they take 1 or 2 each day, they won't be bringing any back for USCBP to find.  All gone!  Not an issue!

Still doesn't change the fact that it is not permitted by most cruise lines to be taken on board in the first place - but I guess that doesn't matter.......

[evandbob]

Just now, leaveitallbehind said:

Still doesn't change the fact that it is not permitted by most cruise lines to be taken on board in the first place - but I guess that doesn't matter.......

 

I'll show you 21 capsules, and you tell me what the prohibited items are.  Is it Alleve, a NSAID, Tylenol PM or CBD?  A combination?  Some type of vitamin?  Guess what?  Security won't know either.  This whole discussion is moot.

 

Let's agree that we shouldn't use rum runners or try other smuggling booze tricks and leave CBD alone, because security won't look for it, let alone find it.  Useless and non workable prohibitions are just that - useless.    If someone tries to smuggle it on against the rules and they are somehow caught, they accept their penalty, getting thrown off the ship. End of issue. 

[evandbob]

4 hours ago, Elaine5715 said:

The cruiser found with CBD is responsible for its content.  Whether items are found on some random security screening (yes, unlikely)or found by Customs upon re-entry (more likely), the excuse "it says it doesn't contain THC" may not be sufficient to avoid consequences.  A person using legally purchased CBD products in my state can become intoxicated since there is no prohibitions here on THC levels.   

 

I don't know how many times I've had users test positive for THC and they tried to blame something innocent, like CBD or a 2nd hand whiff, for the result.  "Wasn't me man, I didn't smoke no weed, it must been  .....(insert whatever)......Honest!"  Laughable the excuses we used to hear.

 

 

[Charles4515]

1 hour ago, evandbob said:

 

If a person brings 7 or 14 CBD capsules with them on a week long cruise, and they take 1 or 2 each day, they won't be bringing any back for USCBP to find.  All gone!  Not an issue!

What your missing is that you are cruising to foreign ports. The countries you are in have their own enforcement and some actively enforce their laws. Some do send their police onboard cruise ships docked at their ports. Conveniently they take the perp to a magistrate and almost all pay up a large fine on the spot rather than be detained in that foreign country. 

Edited March 7, 2020 by Charles4515

[leaveitallbehind]

1 hour ago, evandbob said:

 

I'll show you 21 capsules, and you tell me what the prohibited items are.  Is it Alleve, a NSAID, Tylenol PM or CBD?  A combination?  Some type of vitamin?  Guess what?  Security won't know either.  This whole discussion is moot.

 

Let's agree that we shouldn't use rum runners or try other smuggling booze tricks and leave CBD alone, because security won't look for it, let alone find it.  Useless and non workable prohibitions are just that - useless.    If someone tries to smuggle it on against the rules and they are somehow caught, they accept their penalty, getting thrown off the ship. End of issue. 

No, let's agree that all your trying to say is that you feel it's OK to ignore the rules because it may be difficult to get caught.  Regardless of any argument you may continue to try to make, it doesn't change the fact that this is a prohibited item to bring on board with most cruise lines.  So the discussion is not moot. End of issue.

Edited March 7, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[Glaciers]

On 3/4/2020 at 1:43 PM, leaveitallbehind said:

And regardless of whether it is on your person or in your stateroom, while in that port, the ship - and you - are under that country's regulations.

 

How would the cruise lines respond to someone bringing something onboard that is illegal in one of the ports they are stopping at but not prohibited by the cruise line? Would they deny boarding or just let them on board knowing that it would be illegal at one of the port stops?

[evandbob]

9 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

What your missing is that you are cruising to foreign ports. The countries you are in have their own enforcement and some actively enforce their laws. Some do send their police onboard cruise ships docked at their ports. Conveniently they take the perp to a magistrate and almost all pay up a large fine on the spot rather than be detained in that foreign country. 

 

What you don't seem to understand is that someone will have the CBD capsules unmarked in their meds dispenser in their cabin.  Do you honestly believe a 3rd world cop will look there?   Even if they did, in odds that would be greater than catching both noro and coronavirus together, do you think they can differentiate what pills are what?  

 

I stated in my 1st post that I was strictly talking about CBD capsules, not lotions or creams or oils.  Others have stated that they have vaped CBD openly with no issues, you can discuss that with them, not me..

[evandbob]

8 hours ago, leaveitallbehind said:

No, let's agree that all your trying to say is that you feel it's OK to ignore the rules because it may be difficult to get caught.  Regardless of any argument you may continue to try to make, it doesn't change the fact that this is a prohibited item to bring on board with most cruise lines.  So the discussion is not moot. End of issue.

 

I've never said to ignore the rule, in my 1st post I stated exactly what the rule is - prohibition.  Then I explained how CBD capsules, if brought on board via a weekly med dispenser would be impossible to detect.  I stated that if someone does that, they would need to know the consequences and accept them if in the jazillion to one chance they get caught.

 

 

[Charles4515]

35 minutes ago, evandbob said:

 

What you don't seem to understand is that someone will have the CBD capsules unmarked in their meds dispenser in their cabin.  Do you honestly believe a 3rd world cop will look there?   Even if they did, in odds that would be greater than catching both noro and coronavirus together, do you think they can differentiate what pills are what?  

 

The customs officers or police come onboard with a trained sniffer dog. The dog leads them to where to look. This is actually happening. In Bermuda during the cruise season multiple people are caught. It is reported every week in their press including the names of the cruise passengers and amount of the fines. Some plea it is medicinal. The authorities don’t accept that plea. 

Edited March 7, 2020 by Charles4515

[leaveitallbehind]

4 hours ago, evandbob said:

 

I've never said to ignore the rule, in my 1st post I stated exactly what the rule is - prohibition.  Then I explained how CBD capsules, if brought on board via a weekly med dispenser would be impossible to detect.  I stated that if someone does that, they would need to know the consequences and accept them if in the jazillion to one chance they get caught.

 

 

Which is the same as saying that because the odds are in your favor, go ahead and bring them on.  What about the sense of responsibility in not violating a policy or regulation and respecting that it is there for what in the eyes of the cruise line is there for a valid, and likely legal, reason?

 

My point is just because it would be difficult to be caught doesn't mean its OK to do something that violates the rules.

[c-boy]

5 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

The customs officers or police come onboard with a trained sniffer dog. The dog leads them to where to look. This is actually happening. In Bermuda during the cruise season multiple people are caught. It is reported every week in their press including the names of the cruise passengers and amount of the fines. Some plea it is medicinal. The authorities don’t accept that plea. 

hmmm. interesting,  and at the same time things are changing https://mjbizdaily.com/bermuda-releases-draft-medical-marijuana-law-and-regulations-to-spark-entrepreneurship/

Edited March 7, 2020 by c-boy

[leaveitallbehind]

9 hours ago, c-boy said:

hmmm. interesting,  and at the same time things are changing https://mjbizdaily.com/bermuda-releases-draft-medical-marijuana-law-and-regulations-to-spark-entrepreneurship/

Not saying that you are suggesting otherwise, but this will likely have no bearing on the cruise lines in terms of relaxing their policies regarding this - and the other items in the OP's topics of conversation - as they will still be dealing with flag of registry laws, international crew concerns with maritime regulations, and a vast array of ports of call laws, which will remain at the heart of their policies.

Edited March 8, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[evandbob]

On 3/7/2020 at 7:36 AM, Charles4515 said:

The customs officers or police come onboard with a trained sniffer dog. The dog leads them to where to look. This is actually happening. In Bermuda during the cruise season multiple people are caught. It is reported every week in their press including the names of the cruise passengers and amount of the fines. Some plea it is medicinal. The authorities don’t accept that plea. 

 

And those dogs are tremendously effective in sniffing out pot and illegal drugs.  They would not diminish this assets ability by training it to sniff out CBD capsules.

[evandbob]

On 3/7/2020 at 11:02 PM, leaveitallbehind said:

Not saying that you are suggesting otherwise, but this will likely have no bearing on the cruise lines in terms of relaxing their policies regarding this - and the other items in the OP's topics of conversation - as they will still be dealing with flag of registry laws, international crew concerns with maritime regulations, and a vast array of ports of call laws, which will remain at the heart of their policies.

 

When my car radar is clear and conditions and traffic allow, I sometimes travel a few miles per hour over the speed limit.  Wow, don't call the police station to send out the highway patrol, they'll probably thank you, chuckle and ignore your request.

 

Just like the cruise ships are ignoring CBD capsules and apparently CBD vape pens.  The burden, time and effort of item ID is far far greater than any possible benefit the cruise lines would get by trying to search out these items.

 

They are more interested in interdicting marijuana and rum runners.  Don't think there has been an instance of anyone being gangwayed off a cruise ship due to possession of CBD.

[Cruzaholic41]

16 minutes ago, evandbob said:

 

Just like the cruise ships are ignoring CBD capsules and apparently CBD vape pens.  The burden, time and effort of item ID is far far greater than any possible benefit the cruise lines would get by trying to search out these items.

 

No, they are not. There is a lot at stake in the maritime industry. Zero tolerance means ZERO tolerance. If it is not allowed on board and they know you have it, they will not let it slide. 

[leaveitallbehind]

1 hour ago, Cruzaholic41 said:

No, they are not. There is a lot at stake in the maritime industry. Zero tolerance means ZERO tolerance. If it is not allowed on board and they know you have it, they will not let it slide. 

I think what seems to be missed repeatedly is - as you indicate - that the regulations that are in place are not trivial or arbitrary, and are based on serious maritime regulations and different jurisdictional legalities that directly affect the cruise lines.  Otherwise, if they weren't the cruise lines would not impose them.  This has been clearly explained by chengkp75 who is directly involved with the industry, along with others. 

 

Simply because they may be difficult to enforce does not mean that ignoring them is OK, or intentionally overlooked by the cruise lines in pursuit of more serious issues.  But that will never change the minds of those who only care about their personal interests.

Edited March 9, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[evandbob]

7 hours ago, leaveitallbehind said:

I think what seems to be missed repeatedly is - as you indicate - that the regulations that are in place are not trivial or arbitrary, and are based on serious maritime regulations and different jurisdictional legalities that directly affect the cruise lines.  Otherwise, if they weren't the cruise lines would not impose them.  This has been clearly explained by chengkp75 who is directly involved with the industry, along with others. 

 

Simply because they may be difficult to enforce does not mean that ignoring them is OK, or intentionally overlooked by the cruise lines in pursuit of more serious issues.  But that will never change the minds of those who only care about their personal interests.

 

I have no personal interests at stake here - I don't use CBD nor would I recognize a CBD capsule (just like 99.99% of law enforcement, maritime experts, etc.) - but I do like playing devil's advocate with a nonsensical regulation that has no impact on a cruise experience.

 

I interpret the cruiselines inability to detect CBD in either vape or capsule form as their realization that it is useless and non-profitable for them to pursue it, esp. when catching rum runners, weed, irons, etc. that do affect a cruise experience or their bottom line is way more important.

 

They have the ban simply because it is a holdover from the Federal Gov't's failed war on drugs.  When public pressure forces the govt to change laws, the cruise lines will follow and dispense with their ban.

 

I will continue to go 73 in a 70 mph zone when conditions and traffic safely allow it.  Of course, I'll be in the minority at that speed, since the majority of drivers will be doing 80 -85 mph.

[leaveitallbehind]

2 hours ago, evandbob said:

 

 - but I do like playing devil's advocate with a nonsensical regulation that has no impact on a cruise experience

 

They have the ban simply because it is a holdover from the Federal Gov't's failed war on drugs.  When public pressure forces the govt to change laws, the cruise lines will follow and dispense with their ban.

 

I just don't understand what it is you don't understand.  It is not nonsensical.  And it has nothing to do with the Federal Gov't. regulations. The regulations are based on the flag state of registration for the ships, regulations in place with the maritime industry, and possible laws of countries of ports of call. Nothing to do with the US laws.  They are in place to protect the cruise lines, which operate internationally. 

 

Playing devils advocate or not, your arguments are incorrect as your assumptions that they are based on are wrong. To support that, following is an excerpt from post #6 in this thread from chengkp75, who would be IMO an expert in these matters as he is a career maritimer.  Please digest what he is saying:

 

While the US may have become "progressive" with respect to CBD, you must remember that once on the ship you are no longer on US territory, and no longer subject to US federal, state, or local laws.  You are under either the laws of the "flag state" (the country where the ship is registered) or the "port state" (the country where the ship is docked), in varying degrees of jurisdiction.  The reason that most cruise lines prohibit CBD is because the maritime industry, worldwide, has a "zero tolerance" for drug use, and allowing passengers onboard with CBD would open a gray area, with the possibility of cross-over to crew.

Edited March 10, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[ldubs]

1 hour ago, evandbob said:

 

I have no personal interests at stake here - I don't use CBD nor would I recognize a CBD capsule (just like 99.99% of law enforcement, maritime experts, etc.) - but I do like playing devil's advocate with a nonsensical regulation that has no impact on a cruise experience.

 

I interpret the cruiselines inability to detect CBD in either vape or capsule form as their realization that it is useless and non-profitable for them to pursue it, esp. when catching rum runners, weed, irons, etc. that do affect a cruise experience or their bottom line is way more important.

 

They have the ban simply because it is a holdover from the Federal Gov't's failed war on drugs.  When public pressure forces the govt to change laws, the cruise lines will follow and dispense with their ban.

 

 

What about other countries that still ban CBD.  Seems that possibly could come into play more so than US reg's.  

[c-boy]

12 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

What about other countries that still ban CBD.  Seems that possibly could come into play more so than US reg's.  

always check b 4 you go, cause ya never know.

[Toofarfromthesea]

Just remember, no matter what encouragement you get from people here, if you take a prohibited substance on board and against all odds it blows up in your face, it will be YOU facing the possibly serious hassles, not the cruisecritic cheering squad.

[Byairorsea]

Amazed that this topic is still "jumping around" but a lot of people seem to have strong views and opinions on both sides.  Hmmm.  I'm not a user, my friends have decided they are cruising (at least not this year) so for me it's not an issue.  I guess others are just justifying their views and ideas on the matter.  However, I DO agree with the above, it would be YOU who would deal with any hassle - if caught or pulled aside.  Cruisecritic readers would only be interested in the results, fines, punishments, or whatever.

Of course with the Corona Virus out there, not too many others may be cruising in the next few months also.  Very sad for the cruise companies, airlines, and families of the most seriously affected.

[missalexandra]

This stuff is really simple, folks. The cruise lines do what benefits them. 

 

The reason for alcohol prohibitions is the company's bottom line. It has nothing whatsoever to do with safety or anything else. Letting you bring your own booze costs them money. 

 

Allowing substances of dubious legality would be a huge pain in the ass for them and potentially open up difficulties regarding local laws. They gain no benefit unless the time comes that disallowing the substance costs them business. So they go with a blanket prohibition which covers their asses. It is a sensible thing to do and I would do the same in their position.

 

However, it also does not benefit them to actively seek out contraband unless there are safety concerns which could result in injuries and bad press for the company. This is why passengers boarding a rave cruise can expect to be searched more carefully. They are more likely to have drugs and many people taking hallucinogens at sea is a potential safety nightmare. When drug dogs come aboard a regular cruise I am sure it is because 1. local authorities demand to do it to boost their revenue 2. they are investigating something much larger than a joint or 3. someone complained. Bothering a passenger over a joint, much less CBD capsules, gains the cruise line nothing and costs them a customer. Barring unusual circumstances you have to be stupid or make a nuisance of yourself to get caught by security.

 

Drug dogs are trained to detect particular substances. Those chemicals should not be present in any quantity in CBD products. A dog walking down the corridor will not smell that in your room; they are looking for something else. Yes, they might detect it if you walk by them carrying it. So don't. The odds of being caught with CBD capsules in your luggage or room is close to zero. The odds of being caught with repackaged edibles is slightly higher (I have done it). The odds of being caught with small amounts of marijuana are still relatively small but higher, and the odds of your neighbor getting you in trouble with a complaint are decidedly not zero.

 

And yes, getting caught is the key question. I could not care less about policies promulgated to make things easier and more profitable for a corporation. I have zero regard for any rule not related to actual safety. If the drink package is not cheap, I will smuggle and not feel the slightest bit bad about it. (I have been 100% successful.) If I wanted to bring CBD capsules, I would bring them. I wouldn't smoke on my balcony because 1. it is rude to the people around me and 2. it is risky. But I view getting around rules that are arbitrary or designed strictly to allow a company to extract more money from me almost a point of honor.