Time to start fresh

[westmount]

Its been a month since we left Perth and made out way home to Canada, and we all must admit its been a pretty crazy and in many ways depressing 30 days. We were on a wonderful section of the World cruise with an  unbelievably gracious staff and crew, and although we were lost at sea for about 17 days, I would certainly have preferred to have stayed on the ship than return home to stay at home rules without the gym, activities, food and spirit of cruise life. 

  that said, the cruise industry is in turmoil, and i've read over the past month many complaints that Seabourn should be taking care of. They are not so large, don't have so many passengers to deal with, had a wonderful reputation, and so i wonder if we can't use the forum to simply tell them what we want from them. We are a pretty loyal group, and loved everything Seabourn offered to us, so let's stop complaining and simply put out to them what we think they could do better right now, and what we think they should be doing better once they get started again. 

We know they are a little player in the Carnival arsenal, but we don't care about Carnival, we care about Seabourn, and we want to know how they want to make good on things that didn't go so well over the past couple of months. 

  I believe they should be proactive right now, and setting us up for when they do in fact return. i'd like to see rooms saved for those with credits, I'd like to see them take care of those who didn't cancel on Seabourn and should be given additional upgrades and freebies. i'd like to think those that stuck with them get rewarded. This should be the time when Seabourn is telling us how they want to take care of their people, their guest, going forward. 

   It's now been a month since we got a diverted cruise that didn't  go to any of the ports we were supposed to, didn't stop for three weeks save for a pit stop for fuel and food thankfully, and yet we didn't even get an email hoping we go home safely. 

  This is a cruise line charging $1000 plus a day, and for some reason, has forgotten why we travel with them. 

  I gather many of you on cruise critic love cruise and like traveling on Seabourn, so let's support them by wishing them the best of luck, and telling them honestly where they have let us down. 

  This has nothing to do with deposits, credits, FCC or refunds, but communications to everyone, and that really doesn't cost a lot of money. 

  I don't know if anyone is going to respond to this message, but lets al be positive about the future of cruising, especially on Seabourn, and simply tell  them what we would like to see changed, and only Seabourn clients with lets say 100 days with them should respond, as they are the only ones they will listen to. 

 

[SLSD]

31 minutes ago, westmount said:

 

  This is a cruise line charging $1000 plus a day, and for some reason, has forgotten why we travel with them. 

  I gather many of you on cruise critic love cruise and like traveling on Seabourn, so let's support them by wishing them the best of luck, and telling them honestly where they have let us down. 

  This has nothing to do with deposits, credits, FCC or refunds, but communications to everyone, and that really doesn't cost a lot of money. 

  I don't know if anyone is going to respond to this message, but lets al be positive about the future of cruising, especially on Seabourn, and simply tell  them what we would like to see changed, and only Seabourn clients with lets say 100 days with them should respond, as they are the only ones they will listen to. 

 

Westmount,  Mr. SLSD and I  love Seabourn as much as you do.  We have very fond memories of sailing with them.  But here is what Mr. SLSD (a retired successful insolvency lawyer) tells me. They have a shortage of cash.  Seabourn is not in a good place.  They can't take care of their loyal customers right now because they don't have the money to do so.  They are going to hold own to every single dollar they have as they are in financial crisis.  This is the advice they are receiving from their lawyers and their financial advisors. 

 

If they sell to someone, goodwill will be part of what is being purchased and customers owed may well be made whole.  If the company reorganizes itself, everyone may well get a significant "haircut"--vernacular in the legal world for pennies on the dollar.  We all want the best for our cruising world (as we do for all for

our friends and family who have lost jobs themselves).  I think this is going to be a wait and see scenario with all of us hoping for the best all around. 

Edited April 20, 2020 by SLSD

[Covepointcruiser]

As a retired “successful insolvency “ lawyer, tell us to whom Carnival will sell Seabourn?

Speaking from the medical community, small ships may be the only successful ones in the future.   Rather be on Seabourn or Azamara than on one of the large Petri dishes.   I  won’t be surprised if the ports first open to only the small ships.

[florisdekort]

“Time to start fresh.”

 

I’ll be happy to do so once my $160,000 refund is in my bank account.

 

Floris 

 

[Paulchili]

2 hours ago, florisdekort said:

“Time to start fresh.”

 

I’ll be happy to do so once my $160,000 refund is in my bank account.

 

Floris 

 

Floris - I am sorry to hear that.

I cannot even imagine being in your situation.

[saminina]

8 hours ago, westmount said:

  I don't know if anyone is going to respond to this message, but lets al be positive about the future of cruising, especially on Seabourn, and simply tell  them what we would like to see changed, and only Seabourn clients with lets say 100 days with them should respond, as they are the only ones they will listen to. 

 

You are dreaming while in isolation.  You think people with one hundred minimum days on SB should respond to your post and state rules of being positive.   My positive prediction is that Meadows will be relieved of his of ceremonial position.  CCL cannot afford to be paying salaries to these divisional execs.  HAL runs the SB show.

 

Carnival, RCL, NCL......Are any of them paying out refunds?  I don't think so.   Are any them delaying payments for future bookings that will most likely be cancelled?   I don't think so.   It's a very real one way street with little regard to their customers.

 

My only future booking is with Crystal.....a two week freebie that ends up being not so free as the itinerary has been expanded to sixteen days and they expect payment three months prior to a sailing that probably will not happen.

 

Plenty of people are waiting for six figure refunds.    Many more waiting for refunds of $50,000+.   Hardly a time for worthless suggestions with a smiley face.

[Roger88]

If I was alone, without family and kids I wouldnt even notice this pandemia. I would just stay at home and find a million ways to entertain myself. Those who suffer the most are married men in their middle ages who have a burden to help their families and parents. I feel pity for them just as for myself. We provide for our loved ones and now we are stuck at home trying to figure our what to do next. Most of us lost our jobs and cannot afford to go anywhere. All our forces are aimed at finding provisions for our families 

[cruisetheworld67]

7 hours ago, saminina said:

You are dreaming while in isolation.  You think people with one hundred minimum days on SB should respond to your post and state rules of being positive.   My positive prediction is that Meadows will be relieved of his of ceremonial position.  CCL cannot afford to be paying salaries to these divisional execs.  HAL runs the SB show.

 

Carnival, RCL, NCL......Are any of them paying out refunds?  I don't think so.   Are any them delaying payments for future bookings that will most likely be cancelled?   I don't think so.   It's a very real one way street with little regard to their customers.

 

My only future booking is with Crystal.....a two week freebie that ends up being not so free as the itinerary has been expanded to sixteen days and they expect payment three months prior to a sailing that probably will not happen.

 

Plenty of people are waiting for six figure refunds.    Many more waiting for refunds of $50,000+.   Hardly a time for worthless suggestions with a smiley face.

People waiting for "six figure" refunds can afford it. They just need to rebook and charge another six figures on the platinum AMEX.  Easy peasy! 😁😁😁

[Les Picantins]

As I write this, I am sitting at my juliette balcony overlooking one of the main streets in my town of 40 thousand habitants.Today, there is a little more movement as a drive through COVID-19 testing pop-up was installed a half a block away. This time 2 weeks ago all I would see from this same spot were ambulances, hearses (some carrying 2 coffins), domestic food delivery vans and desperate people popping in and out of the pharmacy across the street. Occasionally people pass while walking their dogs, since that is one of the few justifiable reasons to be out in public on the streets of France.

 

For me, 3 months ago this virus was one of those tragedies that only happens on the other side of the world. A few weeks later it was ravaging our neighbors and cousins in Italy. It still didn’t hit home until BAM -on February 26th our mayor was on national news. The first COVID-19 death in France was declared and the victim had just been transferred from our local hospital to Paris!

 

I totally understand that waiting around for information about refunds or future cruises is very frustrating especially considering the substantial sums involved. I also understand the fear that those working to process those refunds and massive inquiries, are facing. Are they risking their health by showing up for work, maybe taking public transportation to a job that may be on the line?

 

I too have a cruise scheduled for this summer which has not yet been canceled. When the first wave of sailings were stopped, I waited several weeks before bothering my TA figuring she would be drowning in frantic calls from others like myself. When I finally made contact last week she had just finished arranging for her last clients to make it home safely. I hadn’t even imagined those travel nightmares trying to return to their country.

 

This situation is AWFUL for EVERYONE worldwide.
 

I guess the moral of all this is it’s better to be waiting around for a refund than waiting around for a loved one to hopefully make it home from the hospital. I have so much more to say, but this has been long enough.

 

 I can only hope that Seabourn makes it through this storm, everyone stays safe and we can all return to a life as it was just a few months ago as soon as possible.

[westmount]

Well, that was fun.

 There are many other sections of the Seabourn forum section of Cruise Critic to complain about missing deposits, or refunds not processed. I don't know if a claim for a canceled voyage is more justified than a claim for 18 days lost at sea, but let's just say I believe Seabourn will do what is right once they are ready to commence operations. I gather they haven't loaded up the office with staff to process refunds, but once they are allowed to get back to business, they know the easiest customers to lure back will be their existing clients, so all reasonable claims will be processed, whether in cruise credit or a real refund. 

  That said, I started this subject for discussion,  , so I'm allowed  to ask that sound minds simply make suggestions on how they would like to see go in the future. As an example, they were still serving self service lunch in the Colonnade, which was mystifying as things were moving along. I gather that would be a thing of the past. I also agree with a prior writer  that Seabourn will be one of  the first Cruise lines out of the gate, as the smaller ships and affluent client mix will be back quicker than the monster ships with thousands of passengers needed.  My guess date was December 15th for a couple of ships to starts sailing the Carribean or possibly Australia. It will be interesting to see how many passengers with FCC get the rooms they want vs new passengers paying full price, but that will be a discussion for another time. 

   In any case, if there's anything you  would like to see besides a refund in your account tomorrow, presume someone from Seabourn reads these things, so give it a shot, you never know who's listening. I'd like to see a Reunion cruise that would actually go from Cape Town ( or the Seychelles) with a return stop to Madagascar ( beautiful) and on to Singapore etc for 2022 as part of the World Tour that never happened, everyone gets their room back at a price we can't refuse. 

  I read yesterday of the Costa cruise that just returned to Europe after 35 straight days at sea, wow, I thought 18 was long, but right now, I'd still say it was probably the best place in the world to be, with the caveat that everyone was healthy and thankfully so. Last thing i will add, is that the magic thing the cruise lines need is instant testing, probably more than any other industry, and when that comes, I'm booking my next cruise. 

[SLSD]

18 hours ago, Covepointcruiser said:

As a retired “successful insolvency “ lawyer, tell us to whom Carnival will sell Seabourn?

Speaking from the medical community, small ships may be the only successful ones in the future.   Rather be on Seabourn or Azamara than on one of the large Petri dishes.   I  won’t be surprised if the ports first open to only the small ships.

I only mention that he was a "successful insolvency lawyer" to convey that he has been around the block a few times with big corporations.  Right now, any sale of SB would be a rock bottom prices, so he thinks they are more likely to reorganize. Frankly, a ship with 400 passengers and additional numbers in terms of crew is also a petri dish if you want to get down to it.  I think this is a tough time for everyone--in terms of health issues, job issues, financial issues.  Again, my hope that that we all get to return to cruising.  For us, it will take an effective vaccine.  

Edited April 21, 2020 by SLSD

[saminina]

1 hour ago, westmount said:

  That said, I started this subject for discussion,  , so I'm allowed  to ask that sound minds simply make suggestions on how they would like to see go in the future. As an example, they were still serving self service lunch in the Colonnade, which was mystifying as things were moving along. 

Just a guess, but I'm thinking sound minds today don't give a hoot about lunch service in Colonnade.  Looking forward to see how many people reading this thread want to play along with your game.

[westmount]

You might not like this, but more people probably care more about how service will be provided on future cruises than your refund, and how the cruise industry will be changed forever due to the virus. Seabourn is a great cruise line, but they have bosses upstairs at Carnival, hopefully things work out for all of them. The saga of the Princess Cruise illnesses will be what the average person remembers, but the funny thing is most passengers were thankful for the help and care that the staff and cruise line did for them, so there seems to be a disconnect from the operations side of the line to the corporate side, and i gather in times like this, money talks and everything else is pushed aside. 

Hopefully that will change. 

Good luck with your refund though, unless they file for protection, you'll get it. 

[johng75370]

FWIW, I like the spirit of re-thinking what the Seabourn experience could be on the other side of this crisis.  Here are a few to chew on: 

1.  Why not have a few land-based Seabourn experiences to whet the appetite for being back onboard - a pop-up TK Grill restaurant in selected cities based on where Seabourn guests typically reside; "Caviar in the Turf", Dr. Andrew Weil spa sessions, etc.  Could start those during the current hiatus, and if goes well make them ongoing.  Free/reduced charge for Seabourn Club members. 

2.  Offer a subscription-based approach:  30-60 nights for a flat fee ($300/night/pp?); or other non-traditional pricing that could help them stabilize revenues over the next couple years.  In 1981 American Airlines sold a lifetime first class pass for $250K; maybe there is something in that to help Seabourn get through the short term.  https://thehustle.co/aairpass-american-airlines-250k-lifetime-ticket/

3.  Automatically give everyone on board the Future Cruise Deposit; why have to sign up for it or work with the Future Cruise Consultant. 

 

Admittedly maybe not the best ideas, but to the point of this thread if we start thinking outside the box then we might actually come up with something that works for both Seabourn and ourselves.  

[galeforce9]

On 4/21/2020 at 8:32 AM, Roger88 said:

If I was alone, without family and kids I wouldnt even notice this pandemia. I would just stay at home and find a million ways to entertain myself. Those who suffer the most are married men in their middle ages who have a burden to help their families and parents. I feel pity for them just as for myself. We provide for our loved ones and now we are stuck at home trying to figure our what to do next. Most of us lost our jobs and cannot afford to go anywhere. All our forces are aimed at finding provisions for our families 

Men?

[jenidallas]

31 minutes ago, galeforce9 said:

Men?

 

My thought exactly.

 

The times they are a changing....

[westmount]

Johng, 

 

thats exactly what i'm taking about. Your ideas sound great actually, and i believe that's what is needed ( besides a vaccine) to get them back on track. I think Regent had the right idea with excursions being part of the price, although many of the tours i experienced  seemed to be sponsored tours rather than proper excursions, and would like to have Seabourn make excursions part of the price and experience. 

Keep the ideas flowing. 

 

[frantic36]

1 hour ago, westmount said:

Johng, 

 

thats exactly what i'm taking about. Your ideas sound great actually, and i believe that's what is needed ( besides a vaccine) to get them back on track. I think Regent had the right idea with excursions being part of the price, although many of the tours i experienced  seemed to be sponsored tours rather than proper excursions, and would like to have Seabourn make excursions part of the price and experience. 

Keep the ideas flowing. 

 

 

 

I have been avoiding reading or posting on Cruise Critic but I have to respond with this one. The one thing I particularly do not want is excursions included in the price. I have learnt to avoid them and rarely take them only if it is something I can't organise myself.

 

I did two last July on a 21 day Med cruise. One in Dubrovnik to get to try Ston oysters and the excursion ended up being small and well done. The one to Olympia because I thought it would be fine and save money in a group. The first part was reasonable the second part was horrible. It seemed the others enjoyed it just not my husband and myself. Unfortunately most of my experiences have been more like the latter tour.

 

It is why I have no plan to sail on Regent.

 

Les Picantins well said re priorities. I have lots of money waiting to be refunded but there is no point continually complaining on CC about it. Thankfully in Australia we haven't been badly affected at the moment but we have to move carefully as our Winter flu season is going to be a test for the country. 

 

Julie

[marazul]

Julie - 

I second everything you said, both on the excursions and the complaints. I want to do my own excursions (with oyster exceptions). Besides, friends who sail in Regent say that the included excursions are basic and not that interesting. There is a charge for better ones.  

 

I left my refund in the capable hands of my TA and it will come eventually.  Harassing the office staff will  not make it come any sooner. 

 

I am looking forward to sailing next year and hoping for the best.  

 

Mme. Picantin - that is the right perspective. My friends in both France and Spain are going through a miserable, scary time and most of us in the USA have not experienced anything like it, yet. 

 

Westmount - you are right to look forward to happier days. Why not? There has to be room for hope and a little fun and wishful thinking.  Our cruise was supposed to leave today.  Thinking of the future helps with the disappointment. 

[Paulchili]

42 minutes ago, marazul said:

My friends in both France and Spain are going through a miserable, scary time and most of us in the USA have not experienced anything like it, yet. 

You are obviously not in the NYC metro area or New Orleans.

[ab21au]

56 minutes ago, marazul said:

My friends in both France and Spain are going through a miserable, scary time and most of us in the USA have not experienced anything like it, yet. 

For the moment, I think I am glad to be Australian and living in Australia.  It is so sad seeing what is happening around the world. 

[SLSD]

15 hours ago, Paulchili said:

You are obviously not in the NYC metro area or New Orleans.

Our son, our daughter in law and our four year old granddaughter live in NYC.  Yes, it has been grim, scary, and life changing.  It's hard to think about cruising when you are worried about family member, but good to focus on good things to come.    I KNOW we will cruise again on Seabourn.  And Westmount is right--it IS good to have some hope and something to look forward to.   As for my suggestions,  I would ditch the buffets permanently.  We do not frequent the buffet luncheon --even on an itinerary of more than 25 days.  When in the Colinnade, we order from the specials menu.  It's all about hygiene for us--even when there is no pandemic.  

Edited April 23, 2020 by SLSD

[westmount]

just so you know i have some skin in the game, i have a big claim with Seabourn pending, have a daughter in NY, wish to cruise with Seabourn in the future, use tours by locals where available for many reasons, don't understand self service buffets in the Colonnade and won't cruise until a vaccine is found.

That said, we are all hoping this is a short term depression economically as it is or was the only way to stop the pandemic. If the world would follow the New Zealand discipline, we could be done with this by the end of the summer, so while four months of lockdown is horrible if one shuts down,  , its better than three years of the same with partial restrictions. 

I feel very lucky to have been able to cruise to all points of the world on the various top lines, and to be honest, we are spoiled rotten on all of them. I really don't know a better way to travel around the world other than on Seabourn, Regent, Crystal or the poorer cousins Oceania with the better top suites and food. 

  Let's just hope they figure out how to survive and possibly treat their customers a little bit better. as many of their practices have not been "nice" something that is not acceptable going forward. 

  For some reason, they treat everyone like crap before and after they get on the ship, and yet they manage to allow everyone to feel like Kings and Queens once onboard, not sure that occurs in any other business. 

[SLSD]

4 hours ago, westmount said:

just so you know i have some skin in the game, i have a big claim with Seabourn pending, have a daughter in NY, wish to cruise with Seabourn in the future, use tours by locals where available for many reasons, don't understand self service buffets in the Colonnade and won't cruise until a vaccine is found.

 

 

 

I hope your daughter in New York remains safe and well.  Like you, we will not be cruising until there is an effective vaccine we can access.  I don't know why, but I can never remember how to spell Colonnade!  And I'm glad you agree that self serve buffets are not what we want.  

[Paulchili]

40 minutes ago, SLSD said:

And I'm glad you agree that self serve buffets are not what we want.  

Which part do you not want - the buffet per se or the self serve part?