Cunard to Nowhere?

[ew101]

Cruises to Nowhere are apparently banned by US labor laws.  (ChengKP has carefully explained this elsewhere).  However the last I looked the UK is not part of the US.  So could Cunard come and go from Southampton carrying passengers?

 

I would expect some wildly unpopular changes to our normal routines would be needed.     Most potential guests would not go.  But some might.  The costs of running a cruise ship are largely fixed so a bit of revenue might be helpful.

 

We are facing a now well understood virus which spreads best via inhaled droplets and sadly thrives in the crowded conditions beloved by cruise line accountants and many passengers.  (Churchill wrote that humans are gregarious - wondering why there was not more disease spread during the WW2 Blitz).  So most of the norms go out the window.  If we are careful (many don't accept this) the spread can be reduced.   

 

Acceptance of terms /rules- waiving your "right to infect others" 

Sail half full

Crew in inside cabins 

Every other table 

Masks all around 

Changes to common area ventilation for less recirculation 

Some kind of new dining service model

Short trips

Face scanners to detect fever 

 

On the other hand, many elements of a Cunard experience can be preserved.  

 

 

 

 

 

[BlueRiband]

There are several threads where members posted good faith suggestions for restarting the Queens.  Many things that make Cunard special would be compromised or lost altogether.  Masks with formal attire?  Half capacity at tea in the Queens Room?  The end of the Captain’s or Officer’s tables?  Ditto for tables of six or eight?  
 

Personally I would not book a ship that operated under the conditions that you outlined.  But that’s just me.  Maybe some people want to be back so badly that they will submit to anything to get back on board.

[ew101]

2 minutes ago, BlueRiband said:

 Masks with formal attire?  Half capacity at tea in the Queens Room?  

We already wear masks with formal attire.  Waiting in line for tea is important to who? 

[BlueRiband]

2 hours ago, ew101 said:

We already wear masks with formal attire...

I don't know which formal events you attend - that are still ongoing - which require face masks.  Unless it's a masquarade party.

 

2 hours ago, ew101 said:

... Waiting in line for tea is important to who? 

A lot of passengers feel that afternoon tea is a very enjoyable part of a Cunard voyage.  Reducing capacity necessarily reduces how many can enjoy this on any given day.  I'm not willing to sail if some of the proposed dining changes that have been suggested on these boards were actually implemented. 

 

Should crew be housed in former passenger inside cabins that reduces revenue and necessarily requires much higher fares.  

 

All in all it sounds like the end of the Cunard experience as I've understood it and for a lot more money than before.    The greatly diminished experience versus drastic increase in price will make a lot of Cunarders re-evaluate if this is how they want to spend their vacation time and money. 

 

[majortom10]

Afternoon tea on QM2 TA trips is very important to us and one we look forward to everyday. Also there is no way I would go on a cruise wherever going to where masks are compulsory around the ship. Sorry not a holiday for me.

[Lanky Lad]

My first trip on QE2 was a cruise to nowhere so it can be done.  Alternatively you could cruise from one UK port to another and back again.  I expect when cruises start it will be at a reduced capacity, so you might still get afternoon tea in the Queens Room.   

[BlueRiband]

I don't see sailings at reduced capacity unless it's the first voyage and just as a way to get the service routine back on track.  It's just not economically feasible.  Not only is there less fare revenue there would also be the loss of onboard spend revenue.  Fewer passengers also means a substantially lower gratuity pool so they would have trouble getting crew members to sign on for less money.

[Germancruiser]

Oh I would sure board a  cruise to nowhere- out of Southampton on board QM2. Even at full capacity the tea in the Queens Room could be managed in two seatings- for excample! That would require a good deal of organisation- but as far as I can see it is possible!

Germany starts cruising again around June 15th- Rivercruises- but still- it´s is a beginning. The first  ( and hopefully last) wave is slowly drawing to a close around here.

[eroller]

Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings (NCL, Oceania, Regent) recently released new health safety protocols for when they begin sailing.  Keep in mind it's fluid and can be amended as conditions warrant, but it's a great start and probably what we can expect from other lines.  Masks are not required.  I think most cruise lines (as well as resorts and hotels) realize that people simply will forgo a vacation if it means wearing a mask the entire time.  They may recommend masks for certain activities like the muster drill and going ashore in tender boats.  I know Royal Caribbean is working on approval for the muster drill to temporarily be conducted in your cabin.  

 

All the NCLH brands will initially limit capacity to promote social distancing.  How much it will be limited I don't know, but again it's something.  

 

Some finer details will work themselves out, such at the buffet.  I think it will still exist but no longer self-serve.  Everything will be plated for you.  Likewise I can see shows limited in capacity with every other seat blocked off.  This will mean more performances are required but better than none at all.  

 

I think cruising can absolutely continue and even thrive.  It's a resilient business and they will adapt to the times for sure.  There will be a period of uncertainty but once past that, I can see a bright future.  I for one am ready to be back on a ship!  

 

 

Edited June 6, 2020 by eroller

[BlueRiband]

56 minutes ago, eroller said:

Norwegian Cruise Line Holdings (NCL, Oceania, Regent) recently released new health safety protocols for when they begin sailing.  Keep in mind it's fluid and can be amended as conditions warrant, but it's a great start and probably what we can expect from other lines...

 

All the NCLH brands will initially limit capacity to promote social distancing.  How much it will be limited I don't know, but again it's something...

Thanks for the heads-up eroller as the Carnival group will probably come up with something similar.  The social distancing, if implemented on Cunard, is a deal killer for me.  It would be half capacity or less at all entertainment venues.  No more large dining tables either.  I'll wait and see what happens but will cancel if it seems likely to be in force for my sailing.   It's no fun to dine alone.  I think a lot of other solos would feel the same way.

[BlueRiband]

2 hours ago, Germancruiser said:

... Even at full capacity the tea in the Queens Room could be managed in two seatings- for excample! That would require a good deal of organisation- but as far as I can see it is possible!...

I don't see that happening as a "second sitting" for tea would start to run too close to the time for the early sitting for dinner.  

[eroller]

21 minutes ago, BlueRiband said:

Thanks for the heads-up eroller as the Carnival group will probably come up with something similar.  The social distancing, if implemented on Cunard, is a deal killer for me.  It would be half capacity or less at all entertainment venues.  No more large dining tables either.  I'll wait and see what happens but will cancel if it seems likely to be in force for my sailing.   It's no fun to dine alone.  I think a lot of other solos would feel the same way.

 

 

Unfortunately things won't be "typical" when cruising returns.  Just like after 9/11 we saw a big change in cruising with security requirements and protocols, the same will happen now with cleanliness protocols related to health safety.  In time things will ease up, but some aspects of cruising might be changed for good, and that might not be a bad thing in some respects.  Things are progressing rapidly with COVID-19, and as we become more familiar with the virus things will become more "normal".  I know that is difficult to imagine now.  Also a vaccine is hopefully forthcoming and society in general may build up antibodies to the virus, so hopefully that all spells well for the future of cruising and the style of cruising that most of us enjoy (which includes the social aspect).    

[babs135]

As a slight aside to the general conversation;  if the number of passengers is restricted what will happen to those cruises for 2021 which are just about full?  Will they have to ask people to 'jump ship' and if not enough people agree to this will the powers that be draw a ballot to see who will be left behind?

[Host Hattie]

Maybe people would go for a cruise with no ports but lots of scenic cruising ! Round Britain or to Norway ?

 

[BklynBoy8]

Remember the No Where Cruises in the Early 70's sailing out of the Port of New York.

 

They uses to leave from the Manhattan Cruise Terminal 5PM on Fridays and returned on the Monday Morning at 8AM.

 

We use to sail out of NY to the open sea for Sunbathing, Recreation, Gambling, Swimming, Dining, Great Showtimes and all the other good things during a At Sea Day.

 

Before booking longer and larger sailings, it was a great chance to get the opportunity of what cruising was all about. Once you did a couple of No Where's, you definitely caught the CRUISE BUG....

[eroller]

13 minutes ago, BklynBoy8 said:

Remember the No Where Cruises in the Early 70's sailing out of the Port of New York.

 

They uses to leave from the Manhattan Cruise Terminal 5PM on Fridays and returned on the Monday Morning at 8AM.

 

We use to sail out of NY to the open sea for Sunbathing, Recreation, Gambling, Swimming, Dining, Great Showtimes and all the other good things during a At Sea Day.

 

Before booking longer and larger sailings, it was a great chance to get the opportunity of what cruising was all about. Once you did a couple of No Where's, you definitely caught the CRUISE BUG....

 

 

I enjoyed them as well.  I did several on Chandris Line.  Of course today in the US at least they are illegal.  The lines that are lucky enough to own their own private destinations (Coco Cay; Half Moon Cay; Castaway Cay; Great Stirrup Cay; Princess Cays; Ocean Cay; etc) have the opportunity to restart short cruises from Florida to these private destinations which are completely controlled by the cruise lines.  It's a contained environment and a perfect way to get the foot back in the door of cruising again.  I'm guessing these will be the first cruises you will see restart from the US.    

[eroller]

5 hours ago, babs135 said:

As a slight aside to the general conversation;  if the number of passengers is restricted what will happen to those cruises for 2021 which are just about full?  Will they have to ask people to 'jump ship' and if not enough people agree to this will the powers that be draw a ballot to see who will be left behind?

 

 

Hopefully it won't come to that, and by 2021 this will have all worked itself out.  If it does, I would imagine they will decide by booking date ... but honestly I'm guessing it won't.  

[chengkp75]

46 minutes ago, eroller said:

restart short cruises from Florida to these private destinations which are completely controlled by the cruise lines.

These are not "completely controlled" by the cruise lines, they are still part of the Bahamas, and while the Bahamas has announced they are reopening their borders July 1, they could just as easily close them again, closing those private islands.

[eroller]

15 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

These are not "completely controlled" by the cruise lines, they are still part of the Bahamas, and while the Bahamas has announced they are reopening their borders July 1, they could just as easily close them again, closing those private islands.

Yes true they still fall under the government of the Bahamas, but my point was that the cruise lines have a controlled environment with these private destinations that they largely control, and they make an ideal starting point to resume cruises.  I’ll also mention the cruise lines have s fair amount of leverage with the Bahamian government due to these investments, and the overall revenue they bring to the country, which of course heavily relies on tourism dollars.  

Edited June 6, 2020 by eroller

[Lanky Lad]

I did wonder about Southampton to Liverpool and back.  Would give you a day at sea, a day in Liverpool then another day at sea.  Not the most exciting trip but it could be done.  Unless I have technically been to Bermuda as well.

[eroller]

Some local market cruises are already in the start-up phase.  Mostly with small ships.    

 

Seadream Yacht Club will offer some sailings in Norway (marketed to Norwegians) this month (June).  The response was so well received they are adding a second ship.  

 

Viking Ocean is testing the market for possible "Round-Britain" cruises out of the UK in July.  

 

Ponant is looking to resume cruises from France as early as July 4.  Five itineraries.  

 

Scylla river cruises in Europe have already embarked their first passengers a few days ago in Passau.    

 

 

So we are already seeing the very beginnings of the restart of cruising.  This comes are more countries are opening up (which will be key to restarting any operation), air lift is expanding (more frequency and destinations every month), and some key destinations are reopening like Las Vegas and Disney World in Florida.  

 

 

 

 

Edited June 6, 2020 by eroller

[BlueRiband]

Scylla, to improve social distancing, has banned use of passenger elevators.  Maybe a 2-3 deck river boat can do this but not a ship with dining on deck 2 and cabins on deck 13.

[eroller]

7 minutes ago, BlueRiband said:

Scylla, to improve social distancing, has banned use of passenger elevators.  Maybe a 2-3 deck river boat can do this but not a ship with dining on deck 2 and cabins on deck 13.

 

 

Nope.  Things will be different for large passenger ships.  They may "recommend" wearing masks in tight spaces like elevators, and post signs for max occupancy of elevators due to social distancing.  Compliance will likely be left up to the passengers ... who I might mention are already pretty good at balking if too many people enter the elevator.  Initially limiting overall capacity like the NCLH brands are doing will help ease elevator crowding but obviously not entirely (like after a show lets out).  Maybe more people will use the stairs (those that can), but otherwise be prepared for longer waits.  Part of a new reality, at least for now.   

 

Honestly for those that are inpatient, hate restrictions, or have health concerns, now (and the near future) is probably not the time to cruise OR the other option (for those that can afford it) is to pay more and sail on a small luxury ship where social distancing is simply not an issue.    

Edited June 6, 2020 by eroller

[showingdiva]

1 hour ago, Lanky Lad said:

I did wonder about Southampton to Liverpool and back.  Would give you a day at sea, a day in Liverpool then another day at sea.  Not the most exciting trip but it could be done.  Unless I have technically been to Bermuda as well.

 

A trip I did on the QM2 last year .. just the one way Southampton - Liverpool as part of the 175th celebrations.  Sailed out of Southampton on a beautiful, hot July evening.  Water like a mill pond.  Lovely views of the Isle of Wight and South coast.   Great, restful day at sea doing all the usual QM2 things (planetarium, leisurely lunch, library, shops, afternoon tea etc).   Sailed into Liverpool around midnight to a welcome from tugs and plenty people on both sides of the Mersey waiting to see her).  And a very civilised disembarkation time the following morning.   Loved it.

[jsn55]

On 6/5/2020 at 8:37 AM, ew101 said:

Cruises to Nowhere are apparently banned by US labor laws.  (ChengKP has carefully explained this elsewhere).  However the last I looked the UK is not part of the US.  So could Cunard come and go from Southampton carrying passengers?

 

I would expect some wildly unpopular changes to our normal routines would be needed.     Most potential guests would not go.  But some might.  The costs of running a cruise ship are largely fixed so a bit of revenue might be helpful.

 

We are facing a now well understood virus which spreads best via inhaled droplets and sadly thrives in the crowded conditions beloved by cruise line accountants and many passengers.  (Churchill wrote that humans are gregarious - wondering why there was not more disease spread during the WW2 Blitz).  So most of the norms go out the window.  If we are careful (many don't accept this) the spread can be reduced.   

 

Acceptance of terms /rules- waiving your "right to infect others" 

Sail half full

Crew in inside cabins 

Every other table 

Masks all around 

Changes to common area ventilation for less recirculation 

Some kind of new dining service model

Short trips

Face scanners to detect fever 

 

On the other hand, many elements of a Cunard experience can be preserved.  

 

 

 

 

 

We are scheduled to sail in September.  No problem with lots of changes to keep people safe, but I cannot imagine wearing a mask every time I leave my cabin.  What do y'all think?