Carnival sale of Cunard rumoured

[BigAl94]

Don't subscribe to this but here's the headline https://www.tradewindsnews.com/cruise-and-ferry/carnival-believed-to-be-eyeing-sale-of-cunard-and-seabourn-brands-cruise-insiders-say/2-1-848809?fbclid=IwAR2yx42GV5Nptl_L24Wsacv1aHVAxQQgazDFmYYXOU80zl1Dh8pciGNULhs

[oskidunker]

You need to pay to read the story. 

[rrunner]

I read the article on Face Book this afternoon.  Surprised  no comments   

[seacruise9]

Hi, 

 

Could someone please provide some further information concerning this rumor? I'm not on Facebook. 

 

Thanks,

 

Chuck

[Burgee]

2 hours ago, seacruise9 said:

Hi, 

 

Could someone please provide some further information concerning this rumor? I'm not on Facebook. 

 

Thanks,

 

Chuck

 

See below 

https://www.cruisehive.com/its-reported-that-carnival-could-be-selling-cunard-and-seabourn/40949

[canoncruiser]

Just read the article. It sounds like carefully planted industry gossip - and entirely speculative. BUT The basis of the story is that Cunard and Seabourn depend on an aging and diminishing  customer base and that Carnival wants to make more money with brands that cater to a ‘younger’ customer base that is more promising . But there is  always an aging and prospering demographic who will want move beyond the mass market.  I’ve spent a lot of time on Cunard ships and , yes there are a large number of ‘seniors’, but in my experience they are not floating retirement homes, there is lots of life and energy. So we’ll see. 🤨

Also, not really sure that Cunard’s fleet will appeal to ‘fast buck’ types-though great ships have been cheapened before.But the real issue nowadays is the Pandemic. 

[rrunner]

1 hour ago, canoncruiser said:

Just read the article. It sounds like carefully planted industry gossip - and entirely speculative. BUT The basis of the story is that Cunard and Seabourn depend on an aging and diminishing  customer base and that Carnival wants to make more money with brands that cater to a ‘younger’ customer base that is more promising . But there is  always an aging and prospering demographic who will want move beyond the mass market.  I’ve spent a lot of time on Cunard ships and , yes there are a large number of ‘seniors’, but in my experience they are not floating retirement homes, there is lots of life and energy. So we’ll see. 🤨

Also, not really sure that Cunard’s fleet will appeal to ‘fast buck’ types-though great ships have been cheapened before.But the real issue nowadays is the Pandemic. 

Their ships  will be empty if they make it more difficult for older people to travel especially if they have existing health issues.  It will not be easy filling cabins for a world cruise .        

[seacruise9]

Hi,

 

Thanks for posting the link to the article. If Carnival Corporation wants a younger demographic, I wonder if the sale of Holland America also might be a possibility? Also, there is no mention of a potential buyer of Cunard and Seabourn. I think Carnival Corporation has been a good owner of these lines because it has invested in new ships. Of course, the shipping industry has changed tremendously in the past few months. It will be interesting to see what develops.

 

Chuck

[Windsurfboy]

The quest for the younger demographic is common,  a function of a misconception by the young an innumerate marketing departments with no understanding of The economics and demographics . The so called elderly is the fastest growing demographic in the world. The well off "elderly" have far more  disposable income than the young/middle aged. We are the only people with the time and more importantly  spare money for multiple cruises every year in year out. 

 

Let carnival chase the young.  Hopefully a new buyer will snap up Cunard and  Seabourn, someone who understands what the biggest and wealthiest demographic want. No more dilution of standards. 

[ew101]

If you bought Cunard Line for say half price, (or less), you could run the ships half full and possibly make a go of it.   Not having a giant mortgage takes off a lot of cash flow pressure.  There is a large supply of potential investment capital sitting in banks right now all over the world.  

 

I would walk away from ship #4.  Unless you could put it on hold and modify it for better indoor air circulation.  The cruise liner of the future is not as densely packed as the ones of 2019.    

 

[Solent Richard]

I can only 'copy and paste' an entry from one of my Cunard fb groups which was written earlier this morning and comes from a most reliable source...

 

"Carnival Corporation denies it is considering selling the Cunard and Seabourn brands. Chief communications officer Roger Frizzell said: ‘There is no truth to this rumour. Cunard and Seabourn are iconic brands for our company, and both lines have a strong track record of success over the years.’"

 

Meanwhile it was good to see Queen Victoria slipping past this morning as we were taking breakfast on our balcony...

 

 

 

Edited July 30, 2020 by Solent Richard

[majortom10]

Personally depending on who bought Cunard I dont think it would be a bad thing if Carnival sold Cunard.

[foodsvcmgr]

Not sure if the existing major cruise lines would have interest or more importantly need to take over Cunard and or Seabourn.

Most likely private capital, ideally hiring some good experienced people from the industry if it were to happen at all.

MSC is looking to create a luxury division so possibly Seabourn could benefit them in that regard.

[newjoisey]

business wise this virus will/is thinning the herd , i do not know if cunard will survive but i would not buy their stock............. 

[BlueRiband]

12 hours ago, ew101 said:

If you bought Cunard Line for say half price, (or less), you could run the ships half full and possibly make a go of it.   Not having a giant mortgage takes off a lot of cash flow pressure.  There is a large supply of potential investment capital sitting in banks right now all over the world...

 

Doubt if that would work.  A ship sailing at half capacity doesn’t run on half the crew.  Certainly fewer stewards and waiters would be needed but it would still need a full engineering, deck, bridge, and entertainment staff.  

[bluemarble]

I don't know how much we can read into this, but I found the following observation interesting from this article found on cruiseradio.net: Carnival Addresses Rumors They’re Selling Two Cruise Lines

 

"What makes this particularly interesting is the quickness and firmness with which the rumor was denied. You’ll recall that earlier this month, when news began to break that Carnival Fantasy had been sold and was heading for the scrapyard, Carnival told Cruise Radio that they were not “in a position to confirm, deny or comment on speculation or rumor.”"

[resistk]

CCL share price is holding up; but they will be under pressure to cut costs the longer the pandemic drags out. The only way they can cut costs right now is shed liabilities and a parked cruise ship can be worse than no cruise ship.  Keep in mind too, as the economy eventually returns, they will start to reacquire ships.

[RJChatsworth]

Cunard might not be up for sale but if the right offer came along you wouldn't bet on them not selling!

[WorldTraveler151208]

I have come across rumors on various websites that the Carnival Corporation is considering selling Cunard and Seabourn. Is it true? Who would take over Cunard?

[majortom10]

Private equity company cannot see any current cruise companies in current circumstances wanting to buy more cruise ships when nobody knows how cruising is going to be for next 12 months.

[WorldTraveler151208]

With Carnival in such a difficult situation, perhaps it would be better for Cunard if they were independent.  It would be best if some company from another industry bought them. Anyway, after this crisis, Carnival will certainly not be able to provide Cunard with proper development, because they will probably first try to save the leading cruise lines like Carnival, Princess and Costa. Cunard, on the other hand, will need to develop after the crisis as the fleet is aging fast.  Cunard is a great cruise line with history and someone should take care of its development, but at the same time maintain the quality for which it is known. It would be a real shame if the 180-year-old line collapsed because of the pandemic. 

[exlondoner]

11 minutes ago, WorldTraveler151208 said:

With Carnival in such a difficult situation, perhaps it would be better for Cunard if they were independent.  It would be best if some company from another industry bought them. Anyway, after this crisis, Carnival will certainly not be able to provide Cunard with proper development, because they will probably first try to save the leading cruise lines like Carnival, Princess and Costa. Cunard, on the other hand, will need to develop after the crisis as the fleet is aging fast.  Cunard is a great cruise line with history and someone should take care of its development, but at the same time maintain the quality for which it is known. It would be a real shame if the 180-year-old line collapsed because of the pandemic. 

 

Why is the fleet aging fast? Surely it continues to age at the same speed, like us all.

[WorldTraveler151208]

13 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

 

Why is the fleet aging fast? Surely it continues to age at the same speed, like us all.

My point is that Cunard has not had any new ship in last 10 years and it is not known if, with this turn of events, they will be able to build the fourth one on time. Maybe it does not look like this, but the flagship QM2 is already 17 years old.  That is a lot for a ship. Something fresh in the fleet is necessary.

[princeton123211]

2 hours ago, WorldTraveler151208 said:

Maybe it does not look like this, but the flagship QM2 is already 17 years old.  That is a lot for a ship. Something fresh in the fleet is necessary.

She was designed to sail til 40 years old-- much longer than most cruise ships. 

[canoncruiser]

PRIVATE EQUITY!!!!!!!🤢 Most of the PE acquisitions strip a firm of its cash and load it up with debt in order to reward themselves with huge fees. God forbid such a fate for Cunard. The acquired firm then spirals into overwhelming debt and starts cutting and cutting to pay off the debt; imagine such a fate for Cunard. 😠