Gratuity on top of Cover Charge

[jelayne]

3 minutes ago, Kilroyshere said:

I named 2 premium cruise lines in the post you responded to where tipping is not a mandatory automatic fee. In fact, they state: 'Tipping is neither required nor expected.'

 

It's the same non-mandatory tipping policy at my local health club, masseur, barber, nearly all restaurants I frequent (unless party is of 6 to 8 or more which is disclosed on the menu) and most other service venues where tipping is customary, but not required.

 

I tip generously for good to excellent service. I will tip lower when service is IMO not satisfactory nor up to par. 

 

I dislike mandatory tipping. It IMO does not incentivize Premium service when the operator knows it's a guaranteed revenue stream regardless of service quality delivered.

 It seems that Seaborn and Regent are better suited for your cruising.

[Ipeeinthepools]

17 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

University Level Look at Tipping as a Social Norm

"Tipping has several different forms, : reward-tipping, price tipping, tipping-in advance, bribery-tipping, holiday-tipping and gift-tipping. The common feature of all forms of tipping is the voluntary and discretionary nature of the tip: the consumer is free to choose how much to tip, if at all. This definition excludes service charges [aka discretionary service charges] that are sometimes added to the bill (for example in many European countries), imposed gratuities (US restaurants often impose a 15-18 percent gratuity for large parties – usually six diners or more), [cruise ship imposed gratuities]and imposed tips (for example some tour packages include a certain amount that the consumer has to pay for tips). Indeed, these cases have little in common with voluntary tipping."

 P.S. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23748777_The_Social_Norm_of_Tipping_A_Review

 

Just tell me what's expected.  If you want me to leave 18-20% in cash, I will.  if you want me to add 15-20% to the bill and do the math, I will.  If the restaurant wants to add 18-20%, that's fine I'll sign the bill.  At least in the US, service has little to do with the tip, it's an additional charge that's expected.  I'm not going to try and re-invent the system because I think it should be different.

[Oceangoer2]

2 hours ago, D C said:

That's the thing. You DID tip 18% already, as Celebrity said that service charge was included in the cover charge for the specialty restaurant.  If you DOUBLE tipped before with an extra 18%, then you're only single tipping now. 

my head is spinning  🤑🥴.... how many more ways can we explain this???

[Bo1953]

17 hours ago, Mark_T said:

... and that remains my concern, as this certainly does nothing to benefit the staff, if the service charge doesn't make its way into their pockets and I would expect that it will have had a significant impact on the number of people leaving additional tips...

Do you have reason to believe or direct knowledge that the SC does not go to the staff to some degree or is this speculation???

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

[Kilroyshere]

28 minutes ago, jelayne said:

 It seems that Seaborn and Regent are better suited for your cruising.

This thread revealed to us that despite the Retreat Amenities page stating tips are included, that is not so as we understood it advertised when we booked our X cruise.

 

It's all part of a cruise experience that will determine if we become Retreat repeaters or not.

 

 

Edited October 31, 2022 by Kilroyshere

[Bo1953]

20 hours ago, CaroleSS said:

I am well aware of this.......BUT, when the conversation goes like this......

 

me: how much it will cost to upgrade the two of us from classic to premium?
X: it will be $abc for the two of you

me: is that including my Captains Club discount and the gratuity

X: yes

me: ok, that's great

 

and after the phone call, I check my account and I was charged $abc + 18%......yes, I think that is being dishonest. I specifically asked if the charge included the gratuity and was told "yes"......When I called back to ask about the additional charge, I was told that they quote you a price based upon the "first screen", but the gratuity is only added once they put the "items in the cart". I asked why don't they just wait to tell you the price until they add it to the cart. I was told because it is time consuming to go through all those screens to only be told "no".

 

I'm just asking for honesty and transparency. Tell me the "true" cost and I will determine if I want the product or not, but to tell me the cost is one amount and charge me another - and never tell me there is an additional cost isn't appropriate......especially when I specifically asked!

Personally, methinks that is an issue concerning the Rep you spoke to rather than X.

 

Does the Rep require some additional training, of course and one can call X to point this out based on the experience.

 

Yet to 'categorically' blame X for this, may be a bit out of the park, do you not think???

 

I do understand the concern, regardless, yet at X's website it is clear what is what concerning the beverage packages and I would have done a quick calculation to know the 'ball park' of what to expect in terms of cost before calling in. If the price did not sound correct, then there would be additional questioning just to make sure there would not later surprizes, if it mattered that much to me.

 

That is just me, though, and a few others I Am sure. Yet, it sounds like you may be new to X and do not yet fully understand the pricing and gratuities added to packages.

 

Cheers and bon voyage

[Mark_T]

3 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

Do you have reason to believe or direct knowledge that the SC does not go to the staff to some degree or is this speculation???

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

Entirely speculation, as is so often the case in these matters 🙂

 

... it has more to do with the way this has been implemented, previously the cover charge included gratuity, and many, myself included, tipped extra on top...

 

If the cover charge had simply increased, nothing would have changed and I would still be tipping on top.

 

By adding the mandatory 'gratuity' instead of raising the cover charge, I believe it will greatly decrease the additional tipping, but I remain concerned, without any evidence, that this move has more to do with price increases than increasing the amount available to staff as tips...

 

If the opportunity arises I'll seek clarification once onboard.

 

[morpheusofthesea]

27 minutes ago, Ipeeinthepools said:

service has little to do with the tip

I tend to agree to some extent. So I find tipping in advance, over and above the included gratuities, generally most helpful in getting the service I am looking for. One must be careful with tipping in advance that the maitre d' is there for the whole trip, that the butler/host/steward is not stricken with a malady and taken out of commission or your watier is assigned to another venue. As the university review found that 'in advance tipping' use to be the most popular form of tipping and the service provider actually performs better. Most are confusing imposed gratuities with tipping. " Indeed, these cases have little in common with voluntary tipping." (Azar/ Arrow)

Edited October 31, 2022 by morpheusofthesea

[morpheusofthesea]

17 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

Do you have reason to believe or direct knowledge that the SC does not go to the staff to some degree or is this speculation???

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

Very interesting !  Went back and found this social media post. Purported to be a former crew member.

"Lorena M.

I confirm, I used to work in NCL, and the crew DOES NOT get the services charges that are automatically charged to the guests accounts. If you want people to get tips, cancel those on your account, and give them in hand to the people who deserve them."

Though we would never go as far as cancelling anything like DSC..we do enjoy the act of tipping extra.

[Bo1953]

14 minutes ago, Mark_T said:

Entirely speculation, as is so often the case in these matters 🙂

 

... it has more to do with the way this has been implemented, previously the cover charge included gratuity, and many, myself included, tipped extra on top...

 

If the cover charge had simply increased, nothing would have changed and I would still be tipping on top.

 

By adding the mandatory 'gratuity' instead of raising the cover charge, I believe it will greatly decrease the additional tipping, but I remain concerned, without any evidence, that this move has more to do with price increases than increasing the amount available to staff as tips...

 

If the opportunity arises I'll seek clarification once onboard.

m - only you know for sure, yet will the 'investigation' be a good use of vacation time?

 

At this juncture, will it matter in the total scheme of things, if you do the investigation, please make sure you have a cross section of staff in each specialty dining facility to gauge the range of responses, if there are in fact, differences.

 

bon appetit and bon voyage

[morpheusofthesea]

On 4/13/2022 at 10:18 AM, Panzano said:

We were on the Reflection a few weeks ago and towards the end of our cruise we were going to leave our stateroom attendant a tip from our OBC.  We let him know that we were doing that and we got the sense that he would have preferred cash.  We ended up giving him cash instead of a tip from our OBC.

 

We were wondering why we got the response we got. I wonder if they pay taxes on their pay and if their tips show up in their paycheck from an OBC tip that it becomes taxed.

[Bo1953]

2 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

On 4/13/2022 at 10:18 AM, Panzano said:

We were on the Reflection a few weeks ago and towards the end of our cruise we were going to leave our stateroom attendant a tip from our OBC.  We let him know that we were doing that and we got the sense that he would have preferred cash.  We ended up giving him cash instead of a tip from our OBC.

 

We were wondering why we got the response we got. I wonder if they pay taxes on their pay and if their tips show up in their paycheck from an OBC tip that it becomes taxed.

... or could it be the timing of when they receive them, possibly???

 

Just a thought and thank you,

 

bon voyage

[morpheusofthesea]

2 minutes ago, Bo1953 said:

... or could it be the timing of when they receive them, possibly???

 

Just a thought and thank you,

 

bon voyage

Benefit of the doubt? I want you on any jury I might be destined to have.

[wrk2cruise]

37 minutes ago, Kilroyshere said:

This thread revealed to us that despite the Retreat Amenities page stating tips are included, that is not so as we understood it advertised when we booked our X cruise.

 

It's all part of a cruise experience that will determine if we become Retreat repeaters or not.

 

 

Tip are included on all things included in the Retreat amenities.   You will be charged automatic gratuities on anything over and above the amenities which are included with your cabin type.

 

For example you have a premium drink package included.  You can have any drink up to the $15 limit and the gratuity is included.   If you order a $21 glass of wine in Luminae you will be charged $6 + $1.20 gratuity.   Celebrity is not an all inclusive line even in the highest Retreat categories.

[Pinboy]

5 minutes ago, morpheusofthesea said:

Benefit of the doubt?

4 pages already--

No " benefit of the doubt " required.

Some people just don't/won't want to tip--- easy to see who---they always " find " ( make up ) an excuse not to tip-- 

Ya spend $$$ on a cruise and post ( need others opinion ) whether tipping is included in room service delivery ??  ( Unbelievable ).

And, about Specialty restaurants--- tipping included or not-- Is it such a " big deal " to hand your Server a few $$ ?  

Lastly-- GR should have a policy to not remove Gratuities---

If the Customer is unhappy and wants to remove Gratuities, tell them to take it up with Head Office after the cruise--- or worse ( LOL) -- complain to the Captain that your Stateroom Attendant didn't bring the ice or your Butler didn't " draw " your bath on time.

LOL-- Now, if your Waiter forgot to bring your 3 shrimp cocktails at the same time--- that's a different " story ".

 

 

[Purplsmurf]

We very rarely book specialty restaurants and when we do it’s on board with a discount. We have a cruise in May for our 30th anniversary. Originally booked a SS, but can’t justify $14k for a ship that hasn’t been revolutionized, so we changed to Aqua (which was actually cheaper than a veranda). We decided to eat in specialty twice. I booked on line, made our reservation and paid. If it’s already paid for (gratuity was included) , I won’t be paying another 18% once there will I? Might sound like a stupid question, but as I said, we rarely eat in specialty restaurants, but decided to do 2 since we gave up our suite. 

[AnnaNicole]

1 hour ago, Bo1953 said:

Personally, methinks that is an issue concerning the Rep you spoke to rather than X.

 

Does the Rep require some additional training, of course and one can call X to point this out based on the experience.

 

Yet to 'categorically' blame X for this, may be a bit out of the park, do you not think???

 

I do understand the concern, regardless, yet at X's website it is clear what is what concerning the beverage packages and I would have done a quick calculation to know the 'ball park' of what to expect in terms of cost before calling in. If the price did not sound correct, then there would be additional questioning just to make sure there would not later surprizes, if it mattered that much to me.

 

That is just me, though, and a few others I Am sure. Yet, it sounds like you may be new to X and do not yet fully understand the pricing and gratuities added to packages.

 

Cheers and bon voyage

With all due respect, if a representative of X is misquoting X's product that indeed is an issue concerning X.   X bears the ultimate responsibility in ensuring proper communication of its products to its customers.    

Why would you think X is not at fault if reps giving false and misleading information?  Is it X's responsibility to properly train their reps?

[AnnaNicole]

23 minutes ago, Purplsmurf said:

We very rarely book specialty restaurants and when we do it’s on board with a discount. We have a cruise in May for our 30th anniversary. Originally booked a SS, but can’t justify $14k for a ship that hasn’t been revolutionized, so we changed to Aqua (which was actually cheaper than a veranda). We decided to eat in specialty twice. I booked on line, made our reservation and paid. If it’s already paid for (gratuity was included) , I won’t be paying another 18% once there will I? Might sound like a stupid question, but as I said, we rarely eat in specialty restaurants, but decided to do 2 since we gave up our suite. 

Your bill will be $0 at the restaurant (unless you order an upcharge menu item).   18% of $0 is $0.  You can leave an additional tip if you feel it is warranted but it is not necessary.

[mayleeman]

2 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

Personally, methinks that is an issue concerning the Rep you spoke to rather than X.

 

Does the Rep require some additional training, of course and one can call X to point this out based on the experience.

 

Yet to 'categorically' blame X for this, may be a bit out of the park, do you not think???

 

I do understand the concern, regardless, yet at X's website it is clear what is what concerning the beverage packages and I would have done a quick calculation to know the 'ball park' of what to expect in terms of cost before calling in. If the price did not sound correct, then there would be additional questioning just to make sure there would not later surprizes, if it mattered that much to me.

 

That is just me, though, and a few others I Am sure. Yet, it sounds like you may be new to X and do not yet fully understand the pricing and gratuities added to packages.

 

Cheers and bon voyage

 

Nice post, and good to see you back here again (I might have just missed your poosts because I don’t read all the threads!).

 

The first post by Carole just said the rep quoted the price and then the charge for gratuity showed up on the bill. Her later post included the conversation where she says she specifically asked if tip was included and was told yes. The second version (the one you quoted) definitely shows a problem of the rep being wrong/careless at best, and possibly lying at worst. Her first version presented an omission that may have been entirely innocent because the base price was probably what the rep thought was being asked. Nothing nefarious IMO.

[dlh015]

1 minute ago, mayleeman said:

 

Nice post, and good to see you back here again (I might have just missed your poosts because I don’t read all the threads!).

 

The first post by Carole just said the rep quoted the price and then the charge for gratuity showed up on the bill. Her later post included the conversation where she says she specifically asked if tip was included and was told yes. The second version (the one you quoted) definitely shows a problem of the rep being wrong/careless at best, and possibly lying at worst. Her first version presented an omission that may have been entirely innocent because the base price was probably what the rep thought was being asked. Nothing nefarious IMO.

I noticed that also. 'Nuff said  😁

[Oceangoer2]

2 hours ago, Pinboy said:

LOL-- Now, if your Waiter forgot to bring your 3 shrimp cocktails at the same time--- that's a different " story ".

😉

[Mark_T]

4 hours ago, Purplsmurf said:

If it’s already paid for (gratuity was included) , I won’t be paying another 18% once there will I? Might sound like a stupid question, but as I said, we rarely eat in specialty restaurants, but decided to do 2 since we gave up our suite. 

If you booked and paid after they started adding the gratuity then no, you will not be paying again.

 

If you booked and paid before they started adding the gratuity then others have reported having the gratuity added onboard the ship.

 

[Mark_T]

5 hours ago, Bo1953 said:

m - only you know for sure, yet will the 'investigation' be a good use of vacation time?

In the interest of accuracy, I did say I would seek 'clarification' certainly not intending to conduct a detailed investigation, and certainly not by questioning multiple staff, far better things to be doing onboard 🙂

[WrittenOnYourHeart]

5 hours ago, morpheusofthesea said:

On 4/13/2022 at 10:18 AM, Panzano said:

We were on the Reflection a few weeks ago and towards the end of our cruise we were going to leave our stateroom attendant a tip from our OBC.  We let him know that we were doing that and we got the sense that he would have preferred cash.  We ended up giving him cash instead of a tip from our OBC.

 

We were wondering why we got the response we got. I wonder if they pay taxes on their pay and if their tips show up in their paycheck from an OBC tip that it becomes taxed.

 

IDK. But if I had said I was going to add it onto my account and felt pressured to give cash, whatever I was going to give would go to someone else.

[islabahia]

6 hours ago, Kilroyshere said:

This thread revealed to us that despite the Retreat Amenities page stating tips are included, that is not so as we understood it advertised when we booked our X cruise.

 

It's all part of a cruise experience that will determine if we become Retreat repeaters or not.

 

 

There will always be another pax to fill your spot in the Retreat.  Tip/don’t tip…the choice is yours!