The Threat of a Delta Strike (all threads merged here)

[ioanab]

We are flying back on Delta at the end of May, back from our cruise. If I wait until a decision is made to strike, will it be too late to order paper tickets then?.... :confused:

[48is24is1]

Greatam, you have made some great points, in fact, I just left the airport. I only had etickets but after reading all the reasons to get paper tickets I went for it! The Delta representative did not charge me the $20 per ticket fee. Thanks again for the information.

[stlrboo]

Greatam, you have made some great points, in fact, I just left the airport. I only had etickets but after reading all the reasons to get paper tickets I went for it! The Delta representative did not charge me the $20 per ticket fee.

I too am going to take that route, I believe.. Our departure city is Buffalo, NY approximately 90 miles from here.. Can I go to the Delta ticket counter in Erie (10 miles) and get paper tickets? Sure would save some gas $$$...;)

[48is24is1]

stlrboo, we are flying out of Norfolk but I went to the Delta ticket counter in Richmond because it is nearby. I don't think you should have a problem as long as there is a Delta ticket counter. The one thing that I didn't mention is initially the Delta Representative told me that it would be $20 per ticket but he wrote a note to his co-worker who told him that it would not be a charge for the ticket. I didn't ask them why, he gave me my tickets, I said thank you and that was it!

[gameover]

According to the article referenced a few posts back "The panel's deadline is April 15, at the start of the holiday weekend. But it is not likely to announce a decision until after the holiday weekend."

 

So even though the deadline is 4/15, we will not know the outcome until the 17th.

 

The other thing that was interesting from the article is that according to the union "...notice of a strike could range from a few hours to 30 days". I would think that if the two sides have not agreed before the deadline but are in the ballpark during talks that it would be unlikely a strike would be called in a few hours. The union in my opinion has more to lose if they force a stike sooooo quickly. If anything they could set a date one or two weeks out and let customers continue to make alternate plans and encourage managment to end the dispute.

 

My flight is on the 20th and based on everyting I've read I feel that it is more likely that the flight will take off as scheduled versus looking for alternate plans. Less sure about the return flight but my main concern is to get on the boat. That's why I always try to leave a couple of days early in the event there are issues. At least on the 20th there are still plenty of flights available on other airlines. However around the 29th things look more full on other carriers.

 

Hopefully common sense will prevail between union and management and they can come to an agreement and retrun Delta to profitability. All of us lose if this airline goes under. Less choice = higher fares.

[Lois R]

Fooey, I thought I had posted on here but must have

lost it in cyber space:confused:

greatam, I wanted to thank you again for your help.

 

As I stated in a prior post, I am flying to FLL on Thursday so

I will get paper tickets while at the airport.

And maybe there will be good news as the next few months go by.

Since I don't fly to Seattle till October I am not going to stress

out over this right now.

As you suggested, I will peek in here on and off as the spring

and summer go by and see if there is any updated news.

 

Thanks again for all your help:)

[stlrboo]

stlrboo, we are flying out of Norfolk but I went to the Delta ticket counter in Richmond because it is nearby. I don't think you should have a problem as long as there is a Delta ticket counter. The one thing that I didn't mention is initially the Delta Representative told me that it would be $20 per ticket but he wrote a note to his co-worker who told him that it would not be a charge for the ticket. I didn't ask them why, he gave me my tickets, I said thank you and that was it!

Many thanks... I'll be heading out there as soon as I return from PGH tomorrow.. Better safe than sorry, and if they understand the predicament they are putting everyone in, they may just waive the $20. fee for me as well.. ;) THANX:p

 

If there is no resolution by Monday, April 17 I'll be buying 'fully refundable' on Southwest! Hmmmm.m.m.m.m....... Why wait; they are 'fully refundable'..:rolleyes:

[teedee]

Thanks for all your help greatam! I'm going to go ahead & get paper tickets. I'm hoping all this worrying is for nothing, but I want to have every advantage I can get if the worst happens.

 

Terri

[mek]

We are booked for April 20 - CVG to FLL, with a return on the 28th. Our back up plan is to leave on Wed and dive to Ft Lauderdale. If the issue is not settled before we leave and we are lucky enough to get to Ft Lauderdale next Thursday, I think I will go ahead and make a one way car reservation so if there is a problem when we get off the ship, we have a way to get home. I hope if they do decide to strike that it doesn't drag on for a couple of days since we will have to leave on Wednesday if we drive.

[Kerrid]

I just called American Airlines and asked if they would accept a Delta e-ticket in the event of a strike. I was told that if Delta strikes, Delta can either endorse their tickets over to American or not endorse them. If they don't endorse over to American then American can't accept any of Delta's tickets paper or e-ticket! She did advise that American does have an agreement with Delta to accept e-tickets if Delta goes ahead and endorses them over. So basically it's all in Delta's hands on what happens.

[mojo4trav]

I just can't help but wonder... If there aren't any employees working due to a complete liquidation, who will endorse the tickets?

[Kerrid]

I just called Delta to inquire about my FF e-tickets and was told the following:

By Law the Pilots can't strike until after May 15th (some sort of cooling off period after the April 17th date). They are not anticipating a strike and told me that the talks are going well (yeah like this c/s rep knows) and I can redeposit our miles back into our Delta FF account for $50 per ticket at any time. In the event of a strike Delta will try to get us on another carrier to Aruba or we can get our miles refunded for no charge. She also mentioned that the President could step in to avoid a strike

[greatam]

I just called Delta to inquire about my FF e-tickets and was told the following:

By Law the Pilots can't strike until after May 15th (some sort of cooling off period after the April 17th date). They are not anticipating a strike and told me that the talks are going well (yeah like this c/s rep knows) and I can redeposit our miles back into our Delta FF account for $50 per ticket at any time. In the event of a strike Delta will try to get us on another carrier to Aruba or we can get our miles refunded for no charge. She also mentioned that the President could step in to avoid a strike

 

As posted before, DALPA (Delta pilots union) states that the RLA (Railway Labor Act) rules do not apply to this situation. So the "law" doesn't apply. They may be correct. This is an UNPRECEDENTED situation. The carrier is in BANKRUPTCY and wants the bankruptcy court to throw OUT the pilots contract, IF the mediation board cannot get the pilots to give up more pay. This scenario has NEVER happened before.

 

The 30 day cooling off period (RLA) applies when a union and management cannot come to an agreement on a UNION contract. This is the differerence. IF the pilots and Delta cannot come to an agreement to reduce pilots pay, Delta will ask the bankruptcy court to THROW OUT the contract. DALPA position -NO contract, no RLA (30-90 day period). Since there is NO legal precedent, every party will be filing injunctions, lawsuits, etc. while the pilots MAY be on strike. The courts will have to decide IF RLA applies. That will not be decided overnight, what with appeal upon appeal. And in the meantime, customers could be stranded and Delta could fold. Delta has large creditor obligations, primarily to GE Financing. If GE sees another market for the planes Delta has on lease, they could no longer help Delta with financing and the airline folds. There are too many intangibles. NO ONE KNOWS.

 

And by the way, what did you really expect Delta to tell you??? Absolutely, positively there would be no strike??? And did you really think they would tell you that they would NOT reaccommodate you? Sure they will, on a SPACE AVAILABLE business-you and almost 20% (Delta's market share) of total airline passengers. What airline can YOU guarantee will have seats available? The planes are flying at capacity. Even first class is FULL.

 

Sorry if my "tone" is harsh and I know you are hoping for the best, but please be realistic about the Delta situation. NO ONE KNOWS what will happen. I have only given everyone suggestions to make the best of a worst case scenario. Hopefully, the worst case won't happen.

[greatam]

I just can't help but wonder... If there aren't any employees working due to a complete liquidation, who will endorse the tickets?

 

Another reason I am encouraging everyone possibly caught in this situation to get paper tickets. Your e-ticket (and all the information it contains) resides in Delta's computers. As you stated, no employees, no computer access-how can you REALLY prove you have a ticket???

[mojo4trav]

Another reason I am encouraging everyone possibly caught in this situation to get paper tickets. Your e-ticket (and all the information it contains) resides in Delta's computers. As you stated, no employees, no computer access-how can you REALLY prove you have a ticket???

 

Don't paper tickets also need to be endorsed?

[Kerrid]

Greatam, no need to get hostile. I just posted exactly what I was told by Delta.. wasn't asking for anyone's opinion just thought I'd share the information. I don't feel that Delta would accomodate anyone if they went bellyup - just not possible. We are all hoping for the best.

 

As far as the Delta paper tickets - I was told by American Airlines this morning that if Delta strikes, goes belly-up whatever, that they can't honor the paper or e-tickets unless Delta endorsed all of their tickets over and how can they do that if there are no employees left! So even with the paper tickets everyone will be S.O.L.

[greatam]

Don't paper tickets also need to be endorsed?

 

Every one is confusing a very literal "endorsement" (like writing or something) with common airline practice.

 

By having paper tickets, you PROVE you have tickets. Plain and simple. And you prove that they DO NOT have restrictions that would not allow you to fly on another airline. As I posted previously, SOME tickets are non-endorsable-Priceline being one, some third party vendors being others, company negotiated contract tickets, consolidators. The non-endorsable tickets have conditions which were agreed to BEFORE the tickets were issued-no other airline will accept them.

 

On the face of it, most airlines will automatically accept other carriers' paper tickets. Other airlines have NO access to Delta's computer system, so cannot even see what you purchased. They can get the info needed off paper tickets.

 

It will still be a hassle anyway you look at it, BUT. I would still take my chances with paper tickets any day of the week, in a strike or shutdown situation.

 

I am currently dealing with this very situation with my own business. We ship freight all over the world-highly perishable freight which often rides on airlines. I am trying to make sure that all of our scheduled Delta freight is "endorsable" to another airline, IF I need to make rapid changes. The changes are incompassed in a WHOLE lot of rules and regulations, some of them dating back to the 30's and 40's. Some rules are very conflicting. Freight and passengers fall under SOME of the same rules. I can't afford to leave high dollar cheese sitting at an airport going bad. Or especially the chocolate that we ship EVERY week.

 

For my freight, I am doing everything I can to make sure strike/shutdown situations don't bog my company. I hope everyone is doing the same for their vacations.

 

PS-I called Delta cargo again this morning-got three different answers from three different people to the same question. Who's correct? Who knows??? But when I finally got the answer I believed to be correct, I had the person send me email verifying what I believe are the rules. Now we will see how this all plays out. I don't know FOR SURE and neither does anyone else. This is unchartered territory. But a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.

[greatam]

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/delta/stories/0406deltaqanda.html

 

http://www.sltrib.com/business/ci_3686777%20target=_blank

[Chat Noir]

greatam... or others in the know... can you help me please?

 

My family is flying Delta, May 19th, Tulsa-Seattle

Returning Delta, June 4th, Anchorage-Tulsa

 

I have printed tickets from the Delta counter in the shape of typical boarding passes, two card-weight passes stapled together.

 

The front one states ETKT PASSENGER ITINERARY listing the itinerary - day, date, status, carrier/vendor, city, time, seat, class, meal, remarks.

The back one states ETKT PASSENGER RECEIPT listing the endorsements (non-ref/$change fee) fare calculation, expiration date, confirmation number, form of payment, price.

 

Are these considered my paper ticket, or e-tickets only?

Do I need to get something else from Delta, or will these work in the event we need to scramble to find another carrier? We have appx. 30 hour window from original Tulsa departure time in order to make it to Seattle Amtrak for our Vancouver transfer.

Does the endorsement (non-ref/$change fee) invalidate it from even being accepted by another carrier?

 

We may look like bedraggled ruffians by the time we manage to catch flights and get to Seattle... if we even can!!!

 

Thanks for any insight!

[Kerrid]

Well I decided to stop worrying about this and went ahead and had Delta cancel my reservation and put our FF miles back into our account and I booked on another carrier for our trip!

[greatam]

Well I decided to stop worrying about this and went ahead and had Delta cancel my reservation and put our FF miles back into our account and I booked on another carrier for our trip!

 

Congratulations!!! Bet you feel a whole lot better and one big worry off your shoulders. Enjoy your trip.

[greatam]

greatam... or others in the know... can you help me please?

 

My family is flying Delta, May 19th, Tulsa-Seattle

Returning Delta, June 4th, Anchorage-Tulsa

 

I have printed tickets from the Delta counter in the shape of typical boarding passes, two card-weight passes stapled together.

 

The front one states ETKT PASSENGER ITINERARY listing the itinerary - day, date, status, carrier/vendor, city, time, seat, class, meal, remarks.

The back one states ETKT PASSENGER RECEIPT listing the endorsements (non-ref/$change fee) fare calculation, expiration date, confirmation number, form of payment, price.

 

Are these considered my paper ticket, or e-tickets only?

Do I need to get something else from Delta, or will these work in the event we need to scramble to find another carrier? We have appx. 30 hour window from original Tulsa departure time in order to make it to Seattle Amtrak for our Vancouver transfer.

Does the endorsement (non-ref/$change fee) invalidate it from even being accepted by another carrier?

 

We may look like bedraggled ruffians by the time we manage to catch flights and get to Seattle... if we even can!!!

 

Thanks for any insight!

 

Since I can't physically see the tickets, I can't say for sure. On AA's paper tickets, there is a fare class indicator. They also do not have ETICKET printed. Where and how did you get these "tickets"? Hopefully, someone who actually got DELTA paper tickets this week in exchange for e tickets will chime in.

 

The endorsement is one thing you are looking for-it does NOT say non-endorsable. correct?. It just states that it is non-refundable (as are the majority of leisure tickets purchased in todays world) and has a change fee attached (again, VERY standard for all airlines).

[greatam]

http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/delta/stories/0412deltamarch.html

[48is24is1]

I was issued paper tickets this week. Sym1966, my paper tickets are identical to the tickets you described (they are now paper tickets if your document number has changed, the 006 number, the last digit on tickets changed). The first Northwest agent told me that although my paper ticket has ETKT it is indeed a paper ticket because my document number has changed, she said that if I had left the ticket as an eticket received by email confirmation the eticket could have been changed over the phone. However, the second Northwest agent that I talked to said as of now, Northwest does not know how they are going to handle a Delta situation if it should become a situation but they are going to do all that they can to help (both of the agents were very nice). She also said they are given updates daily but don't have an update today. I asked her about the information that the other Northwest agent gave me, she said that could happen but they don't have any guidelines from Delta on how to handle their passengers. I asked her about having the paper tickets endorsed, she explained that a system will be up into place even if there aren't any Delta agents to endorse the tickets. This is a very confusing situation but I feel better knowing that something (I don't know what) will be done.

[zqvol]

For everyone who is worrying about paper tickets, those are the least of your concern if Delta ceases operations, which it will if the pilots go on strike, there is not enough extra capacity to get everyone accomodated in a reasonable time frame to make your cruise.

 

If there are no seats to your destination there are no seats.

 

If you are really concerned that Delta will not be flying, you need to book something else now or plan on driving to departure.

 

You might get a flight but the odds are that you won't get one in time to get to your cruise, unless you pay on someone else.