Passport - why so scary

[njhorseman]

I have read the regulations and the proposed regulations and know what they say. Fact is you could cruise to the Caribbean Islands without a passport before the DHS regulations were enacted. The regulations don't pertain to other countries and their entry requirements, they pertain to what US citizens need in order to be re-admitted to the US.

 

Correct. In fact not only could you cruise to the Caribbean, as well as Canada and Mexico without a passport before the regulations were enacted, in some cases prior to the regulatory changes brought on by the 9/11 terrorist attacks you could fly to those countries without a passport.

[sail7seas]

Someone has probably already said this, but here goes. I am a Canadian living an hour and a half away from the US border. It does not even occur to me to try to enter your country anymore without a passport - you will not let me cross your border without it.

 

So I ask without malice, why do Americans think they should be able travel to any other country without a passport? It is what you require from everyone else who wants to enter your country. And we all had to pay for our passports too.

 

I understand your impression some Americans think the rules should be different for them but it is not the individual or the Americans' rule. That is Canada's rule. It is for each country to determine the entry requirements and to enforce them.

 

I wouldn't guess Canada's reasons for their entry rules but I will always abide by every country's rule and not judge them for it. Their country; their right to allow me to enter or not and their right to say what I need to do in order to be permitted to enter.

 

[LuckyZ]

I understand your impression some Americans think the rules should be different for them but it is not the individual or the Americans' rule. That is Canada's rule. It is for each country to determine the entry requirements and to enforce them.

 

I wouldn't guess Canada's reasons for their entry rules but I will always abide by every country's rule and not judge them for it. Their country; their right to allow me to enter or not and their right to say what I need to do in order to be permitted to enter.

 

 

Agreed. Same message I am trying to explain to "sparks".

[paul929207]

It will be interesting to see what happens if RCI must terminate the Grandeur of the Seas sailing in the Bahamas. How much (if any) trouble will those without passports have.

[S.S.Oceanlover]

It will be interesting to see what happens if RCI must terminate the Grandeur of the Seas sailing in the Bahamas. How much (if any) trouble will those without passports have.

 

probably as much trouble as the Carnival cruisers had getting home. None:)

 

Bill

[paul929207]

probably as much trouble as the Carnival cruisers had getting home. None:)

 

Bill

That's what I figure.

[sparks1093]

Agreed. Same message I am trying to explain to "sparks".

 

The countries in the Caribbean didn't change their laws to allow US passengers entry because of the closed loop exception as they allowed US citizens entry without passports prior to the enactment of the regulations (your original post in this current discussion seemed to imply that the Caribbean islands changed their laws so that US citizens could travel there on a closed loop cruise without a passport, if that isn't what you were saying then I apologize). I fully understand that each country has the right to establish their own entry requirements and that travelers must meet those requirements in order to visit.

[Doug R.]

It will be interesting to see what happens if RCI must terminate the Grandeur of the Seas sailing in the Bahamas. How much (if any) trouble will those without passports have.

 

I am certain that an exception will be granted by the State Department and the airlines and CBP will be so advised. Does not prove any point about having or not having a passport no matter how triumphant the anti-passport crowd seems about this. :rolleyes:

[paul929207]

I am certain that an exception will be granted by the State Department and the airlines and CBP will be so advised. Does not prove any point about having or not having a passport no matter how triumphant the anti-passport crowd seems about this. :rolleyes:

It means there is one less reason to have to worry about cruising without a passport.

[Doug R.]

It means there is one less reason to have to worry about cruising without a passport.

 

However if injury, illness or being kicked off the ship for being a horse's fanny ends your cruise in a foreign port, you are still up the creek without a passport, no one will bend over backwards to get you home. You will still face several days of waiting for your passport to be issued. You pays your money and takes your chances.

[sparks1093]

I am certain that an exception will be granted by the State Department and the airlines and CBP will be so advised. Does not prove any point about having or not having a passport no matter how triumphant the anti-passport crowd seems about this. :rolleyes:

 

The State Department won't have anything to do with it, it will be handled by CBP as it was with Carnival. (And yet again I point out that I am not anti-passport, but valid alternatives exist.)

Edited May 28, 2013 by sparks1093

[paul929207]

I am certain that an exception will be granted by the State Department and the airlines and CBP will be so advised. Does not prove any point about having or not having a passport no matter how triumphant the anti-passport crowd seems about this. :rolleyes:

You accuse those who disagree with you of being anti-passport. I am not. I certainly think it is good to have a passport if you are leaving the country. I think anyone planning to go on a closed loop cruise should consider purchasing a passport and be aware of the risk they are taking. If someone decides to take that risk, well that is their choice. If they happen to be the one who winds up needing one, then they will pay the price. However, the overwhelming majority will not have a problem.

[Doug R.]

The State Department won't have anything to do with it, it will be handled by CBP as it was with Carnival. (And yet again I point out that I am not anti-passport, but valid alternatives exist.)

 

Not really that big of a point, but State does get involved in any request or action taken on foreign soil even if it is just to say "alrighty then" and pass it on to the responsible agency. They need to be in the loop so they are aware in case something goes bad. That way they don't have to face a Congressional mob asking how could you not have known this was happening. My agency has to clear all inbound and outbound travel though State to foreign countries.

[zekekelso]

So I ask without malice, why do Americans think they should be able travel to any other country without a passport?

 

Because we can.

 

I find your question bizarre. Its like asking why do American's think they can live in Cleveland.

[Warm Breezes]

Someone has probably already said this, but here goes. I am a Canadian living an hour and a half away from the US border. It does not even occur to me to try to enter your country anymore without a passport - you will not let me cross your border without it.

 

So I ask without malice, why do Americans think they should be able travel to any other country without a passport? It is what you require from everyone else who wants to enter your country. And we all had to pay for our passports too.

 

Because other countries allow us to come into their countries on closed loop cruises without passports and our country allows us to re-enter our own country on a closed loop cruise without a passport. Simple as that.

[Warm Breezes]

I am certain that an exception will be granted by the State Department and the airlines and CBP will be so advised. Does not prove any point about having or not having a passport no matter how triumphant the anti-passport crowd seems about this. :rolleyes:

 

Again not anti-passport....pro-choice per our law as it currently stands. Yes it does prove a point to the many posters who come onto these passports threads and use these types of examples as reasons why you must have a passport.

[cb at sea]

If I don't NEED it, I won't pay for it....simple!

[Warm Breezes]

If I don't NEED it, I won't pay for it....simple!

 

It really is as simple as that. We have the option to choose given to us by our government and the governments of the countries we choose to visit on a closed loop cruise. Yes there is an extremely small chance that an emergency passport or passport waiver may be needed to return home and that chance percentage is not the same for every person. Things like pre-existing conditions and ill family members at home can increase your risks. How much risk we are willing to take is up to each of us individually...per our government. Too bad some posters have such a hard time understanding this concept.

Edited May 28, 2013 by Warm Breezes

[Quilting_Cruiser]

You accuse those who disagree with you of being anti-passport. I am not. I certainly think it is good to have a passport if you are leaving the country. I think anyone planning to go on a closed loop cruise should consider purchasing a passport and be aware of the risk they are taking. If someone decides to take that risk, well that is their choice. If they happen to be the one who winds up needing one, then they will pay the price. However, the overwhelming majority will not have a problem.

 

Again not anti-passport....pro-choice per our law as it currently stands. Yes it does prove a point to the many posters who come onto these passports threads and use these types of examples as reasons why you must have a passport.

 

 

Another chiming in to say, "I'm not anti-passport." If anything, I'm pro-passport. LOL. I have a passport as does my DD. But, I'm in favor of each individual's right to choose whether to get a passport. I don't understand why there are those participating here who seem to be unable to understand it's a choice and as long as it is, there will be thousands and thousands of Americans who travel on closed-loop cruises without passports every year and very, very few of them will be confronted with an actual need for one.

[songbird1329]

Twice within a matter of months the US government has had to issue passport waivers en masse because a cruise line had to fly its passengers home in the middle of a closed loop cruise. Can't help but wonder if the folks in Washington are going to rethink policy.

[Warm Breezes]

Twice within a matter of months the US government has had to issue passport waivers en masse because a cruise line had to fly its passengers home in the middle of a closed loop cruise. Can't help but wonder if the folks in Washington are going to rethink policy.

 

I doubt it...but if they do, I'm sure there will be plenty of debate and plenty of time for those without one to get one before they need to.

[sullaRaffaello]

Twice within a matter of months the US government has had to issue passport waivers en masse because a cruise line had to fly its passengers home in the middle of a closed loop cruise. Can't help but wonder if the folks in Washington are going to rethink policy.

 

I would say yes. I think it's only a matter of time when it's going to be: if you leave your country, you'll need a passport, period.

[Doug R.]

Twice within a matter of months the US government has had to issue passport waivers en masse because a cruise line had to fly its passengers home in the middle of a closed loop cruise. Can't help but wonder if the folks in Washington are going to rethink policy.

 

Ain't gonna happen unless they develop some serious fortitude inside the Beltway. Just like they never got rid of the dollar bill after issuing coins, instituted the metric system, or abolish the expensive penny like Canada has done. Those congressional cowards are so afriad they might lose votes, or more importantly corporate dollars. :rolleyes:

Edited May 28, 2013 by Doug R.

[paul929207]

I would say yes. I think it's only a matter of time when it's going to be: if you leave your country, you'll need a passport, period.

If they do, they will give plenty of warning. Each person without a passport will then have a choice, get a passport or stay in the US. I am sure some will select each option.

[zekekelso]

I would say yes. I think it's only a matter of time when it's going to be: if you leave your country, you'll need a passport, period.

 

Why would the government to that; what is their motivation?