The cost of cruising

[blackshirt]

To the OP: Was airfare included in the price of your cruise in 1981?

 

Airfare was not included in that $1790 fare. We paid an additional $410 for round trip airfare for two between Oklahoma City and Miami.

[Ourusualbeach]

There are many changes that have occurred in the industry over the years: size of ships, # of passengers, things to do onboard, type of services provided, additional dining venues and others can probably add to this list.

 

What I don't believe you can say is: "The extra crew needed like waitstaff and stateroom attendants pay comes from gratuities for the most part it seems." I don't believe that to be true.

 

It has been talked about on here quite often that other that a $50 payment from Royal every 2 weeks or monthly that the waitstaff and stateroom attendants do rely on the gratuities as their sole means of compensation.

 

I would take that part of the statement as being correct however there are a lot of personnel other than waiters and stateroom attendants that are indeed paid a salary by Royal.

[Paulette3028]

It has been talked about on here quite often that other that a $50 payment from Royal every 2 weeks or monthly that the waitstaff and stateroom attendants do rely on the gratuities as their sole means of compensation.

 

I would take that part of the statement as being correct however there are a lot of personnel other than waiters and stateroom attendants that are indeed paid a salary by Royal.

 

"Talked about here quite often................" doesn't mean that I believe that to be the facts. Are the people talking employees of Royal who would know, or just speculating from what they may believe. At $12 or $14 per day per person for tips (depending upon cabin) and knowing that that daily tip amount has to be spread amongst quite a few people, they have to have a base salary.

 

What I have been told is that Royal guarantees a minimum base of tips and if the actual tip amount earned does not meet that minimum Royal supplements it, if it exceeds it -- that is wonderful. But that this guaranteed tip minimum is not in lieu of a base salary. I even take that information with a grain of salt, since I have no way of verifying.

[Paulette3028]

There has been much discussion about prices and whether prices are going up, etc. I recently ran across the invoice of our first cruise on the Carnival Festival in 1981. It was a 7 night Carribbean cruise out of Miami and we had I guess what would be considered an ocean view because it had a port hole but definitely no balcony. Our cruise fare back in 1981 was $1790 or $895/person. I'm not sure what that is in today's dollars but I'm sure it is at least double. We paid only slightly more than that for a 7 night cruise on Oasis last year in a balcony. Maybe prices aren't as bad as we think. I also now realize why I didn't return to cruising until 2008.

 

We were looking at a possible cruise in our future....a 9 day cruise on Navigator in February 2017. The 9 days (using todays pricing) would be $2300for a balcony cabin. In 2004, on our first cruise on Navigator we were in a balcony cabin on a 7 day cruise -- cost of cruise $2200. So the 2017 cruise would cost less on a per day comparison basis. Same ship. Yes, the ship has undergone a refurb and has had some cabins added which will add more passengers to the sailing potentially. They added Flowrider, which I love to do. Yes, some things have been discontinued like the crazy Midnight Buffet and chocolates on my pillow -- neither one I miss. But I get two extra cruising days.

[Ourusualbeach]

"Talked about here quite often................" doesn't mean that I believe that to be the facts. Are the people talking employees of Royal who would know, or just speculating from what they may believe. At $12 or $14 per day per person for tips (depending upon cabin) and knowing that that daily tip amount has to be spread amongst quite a few people, they have to have a base salary.

 

What I have been told is that Royal guarantees a minimum base of tips and if the actual tip amount earned does not meet that minimum Royal supplements it, if it exceeds it -- that is wonderful. But that this guaranteed tip minimum is not in lieu of a base salary. I even take that information with a grain of salt, since I have no way of verifying.

 

Yes, believe it or not there are many people here on CC that do provide accurate information.

 

I do agree that Royal has set a minimum amount for different positions to cover them in the event of unforeseen circumstances however that is not a salary. The poster that you referred to in your original post did say MOST and I believe that statement was correct.

 

The current breakdown for cabin stewards has them receiving $6.10 pp per day. The stewards that I have talked to have said that they have 8 cabins to take care of. Even only at double occupancy that is over $680 per week. Are you suggesting that Royal pays them more of a salary on top of this?

[George C]

My 1st 7 day cruise was 1977, on Hal Rotterdam ( which was a great ship at the time and cost was 600 for a single occupancy, double occupancy would have been just 400 ( inside room , no balconies existed back then), Heineken's were 75 cents. But that was a lot of money back then. One of the main reasons that I cruised every year since it is a bargain for what you get.

[rockdoctor]

We started cruising in 2007. It was nice to have one cruise prior to 2008, when, IMHO, cruiselines started to really cut back. No more midnight buffet, no more Death Chocolate Buffets, no more pooside barbeque, no more suchi by the pool. But at a cost. The next year, we took 2 half price cruises. We find that the same cabins are now back to the 2007 prices, but the cut backs remain.

[Paulette3028]

Yes, believe it or not there are many people here on CC that do provide accurate information.

 

I do agree that Royal has set a minimum amount for different positions to cover them in the event of unforeseen circumstances however that is not a salary. The poster that you referred to in your original post did say MOST and I believe that statement was correct.

 

The current breakdown for cabin stewards has them receiving $6.10 pp per day. The stewards that I have talked to have said that they have 8 cabins to take care of. Even only at double occupancy that is over $680 per week. Are you suggesting that Royal pays them more of a salary on top of this?

 

I am suggesting and expecting that Royal pays a salary on top of that $680 per week number you have shown. Could you live on that annual salary.....$680 x 52 which equals $35,360? People will say, sure -- Royal is providing their room and board, so why not. The staff that I have spoken to send their money home to support their family as I would expect, but they do need some expense money for themselves. Sure many of them live in countries where the cost of living is less expensive than here in the US.

 

I have never inquired as to the financial enumeration of the onboard positions, so everything I read about what others say about salary/tips I take with a large grain of salt.

 

I did know someone who worked for Royal in Guest Services, and she admitted she was compensated nicely. It wasn't my place to be more nosey than that....but she also admitted that being away from home and family was tough and the pay did not always compensate enough for that -- although she did it for 8 years, until she got married. When she stopped working on a ship, she had no idea how to go grocery shopping -- since that was not part of her weekly life for so long.

[LuCruise]

Think about the QUALITY of that first cruise...how very special it was. Think about the dining room service....and the place-settings...the multiple courses and the actual "plating" of the food....so special! Think about the drink prices then compared to now....

 

Today, you aren't paying THAT much more, but you are getting considerably less.

 

Perhaps the service and food quality are going down (it's hard to keep that up when there are so many more passengers), but I have to disagree that we're getting less. There is soooo much to do on these cruises these days, and different cabin choices, better quality shows, etc....everything may not interest everyone...but overall we're getting more.

Edited May 11, 2015 by LuCruise

[Ourusualbeach]

I am suggesting and expecting that Royal pays a salary on top of that $680 per week number you have shown. Could you live on that annual salary.....$680 x 52 which equals $35,360? People will say, sure -- Royal is providing their room and board, so why not. The staff that I have spoken to send their money home to support their family as I would expect, but they do need some expense money for themselves. Sure many of them live in countries where the cost of living is less expensive than here in the US.

 

I have never inquired as to the financial enumeration of the onboard positions, so everything I read about what others say about salary/tips I take with a large grain of salt.

 

I did know someone who worked for Royal in Guest Services, and she admitted she was compensated nicely. It wasn't my place to be more nosey than that....but she also admitted that being away from home and family was tough and the pay did not always compensate enough for that -- although she did it for 8 years, until she got married. When she stopped working on a ship, she had no idea how to go grocery shopping -- since that was not part of her weekly life for so long.

 

We are not talking about wether or not you or I could live on that we are talking about people from other countries with different standards of living and different costs where a salary of even $10,000 a year could be considered a lot.

 

You can't really compare what an officer at guest services makes to what a cabin steward or waiter makes.

 

Also assume that they work 12 hours in a day which is 84 hours. The federally mandated minimum wage in the US is $7.50 which would be $630 for the week.

[ryano]

To be honest I could care less about that stuff, if the price were paying today is comparable to to what it was 30 years ago but we we dont have place settings etc, i'm good with that. Ships today have so much more to offer, plus its the Caribbean, do we really need all t hat fancy smancy stuff? I dont I guess, but to each his or her own....:o

 

I agree 100%. Im fairly new to cruising and remember not "the good ol days" and honestly, Im glad. If I want the fancy smancy stuff, I would save up and go luxury cruising. I care nothing about midnight buffets, white glove service and fixed seating for all three meals etc and so forth that people talk about.

 

I DO wish the food was a little better as Ive noticed the MDR food quality going downhill a little since ive been cruising but I never starve and always find something pleasing.

 

Cruising for me, is still the best vacation for the money. :)

[Ourusualbeach]

I agree 100%. Im fairly new to cruising and remember not "the good ol days" and honestly, Im glad. If I want the fancy smancy stuff, I would save up and go luxury cruising. I care nothing about midnight buffets, white glove service and fixed seating for all three meals etc and so forth that people talk about.

 

I DO wish the food was a little better as Ive noticed the MDR food quality going downhill a little since ive been cruising but I never starve and always find something pleasing.

 

Cruising for me, is still the best vacation for the money. :)

 

Nailed it.:)

[WhenIsLobsterNight]

Think about the QUALITY of that first cruise...how very special it was. Think about the dining room service....and the place-settings...the multiple courses and the actual "plating" of the food....so special! Think about the drink prices then compared to now....

 

Today, you aren't paying THAT much more, but you are getting considerably less.

 

 

Perfectly said. This is my feelings exactly. RCCL offers a vastly inferior product than they they did 5, 10, 15 and 20 years ago. Every year it gets worse. We sail in 19 day on the Independence. We are looking forward to our trip, but it will be our last RCCL cruise.

[John&LaLa]

Yes, believe it or not there are many people here on CC that do provide accurate information.

 

I do agree that Royal has set a minimum amount for different positions to cover them in the event of unforeseen circumstances however that is not a salary. The poster that you referred to in your original post did say MOST and I believe that statement was correct.

 

The current breakdown for cabin stewards has them receiving $6.10 pp per day. The stewards that I have talked to have said that they have 8 cabins to take care of. Even only at double occupancy that is over $680 per week. Are you suggesting that Royal pays them more of a salary on top of this?

 

Don't the cabin stewards have a behind the scenes partner that assists them? Wouldn't they have to split part of that. Also solo cruisers only are obligated for half that tip amount. Maybe it evens out with cabins that have added passengers

[John&LaLa]

We are not talking about wether or not you or I could live on that we are talking about people from other countries with different standards of living and different costs where a salary of even $10,000 a year could be considered a lot.

 

You can't really compare what an officer at guest services makes to what a cabin steward or waiter makes.

 

Also assume that they work 12 hours in a day which is 84 hours. The federally mandated minimum wage in the US is $7.50 which would be $630 for the week.

 

No overtime in your calculation, shouldn't that be included?

[TM38Rob]

There are many changes that have occurred in the industry over the years: size of ships, # of passengers, things to do onboard, type of services provided, additional dining venues and others can probably add to this list.

 

What I don't believe you can say is: "The extra crew needed like waitstaff and stateroom attendants pay comes from gratuities for the most part it seems." I don't believe that to be true.

Point I was trying to make is that the same (or similar) amount of crew with a thousand more passengers = more money going to a ship for almost the same sailing. The cost of the 180 or so additional crew to handle 1,000 extra people is somewhat offset by the gratuities they pay.

 

Wasn't trying to start a debate on crew salary vs their tipped income.

[TM38Rob]

Airfare was not included in that $1790 fare. We paid an additional $410 for round trip airfare for two between Oklahoma City and Miami.

Thanks.

[Ourusualbeach]

Don't the cabin stewards have a behind the scenes partner that assists them? Wouldn't they have to split part of that. Also solo cruisers only are obligated for half that tip amount. Maybe it evens out with cabins that have added passengers

 

The information that I received was posted by Patti. The original amount was $7.45 for housekeeping with $6.10 for the cabin steward and $1.35 for other housekeeping personel. I agree with you that any solo cruisers who do tip half of the double amount would easily be compensated for by cabins with more than 2 guests. There are most likely more cabins with more than 2 than with solo cruisers.

[TonyFred]

Think about the QUALITY of that first cruise...how very special it was. Think about the dining room service....and the place-settings...the multiple courses and the actual "plating" of the food....so special! Think about the drink prices then compared to now....

 

Today, you aren't paying THAT much more, but you are getting considerably less.

 

My first cruise was on Carnival in 1991. It was horrible compared to today's cruises. I got shamed at the breakfast buffet for taking 2 pieces of toast. Which in reality was one piece that had been cut in half. The attendant rolled his eyes and asked "you want 2 pieces of toast?!"

I said "No, I want one that you cut in half".

That was my first and last Carnival cruise.

[Sherri914]

The worth or value of any product is what people are willing to pay for said product. I haven't been cruising as long as many on CC have. I don't remember the golden years of cruising that some recall fondly. But for me, cruising remains a good value.

 

We cruise for the overall experience - not just for the ports or food or shows. We look at each cruise as a whole vacation experience. Could I go to an all-inclusive resort for roughly the same price or cheaper? Perhaps. But it doesn't matter to me that I could go somewhere else cheaper or on another cruise line cheaper. To me, that's akin to debating my choice to buy a luxury car over an economy car. They're both cars after all. They both get me from point A to point B. But the luxury car has bells and whistles the economy car doesn't. And the fact is, I wanted a luxury car, I could afford the car, so I bought the luxury car. (And no, I'm not saying RCCL is a luxury cruise.) What I'm saying is, it's my money, my choice. It's what i want to do, therefore for me, it's a valuable, viable vacation experience.

 

Maybe cruising isn't what it once was. The Titanic was very luxurious if you weren't in steerage. But they didn't have enough lifeboats for the pax. So where was the value there? (Again, just a figure of speech for comparison sake.)

 

HAL, CCL - both lines message boards have threads discussing that their line's service has decreased and the prices have increased and they're "jumping ship" for a better value elsewhere. For me, it doesn't matter what cruises used to be like or what other cruise lines offer. I also don't consider whether the crew is compensated appropriately when making my vacation decision - no more than I consider the salesman's salary when I buy a car, or the clerk's salary when I buy my groceries. The ship's crew sign contracts. What they do with their money is their business. If they aren't paid what they need to survive, they need to do what we all do in that situation: look for other work.

 

Every year when I plan my vacation, I look for the best value for my vacation dollars. In the end, cruising is a value to me. But it's my money, my choice. And if I decide it no longer meets my needs, I can spend my vacation dollars elsewhere.

[John&LaLa]

Im not sure cruising is still the best bang for the buck. Flew from SF to Hnl, stayed 7 nights at the Hilton Hawaiian village on the 35th floor of a new tower. Cost with airfare, 2400 dollars...Last cruise from SFO to San Juan airfare 900. cruise aft cabin 2700. Pre cruise hotel 200. Incidentals 100. 3900 without anyone spending yet...

 

True, but you did get food and shows with the cruise. Last time I was at HHV I also had to pay $75 a day for two beach chairs and an umbrella

[hiccups]

I'm chuckling at the number of people that sailed on Carnival's Festivale! That was my first cruise in 1990. Supposedly we were on one of the first cruises that stopped in Dominica. Getting off the ship there, we were surrounded by little children wanting us to buy paper flowers. Looking back, I wouldn't mind doing that itinerary again, especially Barbados.

 

I recall paying about $1000 for the week-long trip, and that included airfare from Philadelphia to San Juan. Even back then, my cousin and I were disappointed that not many people dressed up for dinner--we had each brought a garment bag with a dress for every night!

[John&LaLa]

I'm chuckling at the number of people that sailed on Carnival's Festivale! That was my first cruise in 1990. Supposedly we were on one of the first cruises that stopped in Dominica. Getting off the ship there, we were surrounded by little children wanting us to buy paper flowers. Looking back, I wouldn't mind doing that itinerary again, especially Barbados.

 

I recall paying about $1000 for the week-long trip, and that included airfare from Philadelphia to San Juan. Even back then, my cousin and I were disappointed that not many people dressed up for dinner--we had each brought a garment bag with a dress for every night!

 

We sailed Carnivale in 1989

 

Festivale was the fancy ship

[Paulette3028]

Think about the QUALITY of that first cruise...how very special it was. Think about the dining room service....and the place-settings...the multiple courses and the actual "plating" of the food....so special! Think about the drink prices then compared to now....

 

Today, you aren't paying THAT much more, but you are getting considerably less.

 

It wasn't the 'quality' of anything specific that made that very first cruise special.....it was the overall enjoyment of the experience of a different type of vacation that made the cruise special.

 

TO be honest, I don't need someone 'plating my food' or taking the lobster tail out of its shell for me -- I am capable of doing that on my own. I do want my water glass filled when it is close to empty. I want the waiter after the first night to know, to ask me if I want my tea or coffee served WITH my meal rather than waiting to have it with dessert. I want an honest answer when I ask about the menu choices.

 

I have been to enough black tie events in my life to understand formal attire and 'white glove service' which I don't need on my vacation.

 

What has changed for me, has changed for the better -- more to do and enjoy on a cruise....and that is just fine. I don't judge the cruise by the quality of the linen or the china on the table. I hope guests to my home for dinner don't judge me by the china or silverware (although I do have expensive silverware and china -- if anyone cares), they seem to accept future invitations because of the ambiance and dinners I serve. I have never walked out of the MDR hungry on any cruise, I have gone on.

[BruceMuzz]

There has been much discussion about prices and whether prices are going up, etc. I recently ran across the invoice of our first cruise on the Carnival Festival in 1981. It was a 7 night Carribbean cruise out of Miami and we had I guess what would be considered an ocean view because it had a port hole but definitely no balcony. Our cruise fare back in 1981 was $1790 or $895/person. I'm not sure what that is in today's dollars but I'm sure it is at least double. We paid only slightly more than that for a 7 night cruise on Oasis last year in a balcony. Maybe prices aren't as bad as we think. I also now realize why I didn't return to cruising until 2008.

 

If you go on the internet and plug that $895 per person into an inflation calculator you will find that the $895 in 1981 would be $2,324.82 today.

 

When I started working on the Royal Viking Sea in 1974, we were doing a 7 day Mexican Riviera cruise out of LA. An Ocean View cabin (2 portholes) cost - per person - the price of a new Buick automobile.

If I could charge you and your wife the equivalent of 2 Buicks today for a 7 day cruise ,the dining room service, the settings, the plating of the food, and drink prices would be spectacular. I would even throw in a balcony and free internet.

 

But since you are now getting a balcony cabin on a 7 day cruise for the equivalent of one monthly payment on a Buick, the services, food, and quality will not be the same as before.