NCL Cruise Service Charge Refund

[NLH Arizona]

You may not have said it, and I'd believe you haven't said it, but it comes up frequently on here and social media and you should read the outright badgering of people about it. It's a shame really.

I have never read anyone on here posting that someone has to give more than the DSC or calling someone who doesn't cheap. If you are talking about Butler/Concierge tips, then possibly you should have said that in your statement, instead of making a statement where folks feel that others feel they would be called cheap if they don't tip above and beyond the DSC.

[SeaShark]

Pay the DSC...easy peasy. No muss, no fuss.

 

 

If you want to give tips in addition to the service charge, by all means go right ahead and do so. Give whatever you want to whomever you want and call it a day.

 

If you don't want to give any additional tips, then you simply don't have to. No problem. Nobody cares.

 

 

What I don't get is the constant need that people have to explain their choice to everyone else on a public forum. Why do people feel the need to explain and convince others about their choice? Just do what you want and let it be...no need to get anyone's approval or even to let anyone know what you've done.

[Jana60]

The only time I ever decreased gratuities on a cruise was when at every aspect of the cruise I was presented with poor service. The room steward, the dining staff, everybody! But even then we only decreased our gratuities by 50%. We feel that 10% is bare minimum even if service is poor. But we feel 20% is indicated if service is good so we give at least 10% and if indicated tip additional.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

[Expat Cruise]

Pay the DSC...easy peasy. No muss, no fuss.

 

 

If you want to give tips in addition to the service charge, by all means go right ahead and do so. Give whatever you want to whomever you want and call it a day.

 

If you don't want to give any additional tips, then you simply don't have to. No problem. Nobody cares.

 

 

What I don't get is the constant need that people have to explain their choice to everyone else on a public forum. Why do people feel the need to explain and convince others about their choice? Just do what you want and let it be...no need to get anyone's approval or even to let anyone know what you've done.

 

Agreed anyone can do whatever they feel is correct for the bookings they make. You asked why explain here? Because this is a information site and people come here to learn more about the ships and cruises they take. Everyone is entitled to a opinion here but the problems come when a poster says something others don't like or agree with they want to prove them wrong for having a opinion. So we have threads with far to many posts that should have been closed long ago.

[newmexicoNita]

As I read this thread, it brings more questions. I realize these people are paid a low salary but is their room and board factored into the equation?

 

I realize you cannot support a family in these wages but I think that’s a choice made by the individual. Just like it’s a choice to be an electrician, seamstress or a burger flipper. Who are we to condemn those who own or work in this industry? By not paying the suggested gratuity, you have to ask yourself are you part of the problem? Or maybe ask for your gratuity refund and hand it directly to the staff???

 

Want to be effective and call for change? Be part of the solution instead of protesting.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

told myself I would not respond to anything on this thread again cause it has been beat to the ground. But I had to make a comment about supporting a family on their salary and tips: most of the crew are from countries where they can support their families pretty well on what they make.

 

Yes meals are part of their income. NO, they will not get rich on what they make, but many are not educated at all. The worst part is being away from their families for months on end.

[SeaShark]

Agreed anyone can do whatever they feel is correct for the bookings they make. You asked why explain here? Because this is a information site and people come here to learn more about the ships and cruises they take. Everyone is entitled to a opinion here but the problems come when a poster says something others don't like or agree with they want to prove them wrong for having a opinion. So we have threads with far to many posts that should have been closed long ago.

 

I agree with what you said, except for the highlighted sentence above.

 

Yes, this is an information site for people to learn more about the ships and cruises they take, however, I still don't think people need to know if and why person A gives tips over and above the DSC, or if and why person B adjusts the DSC.

 

If you want to learn about ships and cruises, or if you want to share information about ships and cruises, then by all means knock yourself out...this is the place to do that. Just keep your personal financial issues to yourself...if you aren't going to tip and/or pay the DSC, keep it to yourself...you don't need to justify your actions to everyone else.

[Sam Ting]

I agree with what you said, except for the highlighted sentence above.

 

Yes, this is an information site for people to learn more about the ships and cruises they take, however, I still don't think people need to know if and why person A gives tips over and above the DSC, or if and why person B adjusts the DSC.

 

If you want to learn about ships and cruises, or if you want to share information about ships and cruises, then by all means knock yourself out...this is the place to do that. Just keep your personal financial issues to yourself...if you aren't going to tip and/or pay the DSC, keep it to yourself...you don't need to justify your actions to everyone else.

 

Who elected you to be chief of telling people what to post?

 

We proudly remove the DSC and tip as we go. The cruise line must be okay with it as they allow it in the contract. Not only do they agree to that provision, they are the ones who wrote it.

[SeaShark]

Who elected you to be chief of telling people what to post?

 

We proudly remove the DSC and tip as we go. The cruise line must be okay with it as they allow it in the contract. Not only do they agree to that provision, they are the ones who wrote it.

 

You misunderstand (no surprise there though, right?) I'm not telling people what to post. I don't even care that you remove the DSC and "tip as you go" ;p you are free to do whatever you want and under any justification that suits you.

 

What I am saying is that there is no need to explain or justify your choices to me or anyone else via a public forum. You don't need to tell me what you're going to do. You don't need to tell me why you do what you do. You don't need my approval for your actions. Can you at least agree to that point?

[erdoran]

I guess it ticks me off when there is the "pay the DSC because the crew is so poor, overworked, and exploited and you are a terrible person if you remove it because it comes out of the poor workers' paychecks if you don't". And the way it is set up if every single person you come in contact with does a terrible job (never happened to me, just sayin') and you wouldn't tip them on land because you are so dissatisfied, if you remove it then (according to some on the boards) you're "punishing" all the poor, overworked and exploited behind the scenes staff who are (presumably) meeting expectations.

 

The real problem here is that the DSC is positioned as a gratuity/tip. That implies a one to one where exployee x interacts with you in a service role and you pay them directly based on your satisfaction with the service you have received. You ordinarily have a base tip (let's say 15-20%) for reasonable service; go above for outstanding, and go to the bottom of the range or lower for poor; rarely zero without extreme circumstances. But YOU get to decide how much to give, and it only affects the individual worker, not all the behind the scenes staff (for the most part).

 

That's not the case for DSC according to the vocal posters. Even if your steward does a terrible job, you can't reduce his tip without affecting everyone. And that makes this NOT a tip or gratuity at all, but part of the fare, and the "extra tip" becomes the way to tip above your standard range.

 

Maybe in the future the DSC cheerleaders might want to consider this alternative approach. The "poor, starving, underpaid & overworked & exploited crew member" approach is disrespectful to the crew and to me drips with charity and entitlement. Combine that with "this is a discretionary tip" and that's why we have these flame wars. After all, if the reason to pay the DSC no matter what is so we make sure the crew has a living wage so their families don't starve, IMHO that argues for REMOVING the DSC entirely and (honestly, no BS excuse) tipping each performing crew member directly MORE than their DSC share - but then what about the back-end people? OR - stay home and send your entire cruise fare to a charitable organization of your choice that cares for the poorest of the poor.

 

I AM passionate about this. The guilt trip insults my intelligence and common sense, and is demeaning both to me and to the crew. If the goal is to make sure we all pay our DSC, then just position it as I've said - it's part of your cruise fare, it's industry-wide, and it's positioned as a tip by the cruiselines just so you won't be taxed on it AND as a marketing trick to make their fares appear lower than they really are. ALL cruiselines do it - they utilize the US norm of tipping those in the service industry to get away with this.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if some of the "poor, poor crew member" posters either work for NCL or benefit in some other way from DSC being paid (or have someone they know benefit).

 

Now I'm going to try to shut up and go earn my paycheck to pay for my upcoming cruise and my DSC :>

[Sam Ting]

You misunderstand (no surprise there though, right?) I'm not telling people what to post. I don't even care that you remove the DSC and "tip as you go" ;p you are free to do whatever you want and under any justification that suits you.

 

What I am saying is that there is no need to explain or justify your choices to me or anyone else via a public forum. You don't need to tell me what you're going to do. You don't need to tell me why you do what you do. You don't need my approval for your actions. Can you at least agree to that point?

 

Agree! Happy cruising!

[Expat Cruise]

I agree with what you said, except for the highlighted sentence above.

 

Yes, this is an information site for people to learn more about the ships and cruises they take, however, I still don't think people need to know if and why person A gives tips over and above the DSC, or if and why person B adjusts the DSC.

 

If you want to learn about ships and cruises, or if you want to share information about ships and cruises, then by all means knock yourself out...this is the place to do that. Just keep your personal financial issues to yourself...if you aren't going to tip and/or pay the DSC, keep it to yourself...you don't need to justify your actions to everyone else.

 

While you are entitled to your opinion about what should be posted, others also have their right to post what they believe and their opinions. Because this being a United States site this little amendment below has the last word.

 

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

[SeaShark]

While you are entitled to your opinion about what should be posted, others also have their right to post what they believe and their opinions. Because this being a United States site this little amendment below has the last word.

 

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

 

Sure, but that amendment only prevents the government from impeding your right to free speech. It does not apply to the private sector. Since CC is a private site, they are free to determine what speech is, and is not, allowed here. Likewise we are free to state what speech we need, and don't need, to hear. Remember, you have a right to speak, but you don't have a right to be heard. Others can choose whether or not to listen.

[Expat Cruise]

Sure, but that amendment only prevents the government from impeding your right to free speech. It does not apply to the private sector. Since CC is a private site, they are free to determine what speech is, and is not, allowed here. Likewise we are free to state what speech we need, and don't need, to hear. Remember, you have a right to speak, but you don't have a right to be heard. Others can choose whether or not to listen.

 

And with that we are back to what has been said several pages back. Any one is free to post anything within the rules of the site. Not just those who agree with your point of view,

[Wyoming2010]

Which is why you don't see many Americans, Canadians, or Europeans in the service jobs on the ship. Everyone wants to keep complaining about the "horribly paid and disadvantage worker" but nobody wants to pay more for a cruise or anything else for that matter. Want to know why most automobiles and clothing are made outside the US? Because our wages are higher and nobody wants to pay an extra 2-3k for a car or $50 for a shirt when they can get similar quality for half the cost. You realize when you go into Dillard's and purchase that $30-$40 polo it is made by someone in the far east or central america making pennies on the dollar. It is not just the cruise industry.

 

The bolded statement is not true. Our worst cruise ever was on NCL Pride of America in 2008, which at that time was staffed 100% by American and British crew. They were a mess -- both in physical appearance and the way they treated passengers. The cleanliness of the ship was the worst we'd ever seen. And yes, that crew was obviously unhappy and grouchy! [Glad to hear that since then they have gotten permission to hire 25% foreign crew and I've heard the conditions have improved.]

[SeaShark]

And with that we are back to what has been said several pages back. Any one is free to post anything within the rules of the site. Not just those who agree with your point of view,

 

You are dancing all around the point without actually hitting it. Nobody is saying you aren't free to post within the rules...this isn't being denied by anyone. All that I've been saying is that there is no NEED to explain, and or obtain agreement, on your reasons for what you decide to do with regard to service charges, gratuities, or both.

 

IOW, why can't you just do your thing without having to explain to people why...especially given that people aren't even asking why. :rolleyes:

[NLH Arizona]

IOW, why can't you just do your thing without having to explain to people why...especially given that people aren't even asking why. :rolleyes:

I don't particularly mind posters saying what they do when another posters asks, as long as they know they will get agreed with and disagreed with and not call others names if they disagree with them. If you don't want people commenting about what you are doing, don't put it on a public site.

 

What drives me crazy are those that say matter of factly that the DSC does not go to the crew or NCL steals from the DSC and then when asked for proof, it is never there, because they have no proof it is all just speculation on their part and by saying it, they feel better about removing it. IMHO, these posters are trying to sway others, without any factual information, to their side to stop paying the DSC. Maybe it is to make themselves feel better about not paying it and feel good when people will follow them or some seem to have a bone to pick with NCL. It just takes a little reading on here to know which ones are which.

Edited August 9, 2018 by NLH Arizona

[njkate]

Paying DSC is fine with me. If someone goes above and beyond, sure give them extra, How NCL divides it up is not my problem This may sound cold but the employees are not indentured servants, not happy with pay or working conditions simple, quit. Some employees have been there for years, so that tells me they are either satisfied or home must be hell.

[graphicguy]

Paying DSC is fine with me. If someone goes above and beyond, sure give them extra, How NCL divides it up is not my problem This may sound cold but the employees are not indentured servants, not happy with pay or working conditions simple, quit. Some employees have been there for years, so that tells me they are either satisfied or home must be hell.

 

 

APPLUASE!

 

BTW....the U.S. Constitution really has no bearing whatsoever in this discussion.

[Seminole1975]

I don't particularly mind posters saying what they do when another posters asks, as long as they know they will get agreed with and disagreed with and not call others names if they disagree with them. If you don't want people commenting about what you are doing, don't put it on a public site.

 

What drives me crazy are those that say matter of factly that the DSC does not go to the crew or NCL steals from the DSC and then when asked for proof, it is never there, because they have no proof it is all just speculation on their part and by saying it, they feel better about removing it. IMHO, these posters are trying to sway others, without any factual information, to their side to stop paying the DSC. Maybe it is to make themselves feel better about not paying it and feel good when people will follow them or some seem to have a bone to pick with NCL. It just takes a little reading on here to know which ones are which.

 

For what it is worth, I totally agree with you. It is like some people are trying to find justification for removing the DSC when there really isn't any. I will always pay the DSC and have no intention of removing it.

 

We have also been known to tip the butler, the concierge, the cabin steward, certain wait staff and bartenders when they give us great service. The Haven staff in the Baltic on the Getaway last September 2017 went above and beyond! I wrote out Hero cards for all as well. That too supposedly means a lot.

[boo214]

For me the whole behind the scenes thing is something the cruise lines have put into people's minds to guilt them into paying more dsc. When you go to a hotel, do you worry about tipping "behind the scenes?" I just am not responsible for directly paying everyone on the ship's salary. What the cruise lines are doing is taking money that would have gone to your steward and waiters and giving it to other people to subsidize their salaries. It is a weird system, but obviously they think people like seeing the lower fare, when actually your fare includes the dsc.

not neccesarily. cruise ships are similar to restaurants in that in some/most restaurants the waiters tip out busboys/bartenders, etc., a room stewart might tip out laundry people or off duty crew that help him/her with his/her rooms. so that if he/she receives no tip they may still be paying other crew. this may be why behind the scenes people were added to the dsc. just wanted to point that out as it is often overlooked.

Edited August 9, 2018 by boo214
correction.

[njkate]

not neccesarily. cruise ships are similar to restaurants in that in some/most restaurants the waiters tip out busboys/bartenders, etc., a room stewart might tip out laundry people or off duty crew that help him/her with his/her rooms. so that if he/she receives no tip they may still be paying other crew. this may be why behind the scenes people were added to the dsc. just wanted to point that out as it is often overlooked.

 

Yes it's apparent from many of these posts the posters never worked in the service industry.

[Love my butler]

Who elected you to be chief of telling people what to post?

 

We proudly remove the DSC and tip as we go. The cruise line must be okay with it as they allow it in the contract. Not only do they agree to that provision, they are the ones who wrote it.

 

Self elected. He thinks he is king of the world.

[Love my butler]

I don't think anyone said or implied that not giving extra above the DSC is cheap. Only those who take away the DSC. Don't give the excuse you tip in cash. Baloney.

 

Tipping in cash is not an excuse, it is reality for many of us. My money, my choice.

[cathi007]

The worst part is being away from their families for months on end.

 

Thats what makes me sad, they are away from their families, just so their families can have a better life. I teach at a private boarding school and one of our teachers is a Filipino. This person hasn't seen their spouse in 5 years. All the money they make goes to their spouse and children. That is why I bring a strap of dollar bills and hand them out when someone helps me, I know I am helping them help their families and maybe it helps them form missing them a bit

[Love my butler]

For what it is worth, I totally agree with you. It is like some people are trying to find justification for removing the DSC when there really isn't any.

 

Quite bold of you to state that there is never any justification for removing the Discretionary Service Charge. Should we check with you on all matters to get the final word?