CDC 100 Day No Sail Order

[jimbo5544]

14 minutes ago, rattanchair said:

They were given 7 days from the second "Framework" proposal April 9. Read the No-Sail-Order.

Understand what the no sail said, was expressing my thoughts as why they had to reply in 7 days if they cannot sail for 60

Edited April 24, 2020 by jimbo5544

[rattanchair]

1 minute ago, jimbo5544 said:

Understand what the no sail said, was expressing my thoughts as why they had to reply in 7 days if they cannot sail for 60

Because saying something and putting it into practice takes time, in US opinion 100 days or less.

[bluesea321]

5 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Understand what the no sail said, was expressing my thoughts as why they had to reply in 7 days if they cannot sail for 60

 

Because the CDC ordered them to do so.

 

"1. As a condition of obtaining controlled free pratique to continue to engage in any cruise ship operations in any international, interstate, or intrastate waterways subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, cruise ship operators shall immediately develop, implement, and within seven (7) days of the signing of this Order operationalize, an appropriate, actionable, and robust plan to prevent, mitigate, and respond to the spread of COVID-19 on board cruise ships.
2. As a condition of obtaining controlled free pratique to continue to engage in any cruise ship operations in any international, interstate, or intrastate waterways subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, the cruise ship operator shall make the plan described in paragraph 1, above, available to HHS/CDC and USCG personnel within seven (7) days of the signing of this Order."

[LMaxwell]

So, no, Carnival has not complied w CDC yet to our knowledge. 

[jimbo5544]

1 hour ago, bluesea321 said:

 

Because the CDC ordered them to do so.

 

"1. As a condition of obtaining controlled free pratique to continue to engage in any cruise ship operations in any international, interstate, or intrastate waterways subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, cruise ship operators shall immediately develop, implement, and within seven (7) days of the signing of this Order operationalize, an appropriate, actionable, and robust plan to prevent, mitigate, and respond to the spread of COVID-19 on board cruise ships.
2. As a condition of obtaining controlled free pratique to continue to engage in any cruise ship operations in any international, interstate, or intrastate waterways subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, the cruise ship operator shall make the plan described in paragraph 1, above, available to HHS/CDC and USCG personnel within seven (7) days of the signing of this Order."

Thanks for posting what I read.   My point was.... oh never mind.  

[jimbo5544]

4 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

So, no, Carnival has not complied w CDC yet to our knowledge. 

I do not know that to be true.  

[LMaxwell]

Just now, jimbo5544 said:

I do not know that to be true.  

No cruise line has yet.  If they did so and it was accepted they'd be saying that they've met CDC requirements. 

[shipbound2]

On 4/10/2020 at 8:32 AM, chengkp75 said:

Well, it gets a little gray.  The CDC cannot stop a cruise ship, with no passengers onboard, from leaving a US port and sailing to another country.  However, the USPH is tasked with prevention of introduction of infectious diseases into the US, so they can deny any ship, cruise or otherwise, from entering US waters, or require a quarantine for the ship.  The CDC is tasked with safekeeping the health of US citizens within the US, so they can deny a ship from embarking passengers if there is a perceived health risk.  And the USCG has jurisdiction over all navigable waters in the US, and the order states that operations require USCG approval, with agreement from HHS/CDC.

The key words are a perceived risk that could be anything so if a cruise ship comes back to a US port and there are no passengers  or crew that show flu like symptoms and just because it is a perceived risk that someone may be sick  the ship can be denied entry to that  US port. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by shipbound2

[chengkp75]

35 minutes ago, shipbound2 said:

The key words are a perceived risk that could be anything so if a cruise ship comes back to a US port and there are no passengers  or crew that show flu like symptoms and just because it is a perceived risk that someone may be sick  the ship can be denied entry to that  US port. 

The post I was answering asked whether the CDC had the authority to stop cruise ships from entering port, or whether they were merely advisory.  My answer is that it is really up to the USCG, USPH, and CBP to determine whether a ship is cleared to enter a port.  But, they take the CDC's recommendations into consideration when doing so.  The CDC sets the requirements for disease control, and the USPH is primarily responsible for implementing these requirements on foreign vessels, and then CBP has health and sanitation experts, and all feed to the USCG as the final arbiter.

[outdoors27]

On 4/23/2020 at 3:38 PM, skridge said:

It is amazing the number of people on the boards with a head in the sand mentality.  I love cruising, but I don't understand why the suspension of disbelief from so many on these forums.

 

Because we try to be positive. With all thats going on it's nice to have something to hope for or look forward to. No matter what happens.

[trummy]

1 hour ago, outdoors27 said:

Because we try to be positive. With all thats going on it's nice to have something to hope for or look forward to. No matter what happens.

Facing facts and assessing risks is not a negative thing.

 

Considering how my actions may impact others is a positive thing. I do not want to cruise right now. For all I know, I am a silent carrier. For all I know, if cruises come back too soon, the cost could be in human lives.

 

If the only way I could have a positive attitude was to know I would cruise by a certain date, I would need to re-examine my priorities and life.

[outdoors27]

22 minutes ago, trummy said:

Facing facts and assessing risks is not a negative thing.

 

Considering how my actions may impact others is a positive thing. I do not want to cruise right now. For all I know, I am a silent carrier. For all I know, if cruises come back too soon, the cost could be in human lives.

 

If the only way I could have a positive attitude was to know I would cruise by a certain date, I would need to re-examine my priorities and life.

Your a better person than I am, I try not to think about what you mentioned other than just being with my family. Ive worked throughout this entire thing plus extra. My family hasn't contracted anything yet. So if we can cruise we will. If I'm forced to quarantine for two weeks when we return so be it. I have the time to burn so its really no big issue, I'll count it as another vacation. 

[skridge]

3 hours ago, outdoors27 said:

Because we try to be positive. With all thats going on it's nice to have something to hope for or look forward to. No matter what happens.

I'd rather keep my money and if they are still in business in a couple of years I might reconsider.  You do what works for you.

[jimbo5544]

23 minutes ago, beerman2 said:

Seeing and reading posts/comments on here are like reading a book, you have comedy, drama, suspense and all other emotions rolled into one.

 

Makes passing time during quarantine a little more palatable. Even better with a Dirty Martini next to you.

I cannot argue with the dirty martini aspect.

[beerman2]

3 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

I cannot argue with the dirty martini aspect.

Extra olives!!!!!!

[jimbo5544]

1 hour ago, beerman2 said:

Extra olives!!!!!!

A requirement, 3 minimum 

[Roger88]

100 day "no sail order" has been announced like over a month ago. So, there should be something around 50-60 days left unless they announced another 100 days of "of no sail". I suppose the reason to it is the increase of the number of infected people and the economy status being able to hold off another 1-2 months of work-free state.. 

[beerman2]

1 hour ago, Roger88 said:

100 day "no sail order" has been announced like over a month ago. So, there should be something around 50-60 days left unless they announced another 100 days of "of no sail". I suppose the reason to it is the increase of the number of infected people and the economy status being able to hold off another 1-2 months of work-free state.. 

It was around April 15 when it was amended to the new 100 days. July 24th is when it is suppose to end now.

 

Maybe it will end earlier, maybe not.

[firefly333]

1 hour ago, Roger88 said:

100 day "no sail order" has been announced like over a month ago. So, there should be something around 50-60 days left unless they announced another 100 days of "of no sail". I suppose the reason to it is the increase of the number of infected people and the economy status being able to hold off another 1-2 months of work-free state.. 

I agree it seems like forever ago. It's like time is in slow motion waiting on cruises to start. I cheer every little opening of a business nationwide and think ok that much closer.

 

Feels like we have been shut down at least 3 months even if we havent.

[ctkathchick]

On 4/11/2020 at 12:46 PM, PhillyFan33579 said:

Personally I wouldn’t fly on an airplane or cruise on a ship right now. However, the reason the cruise industry is being singled out in my opinion is because there have been several ships that have had COVID-19 breakouts to include multiple deaths. On the other hand I have not heard of one person dying from this virus while physically on an airplane, train, bus, subway, etc.  I think it is safe to say the chances of this virus spreading are significantly higher when people spend days to weeks together on a cruise ship, as opposed to spending minutes to hours together on other means of transportation. 

Not trying to start crap but if only long exposure highly contributed to the virus then we would still be shopping and going to dinner etc... That being said I am an essential worker so to speak as I am a vendor for major grocery stores in the east and am in constant close quarters with all the shoppers even with one way aisles, masks etc.. And fortunately for me I do not feel high risk for contracting the virus either on a ship plane or cruise just my opinion. And by the way I wear a mask all day and do not go outside of my yard anytime that I am not working we are all practicing social distancing with our family and friends until this is lifted thanks

 

[BlerkOne]

People die on cruise ships all the time. What isn't reported is how many deaths in recent months were because of Covid 19? Perhaps it was something else like a heart attack. People haven't all of a sudden started dying on cruise ships.

 

The reports I have seen say the virus is highly contagious. You wouldn't need to be in contact with an infected person very long to be infected. There is an incubation period, so I wouldn't expect someone to be exposed on a plane and to die during the flight.

 

As even health care workers have died from the virus, no amount of protective gear may be sufficient when used by amateurs.

[PhillyFan33579]

46 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

I agree it seems like forever ago. It's like time is in slow motion waiting on cruises to start. I cheer every little opening of a business nationwide and think ok that much closer.

 

Feels like we have been shut down at least 3 months even if we havent.

No kidding about it seems like we have been shut down forever. Right now cruising is far from the first thing on my mind. I will be happy when we can start doing simple things in life like having friends over or going to friends houses, go out to eat at a restaurant, go to the beach, etc. My wife and I have been complying with both local and statewide guidance concerning this virus, but it is getting old fast spending most days basically staying inside or around our house every day. 

[kwokpot]

51 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

People die on cruise ships all the time. What isn't reported is how many deaths in recent months were because of Covid 19? Perhaps it was something else like a heart attack. People haven't all of a sudden started dying on cruise ships.

 

The reports I have seen say the virus is highly contagious. You wouldn't need to be in contact with an infected person very long to be infected. There is an incubation period, so I wouldn't expect someone to be exposed on a plane and to die during the flight.

 

As even health care workers have died from the virus, no amount of protective gear may be sufficient when used by amateurs.

Here's a an article that answers some of your questions. Good read.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article241914096.html

[BlerkOne]

16 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

Here's a an article that answers some of your questions. Good read.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article241914096.html

Again, the article mentions deaths, but not how many had coronavirus as cause of death. Some deaths have always occurred on cruise ships. What would be more interesting and credible would be total deaths vs deaths from coronavirus.

 

I don't see many (any?) articles mentioning Costa Deliziosa which started the cruise in Jan, 2020. A cruise ship might well have been the safest place to be.

 

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/costa-deliziosa-last-cruise-ship-what-happened/index.html

 

 

 

 

[kwokpot]

2 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

Again, the article mentions deaths, but not how many had coronavirus as cause of death. Some deaths have always occurred on cruise ships. What would be more interesting and credible would be total deaths vs deaths from coronavirus.

 

I don't see many (any?) articles mentioning Costa Deliziosa which started the cruise in Jan, 2020. A cruise ship might well have been the safest place to be.

 

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/costa-deliziosa-last-cruise-ship-what-happened/index.html

 

 

 

 

I'm attaching a great article for you to read. It doesn't answer your immediate question but it is tangentially related. It's statistical analysis I've been looking for since this pandemic started.

Basically the article compares various countries and some cities HISTORICAL death rates for this particular timeframe of the year vs. what the REPORTED death rates are currently with the virus. As a Business Analyst professional I was always curious how the reported death rates due to Covid-19 compare to how many people NORMALLY die during the same period. This kind of data would also answer some Covid-19 deniers saying the deaths reported are people that would have died if the virus wasn't here.

The data show if anything the deaths attributed to Covid-19 are UNDERREPORTED, not overreported. In other words if you look at the historical average for this time period and you add in the reported Covid-19 deaths the number of total deaths in 2020 does not add up - there is currently a gap of unassociated deaths vs the historical average. 

Bottom line C0vid-19 is real, the deaths are not bogus, and there are way, way more deaths this year in every country than what is normal.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/21/world/coronavirus-missing-deaths.html?referringSource=articleShare&fbclid=IwAR1ZGshWmiBQ2PcBx4tuv0EcxLe1VJwg2PxvQIOzBxEy6ArDG95ti4n4M7s