How About over 55 or 60 cruises?

[Empehi]

Just an idea. Because one of the main problems with COVID-19 is the asymptomatic person spreading the virus unknown that they have the virus.

It is my understanding that older folks are very seldom (if ever) asymptomatic so they would be the easiest population of cruisers to identify pre-cruise.

All the cruise line would have to do is test (perhaps even daily) the crew.  What do people think?

 

[time4u2go]

What about the possibility of someone picking it up in a port?  All it takes is one.

Edited August 7, 2020 by time4u2go

[BND]

You think 55 or 60 is "older"?   Asymptomatic tend to be under 30 or even lower, not under 55.  I'm guessing you are nowhere near 55.     

Edited August 7, 2020 by BND

[zekekelso]

I thought this was going to be about the new D+ requirements. 

[cruisinghawg]

I thought Holland America already had that clientele?

[What We Found Travelling]

It’s not the passengers that the cruise lines are really worried about...... it’s their crew members!

[yogimax]

3 hours ago, Empehi said:

 

 

3 hours ago, Empehi said:

It is my understanding that older folks are very seldom (if ever) asymptomatic

 

3 hours ago, Empehi said:

 

 

Just curious... do you have any facts to back this up?

[grapau27]

8 hours ago, cruisinghawg said:

I thought Holland America already had that clientele?

So does Fred Olsen,Saga and P&O in the UK.

 

[grapau27]

8 hours ago, BND said:

You think 55 or 60 is "older"?   Asymptomatic tend to be under 30 or even lower, not under 55.  I'm guessing you are nowhere near 55.     

Maybe having disembarkation one day then Embarkation the next day so the ships can have a thorough clean down and virus spraying before the next lot of passengers get on.

[Milwaukee Eight]

9 hours ago, zekekelso said:

I thought this was going to be about the new D+ requirements. 

Just wait

[crewsweeper]

Yes, over 65, and maybe over 55, is an at-risk demographic, generally speaking.  But look at the severity and deaths in this demographic and in younger demographics.  There are typically severe underlying conditions--heart disease, diabetes, morbid obesity, etc..   There are plenty of happy, healthy, active seniors out there that cruise.  You can't limit cruising by age alone.

You can set up guidelines for risk in all age demographics.  Require a medical doctor certification of health.  No diabetes, no heart issues, reasonable BMI and other weight metrics, no walkers, no breathing oxygen tankers, maybe no wheelchairs for people who can't walk due to heath issues, versus structural disability.  Unfair to these folks?  Yes,  but general well-being for them and other cruisers is more important in the overall scheme of things.

[TravelerThom]

11 hours ago, Empehi said:

...It is my understanding that older folks are very seldom (if ever) asymptomatic ...

 

9 hours ago, BND said:

You think 55 or 60 is "older"?   Asymptomatic tend to be under 30 or even lower, not under 55.  I'm guessing you are nowhere near 55.     

Direct personal experience: I am 74 and in independent living in a Continuing Care Community. 15 days ago (23 July) prepaid qPCR were offered on a voluntary basis and were taken by 156 of the 350 independent residents. 17 of those 156 returned Positive (over 10% - ouch!). Over the 15 days since testing 1 of the 17 Positives has developed symptoms and has been hospitalized; the remaining 16 have been asymptomatic the entire time. Minimum age: 60s, median age about 80, several asymptomatic Positives are in their 90s. 
 

Am I surprised? Quite frankly I have a lot of questions about all this, but that is the one sample that I am personally part of. (I tested Negative.)

[cruisegirl1]

36 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

Maybe having disembarkation one day then Embarkation the next day so the ships can have a thorough clean down and virus spraying before the next lot of passengers get on.

Not possible unless the model of many 7 night cruises coming in and going out on Saturdays and Sundays is changed.   Maybe seven night cruise us would have an extra weekday added (Sunday to the following Monday) or perhaps cruises would have to be six days instead of seven. We can’t cram all the ships into the ports on Saturday and Sunday. They must stagger.  The beauty of many weeklong cruises was that the majority of passengers with one week off of work can take a cruise.  
 

Of course, along with many other things, we may have to change our concept of a “cruise week“ to adapt.  
 

In the short term, in 2021,  many people have already booked back to back cruises.  This  concept makes them invalid.  
 

One thing I’ve learned, never say never
m

[time4u2go]

There is also the possibility of someone catching the virus the day before the cruise (like while traveling to the port), being asymptomatic on embarkation day, then spreading it once on board. 

[bouhunter]

Just packing a ship with a higher percentage of higher risk people.  Not a good idea.....

[Empehi]

Well ..... from the previous posts on this topic it certainly appears that there will be not be cruising anytime soon.

 

Perhaps an anti-body test and only let cruisers with the anti-bodies onboard due to their supposed immunity to the virus.

 

One last thought .... I find it hard to believe that flying to a cruise departure port would not be a major risk in catching the virus

just prior to boarding. Sure, I know the airlines say it is safe but REALLY: baggage claim, eating at the airport. TSA lines, restroom breaks (especially on the airplane) and the close quarters on the airplane.

 

[Milwaukee Eight]

3 minutes ago, Empehi said:

Perhaps an anti-body test and only let cruisers with the anti-bodies onboard due to their supposed immunity to the virus.

I don’t think there is enough data that recurrence of infection may or may not be possible. Some data seems to indicate that the antibodies are not permanent?

 

Too early to tell. 

[grapau27]

1 hour ago, cruisegirl1 said:

Not possible unless the model of many 7 night cruises coming in and going out on Saturdays and Sundays is changed.   Maybe seven night cruise us would have an extra weekday added (Sunday to the following Monday) or perhaps cruises would have to be six days instead of seven. We can’t cram all the ships into the ports on Saturday and Sunday. They must stagger.  The beauty of many weeklong cruises was that the majority of passengers with one week off of work can take a cruise.  
 

Of course, along with many other things, we may have to change our concept of a “cruise week“ to adapt.  
 

In the short term, in 2021,  many people have already booked back to back cruises.  This  concept makes them invalid.  
 

One thing I’ve learned, never say never
m

7 night cruises would become 6 night cruises to allow for my suggestion.

The way things are going cruising might well be finished so any proactive suggestions to get us cruising is worth considering.

Graham.

[cruisegirl1]

24 minutes ago, grapau27 said:

7 night cruises would become 6 night cruises to allow for my suggestion.

The way things are going cruising might well be finished so any proactive suggestions to get us cruising is worth considering.

Graham.

I suspect we will see changes, but changing all 7 night cruises to 6 night cruises is a drastic change.   

 

If cruises are shortened, of course, RCCL loses one day/night of revenue for every ship for every cruise.  What about the cruise  fare many have paid for a 7 night cruise that would become a shorter cruise ?  Then there is the issue of many  C&A benefits being offered only  for  7 night or longer   cruises ( especially the  D+ bonus gifts ). Can you imagine the outcries when those with higher D+ numbers no longer get 2 or 3 gifts because currently  cruises  from   3 to 6 nights only get one gift, regardless of C&A points.   The list goes on and on and on.....    

 

I have several sets of B2B ( and one B2B2B)  scheduled for 2021 and 2022.  I am interested to see how that transpires.  I already considered that we might have to leave the ship/terminal for several hours to allow for ship cleaning, but I never considered we'd have the  extra expense and hassle of  mid B2B hotel stay and maybe a rental car or transportation costs.  

 

Back to the beginning, cruising as we know it will certainty change.  How it changes, is anyone's guess . 

M

[molly361]

2 hours ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Just wait

Is it time to pick up the slack for John ?😇

[BND]

2 hours ago, TravelerThom said:

 

Direct personal experience: I am 74 and in independent living in a Continuing Care Community. 15 days ago (23 July) prepaid qPCR were offered on a voluntary basis and were taken by 156 of the 350 independent residents. 17 of those 156 returned Positive (over 10% - ouch!). Over the 15 days since testing 1 of the 17 Positives has developed symptoms and has been hospitalized; the remaining 16 have been asymptomatic the entire time. Minimum age: 60s, median age about 80, several asymptomatic Positives are in their 90s. 
 

Am I surprised? Quite frankly I have a lot of questions about all this, but that is the one sample that I am personally part of. (I tested Negative.)

I'm 60.  My MIL is 88 and lives in an independent facility with full time care (she refuses to go to assisted living so she's spending all her savings on aides).  You have to be able to buy into it with 6 figures.  It's the nicest facility in the area, the most expensive and almost all the residents are retired military, professionals (Dr's, engineers, lawyers, etc) and they have had maybe 5 cases in the independent living section of hundreds of people.  In the assisted/long term care/memory care portion, they've had more cases and several deaths, but most of those people were there because they were close to end of life and some were sent there from outside the community.  They've done very well in controlling the outbreak and for about 8 weeks, we couldn't go visit her.  In our county, there have been 115 deaths, none under 40 and 81 over 80,  19 in the 70-79 group and it drops off dramatically from there.  At least 82 deaths were in long term care facilities.  I'm not surprised about the asymptomatic cases overall.  Like almost every virus, there will always be people who don't have symptoms.  When I was a child and went to school for two years before my sister, I would have kids in my class who would come down with something and I rarely caught it, but my sister would.  I was the "carrier" lol and have always had a much better immune system than she has.  There is some info out there that people who routinely get flu shots may have some immunity.  

Edited August 7, 2020 by BND

[BND]

2 hours ago, crewsweeper said:

Yes, over 65, and maybe over 55, is an at-risk demographic, generally speaking.  But look at the severity and deaths in this demographic and in younger demographics.  There are typically severe underlying conditions--heart disease, diabetes, morbid obesity, etc..   There are plenty of happy, healthy, active seniors out there that cruise.  You can't limit cruising by age alone.

You can set up guidelines for risk in all age demographics.  Require a medical doctor certification of health.  No diabetes, no heart issues, reasonable BMI and other weight metrics, no walkers, no breathing oxygen tankers, maybe no wheelchairs for people who can't walk due to heath issues, versus structural disability.  Unfair to these folks?  Yes,  but general well-being for them and other cruisers is more important in the overall scheme of things.

In my county, only 15 of the 115 deaths have been under age 70.  In fact, in the under 60 age group there have been only 5 and I guarantee those all had underlying medical conditions and probably serious ones.  So, from our demographics in our county, it's pretty much over 80 that have the highest number of deaths.  As I posted above 81 of the deaths are in the over 80 age group, which covers 80's, 90's which are a smaller number of the population so the percentage of serious illness and death is much, much higher in 80+ than under 80.  I think your "requirements" are a little over the top.  Diabetes can be controlled and not really be a factor, heart issues, depend on what type, BMI doesn't mean as much as some people think it does unless you are morbidly obese, walkers can just mean back or knee problems which aren't a risk.  I'm glad you don't get to decide who cruises.

[cruisegirl1]

14 hours ago, Empehi said:

Just an idea. Because one of the main problems with COVID-19 is the asymptomatic person spreading the virus unknown that they have the virus.

It is my understanding that older folks are very seldom (if ever) asymptomatic so they would be the easiest population of cruisers to identify pre-cruise.

All the cruise line would have to do is test (perhaps even daily) the crew.  What do people think?

 

55 or 60  ( as you suggested  in the title ) is NOT considered "older folks".      

 

M

[Milwaukee Eight]

1 hour ago, molly361 said:

Is it time to pick up the slack for John ?😇

Hum. May be a long wait. He’s busy cooking pork butts. 😇

[molly361]

2 minutes ago, Milwaukee Eight said:

Hum. May be a long wait. He’s busy cooking pork butts. 😇

We might need another reincarnation