What do you think of the new Covid-19 Health Program for all Viking Ships?

[lackcreativity]

I am quite impressed by the measures that Viking has taken. I will likely still wait for the vaccine for the two of us, but I can foresee a time when my desire to travel outweighs my wish for that experience to be exactly the same as it used to be. At 67, I still hope for a few more good years ahead, but there's still so much to see that I can't wait forever! 😉

[Peregrina651]

3 hours ago, OnTheJourney said:

Several good points raised. With the whole "risk free guarantee" that they've been offering, presumably the wording is that you can simply decide to not go on a trip penalty-free. https://www.vikingrivercruises.com/risk-free-guarantee.html 

 

Just to be clear. The risk free guarantee is not a cash back guarantee. Refunds are given in accordance with the refund policy of the company with the difference being that once in the penalty phase, what the company used to keep as penalty, and we would claim against our travel insurance,  is now given to us as vouchers.

 

As for the vouchers, first, once a voucher, always a voucher, and second, you may apply for a refund once expires at the end of two years.

[Ragnar Danneskjold]

Lot’s of good news coming out on vaccines becoming available for use world wide.  Lots of development and phase three trials going on outside the US.  Bodes well for crew getting vaccinated quickly.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/09/coronavirs-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-to-immunize-the-planet-more-effectively-lancet-editor-says.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/09/chinas-covid-vaccine-from-sinopharm-is-86percent-effective-uae-says-.html?&qsearchterm=uae chinese covid vaccine

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/science/coronavirus-vaccine-tracker.html

[Eastporter]

I am booked on a June Homelands cruise.

 

It appears that Viking has developed a most comprehensive set of protocols to make the actual ships a “bubble”.   But bubbles are not impervious.  I teach at a service academy which has created a bubble.   For the most part, our students are confined to the campus.   They have been 100% restricted for the past several weeks, after the recent uptick in the overall positivity rates.  Our football coach has said that we have guards at our gates armed with guns to ensure the students cannot come and go.   We randomly test over 15% of our student body (PCR) on a weekly basis and test 100% of our in-season athletes several times weekly.   We have separate isolation quarters for those who test positive and those in close contact with them.   Students were not allowed to go home or even off campus for Thanksgiving.   Yet, we have students still testing positive, albeit at a fraction of a percentage of the local area’s positivity rate.   I suspect that Viking (absent a 100% vaccinated population) may see the same thing.  Especially as we are letting the passengers off the ship for excursions, even in a controlled environment.   Bubbles can leak.

 

My concerns are what happens if a passenger or a companion test positive.   Is he left at the current Port to quarantine on his own and experience the potential vagaries of the local medical system (hopefully not in SPB)?   Or does he continue onboard in some sort of quarantine?   Can the onboard staff handle a Covid patient?   How does he eventually get home?   What happens at the end of the voyage?   

 

How will Viking answer these questions?   I haven’t seen the answers yet. 

[Heidi13]

2 hours ago, Ragnar Danneskjold said:

Lot’s of good news coming out on vaccines becoming available for use world wide.  Lots of development and phase three trials going on outside the US.  Bodes well for crew getting vaccinated quickly.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/09/coronavirs-oxford-astrazeneca-vaccine-to-immunize-the-planet-more-effectively-lancet-editor-says.html

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/09/chinas-covid-vaccine-from-sinopharm-is-86percent-effective-uae-says-.html?&qsearchterm=uae chinese covid vaccine

 

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/science/coronavirus-vaccine-tracker.html

 

Ragnar - in addition to development and trials, UK commenced vaccinations yesterday, with 5,000 to 7,000 per day to begin with. Some concern with allergic reactions were noted after day 1.

[Baron Barracuda]

Commend Viking for a very well thought out plan.  Unfortunately not quite reassuring enough to get us back to sailing just yet.  With vaccines imminent we'll hold off until '22.

 

Looked but didn't see in the announcement whether VR will be implementing the same safeguards as VO.  Imagine it would be difficult to squeeze a pcr lab onto the river boats.

[Jim Avery]

8 minutes ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Commend Viking for a very well thought out plan.  Unfortunately not quite reassuring enough to get us back to sailing just yet.  With vaccines imminent we'll hold off until '22.

 

Looked but didn't see in the announcement whether VR will be implementing the same safeguards as VO.  Imagine it would be difficult to squeeze a pcr lab onto the river boats.

I'm with you Baron.  Nothing will be like cruising until covid becomes just another disease like hundreds of others that can make some sick and possibly have worse consequences.  For example, people die of pneumonia every day.  If someone on a cruise is diagnosed with pneumonia does the cruise end, are the passengers all quarantined?  No.  The patient is isolated and treated and put ashore for hospitalization if necessary.  Remember when AIDS first appeared?  It was deadly.  No one knew exactly how it could be transmitted.  Could you get it from a sneeze?  Sweat? Skin contact?  Did the world shut down?  Did cruise ships, airlines, hotels, restaurants stop?  Of course not.  The medical pros went to work and did their best to come up with a solution, which eventually did happen, while the rest of the world continued.  I fear this shutdown/testing/fear becoming normalized.  Rest assured, there will be another virus that pops up.  Is this current reaction the way we really want to spend whatever years we have left?

[OnTheJourney]

29 minutes ago, Jim Avery said:

Is this current reaction the way we really want to spend whatever years we have left?

Seriously...time is of the essence....

Edited December 9, 2020 by OnTheJourney

[Peregrina651]

2 hours ago, Baron Barracuda said:

Looked but didn't see in the announcement whether VR will be implementing the same safeguards as VO.  Imagine it would be difficult to squeeze a pcr lab onto the river boats.

 

In the video, Hagen said that for the river cruises they were setting up labs on shore. 

[moatenote]

19 hours ago, Jim Avery said:

As much as we have loved our time on Viking we will not be traveling with these conditions.  Pay thousands of dollars to be tested every day?  Go only in "safety bubble" excursions?  That's not travel to us.  When it gets to unfettered travel we will have all the shots and be ready to go.  Till then, I am putting in new windows......🍹

I understand the need for Viking to restrict passengers from roaming around a port on their own, but I don't think I want to travel under those conditions.

[duquephart]

43 minutes ago, moatenote said:

I understand the need for Viking to restrict passengers from roaming around a port on their own, but I don't think I want to travel under those conditions.

 

You are not alone.

[Baron Barracuda]

2 hours ago, Peregrina651 said:

 

In the video, Hagen said that for the river cruises they were setting up labs on shore. 

Thanks peregrina

[Baron Barracuda]

3 hours ago, Jim Avery said:

I'm with you Baron.  Nothing will be like cruising until covid becomes just another disease like hundreds of others that can make some sick and possibly have worse consequences.  For example, people die of pneumonia every day.  If someone on a cruise is diagnosed with pneumonia does the cruise end, are the passengers all quarantined?  No.  The patient is isolated and treated and put ashore for hospitalization if necessary.  Remember when AIDS first appeared?  It was deadly.  No one knew exactly how it could be transmitted.  Could you get it from a sneeze?  Sweat? Skin contact?  Did the world shut down?  Did cruise ships, airlines, hotels, restaurants stop?  Of course not.  The medical pros went to work and did their best to come up with a solution, which eventually did happen, while the rest of the world continued.  I fear this shutdown/testing/fear becoming normalized.  Rest assured, there will be another virus that pops up.  Is this current reaction the way we really want to spend whatever years we have left?

Dear MIL was born during spanish flu in 1918.  Just passed away this year (not from covid).  Meanwhile my granddaughter was born earlier this year.  Hopefully she'll also get to age 101 before seeing another pandemic. 

[Heidi13]

1 hour ago, moatenote said:

I understand the need for Viking to restrict passengers from roaming around a port on their own, but I don't think I want to travel under those conditions.

 

That is part of the reason we just cancelled 2022 and booked in 2023. Hopefully by Jan 2023 the world will have settled down.

 

We enjoy booking private tours as well as cruise line shore-ex.

[dandee2]

So it looks like they deliver the PCR test in the room. So you can have one person (the one who got the vaccine) do both test, packed it and give it to the lab crew member? Or do you have to do it in front of the crew?..

[Captain_Morgan]

15 hours ago, Eastporter said:

My concerns are what happens if a passenger or a companion test positive.   Is he left at the current Port to quarantine on his own and experience the potential vagaries of the local medical system (hopefully not in SPB)?   Or does he continue onboard in some sort of quarantine?   Can the onboard staff handle a Covid patient?   How does he eventually get home?   What happens at the end of the voyage?   

 

How will Viking answer these questions?   I haven’t seen the answers yet. 

 

I agree 100% with your entire post but thought the above is the most poignant in this instance as it remains to be seen how they plan on dealing with situations that arise onboard.  

I've seen articles and heard from people with specific knowledge of the situation whereby pax and crew on Costa ships sailing to/from Italy have been landed to a local COVID centre (hospital?) as a result of having tested positive during onboard testing, which may be fine if they are Italian citizens/residents as I believe they (Costa) are only catering to 'local' passengers but how does Viking plan on dealing with an American or Canadian or British passenger who tests positive onboard in a foreign country?  

So far all that has been said from Viking is that they've spent what can be assumed to be an enormous amount of money on technology and drafted plans to say how they will go about creating their bubble but as you very clearly stated, bubbles leak and when they do the true measure is how the situation is handled, not focusing on all the things which were put in place to prevent the occurrence which seemingly failed.

[dandee2]

11 hours ago, dandee2 said:

So it looks like they deliver the PCR test in the room. So you can have one person (the one who got the vaccine) do both test, packed it and give it to the lab crew member? Or do you have to do it in front of the crew?..

Faking the test - some are already thinking about it.

[photopro2]

18 hours ago, moatenote said:

I understand the need for Viking to restrict passengers from roaming around a port on their own, but I don't think I want to travel under those conditions.

Agreed, I think that will be the sticking point for us too. 

 

And our other outstanding question has also been raised.........

 

6 hours ago, Captain_Morgan said:

how does Viking plan on dealing with an American or Canadian or British passenger who tests positive onboard in a foreign country?  

 

[lackcreativity]

On 12/9/2020 at 4:45 PM, moatenote said:

I understand the need for Viking to restrict passengers from roaming around a port on their own, but I don't think I want to travel under those conditions.

We also love to have time on our own in ports, usually after an excursion. However, the inability to do that would not prevent me from cruising when the option is available. Too much time has been lost during this pandemic, and I am anxious to get going again!

 

When we were in St. Petersburg, we were on a private tour (Alla Tours), but even then we were not allowed to go off on our own. That didn't prevent us from considering that one of our favorite ports of all time. 

 

I haven't seen this mentioned anywhere, but perhaps Viking will have smaller groups for their tours if the intention is that the guides are expected to keep a closer eye on the guests than is normally expected.

[OnTheJourney]

On 12/9/2020 at 6:46 PM, Heidi13 said:

That is part of the reason we just cancelled 2022 a

I feel confident (or at least very hopeful) that '22 will be reasonably safe to travel again. Just rescheduled 2 cruises for then. 

[CurlerRob]

On 12/9/2020 at 12:37 PM, Eastporter said:

My concerns are what happens if a passenger or a companion test positive.   Is he left at the current Port to quarantine on his own and experience the potential vagaries of the local medical system (hopefully not in SPB)?   Or does he continue onboard in some sort of quarantine?   Can the onboard staff handle a Covid patient?   How does he eventually get home?   What happens at the end of the voyage?   

 

How will Viking answer these questions?   I haven’t seen the answers yet. 

This was from the Health & Safety FAQ section ... the emphases are mine.

 

"Guests with a positive COVID-19 test will be isolated on board and then disembarked at the first opportunity for quarantine at an appropriate facility ashore. A second test will be performed to validate the first test. If the second test confirms COVID-19, we will arrange for the guest to recover ashore before returning home once their recovery is complete. Upon their return home, Viking Customer Relations will contact the guest and their travel advisor directly regarding any necessary refunding or rescheduling."

 

To me, the impact of onboard cases is the biggest issue for prospective pax to evaluate, at least in the shorter term. Think about testing positive and being "beached" a long way from home - especially if you are asymptomatic or only have mild symptoms. Who defines "appropriate facility" and what might that mean? Are the insurance implications similar to those of having a health emergency in normal times? We've all seen places that we'd love to be "marooned", and others, not so much!

 

In addition, we've all likely experienced schedule changes needed in order to get someone who is ill to proper care. How frequent or impactful might that be when anyone testing positive has to be removed from the ship?

 

Finally, Viking's ability to get stricken pax to an "appropriate facility" may be hampered by local country authorities who are unwilling to accept sick pax - remember the circuses from the spring! As far as I'm concerned, these potential issues dwarf shore excursion and masking issues.

 

In my opinion, Viking's protocols have been well thought out, but they are designed for a world where the virus is still prevalent, and infections are expected to continue. The question each of us needs to deal with is if we are comfortable sailing in that kind of world.

 

On a cheerier side, here's hoping the vaccines play out well, and perhaps the 2022 situation will render much of this moot. Certainly, that's our hope!  🍻🥌
 

 

[TayanaLorna]

The Viking site has Tor's talk, a step by step written guide of the protocol as well as FAQ which will address most of the questions raised here.  I read some great comments and concerns here.  Food for further thought.

 

The Viking plan is pretty much what I hoped they would do and probably the best in the industry.  Yes it creates a bubble and it could burst.  Nothing is 100% especially since I see people here discussing potential ways of circumventing the PCR saliva test.  I would never do that!

 

There was a travel writer on the Sea Dream Barbados cruise who described the experience.  At the end of her blog said something like - a cruise line can create all the protocol they want but it is the people who will flaunt the rules and bring it on board.  I wonder how many people of the group that brought Covid19 on board went out partying on a layover.  It is not easy to get to Barbados from many US locations in one day and in time to board the ship before departure without a layover.  But then taking a mask off to eat or drink on a plane or at an airport food vendor can expose a person.  I am curious to learn the habits and whereabouts of those Covid carriers.

 

For us, I agree with many here that the freedom to explore at one's own pace and on private excursions is important to us.  There are many itineraries that I would not sail with these restrictions.  The only cruise we have booked is a 15 day Trans-Atlantic with 5 ports to visit plus embarkation city for end of November 2021.  We are okay with being limited to Viking tours even the panoramic bus ones at these stops.  We have thoroughly enjoyed both included and optional on Viking Ocean.  Plus our main interest is the lengthy sea time - over half of the itinerary.  Just want to be out on the water and pampered.

 

We will, however, not go unless we are vaccinated.  Initially our criteria was a vaccine requirement for all.  But now knowing their safety protocol we are comfortable traveling without it.  I do expect Viking to start up well before our cruise so it's a "wait and see how well it works" period for us also.

 

 

[OnTheJourney]

On 12/8/2020 at 8:58 PM, Jim Avery said:

 Till then, I am putting in new windows......🍹

 

Jim...off topic here for a moment .....check out the last post in this thread - page 5.. Is it very likely that the 7 p.m arrival time in Charleston is supposed to be a.m.?  No idea what the nautical miles are between Newport RI and Charleston. I mean....there's a sea day after leaving Newport at 6 p.m. and then the itinerary shows to arrive at Charleston in the evening? I don't think so....

 

 

[Jim Avery]

Who knows?  I have watched Viking Sun steam many days all day at 10-12 knots in order to time arrivals.  Not at all like the Good Ole Days on QE2 at 30+ knots..

[photopro2]

On 12/11/2020 at 1:49 AM, CurlerRob said:

we will arrange for the guest to recover ashore before returning home once their recovery is complete. Upon their return home, Viking Customer Relations will contact the guest and their travel advisor directly regarding any necessary refunding or rescheduling."

Thanks CurlerRob for finding and passing on that information. It is nice to see that Viking again seem to be going above and beyond by not only taking care of the sick passenger (medical cost aside, that will require separate insurance I assume) but also even considering refunding or rescheduling for a problem that was was not of their making and largely beyond their control.