Norwegian Cruise Line sues Florida surgeon general over ‘vaccine-passport’ ban

[milolii]

My next sailing is April 2022.  But I feel for all of you.  Booking, canceling, and rebooking

[DCGuy64]

3 minutes ago, saltsandknit said:

I now think of booking cruises as a game of chance. Eventually I will hit the bonus of an actual sailing. Also my time off is very flexible 

I think you're right about it being a game of chance. It certainly seems that way these days.

My time off is somewhat flexible, in general. But I have professional singing commitments starting in October so if we don't get to sail in September, that's pretty much it until after Christmas. And we've already got a cruise scheduled for next April plus a possible overseas trip in May 2022 (which has been rescheduled several times and is a singing trip with probably 40 people, so we can't just make everybody change for us). It's pretty much do or die.

8 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

March 2022. 

I wonder if the user name "Fat Fingers" is taken?

Haha. I thought maybe you'd have enough time to edit it but too late. No worries. You should be fine with a 2022 cruise.

[skywonder]

This is just dumb, it is just going to make a bigger mess then it is already. Del Rio has no sense. If anything its going to slow things down and drag this mess out even longer.

Edited July 13, 2021 by skywonder

[DCGuy64]

FYI Cruise Critic is mentioned by name in the filing of the complaint, it's on page 11.

😃

[ChiefMateJRK]

7 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

March 2022. 

I wonder if the user name "Fat Fingers" is taken?

🤣  I still try to blame my fat fingers as well, but folks near to me know that really means "old brain." 

[Joebucks]

While I can understand NCL's position, I support Florida's more. Regardless of what your stance is on the vaccine, there are two important things to consider. First, the vaccine is still in experimental status. To require anything put into people's bodies, that is an important classification that needs solved. I don't care to hear why you think this overrides that. This is an important precedent. Second, other industries aren't requiring it. The only reason cruising is in this scenario, is already because of a year plus of government restriction. This has caused cruise companies to feel like they need to walk on thin ice, and they are too desperate to not operate. Not to mention that the CDC couldn't give data as to why this control was needed.

 

If anything, I think the ask should be for actual government assistance. This part is a rare view from me too. Maybe funding and plans for treatment, evacuation, etc. If cruising is this risk, which also hasn't been proven yet, then let's start to route those resources where they are needed.

[aubreyc1988]

7 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

While I can understand NCL's position, I support Florida's more. Regardless of what your stance is on the vaccine, there are two important things to consider. First, the vaccine is still in experimental status. To require anything put into people's bodies, that is an important classification that needs solved. I don't care to hear why you think this overrides that. This is an important precedent. Second, other industries aren't requiring it. The only reason cruising is in this scenario, is already because of a year plus of government restriction. This has caused cruise companies to feel like they need to walk on thin ice, and they are too desperate to not operate. Not to mention that the CDC couldn't give data as to why this control was needed.

 

If anything, I think the ask should be for actual government assistance. This part is a rare view from me too. Maybe funding and plans for treatment, evacuation, etc. If cruising is this risk, which also hasn't been proven yet, then let's start to route those resources where they are needed.

 

Here's something you forgot. Cruising isn't a necessity. It's a choice. It's not like going to the grocery store or something, it's a leisure activity.  No one is FORCING anyone to get the vaccine, however a company that operates a LEISURE activity should have the right to say "If you want to come do my LEISURE activity, you have to be vaccinated", just like a person has the right to say "no thanks" and walk away from said leisure activity. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by aubreyc1988

[oteixeira]

Also, if CDC is over reaching enough that Florida would sue, I think Florida is just as much over reaching in business practices by restricting what they can ask for.  Tit for tat, you win one, you lose one Florida.

[coaster]

Bad move on NCL's part. DeSantis already stated he is 'ok' with NCL moving out of Florida. This will just make things be more heated and ugly between the two.

[WarfRatWA]

3 minutes ago, coaster said:

Bad move on NCL's part. DeSantis already stated he is 'ok' with NCL moving out of Florida. This will just make things be more heated and ugly between the two.

Business does not care about heated and ugly nor does it care about politics.  It cares about profits, and NCL has determined 100% vaccinated cruises are the best thing for their bottom line.  So they persist.

[PTC DAWG]

Celebrity’s 95% model seems to be working…I will know more on Aug 1 when I sail…the Edge cruises have been just fine..

[pc_load_letter]

I can see both sides and will be popping the popcorn in anticipation of both sides on here debating.

 

I am in CA and I have to believe the NCL cruise here in Nov will require to be vax'd but who knows.

 

I hindsight, I am surprised Disney never balked at the FL law and yet has been doing fine without asking.

Edited July 13, 2021 by pc_load_letter
update

[smplybcause]

7 minutes ago, pc_load_letter said:

I can see both sides and will be popping the popcorn in anticipation of both sides on here debating.

 

I am in CA and I have to believe the NCL cruise here in Nov will require to be vax'd but who knows.

 

I hindsight, I am surprised Disney never balked at the FL law and yet has been doing fine without asking.

 

I'm sure partially because they focus on kids and partially because so many do a park and cruise thing. 

 

But it's also been over 2 weeks since they canceled their year cruise and not a peep about it being rescheduled. 

[need2cruisesoon]

"At the end of the day, cruise ships have motors, propellers and rudders, and God forbid we can't operate in the state of Florida for whatever reason, then there are other states that we do operate from, and we can operate from the Caribbean for a ship that otherwise would have gone to Florida"   - Frank Del Rio

[Dr. Cocktail]

An interesting topic (mildly understated) for more ways than one .....

 

I have my own opinions on the matter (let's just say I haven't met a vaccine I didn't like ...) but a lot of people on both sides of the argument are missing the fact that .... the fact that you're reading this makes you a TRUE BELIEVER ... in cruising.

 

The vast majority of the population have never been on a cruise and of those that have, a vast majority doesn't know that CC exists! When I explain that it's owned by TripAdvisor, people "get it"!

 

This is all a rambling introduction to: when I tell my patients (the avatar is connected to something!) that I've booked a few cruises for '22 and beyond, the general response is: 1) laughter (they think that I'm out of my mind 2) stunned silence (refer to 1) and a hesitant 3) well, I guess it is next year ...

 

Meaning: the general population still thinks that cruising in the current environment is insane ( or at least unadvised) and this is something that the cruise lines are very well aware of.

 

It's in their vital interest to make a cruise as "unscary" as possible. Having everyone vaccinated is a good step towards that goal ....

[RRSeeker]

Does anyone know how much it would cost a cruise company to have a ship stuck at sea with a group of Covid positive guests or crew? Canceling future cruises and issuing refunds would have to effect their profits and their reputation.

 

I think the best way to keep that from happening is to require 100% vaccination. 

[BermudaBound2014]

It's not surprising that I have a completely different take then the vast majority of CC posters.

 

 Let's just say, it will not shock me if NCL files bankruptcy (CH 11, Ch 7) while this thing is conveniently being battled out in the court room. There is a reason NCL is the only cruise line taking this path. 

Edited July 13, 2021 by BermudaBound2014

[Seany527]

1 hour ago, DCGuy64 said:

There goes our September cruise out of Miami. I can just see NCL cancelling cruises as they fight this out in court. Good news is our final payment isn't due till next week. 😃I support NCL, too, but this doesn't bode well for upcoming sailings. 😟

I think it will still sail. I’m too tired to do the math/ratios but given Celebrity’s numbers at 1-2% unvaccinated it’s a really low percent compared to Gem’s capacity. 
 

NCL will sail, pay their fine and then win it back in court. 

[pc_load_letter]

10 minutes ago, RRSeeker said:

Does anyone know how much it would cost a cruise company to have a ship stuck at sea with a group of Covid positive guests or crew? Canceling future cruises and issuing refunds would have to effect their profits and their reputation.

 

I think the best way to keep that from happening is to require 100% vaccination. 

 

That's some hyperbole there!

 

Cruises have already had multiple Covid positive tests. They are quarantined and let off at the next stop.

[wally4ever]

Speaking as a hopeful first-time cruiser in December and parent of a 9 year old, I wish NCL would make allowances for children who literally cannot get vaccinated, but I get their stance, and if I have to cancel, I have to cancel... I just hope they let me know for sure more than 60 days before.

[RRSeeker]

1 minute ago, pc_load_letter said:

 

That's some hyperbole there!

 

Cruises have already had multiple Covid positive tests. They are quarantined and let off at the next stop.

That is assuming the next port will take them. 

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, Joebucks said:

Second, other industries aren't requiring it

Actually, there are many businesses that require their employees to be vaccinated, most importantly the health care industry.

[mrlevin]

Just now, chengkp75 said:

Actually, there are many businesses that require their employees to be vaccinated, most importantly the health care industry.

Of employees not customers.

[coaster]

NCL needs to move on and stop playing the victim narrative and suing. Other lines are sailing fine from Florida. FDR is just a bully.

[chengkp75]

2 minutes ago, mrlevin said:

Of employees not customers.

And the Florida laws prevents NCL from requiring a vaccine for the crew.  And, since the "non-covid vaccinated" are not a protected class, even in Florida, any business can deny service to a non-vaccinated person.