Merged:Outbreak on QM2 as it pulls into New York?

[Interestedcruisefan]

3 hours ago, comcox said:

This morning when I opened my email, I found one from Cunard suddenly asking me to sign "as soon as possible" an  ACKNOWLEDGEMENT & ACCEPTANCE OF RISKS FOR COVID-19 form for my Jan. 3rd TA on QM2.  Looks like the lawyers are getting nervous.

Here's a passenger getting the message 2 weeks before they sail ?

 

And after they have paid in full I assume? 

 

 

[Host Hattie]

5 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

I was assuming they had only just introduced that

 

Those on the first TA had it in early November, before final payment.

[Interestedcruisefan]

Apparently us Brits don't get sent these risks to be made aware of? 

 

Just US passengers?

 

Dont we matter?

[cruising.mark.uk]

1 minute ago, kohl1957 said:

Curious. My take as an American is that these forms are about advising of what must be already obvious risks of travelling in a sealed container for a set time with a crowd of people from all over, calling at myriad ports en route and, in many cases, flying in an airplane to get there etc. Not to mention that tests and vaccines are no guarantee as to.. well anything.  These forms are about having you having to chosen to still do so, absolve them of the consequences of your decision. Of course, in the U.S. you can never sign away your rights to sue in the case of malfeasance. 

Exactly.  Any Brit who is not aware of the risks of embarking on a cruise in the current environment must have been on a different planet for the last months!

[Twolittleboys]

46 minutes ago, North West Newbie said:

 

Since 1 November 2021 it is supposed to be https://www.nhsx.nhs.uk/covid-19-response/eu-gateway/.

 

Huh, not sure if that is the same thing. Seems to refer to the Covid certificate - I was talking about the warn app which constantly scans which phones are close to you and if you test positive sends a message to all the phones that you were close to for a certain amount of time during the contagious period. Looking at my app it does not look like it integrates with the English one but maybe it does. Would certainly explain my warning.

[Interestedcruisefan]

8 minutes ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

Exactly.  Any Brit who is not aware of the risks of embarking on a cruise in the current environment must have been on a different planet for the last months!

This doesn't make sense 

 

If every cruise passenger already knows all the risks why is any cruise line asking them to sign all that before they cruise

 

As it happens I think there is a huge grey area about who pays expenses for quarantine for positive passengers and close contacts if  they have to quarantine and fly home

 

But clearly US customers must already know all the answers to that?

 

And are paying for it all themselves ?

 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[Interestedcruisefan]

9 minutes ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

Exactly.  Any Brit who is not aware of the risks of embarking on a cruise in the current environment must have been on a different planet for the last months!

So why do US guests have to sign to say they know all the risks and they are happy to pay all their own quarantine costs? 

 

If you guys already know all this?

 

Lol

 

Don't they trust your IQ levels or something?

 

But they trust ours?

[cruising.mark.uk]

3 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

This doesn't make sense 

 

If every cruise passenger already knows all the risks why is any cruise line asking them to sign all that before they cruise

 

As it happens I think there is a huge grey area about who pays expenses for quarantine for positive passengers and close contacts if  they have to quarantine and fly home

 

But clearly US customers must already know all the answers to that?

 

And are paying for it all themselves ?

 

 

I agree that there is a grey area about meeting costs.  But, if you are reading the same form I am, it does not say anything about that.  Rather, it is asking people to acknowledge the risk that they will be refused boarding / quarantined / removed from the ship if they test positive or are a close contact.  That should not come as a surprise to anyone who is sailing.

[North West Newbie]

27 minutes ago, Twolittleboys said:

 

Huh, not sure if that is the same thing. Seems to refer to the Covid certificate - I was talking about the warn app which constantly scans which phones are close to you and if you test positive sends a message to all the phones that you were close to for a certain amount of time during the contagious period. Looking at my app it does not look like it integrates with the English one but maybe it does. Would certainly explain my warning.

 

Apologies, it’s not the same thing. I inadvertently thought you were referring to the NHS COVID Pass being integrated into the EU DCC system.

[Twolittleboys]

1 minute ago, North West Newbie said:

 

Apologies, it’s not the same thing. I inadvertently thought you were referring to the NHS COVID Pass being integrated into the EU DCC system.

 

No problem. It would have explained why I got a warning for a sea day - most of the passengers were from the UK.

[Vskye]

We were on the QM2 TA and disembarked on Monday. 

We got the ACKNOWLEDGEMENT & ACCEPTANCE OF RISKS FOR COVID-19 forms in the mail over a month ago and mailed them back in. We live in the US.

We had a wonderful time on the ship (it was my third TA, but first westbound) and didn't have any problems. Most things seemed unchanged from before, lots of music and good Insights talks with most people wearing masks except when eating or drinking. Having only about 50% capacity was nice.

We didn't get to walk outside on several days due to rough conditions and the decks being closed. There was a long line for the pre-departure covid test in Southampton, but it moved fairly quickly and we were in our cabin before our assigned check-in time. The line to get tested on the ship on Sunday was not as long, as we were assigned times according to our deck. We had the printed results in our cabin by dinner time. 

[Host Hattie]

Thank you for reporting back.

[Victoria2]

1 hour ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Apparently us Brits don't get sent these risks to be made aware of? 

 

Just US passengers?

 

Dont we matter?

 

1 hour ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

So why do US guests have to sign to say they know all the risks and they are happy to pay all their own quarantine costs? 

 

If you guys already know all this?

 

Lol

 

Don't they trust your IQ levels or something?

 

But they trust ours?

Could it be because we, as a country haven't got around to be quite as litigious as in  'sue first ask questions later' ? Not yet at any rate.

[Interestedcruisefan]

2 hours ago, kohl1957 said:

This isn't about costs... that's in the insurance. My insurance covers it, it's clearly spelled out. This is about acknowledging risks and absolving (well as much as possible.. which in the U.S. isn't much) the carrier of responsibility if you still get sick or impacted by others who do. That's why you should (and for US market passengers, you don't have to btw) take out travel insurance. 

 

At this point, the virus itself seems almost light relief compared to the media and government induced panic, angst and frankly hysteria over it.  I am more worried how many dress shirts I should pack for 28 days and not forget my cuff links.  And not expect Cunard to be responsible if I forget to pack them. They are, BTW, original 1969 QE2 ones, too. Very special. 

No sorry you are mistaken

 

The UK cruisers have slowly established only cruisers who test positive are insured for quarantine

 

Close contacts who have to quarantine with them are not insured even with special covid insurance

 

Hence the relevance of the document 

 

Which very much does mention costs which are at your own risk

 

Despite someone above saying its not about costs

 

Also many thought that quarantine takes place on the ship whereas many ships are quick to offload

 

 

 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[mcloaked]

That is the direct relevance of this issue, Interestedcruisefan. Cunard have been really quite secretive about the costs issue when someone accompanying a passenger who tests positive, leaves the ship to join land based quarantine - and if that is a long way from home, and leads to a period in a hotel far from home, and then repatriation, that could amount to significant costs, and more than the cost of the cruise, if insurance does not cover them.  Also if a couple has one of the pair test positive and sent off the ship to quarantine, but the partner/spouse stay on the ship, that would be one miserable holiday - and this kind of issue is not well managed for the passengers concerned. Hence decision making about going or not going is very dependent on the consequences of exactly these issues. The rules have not been clear, and it is also not clear that insurance policies cover those specific eventualities - and would need not only a minutely careful reading of the small print but also asking the underwriters specifically if they would or would not cover these situations.

 

[bbtablet]

I think this is about insurance rather than specific COVID related risks.

 

From reading these threads I have gleaned that American passengers do not have to have insurance - it is up to them - something to do with their "rights" not to have to do anything!

However it is a condition of being allowed onto the ship that every British cruiser has insurance and it has to cover COVID (to some degree).

 

Correct me if I am wrong.

[lissie]

This will get interesting when NZ/Australians start cruising again. I have managed to get full insurance for an upcoming trip next year which includes 2 cruises. But the insurance specifically EXCLUDES quarantine and medical costs for covid on mulit-day cruises.  Will cover me if I get sick on land - but not for any sickness involving the actual cruise.  Fully jabbed with all boosters available at the time I don't  see this as a major risk - even less so as the evidence comes in that omicron is less severe. 

 

The is a good insurance policy - my partner has heart issues and is hard to insure for cruising and the USA = so if  they exclude I[m sure they all do. 

[Victoria2]

It's all very annoying.

 

I can't be bothered working out the exact percentage of Covid positive people on QM2 but it's extremely small.

 

Now right or wrong, I am making the assumption the positive folk, were positive due to to exposure before boarding as the crossing probably wasn't really long enough to infect others [I say probably as an insurance in case I'm wrong].

 

In our case, we are fed up of no holidays for over two years at the moment. We will isolate if needs be before our next cruise. We will double mask up, or triple if it helps, as we wait to board.  We will have room service in our hotel if we decide to stay overnight pre cruise.

 

You get the drift. We will do our UTMOST to be Covid negative and any problems will arise from catching the damn virus onboard. 

Statistics aren't available for that scenario but again, we will be SO careful. 

 

I want to start living again and if it means taking a very small risk by joining a ship where most passengers will adhere to required protocols, then we will go for it.

[Interestedcruisefan]

3 hours ago, bbtablet said:

I think this is about insurance rather than specific COVID related risks.

 

From reading these threads I have gleaned that American passengers do not have to have insurance - it is up to them - something to do with their "rights" not to have to do anything!

However it is a condition of being allowed onto the ship that every British cruiser has insurance and it has to cover COVID (to some degree).

 

Correct me if I am wrong.

Yes but UK cruisers have established that even the covid specific cruise insurance we HAVE to buy to cruise only covers costs of positive cases who have to quarantine and not their close contacts

 

This is the covid cruise insurance the cruise lines themselves recommend

 

Nobody at the cruise lines or insurance companies had anticipated this issue

 

They literally  have no answers 

[Interestedcruisefan]

2 hours ago, kohl1957 said:

So... my insurance most certainly covers quarantine under the standard trip delay or interruption benefit.  Quarantine is as old as travel and has nothing to do or unique with Covid.  So at least my company covers it fully, for any reason, if I am quarantined during the course of the trip. And yes, I confirmed it did, too.  You can be quarantined for yellow fever, smallpox or anything btw on a ship or off it. Been that way for.... well since steamship travel began. It's the definition of a "trip interruption." 

 

And yes... U.S. market passengers are not required to have insurance.  My British wife, who is booked with me, and from the U.S. does not either. Of course, not being imbeciles, we have travel insurance of our choosing. 

 

It's such a pity this causes so much stress, angst and worry.  Sadly, too many react to headlines and creepy crawly "stats" at the bottom of the screen.  Do some basic actuarial research on your own and you find it's... safe to venture out.  Indeed, even travel insurance... the real barometer of how seriously insurance companies take this have not exploded in cost, at least in the U.S. My cruise, double in length from 2019, is being insured for oh about $220 more out of pocket over the per diem rate from 2019. Or about $7.85 more a day. 

 

 

If your wife tests positive but you don't are you going to leave her to quarantine abroad on her own?

 

Or are you going to get off and pay your own expenses abroad and flights home once she recovers ?

 

Because if you aren't positive with her then your insurance won't cover your expenses and vice versa

 

It's a loophole that puts all passengers at risk that the cruise lines haven't considered nor warned us about 

 

It's our problem not theirs

 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[hamrag]

1 hour ago, Victoria2 said:

It's all very annoying.

 

I can't be bothered working out the exact percentage of Covid positive people on QM2 but it's extremely small....

The problem is we do not know, and will never know, the true extent of the outbreak....the Cunard PR machine is in full flow!

[Interestedcruisefan]

2 minutes ago, hamrag said:

The problem is we do not know, and will never know, the true extent of the outbreak....the Cunard PR machine is in full flow!

10 positives when you add in close contacts means plenty of people spending Xmas self isolating  in the Holiday Inn Brooklyn

 

When they thought they were heading for a dream xmas holiday in the Caribbean 

 

I guess it's ok as long as it's happening to somebody else 

 

 

Edited December 22, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[EvaBME]

I have a question.  A friend of my mother's is boarding in Brooklyn.  How often will people be tested? 

 

If people get off the ship in the Caribbean, will they be tested when they come back on board?  

 

So confusing.  I've been on the holiday cruise on QM2 a few times, I really feel for those people taking it for the first time.  My first time on QM2 packing for the formal/elegant casual/semi formal night stressed me out.  I can't imaging COVID on top of it all.

[Host Hattie]

9 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

10 positives when you add in close contacts means plenty of people spending Xmas self isolating  in the Holiday Inn Brooklyn

 

When they thought they were heading for a dream xmas holiday in the Caribbean 

 

I guess it's ok as long as it's happening to somebody else 

 

 

I don't think anyone is saying it's OK, it's obviously not what they'd planned.

I don't want to sound harsh but if you decide to cruise during an ongoing pandemic that's the risk you have to take.

 

 

[Victoria2]

10 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

10 positives when you add in close contacts means plenty of people spending Xmas self isolating  in the Holiday Inn Brooklyn

 

When they thought they were heading for a dream xmas holiday in the Caribbean 

 

I guess it's ok as long as it's happening to somebody else 

 

 

D'you know what? Sadly, it is ok for the majority of passengers ( I’m not unselfish enough to think otherwise) as  long as it’s happening to somebody else plus it’s up to us all, should we want to make the effort, to make sure we’re as Covid contact free pre boarding, and once onboard, follow whatever protocols we personally feel will protect us.