Is high tech making a new class system ,I think so .

[Charles4515]

1 hour ago, Spif Barwunkel said:

So, technology in cruising, while not making a new class system, is certainly making every effort to gradually weed out the non-compliant, correct? Whether due to being less tech savvy, indifference, or the desire not to become totally tech dependent, if you can't or won't navigate a tiny keyboard for all your needs, perhaps you should consider other forms of travel, correct? Whether subtly, or not so much, the smarter the phone, less so the user. 

 

High tech in cruising is becoming another bias against certain cruisers. Kind of like seniors and those with mobility issues, correct?  

    

Tech is what has made it possible for people with mobility issues and disabilities to live a better life.

 

Everyone on Cruise Critic is using tech. You are tech savvy. You have chosen not to live off the grid. There are no other forms of travel to consider except hiking. The tech in cruising is used in all forms of travel and has come later to cruising. Your choice  will be tech, hiking or staying home. 

 

In 2018  I was in London and wanted to do the London Eye. I had a choice. Wait in line for 45 minutes to buy a ticket or buy it immediately on my smartphone. I bought it on my smartphone. I think that was smarter. . 

 

 

Edited November 11, 2022 by Charles4515

[lissie]

On 10/31/2022 at 5:53 AM, ldubs said:

 

I'm going back to the original question.   Right now folks are able to opt out of using apps on board. I think that will change in the near future and the only option will be to use the new technology.  I just don't see this as creating a class system.  It is just a new way of doing things.   Some people like it, some don't.  

  

That option is disappearing rapidly. Just cruised to Singapore (I believe arriving by Air is the same) - you need to register online in advance - using the app is simpler an involves  less repetition than their online form. The cruise line provided a free internet connection for people to  do it but there was much angst amongst the "I lock my phone in the safe and that's where it stays " crowd.  

 

These post pandemic days I think you need to add some things to your packing list 

- a modern phone  which waorks reliably 

- the knowledge on how to basic stuff like connect to wifi and download an app and fill in a form 

 

[ilikeanswers]

16 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

I suppose (?) -- in the same way that those newfangled automobiles represented a bias against horse owners???  

 

😄

 

To be fair there are certain medical conditions that make touch technology very difficult to use. My father use to work with computers so he is fairly technologically adept but his condition means phone screens don't respond to his touch and his voice is unrecognisable by those virtual assistant apps so mobile phones are difficult for him to use and not by choice. I have modified his phone so it is better suited to his condition but unfortunately many apps don't support these modifications. I understand that people like my father are a tiny minority and for a lot of these companies including cruising it would not be profitable to make more disabled friendly apps but I do still find it a bit sad that society doesn't want to carve out a little space for these people☹️. 

[davecttr]

26 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

To be fair there are certain medical conditions that make touch technology very difficult to use. My father use to work with computers so he is fairly technologically adept but his condition means phone screens don't respond to his touch and his voice is unrecognisable by those virtual assistant apps so mobile phones are difficult for him to use and not by choice. I have modified his phone so it is better suited to his condition but unfortunately many apps don't support these modifications. I understand that people like my father are a tiny minority and for a lot of these companies including cruising it would not be profitable to make more disabled friendly apps but I do still find it a bit sad that society doesn't want to carve out a little space for these people☹️. 

My problem with touch technology is the small screens, with my old hands I even have to make frequent corrections when using a computer keyboard. Very frustrating so although I have a smart phone without a SIM so WiFi only and I will take it with me I don't like using it. My mobile phone is a large button dumb version that I can handle easily. Luckily my main cruise line has alternative large touch screen portals that you can use to access the onboard app. They also still deliver the daily newsletter

[cruisemom42]

4 hours ago, davecttr said:

My problem with touch technology is the small screens, with my old hands I even have to make frequent corrections when using a computer keyboard. Very frustrating so although I have a smart phone without a SIM so WiFi only and I will take it with me I don't like using it. My mobile phone is a large button dumb version that I can handle easily. Luckily my main cruise line has alternative large touch screen portals that you can use to access the onboard app. They also still deliver the daily newsletter

 

Have you considered using a tablet instead of a phone?  The larger size makes it much easier to use apps. Even full sized ones fit easily into a carry-on pocket.

[slidergirl]

In regard to hiking being the last non-tech activity:  Many of us use our phones for the GPS and apps with trails and weather information.  iPhone-size solar chargers keep the phones going.  

 

I bought a little Bluetooth keyboard to use on the go with my phone or tablet (Keys to Go).  When I'm sitting down and doing my texting and emails, it helps soo much that I don't have to one-finger type on the phone.  

[pris993]

Not just on cruises, yesterday, I got an email for my dh eye doctor appointment.  It was apparent the preference for rebooking was online - but that involved setting up an app on my iphone which I do not care to do.  I goggled for a phone number, did take 15-20 minutes to run down a phone number and rebook an appointment.  It seems more and more of our world is being taken over by technology and forcing us to do or use devices when a simple phone can can do it just as well.  

[Charles4515]

1 hour ago, pris993 said:

It seems more and more of our world is being taken over by technology and forcing us to do or use devices when a simple phone can can do it just as well.  

They don't want to hire people to just answer the phone. 

[Spif Barwunkel]

Be careful folks, cruising with technology only. Do not leave the ship with your comments. Nothing else applies or is relevant.

[davecttr]

19 hours ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Have you considered using a tablet instead of a phone?  The larger size makes it much easier to use apps. Even full sized ones fit easily into a carry-on pocket.

I have a tablet but carrying it around with me is not an attractive option. Onboard my carried items are an handkerchief, reading glasses for menus etc and my cruise card. Handkerchief in trouser pocket, cruise card and spectacles in shirt breast pocket.

[davecttr]

14 hours ago, slidergirl said:

In regard to hiking being the last non-tech activity:  Many of us use our phones for the GPS and apps with trails and weather information.  iPhone-size solar chargers keep the phones going.  

 

I bought a little Bluetooth keyboard to use on the go with my phone or tablet (Keys to Go).  When I'm sitting down and doing my texting and emails, it helps soo much that I don't have to one-finger type on the phone.  

Here in the UK it is advised if you go hiking in the hills etc you take a decent scale Ordnance Survey map and take a compass and know how to use it, just in case your wizz GPS throws a wobbly. 

 

The problem with all this new tech comes when it is suddenly unavailable like the story, maybe true, about when New Zealands cashless payment system failed. If you did not have real money you could not buy anything, chaos I imagine.

 

I am a firm believer in having a plan B, C etc etc

[Joebucks]

I for one, welcome the use of tech in replacing lots of manual tasks (but not all). Making reservations or placing orders through an app, with a confirmation sent to you, has been infinitely more reliable that calling a number. Where you may wait on hold, one person may not understand the other, the order isn't saved. Leaves more room for error. "Who did you speak to? Oh you don't know?" It's also more convenient to digitally store and condense paperwork. Some people really get worked up about a lot of nothing.

[Keksie]

1 hour ago, Joebucks said:

I for one, welcome the use of tech in replacing lots of manual tasks (but not all). Making reservations or placing orders through an app, with a confirmation sent to you, has been infinitely more reliable that calling a number. Where you may wait on hold, one person may not understand the other, the order isn't saved. Leaves more room for error. "Who did you speak to? Oh you don't know?" It's also more convenient to digitally store and condense paperwork. Some people really get worked up about a lot of nothing.

The problem I have making appointments online is that I have a narrow window of times that will work for me.  Every time I have tried to make an appointment online it gives me times or dates that won't work.  When I call I can say I want an appointment on a certain day at a certain time and most times I get that appointment, or we discuss what other days/times work.  The last time I tried to make a reservation online, when we got there they had no reservation for us.  I should have called.

[ontheweb]

1 minute ago, Keksie said:

The problem I have making appointments online is that I have a narrow window of times that will work for me.  Every time I have tried to make an appointment online it gives me times or dates that won't work.  When I call I can say I want an appointment on a certain day at a certain time and most times I get that appointment, or we discuss what other days/times work.  The last time I tried to make a reservation online, when we got there they had no reservation for us.  I should have called.

Score one for humans interacting with other humans. And not all phone calls are hold forever; not every business is a cruise line. 🤣

[cruisemom42]

I suspect everyone has their own tipping point. I think COVID probably accelerated my own adoption and realization that the technology offered significant benefits.  I particularly like being able to deposit checks via phone. 

 

As mentioned already, for travel getting to/from cruise there are a lot of benefits including use of the app of my airline of choice, which gives me advance notice of things like delays, cancellations, gate changes. I get pinged minutes before the physical signs in the airport change, giving me a heads' up over every one else in terms of scrambling to a new gate or having to get on the phone to get a rep to help me reschedule a flight. (Good luck standing in the actual physical line in the airport -- all the good options will be gone by the time you talk to a "person".)

 

I think cruise lines are still a little behind the curve with regard to technology as well. Some lines are only now making it possible to see your onboard spending dynamically through an app (or your television). I suspect they rather prefer the old system because the less you think about your spend, the more you are likely to spend (Vegas rules...). But apps are improving and there are more and more benefits to the technology.  I never used the apps much prior to my last cruise, but 19 days onboard gave me a healthy appreciation for what I COULD do, plus enough time onboard to become agile in using it.

 

Eventually most people will make the transition. I doubt this will still be a topic of conversation 20 (or even 10) years down the road.

 

[pris993]

16 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

They don't want to hire people to just answer the phone. 

Agree but that does not mean I have to cave to tech.    I was at the supermarket yesterday, two  checkers were talking that they could not force shoppers to use the self-check outs.    I told them the self-checkout risk the loss of jobs.   I make a point of not using them, and ATMs, for that reason.   It was interesting they mentioned then Elon Musk firing tech workers.  I did not tell them these were mostly folks working from home vs front line workers like them.   I not concerned about tech workers losing jobs. They have good severance packages.                    

\

[Charles4515]

53 minutes ago, pris993 said:

Agree but that does not mean I have to cave to tech.    I was at the supermarket yesterday, two  checkers were talking that they could not force shoppers to use the self-check outs.    I told them the self-checkout risk the loss of jobs.   I make a point of not using them, and ATMs, for that reason.   It was interesting they mentioned then Elon Musk firing tech workers.  I did not tell them these were mostly folks working from home vs front line workers like them.   I not concerned about tech workers losing jobs. They have good severance packages.                    

\

 

I agree with you and I rarely use the self checkers. Two reasons.  It does cost jobs and also I  kind of feel like I should be paid or get a discount for doing the work. 😀  The other reason is I like talking to the checkers. 

[Charles4515]

3 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Score one for humans interacting with other humans. And not all phone calls are hold forever; not every business is a cruise line. 🤣

 

The only large company that does not put me on hold forever is Apple Computer. And their support usually knows their stiuff. Other large compaines put me on hold forever and when they answer the call center is often clueless. The absolute worst is cell phone carriers. Small busnesses are usually okay. 

[Charles4515]

9 hours ago, davecttr said:

Here in the UK it is advised if you go hiking in the hills etc you take a decent scale Ordnance Survey map and take a compass and know how to use it, just in case your wizz GPS throws a wobbly. 

 

The problem with all this new tech comes when it is suddenly unavailable like the story, maybe true, about when New Zealands cashless payment system failed. If you did not have real money you could not buy anything, chaos I imagine.

 

I am a firm believer in having a plan B, C etc etc

 

I have not used cash at all for over two years except for the barber who only takes cash. I do have a backup though. I carry $100 in cash and keep a large stash at home. Being tech savvy I do understand that the systems could go down or there could be a natural disaster.  Been through several natural disasters. Here in the states we probably have more than in the UK. 

 

For hiking my tech is indispensable. GPS does not require internet. They compass on my watch has GPS redundancy, waypoints, backtracking, and in a few weeks my phone will be able to connect to a satellite in an emergency if there is no cell service. . 

Edited November 13, 2022 by Charles4515

[ontheweb]

8 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

The only large company that does not put me on hold forever is Apple Computer. And their support usually knows their stiuff. Other large compaines put me on hold forever and when they answer the call center is often clueless. The absolute worst is cell phone carriers. Small busnesses are usually okay. 

I don't particularly like Spectrum, but I have to say that if I and when I can get past the animated voice that answers, they are usually good at both not being on hold for long and for information.

 

American Express is also good for prompt service and information.

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, pris993 said:

Agree but that does not mean I have to cave to tech.    I was at the supermarket yesterday, two  checkers were talking that they could not force shoppers to use the self-check outs.    I told them the self-checkout risk the loss of jobs.   I make a point of not using them, and ATMs, for that reason.   It was interesting they mentioned then Elon Musk firing tech workers.  I did not tell them these were mostly folks working from home vs front line workers like them.   I not concerned about tech workers losing jobs. They have good severance packages.                    

\

So, you got me thinking about our local Supermarket.  There are normally 3 or 4 lanes staffed by real people and the lines can be 10-15 min.  And I always "love" watching a lady (yes, this is a sexist comment) watching as her items are rung up, and then she (OMG..a sexist pronoun) will start to look through her purse to find her money or credit card (as everyone stews in the line) There is also the lady (we have not seen any men do this) who still slowly writes a check at the Supermarket (some folks actually still fill out a check).  Meanwhile, there are 10 self-service counters (supervised by a single person) which seldom have a line.

 

There have already been rumors of some stores and supermarkets charging extra for folks who use human cashiers (or possibly giving a discount to those using self-service).  There are already a few lower cost airlines that charge extra for those who need human assistance.  With the increasing cost of labor coupled with labor shortages we are likely to see an acceleration of the trend to have folks pay more for not using tech.  Just consider this has existed for years at gas stations that charge more per gallon if you want an attendant to fill your car (assuming you can even find an attendant).

 

Hank

[Charles4515]

2 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I don't particularly like Spectrum, but I have to say that if I and when I can get past the animated voice that answers, they are usually good at both not being on hold for long and for information.

 

American Express is also good for prompt service and information.

I agree about American Express. One reason for why I stay with their card.. I only had Spectrum interent for a few months before switching to fiber because their cable  interent was not that great but I have to say they when I disconnected from Spectrum it was not a hassle like when I disconnected from Comcast about 10 years ago at my old home. Comcast did not want to let go.

[Charles4515]

3 minutes ago, Hlitner said:

So, you got me thinking about our local Supermarket.  There are normally 3 or 4 lanes staffed by real people and the lines can be 10-15 min. 

 

You are lucky. My local supermarket which is supposed to be a premium Tom Thumb usually only has 1 lane open staffed. Eevery now and then 2 staffed lanes are open. So most use self checkout with no line because they are forced to. I

[cruisemom42]

4 hours ago, ontheweb said:

And not all phone calls are hold forever; not every business is a cruise line. 🤣

 

Yes, but what about all the places that make you call a central number, wade through several "menus" (none of which seem to offer precisely what you need), only to finally lead to a human being who has no idea what you need and then ends up transferring you from department to department until you're finally dropped and have to start the whole process over again?

 

Or the off-shore service centers where some struggle to understand the person who answers the phone?

 

25 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

Small busnesses are usually okay. 

 

But small businesses often keep limited hours. For someone who works a demanding job that often fully occupies me from 8am to 6pm daily, it can be challenging to find time to call a local business with regular hours. 

 

Even my dry cleaner now uses an automated kiosk pick-up system except for limited hours (which are nearly impossible for me to make).

 

Edited November 13, 2022 by cruisemom42

[Joebucks]

52 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

 

I agree with you and I rarely use the self checkers. Two reasons.  It does cost jobs and also I  kind of feel like I should be paid or get a discount for doing the work. 😀  The other reason is I like talking to the checkers. 

 

Everyone's a humanitarian and job economist when "saving" cashier jobs. Aka the jobs that most businesses are struggling to fill anymore. This view only comes from a mild perturbance from having to "scan your own groceries". 

 

Personally, I absolutely love the self-checkout. I can get in and out in a minute or two. Meanwhile, the cashier lines will take forever as it almost never fails to be behind someone with a full cart, has questions about everything and its price, can't get their payment ready, etc. Saving 15 minutes in a line is easily worth me putting something in a bag in 2.