Murder on Emerald Princess

[vickie_bernie]

Very tragic.

 

Domestic violence is everywhere. Sadly.

 

I wanted to share, in case some reading here feels they need help.

 

Here is a link to those in Canada http://www.awhl.org who are seeking help.

 

 

Perhaps others can share links for their area.

 

I offer the family my condolences.

[EightFurryPaws]

My husband and I will be on the Emerald for 28 days in October. We have no reservations about sailing on this ship. The ship had nothing to do with the horrible incident which occurred.

 

I am so sorry for the family along with all the crew. Even if crew members weren't involved in the actual occurrence, it will be with them for a long time just because of the talk between them. I read these posts because it's just human nature when you hear of a murder on a ship you will be boarding very shortly.

 

Because of the size of the ship, I never expected the cabins where the tragedy occurred to be directly below our cabin. I know this incident will fade in my mind in the next two months, but I also know, the minute I look down to deck D, visions of the face of the beautiful mother will come back to me, and I know i will be thinking about how her daughters are coping after a few months. Something I never dreamed of would be a factor to me on this trip.

[bUU]

... but I also know, the minute I look down to deck D, visions of the face of the beautiful mother will come back to me, and I know i will be thinking about how her daughters are coping after a few months. Something I never dreamed of would be a factor to me on this trip.

 

And this is really what drives my perspective on it. I know that our laws require it but I wish they didn't require that any of this information becomes public knowledge. I really wish identities of the victims and the perpetrators and the locations and the circumstances were sealed for a good long time rather than released and posted on the internet. I really wish our society was such that none of this got any airplay until after the courts have had their say. The public really doesn't need to know about accusations. The public needs to know about convictions.

 

This message may have been entered using voice recognition. Please excuse any typos.

[Woobstr112G]

That sure is reasonable. However, I don't think posting something like "For those who want to know, the cabin numbers are posted here at this link..." is censorship. In fact, I will do you one better. I will memorialize that affidavit on my personal website so that in the event it is removed from previously linked sites, it will still be available to this thread. Here ya go:

 

https://mrose.org/cc/emerald-incident-affidavit/

 

See - no censorship!

 

That's how things are done when respect for everyone participating remains your chief motivation for posting.

 

Well said.....:):):)

Bob

[Mr. Muster]

Unless serious physical damage to electrical or mechanical connections in the cabin, which I doubt there would be, most likely soft goods would be removed and replaced (cushions, mattress, carpet), a thorough cleaning and possibly ozone generator run in the cabin; but I doubt highly removing the cabin unit and slotting in another.

 

 

I just did some sleuthing, and you can book these same rooms on the 9/24/17 Pacific Coastal 1-day sailing.

 

Toot-Toot, Dearies! :*

[luvbluseas]

While not involved in this particular case, the OP is one of those investigators. He, like me, tend to post here trying to damp down speculation and rumor regarding cruise incidents, so I think he was right in getting it out there ahead of the major news outlets, which are so frequently wrong on facts.

 

I would like to thank both of you and most of those that have posted here. We are all interested in what has happened. We are stunned that it would happen in a place that most of us think of as such a "happy place", and yet "Inside" we ALL know how stressful a vacation can be, especially one (as this one "may" have been with extended family included. It seems from the perpetrators comments (if accurate) that "she kept laughing at him". We all understand, that we are our spouses/partners #1 defender and especially in an "extended family" situation, when tension can get high, and some family members can very easily feel inferior, the spouse/partner should always be aware of the "other persons" feelings. This crime sounds like a terrible, terrible misunderstanding, hurt feelings can be a major thing. I think that most of us agree that is what "bulling" is about - hurting someone's feelings. I am so so sorry that this happened to this family, to any family. Children, men and women are now damaged for life and this poor woman is dead all over what was probably something she did not STOP to think about. He was hurt to the core and did not know how to tell her, she did not know how to listen, so she is dead! HOW PATHETIC!

[Brisbane41]

Regarding the cabin numbers and peoples desire to know them and not to cruise in them, weather people like it or not those cabins are now tainted for the life of the ship. It will not matter if they are renumbered because their location on the deck plans will always be the same and people will always work out which cabin numbers they have been changed to. There are people who will rightfully so feel uneasy about staying in a cabin where a murder took place, even more so in various countries around the world there are laws that force real estate agents to notify a buyer if a murder or tragic event has happened in the house they are buying. These are the things that need to be considered.

 

Going further unfortunately due to gossip on these ships there will always be talk of the murder and people will always be pointing out the cabin it happened in and if anything like this happens it could make any future occupants distraught by 1.) being in the cabin and 2.) having the stigma attached to them that others will know they are in the cabin.

 

My thoughts on this are somewhat different. Given that at least two cabins that are balcony cabins have been tainted for the life of the ship there is another option that Princess could do if they were to pull the cabins from any future sale.

 

One option would be to tear out the two cabins entirely and turn it into a casual public space that is no longer private cabins. It could be something simple like a hidden away lounge area with balcony, card room, conference room or something completely different to a cabin. Of course the stigma will always be there and many will know why there are no longer cabins there but by doing this it removes a constant problem that will plague Emerald Princess for the rest of its service life. Removing a cabin from the inventory does not necessarily mean the space cannot be used. The ship is over capacity anyway compared to the original grand class and losing 8 passengers berths would be insignificant on a ship that can carry around 3,400 passengers.

 

Other uses could be crew space/training areas/classrooms for instruction and staff training.

 

I am sure there will be many options.

 

Unfortunately whether people like it or not that cabin will always be talked about and be a topic on the ship. Princess will always be plagued with people not wanting to stay in it and some will go to the extent of investigating the location of the ship it is on.

 

I do not think berating people who mention the cabin numbers will help because it is a fact that had to happen. Burring heads in the sand "out of respect" is nothing more than cowardice that will not make the problem go away. Ever heard about the "elephant in the room" well this is one of those situations and no amount of "respect" will take away the cold hard fact that the cabin will remain a problematic issue for Emerald Princess in the future.

[Host CJSKIDS]

I know what you mean by "structurally damaged", but there is actually nothing structural about the cabins. As noted, they are modular units, and are not really heavily fastened to the ship's structure. I really doubt they would remove cabins since it is only a couple of them, and you have to cut an access to get them out. You can re-panel a cabin in place, it is an extreme pain in the butt, but it is doable. You have to remove the panels in the reverse order that they were installed, so if the damaged panel is the first one, you have to "unzip" the whole cabin to get to it.

 

Thank you for the explanation. Though it's kind of strange to think that the cabins aren't really heavily fastened to the ship's structure. One of my views is of the port of Miami so I watch the cruise ships and the container ships daily. I've also seen pictures where the container ships fall off so I can't help picture the cabins falling out in rough seas. Silly I know.

[A&L_Ont]

Acknowledged, thank you. I am not familiar many users of this particular forum.

 

This individual is also active on the RC boards, in the same manner.

[dw64]

CBS News posted the cabin numbers on the 5:30 PM news, from the original crime report. Jamie Yuccas reporting.

I am scheduled for 29 days later this year, & 17 days in a guaranteed mini suite. You bet...I won't except that cabin.

 

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[tonit964]

Regarding the cabin numbers and peoples desire to know them and not to cruise in them, weather people like it or not those cabins are now tainted for the life of the ship. It will not matter if they are renumbered because their location on the deck plans will always be the same and people will always work out which cabin numbers they have been changed to. There are people who will rightfully so feel uneasy about staying in a cabin where a murder took place, even more so in various countries around the world there are laws that force real estate agents to notify a buyer if a murder or tragic event has happened in the house they are buying. These are the things that need to be considered.

 

Going further unfortunately due to gossip on these ships there will always be talk of the murder and people will always be pointing out the cabin it happened in and if anything like this happens it could make any future occupants distraught by 1.) being in the cabin and 2.) having the stigma attached to them that others will know they are in the cabin.

 

My thoughts on this are somewhat different. Given that at least two cabins that are balcony cabins have been tainted for the life of the ship there is another option that Princess could do if they were to pull the cabins from any future sale.

 

One option would be to tear out the two cabins entirely and turn it into a casual public space that is no longer private cabins. It could be something simple like a hidden away lounge area with balcony, card room, conference room or something completely different to a cabin. Of course the stigma will always be there and many will know why there are no longer cabins there but by doing this it removes a constant problem that will plague Emerald Princess for the rest of its service life. Removing a cabin from the inventory does not necessarily mean the space cannot be used. The ship is over capacity anyway compared to the original grand class and losing 8 passengers berths would be insignificant on a ship that can carry around 3,400 passengers.

 

Other uses could be crew space/training areas/classrooms for instruction and staff training.

 

I am sure there will be many options.

 

Unfortunately whether people like it or not that cabin will always be talked about and be a topic on the ship. Princess will always be plagued with people not wanting to stay in it and some will go to the extent of investigating the location of the ship it is on.

 

I do not think berating people who mention the cabin numbers will help because it is a fact that had to happen. Burring heads in the sand "out of respect" is nothing more than cowardice that will not make the problem go away. Ever heard about the "elephant in the room" well this is one of those situations and no amount of "respect" will take away the cold hard fact that the cabin will remain a problematic issue for Emerald Princess in the future.

 

 

I think you couldn't be more wrong. People will not be talking about this for the life of the ship. This will be old news and people will forget. Princess will not refigure these cabin into a different space or tear them down.

 

There have been many deaths on cruise ships and the cabins remain the same.

 

They will be cleaned up, new carpet and such and then it's business as usual.

[mek]

I think you couldn't be more wrong. People will not be talking about this for the life of the ship. This will be old news and people will forget. Princess will not refigure these cabin into a different space or tear them down.

 

There have been many deaths on cruise ships and the cabins remain the same.

 

They will be cleaned up, new carpet and such and then it's business as usual.

 

I think you are correct. People stopped talking about George Smith on Brilliance OTS long ago. I don't believe they did anything with that cabin, although I realize a body wasn't found in it.

[Thorncroft]

I think you couldn't be more wrong. People will not be talking about this for the life of the ship. This will be old news and people will forget. Princess will not refigure these cabin into a different space or tear them down.

 

There have been many deaths on cruise ships and the cabins remain the same.

 

They will be cleaned up, new carpet and such and then it's business as usual.

I agree. People tend to have short memories.

[Credit 00]

In any case, whoever gets this cabin probably isn't active on these boards. This hasn't hit the new here in Australia from what I can tell, I will be on the Emerald in December.

[MaryZ]

I agree. People tend to have short memories.

Except maybe the people who booked their very first cruise on Princess.

I think lots of them will never book any cruise again, much less on Princess.

 

 

No matter what Princess does, it will never be a happy vacation for most people on that ship.

[land lover]

Entertainers, construction crew, guest lectures might occupy the cabins for the short hall.....sure would beat the insides they usually get.

[DesertDuo]

From their report it appears that the incident took place on deck 9.

 

OMG..We are on the Emerald in a few weeks....DECK 9!! :o Update...we are four cabins away...

Edited July 28, 2017 by DesertDuo

[EastBay Cruisers]

We are booked on the Emerald in about 4 weeks. I asked my husband if he wanted to use the vacation insurance we took out w/ Princess and cancel the cruise, but he said he wanted to go anyway. He reminded me of the report from the poster here who took the "Ultimate Ship Tour" and walked through the infirmary, where the Medical Officer told him that on average, a passenger dies about every two weeks on board. ( But of course, it's not a homicide).

 

 

This is our first cruise, as we recently retired after both working full time for about 45 years and raising a family. We were thinking that cruising would be a fun hobby in retirement. But,

we will be thinking with sadness of the family and children without a mother whose lives have been forever changed. Our deepest sympathies go out to this family and to all the crew members and passengers who must deal w/ this tragedy.

[trouble1964]

I feel horrible for the children and the other people that were there to witness this. Hopefully there will be some sort of debriefing for the crew that had to deal with this as well.

 

Not knowing anything about the couple or their family, I hardly think this was a first time incident, based on my experience with DV. One thing about DV, it eventually ends....one way or another. Too many times with a fatality.

 

I don't know how I would feel if this had happened on a ship I was on. I really don't think I would be in much of a mood to be having fun. But I sure wouldn't be one of the ones complaining about being stuck on the ship and having bored kids. I wouldn't expect any sort of reimbursement or OBC from the line. It probably would have been a good thing for them to try to bring counselors on board and have group meetings with anyone that wanted to talk, and private sessions if possible.

 

I am such an empath, that before I buy a house, I research it to make sure no one died there to the best of my ability, and rely on the word of a realtor. In my state, that has to be disclosed IF ASKED. I would not be able to live in one that someone died in. That may sound stupid to some of you, but I think I would obsess over it if I were to find out after buying a home. There is a home on our street that has been empty for 10 years. Someone killed themselves in it and the owners just listed it last month.

[AZbeachboy]

Trouble 1964, Here in Arizona it is against real estate law to disclose a death in a house. Even your realtor cannot disclose it if you ask them. If you notice signs you can ask about incidents surrounding the house like wondering if a house has an insurance claim within the last five years. Neither can you ask if there is a sex offender in the neighborhood, but you have to do your due diligence. That includes crimes, checking sex offender records, public records that will give you that information. Sounds dumb, but its against fair housing laws. Good realtors will can give you websites to check those things out.

[AZbeachboy]

I am empathetic with the family. No one should lose their life in any type of violence. However, I think people have a right to be upset because they lost vacation time or adventure, because someone who they never knew died or committed a crime. It certainly is not Princess fault, so what is justice for those people whose life was infringed upon by an evil. It is not a major infringement and they did not loose a family member, but they still had a loss they did not anticipate and damaged them. We can feel sorry for but not cry for every person who dies everyday. We would live in depression and sadness at the time.

[sndral]

DV? Perhaps, but my first suspicion was some type of mental health issue due to the somewhat nonsensical response by the suspect about being laughed at, sounds like the type of paranoid statement you hear from defendants with severe psychosis after they commit a homicide IME.

The news hasn't dug up any prior reports about DV, although it is a very under reported crime & there are lots of DV murders w/ no reported prior incidents. In the subsequent investigation it often becomes evident that people suspected DV, but didn't act on those suspicions.

In my mind this could be a mental situation or a more classic DV homicide - too soon to tell.

[SakeDad]

DV? Perhaps, but my first suspicion was some type of mental health issue due to the somewhat nonsensical response by the suspect about being laughed at, sounds like the type of paranoid statement you hear from defendants with severe psychosis after they commit a homicide IME.

The news hasn't dug up any prior reports about DV, although it is a very under reported crime & there are lots of DV murders w/ no reported prior incidents. In the subsequent investigation it often becomes evident that people suspected DV, but didn't act on those suspicions.

In my mind this could be a mental situation or a more classic DV homicide - too soon to tell.

 

Domestic Violence IS a mental health issue! When we start to realize that we can give TREATMENT vs PRISON

[SakeDad]

I am empathetic with the family. No one should lose their life in any type of violence. However, I think people have a right to be upset because they lost vacation time or adventure, because someone who they never knew died or committed a crime. It certainly is not Princess fault, so what is justice for those people whose life was infringed upon by an evil. It is not a major infringement and they did not loose a family member, but they still had a loss they did not anticipate and damaged them. We can feel sorry for but not cry for every person who dies everyday. We would live in depression and sadness at the time.

 

I have read this 5 times and still have no idea what you meant

[coopco]

I'm friends with the neighbor of the family involved. The FBI is sending the girls home this morning. They're completely wrecked by this and have now lost both parents since the father is (obviously) in custody. Please keep them in your thoughts and prayers. They will need a lot of love, support, and therapy to help recover from this.

 

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My heart breaks for the children. If your neighbor friend hears of the guardians or children starting a "Go Fund Me" or similar type of account, please post the information as I'd imagine there will be financial difficulties. It's so sad and recovery will be a long process. I'm sure there is a whole community of support of strangers for them during this difficult time.