My impressions of the new wine menu

[Brisbane41]

38 minutes ago, ProfMHC said:

While food and drink are very personal choices based on so many variables, I did want to note that Princess was accorded a major award for their new wine list by what is often considered the sine qua non of wine connoisseur rating body, Wine Spectator.....

Princess Cruises Earns Wine Spectator 2019 Restaurant Award of Excellence

Michelangelo Dining Room Recognized Among 3,800 Winners; Full 2019 Dining Guide Revealed in Wine Spectator's August Issue

Just a few things here.

 

Firstly awards mean nothing these days. Often one persons expert is another persons idiot and also awards can be awarded for anything and everything including failure.

 

That said I note the last sentence and want to just seize on the word "Dining Room".

 

One thing I have not mentioned yet that in the general bars around the ship I could not tolerate their wine at all. However that needs to come with some sort of clarification. I noticed that there were some wines on the list in "Dining Rooms" including specialty ones that were not included in the general lists around the ship and while my time on the ship was limited I did find some in the dining rooms and specialty restaurants that I could enjoy but I did not get the time to fully appreciate the situation. Also Vines Wine Bar if on the ship has a different list and some were good there but still not enough time to find out.

 

That above is the thing. I do not spend my time in ships dining rooms. The bars will get more time from me and if the best wine is being limited to dining rooms only then that needs to change as by giving all the mediocre wines to the ships bars it is going to leave people with a harsh opinion of them if that is the case with my opinion.

[DeeTO]

5 minutes ago, steelers36 said:

@XBGuy and @Cruise Raider - like your posts.  On Cali Chard's, if there is one thing to say about them, many are OVER-oaked, so I agree should be no problem finding that.  IMO, the new wine list is far superior over-all to the old one.  That said, I still prefer to bring my own when at all possible.

 

As noted, wine choice very personal and my South African taste fairly broad. Found  enough choice under $45 with wine package on Sapphire Princess 28 day March cruise. Dislike oak chard, but enjoyed the French Sancerre offered, SA Chenin Blanc, okay with NZ and Cal Pinot Noir,  Carmenere, Merlot, Nero  D’Avolo. 

Sometimes not possible bringing own when starting in Asia or Scandinavia. Interesting that Wine Spectator approved.

[c-boy]

15 minutes ago, Brisbane41 said:

Just a few things here.

 

Firstly awards mean nothing these days. Often one persons expert is another persons idiot and also awards can be awarded for anything and everything including failure.

 

That said I note the last sentence and want to just seize on the word "Dining Room".

 

One thing I have not mentioned yet that in the general bars around the ship I could not tolerate their wine at all. However that needs to come with some sort of clarification. I noticed that there were some wines on the list in "Dining Rooms" including specialty ones that were not included in the general lists around the ship and while my time on the ship was limited I did find some in the dining rooms and specialty restaurants that I could enjoy but I did not get the time to fully appreciate the situation. Also Vines Wine Bar if on the ship has a different list and some were good there but still not enough time to find out.

 

That above is the thing. I do not spend my time in ships dining rooms. The bars will get more time from me and if the best wine is being limited to dining rooms only then that needs to change as by giving all the mediocre wines to the ships bars it is going to leave people with a harsh opinion of them if that is the case with my opinion.

well shoot this is depressing lol 😄. I'm headin' out next month and was looking forward to this vast selection from all over the world.  What do you suggest in the red wine offerings ?

Edited October 18, 2019 by c-boy

[OzKiwiJJ]

I've just spent 35 nights on Sea Princess enjoying a wonderful selection of wines from the new wine list. All of the wines we tried were excellent. The new selection is much more comprehensive and far, far better than the old wine list where I sometimes struggled to find a palatable wine to match the food I had chosen.

 

The Australian version of the new wine list does differ from the US version. There are less US wines and more wines from Australia and NZ.

 

We mostly drank European wines, delighting in the chance to enjoy wines we seldom get to drink in Australia. I particularly enjoyed the French reds we chose. I find them lighter abd more elegant than Australian reds. We also enjoyed some excellent Italian reds. The Barolo, in particular, was excellent. A real treat.

 

There is a wide and varied selection of whites. Several Rieslings, ranging from the classic Mosel style (which I don't like much but DH enjoys them) to crisp dry Australian Rieslings. An excellent selection of white Burgundies, a couple of very nice Pinot Grigios, a Soave, Sancerre, Gruner Veltliner and much more. 

 

Personally I think Princess has provided one of the best wine lists I've ever seen outside of very expensive restaurants. It's certainly the best I've seen on a cruise line so far. 

[OzKiwiJJ]

2 hours ago, c-boy said:

well shoot this is depressing lol 😄. I'm headin' out next month and was looking forward to this vast selection from all over the world.  What do you suggest in the red wine offerings ?

The bar wines lists are a small subset of the MDR wine list. If you don't like the wines on offer, and there are only a few reds, i suggest making friends with the bartender and seeing if s/he can get you wines from the MDR list. I did notice a few people on our cruise in Crooners who had obviously purchased a bottle of wine that was being kept in the bar for them.

 

BTW what type of of reds do you like?

[OzKiwiJJ]

11 hours ago, Hlitner said:

Hello to all of our friends down under.  I think it is pretty obvious that Princess is very focused on the USA market and you might also consider that the line is run with the home office staff (including those who select wines) mostly USA folks.  To make matters worse, Princess is headquartered in California and the West Coast folks have their own wine tastes which lean heavily to West Coast USA wines.  Our wines (and the taste of many American palates) tend to be more "fruit forward" then many folks from other 

 

Next week we will be on the Emerald and it will be interesting to see what "package" they will offer on that ship.  And by the way, when we were on the CB (last month) there was no attempt by staff to promote the wine package.  We had to actually ask.  I do not even recall any printed material on the packages in the wine list.  Apparently there were supposed to be two packages (silver and gold) but they would only sell the gold (the more expensive package) and told us the other package was not available.

 

Hank

 

 

They've discontinued the silver package as the prices are now mostly higher than the maximum under that package.

 

We don't usually get the wine packages at all on Australisn cruises. I have had it on a Med cruise (where annoyingly 25% of the wines on the wine list were out of stock) and on a repositioning cruise. Even with out of stock issues it still worked out as good value.

[c-boy]

13 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

The bar wines lists are a small subset of the MDR wine list. If you don't like the wines on offer, and there are only a few reds, i suggest making friends with the bartender and seeing if s/he can get you wines from the MDR list. I did notice a few people on our cruise in Crooners who had obviously purchased a bottle of wine that was being kept in the bar for them.

 

BTW what type of of reds do you like?

cabs and pinot 

[OzKiwiJJ]

9 minutes ago, c-boy said:

cabs and pinot 

OK, I can't comment on the Cabs as that is one variety I can't drink - it gives me headaches.

 

There was a great selection of Pinots on the Australian wine list, from NZ, Burgundy and the US. There was only one on the Crooners drinks list, the Albert Bichot burgundy which is excellent, and one Cab.

 

Have ypu ever tried a Carmenere from Chile? It's an interesting variety that is on the Crooners and MDR wine lists.

[c-boy]

ummmm   Carmenere and roast duck,   Yum.  Thnx. 

[OzKiwiJJ]

17 minutes ago, c-boy said:

ummmm   Carmenere and roast duck,   Yum.  Thnx. 

Yes, it goes very well with duck. 😊

[geoherb]

Our tablemates had the drink package. Their problem was that the ship we were on (Crown Princess last month) was out of many of the wines that qualified by the glass. We brought several bottles and paid the corkage for those we enjoyed with dinner.

[Brisbane41]

That is a big risk having very few by the glass wines as it gives you little opportunity to taste them before you decide if you want to purchase a bottle.

 

I wonder what the staff would do if I wanted to purchase a bottle and when they opened it and I sampled it I told them that it was revolting and I could not possibly drink it? - That is a risk that I am not prepared to take.

[Aus Traveller]

35 minutes ago, Brisbane41 said:

That is a big risk having very few by the glass wines as it gives you little opportunity to taste them before you decide if you want to purchase a bottle.

 

I wonder what the staff would do if I wanted to purchase a bottle and when they opened it and I sampled it I told them that it was revolting and I could not possibly drink it? - That is a risk that I am not prepared to take.

A year or two ago I saw something similar happen, although the passenger didn't say the wine was revolting. 😊 When he tasted it he said he didn't like it. When the waiter asked what was wrong, the passenger said it was either too sweet, or not sweet enough. I can't remember the details. The waiter hurried away and came back with a head waiter. The end result was that the passenger didn't have to pay for the wine. They supplied another bottle that met his requirements.

[OzKiwiJJ]

53 minutes ago, Brisbane41 said:

That is a big risk having very few by the glass wines as it gives you little opportunity to taste them before you decide if you want to purchase a bottle.

 

I wonder what the staff would do if I wanted to purchase a bottle and when they opened it and I sampled it I told them that it was revolting and I could not possibly drink it? - That is a risk that I am not prepared to take.

If the wine is genuinely faulty then they should replace it but they aren't obliged to just because you don't like what you've chosen. Given that it appears you have very rigid and specific tastes in wine then you shouldn't risk buying by the bottle.

 

It's a shame that Princess doesn't have sommeliers. Unfortunately the majority of the waiters on cruise ships don't know much about wine so you can't ask them for recommendations. I have a few "restrictions", for want of a better word, in wines I can drink as I react in various ways to a few varieties.  Luckily my DH is more tolerant and can drink and enjoy a wider range of wine so he gets to finish the "mistake" bottles while I try something else.

[OzKiwiJJ]

1 hour ago, geoherb said:

Our tablemates had the drink package. Their problem was that the ship we were on (Crown Princess last month) was out of many of the wines that qualified by the glass. We brought several bottles and paid the corkage for those we enjoyed with dinner.

That was one of the reasons we stopped getting drink packages, especially as many of the wines by the glass on the old wine list were not to my taste so not being able to get a sufficient variety of the ones I liked was annoying.

 

Since we've stopped getting the drink packages we've not only had a bigger selection of wines to choose from, we've also saved heaps. On our recent cruise we came in just over $30 pp average under the AUD drinks npackage price, and we didn't stint on the wineswe chose.

[jeph]

Brisbane, speaking as a fairly serious wino, raised by a fairly serious wino, (here's to you, ma!) and as the brother of a wino so serious that his collection numbers in the thousands and he's a founding partner in one of the nation's most highly esteemed new wineries, I must take issue with your comment that "awards mean nothing these days".  As the prior poster implied, Wine Spectator is no joke-- and their opinions and critical judgements are not for sale.  This was the first I recall hearing about their plaudits for Princess, by the way.

Meanwhile, for whatever it's worth, I have a bunch of very good Aussie Shiraz bottles in my modest basement collection that should be at their peak in another year or two.  Cheers! 🍷😊

[NSWP]

20 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

I lot of Aussies agree with you on Fosters. None of my family drink it.

That is why we sent it to North America and UK. 🤣

[NSWP]

But don't Princess Australia and the oversea Princess ships have differing wine lists?   I will say the wine prices are marked up to the extreme, like paying $50 for a $9 supermarket wine.  Over the top as they say.

 

I bought some Yellow tail wine from the wine shop the other day, commercial quaffer, available world wide.  I paid AU$7.50 a bottle by the half dozen.  I remember seeing it on Princess ships overseas about 5 years ago for US$35.  One can only wonder the price now, probably US$50 is they had it.

 

I can buy a bottle of Yellowtail Chardonnay or Merlot in the restaurant at my local golf club for AU$16 a bottle, so the cruise lines are certainly ripping us off, but what's new? 

Edited October 19, 2019 by NSWP

[OzKiwiJJ]

Les, there are some differences between the Australian wine list and the US one but many of the wines are the same. Essentially they've removed some of the US wines on the Australian wine list and replaced them with wines from Australia and NZ. The variety is amazing. There is something there to suit everybody's palate (but maybe not their pocket).

 

Are the prices over the top? Personally I don't think so. I don't think it's fair to compare them with bottle shop prices. They have a similar markup to wines in reasonable Australian restaurants. For example their lower priced Italian wines are very similar prices to those at my local pizzeria. Although one Italian wine, the Prunetto Barolo, is actually cheaper than the single bottle price at Dan Murphys! We did enjoy a bottle or three of that one. 😄

 

And they aren't cheap wines. I recognised most of the Australian and New Zealand labels and they are all very good wines, certainly higher quality than Yellowtail, and some were probably cheaper than I could get them in a restaurant here. 

[cruze610]

I just looked over the menu and I have to say it’s disappointing. I’ve been cruising with Princess since 2002. When I went on my first cruise I was in my late 20’s and knew nothing about wine.  I knew I liked Chianti and I bought a bottle of Ruffino Chianti Reserva. I loved it and I have been drinking it ever since. I typically have half a dozen bottles in my wine cooler at any given point. I took a break from cruising for the last 3 years and I’ll be on the CB in May. It’s unfortunate to see it’s no longer on the menu. 

[flamomo]

On ‎10‎/‎18‎/‎2019 at 6:28 AM, Brisbane41 said:

Thanks very much for saying this. I like Chardonnay occasionally as well. I am very used to it being an oak taste to it. I used to be happy with all previous versions. With the current menu it is no undrinkable. I do now know what on earth they did to find all wines to be of similar taste that are somewhat sour and have a taste that will give me a quick headache.

 

I would not say that your palate is uneducated, people know what taste they like and what they don't like. 

If you want to try one of the new ones that doesn't seem as tart, try the Decoy. I find it reasonably smooth.

Fortunately, it is one of the few that is also available by the glass, so you don't have to buy a whole bottle  and then find out you dislike it. 😉

Edited October 19, 2019 by flamomo

[OzKiwiJJ]

55 minutes ago, cruze610 said:

I just looked over the menu and I have to say it’s disappointing. I’ve been cruising with Princess since 2002. When I went on my first cruise I was in my late 20’s and knew nothing about wine.  I knew I liked Chianti and I bought a bottle of Ruffino Chianti Reserva. I loved it and I have been drinking it ever since. I typically have half a dozen bottles in my wine cooler at any given point. I took a break from cruising for the last 3 years and I’ll be on the CB in May. It’s unfortunate to see it’s no longer on the menu. 

Try the Frescobaldi Chianti. It's available by the glass so you can try it without buying a whole bottle.

 

There are a few other good Italian reds if you feel brave enougb to branch out a bit. The Barbera is very nice.

[ProfMHC]

6 hours ago, jeph said:

Brisbane, speaking as a fairly serious wino, raised by a fairly serious wino, (here's to you, ma!) and as the brother of a wino so serious that his collection numbers in the thousands and he's a founding partner in one of the nation's most highly esteemed new wineries, I must take issue with your comment that "awards mean nothing these days".  As the prior poster implied, Wine Spectator is no joke-- and their opinions and critical judgements are not for sale.  This was the first I recall hearing about their plaudits for Princess, by the way.

Meanwhile, for whatever it's worth, I have a bunch of very good Aussie Shiraz bottles in my modest basement collection that should be at their peak in another year or two.  Cheers! 🍷😊

I actually saw the Princess award in the August 2019 “dining” issue of Wine Spectator. (We have been subscribers for years). I then found the Princess press release from which I extracted my post. Another quote: “The Award of Excellence recognizes restaurants whose wine lists feature a well-chosen assortment of quality producers along with a thematic match to the menu in both price and style. Wine Spectator began its program to recognize the world’s best wine lists in 1981. There are three levels: the Award of Excellence, the Best of Award of Excellence and the Grand Award.” That being said, I have watched folks pick a “Two Buck Chuck” over a Chateau Margaux at a blind taste testing!

[Steelers36]

9 hours ago, NSWP said:

That is why we sent it to North America and UK. 🤣

In reading the few posts about Foster's, I don't recall ever noticing it anywhere in our travels around Australia for several weeks this past winter (your summer).  To me, it would be like ordering Labatt's or Molson's in Canada which I never do.  Always drink local craft or micro-brewery product.  Always fun to try new beers in foreign countries.

[CC Rider 69]

31 minutes ago, steelers36 said:

In reading the few posts about Foster's, I don't recall ever noticing it anywhere in our travels around Australia for several weeks this past winter (your summer).  To me, it would be like ordering Labatt's or Molson's in Canada which I never do.  Always drink local craft or micro-brewery product.  Always fun to try new beers in foreign countries.

We'll doing the repo of the CB next week and have tours of Moosehead (St John), Alexander Keith (Halifax), & a can't remember pub/brewery in Sydney. Any recommendations on a good brew to try while we're in Canadian ports?