Seabourn and the current issues surrounding the Corona Virus

[Paulchili]

13 minutes ago, Swaxxy said:

Seabourn is working on it. I filed this claim on March 4 and this is the reply I received today. 

 

This communication is to serve as a follow-up to your email and your Change Fee Reimbursement request.

 

After reviewing the information you included, we would be pleased to provide you with a refund in the amount of $ 817.80. Yet, we would like to take this opportunity to offer you an alternative. In lieu of the refund, we would like to provide a Future Cruise Credit for 125% of the refund value. As such, we would like to extend a Future Cruise Credit in the amount of $ 1,022.25. Kindly let us know which of the options listed below you wish to choose and we will proceed with your request.

 

A refund in the amount of $ 817.80

 

or

 

A Future Cruise Credit in the amount of $ 1,022.25

 

We thank you for choosing Seabourn and we hope to see you again in the future.

 

Kind regards,

Shawn Davidson

Guest Relations

I filed my request on 3/2 (although I am not sure when they got it) and am yet to receive such an email - it would be most welcome.

[MightyQuinn]

1 hour ago, Swaxxy said:

After reviewing the information you included, we would be pleased to provide you with a refund in the amount of $ 817.80. Yet, we would like to take this opportunity to offer you an alternative. In lieu of the refund, we would like to provide a Future Cruise Credit for 125% of the refund value. As such, we would like to extend a Future Cruise Credit in the amount of $ 1,022.25.

 

Take the money and run.

[MightyQuinn]

3 hours ago, SLSD said:

The United States is not going to bail out the cruise lines.  I agree with this policy.  There are very few American employees and the cruise lines have done everything in their power to avoid paying taxes in the United States and have avoided the labor laws of the United States.

 

2 hours ago, Paulchili said:

Agree. Can’t see taxpayers’ money going to anyone who does not pay US taxes.

 

As a Canadian who wants the cruise lines to survive and thrive, I agree that American taxpayers should not be asked to bail out the cruise industry.  They should not be in line to collect benefits from the USA when they have done their utmost to avoid paying their fair share of taxes towards its economic well being. 

[bigmjh]

4 hours ago, Paulchili said:

"Agree. Can’t see taxpayers’ money going to anyone who does not pay US taxes...."

Paul - I agree with you in regards to the cruise lines. But also note that 91 Fortune 500 companies effectively paid no federal taxes in 2018. These publicly-owned, profitable corporations included such giants as Amazon, Delta, Netflix, Honeywell International, General Motors and on and on. And you can bet that they will have their hands out - and receive - a healthy cut of this bail-out money. While the cruise lines have escaped paying U.S. taxes, they do employ hundreds of thousands of workers in cruise associated shore-side jobs and purchase millions (billions?) of dollars worth of U.S. produced goods and food. All of which would go away should they be allowed to fail.

[Paulchili]

31 minutes ago, bigmjh said:

Paul - I agree with you in regards to the cruise lines. But also note that 91 Fortune 500 companies effectively paid no federal taxes in 2018. These publicly-owned, profitable corporations included such giants as Amazon, Delta, Netflix, Honeywell International, General Motors and on and on. And you can bet that they will have their hands out - and receive - a healthy cut of this bail-out money. While the cruise lines have escaped paying U.S. taxes, they do employ hundreds of thousands of workers in cruise associated shore-side jobs and purchase millions (billions?) of dollars worth of U.S. produced goods and food. All of which would go away should they be allowed to fail.

In that case why can't cruise lines do exactly what Amazon, Delta, Netflix, etc, etc do and still avoid taxes.

Maybe we need a meaningful tax reform instead of what we got a couple of years ago?

At least those other companies employ Americans and have to obey US laws, including minimum wage and other employee protections as well as provide benefits like healthcare, maybe 401K, etc.

Their employees pay US taxes but the cruise line employees generally do not.

That said, you do make a good point.

Edited March 27, 2020 by Paulchili

[tv24]

I've been following this thread vis-a-vis our wait for our requested total refund for our March 28 sailing.  Thank you to all for your comments and histories.  And also for what to do about our deposit on our Oct. 3 sailing.  I've decided to be patient as much as I can since I can see that the staff at Seabourn are working through all the thousands of cancellations and changes and mine is simply in the huge gueue.  I hope it all works out.  And someday we will sail again.

[teamflames]

9 minutes ago, tv24 said:

I've been following this thread vis-a-vis our wait for our requested total refund for our March 28 sailing.  Thank you to all for your comments and histories.  And also for what to do about our deposit on our Oct. 3 sailing.  I've decided to be patient as much as I can since I can see that the staff at Seabourn are working through all the thousands of cancellations and changes and mine is simply in the huge gueue.  I hope it all works out.  And someday we will sail again.

I just spoke to the manager of the hotel resort complex we live in. Like the rest of the tourism world he has had the whole season cancelled. Despite this he is processing refunds immediately. He confirms what I have previously said that a refund is as quick to process as the original payment. The only reason for lengthy delays is to hold cash for as long possible.

[Paulchili]

3 minutes ago, teamflames said:

I just spoke to the manager of the hotel resort complex we live in. Like the rest of the tourism world he has had the whole season cancelled. Despite this he is processing refunds immediately. He confirms what I have previously said that a refund is as quick to process as the original payment. The only reason for lengthy delays is to hold cash for as long possible.

That is as it should be but I am guessing he has far fewer clients to deal with and much smaller refunds than SB. 🙂

[teamflames]

1 hour ago, Paulchili said:

That is as it should be but I am guessing he has far fewer clients to deal with and much smaller refunds than SB. 🙂

He runs it by himself, 70 rooms multiplied by 6 months of bookings. Says a refund is a matter of minutes , amount of the booking is irrelevant.

Anyway, clearly as usual on cc there are those who no cruise line can do wrong (even when they keep their money for 90 days). If a bank, insurance company, real estate agent etc did the same thing I find it highly unlikely that we would see this open cheerleading (I have certainly never seen it).

[ab21au]

19 minutes ago, teamflames said:

Anyway, clearly as usual on cc there are those who no cruise line can do wrong

I guess I’m one of those you are talking about. We cancelled our Feb 29 cruise before SB cancelled. We got a FCC.  As SB cancelled the cruise I could have gotten more but it was our choice to cancel and we a happy with that. 
 

At the time (early Feb before things really spread) we then booked a cruise for July/August and I added a reminder in my calendar when we moved into 12% cancellation. So I cancelled before that date. Could we have waited? yes. But the relief to have it all finalized is amazing.

 

Apart from the FCC, SB have paid me everything I asked for and so I cannot complain out that.  

[westmount]

Similar to the airline business, cruise lines pay their bills with advance booking deposits and cash from prepaid fares. Without bookings, they have no cash, and thus I would be amazed if refunds are made at the current time. 
  On the other hand, I imagine that once the cruise lines do return, it will be a slow rollout, with fewer ships going to popular spots, at higher prices. If everyone booking is using a FCC plus 25% bonus, it would seem prices will be high since it’s all play money being used , our play money. I read yesterday that hedge funds have over a trillion dollars of cash on the side lines waiting to invest in these type situations, so dent on the ships will be deferred until the ships can filled at profitable prices, at the very worse, the cruise lines will renegotiate their loans, as it’s not like there’s sharper guys who will steal the Oasis of the Sea at 30 cents on the dollar and start sailing . 
  It looks like they are not going to get A bailout, but they don’t really need it , as they’ll get it from everyone else who relies on them. 
  Now will come the interesting discussion, as I had to buy tickets home from Perth through Qatar as my ride home with Air Canada went kaput with fingers pointing everywhere, a lesson on booking a ticket on one own ,mnow needing a travel law PhD to understand . 
  I’m still looking forward to our reunion cruise in 2022, probably free I hope for everyone involved, that would be the proper solution, but hardly one I expect. 
  It’s kind of funny, I believe I’ve been in quarantine since March 1st in the Seychelles, with 8 more days to go, I’m going to need to brush up on social skills pretty soon. 
Let’s see what Carnival comes out with, first they need $5 billion, call if you wish to help. 

[Reef Knot]

I think the higher prices have already kicked in. Our cancelled 15 day Manaus to Miami is a little over 50% more for the same itinerary in 2021 with no internet or OBC incentives. Even with the 25% FCC offer it's still not enough.

 

 

 

[Paulchili]

1 hour ago, Reef Knot said:

I think the higher prices have already kicked in. Our cancelled 15 day Manaus to Miami is a little over 50% more for the same itinerary in 2021 with no internet or OBC incentives. Even with the 25% FCC offer it's still not enough.

 

 

 

Ditto for our almost identical replacement cruise in 2021. Whether they will actually get those prices depends on demand.

[Catlover54]

As part of my communications with my TA to make sure she is on top of doing the paperwork necessary to secure the compensation promised for the cruise SB cancelled while we were on board, ( i.e., to make sure we are “in line”), I advised her of some of the comments on CC about where pax are with their refunds and the backlogs.

She told me

 “. . . all the cruiselines have cut their staff to 4 days a week to help with expenses- so it's even slower than usual.”

 

Does anyone have information, either direct or indirect from TAs, that this is true?

It would seem to me that during a period of high demand for customer service, absent total inability of a company to access funds to pay personnel, there would be an increase and not a decrease in staff work hours ( e.g., as overtime, new temp hires, or similar), like Amazon, Walmart, and supermarkets  have done, or at least maintenance of a regular work week.

 

My TA only works with the luxury cruise lines so I assume her comments are referring to SS, Crystal, Regent, and SB.

[phillipahain]

I just wish SB would stop mucking about pretending April 22nd Barcelona to Athens is still viable since every port on the cruise is closed and still will be and majority of cruisers cant fly to join it anyway 

[Two4Sea]

6 hours ago, Reef Knot said:

I think the higher prices have already kicked in. Our cancelled 15 day Manaus to Miami is a little over 50% more for the same itinerary in 2021 with no internet or OBC incentives. Even with the 25% FCC offer it's still not enough.

 

 

 

 

4 hours ago, Paulchili said:

Ditto for our almost identical replacement cruise in 2021. Whether they will actually get those prices depends on demand.

 

Reef Knot, Paulchili, I've been tracking some Europe 2021 ideas since Christmas and comparing them with their 2020 equivalents. So far the 2020 prices have been consistently 2/3's of the 2021 ones so your 50% markup is sounding normal rather than something new. This seems to be the marketing strategy of the past few years, start with high hopes 2 years ahead and then whittle the prices down in the last 6-9 months. Even the January-February Wave season sale was hollow. The 2020 version of one of my cruises had been on "sale" and has just changed to "non sale". All that happened was that a $300 p/p OBC was dropped while the cruise fare actually went down $200 for a mere price rise of $100 p/p on a 21 day cruise. To me the "sale" wasn't exactly a big deal but most people seem to go by that word rather than the underlying figures.

Bill

[Rambo_Trout]

Just an update to my own situation.

 

We were booked on the Encore for the 26-day cruise from Sydney to Singapore on 22nd March.

 

We bailed out on the 27th February, as our flights were booked for 6th March and the cruise was being shortened, then cancelled.

 

We requested a refund on the same day, which was agreed by Seabourn, with a promise of refund 'within 14 working days'. Needless to say, that 23 working days later, it has not arrived. This has been chased by my UK Travel Agent twice, with Seabourn promising to chase their Accounts Dept. My TA says that SB are now quoting 90 days for repayment.

 

For the record, my previous business was supplying equipment to the marine industry, with Holland America as a regular client. Guess which Company we had to chase the most for non-payment of invoices.

 

A positive for SB, is that they did agree (without asking) to give us the 25% Future Cruise Credit, even though we cancelled prior to them cancelling the cruise.

 

We haven't submitted our claim for cancelled hotels etc yet, but we look like losing over £ 8,000 in Singapore Air Business Class Flights. Does anyone have any experience with claiming back such high flight costs from SB?

 

Kevin

[Paulchili]

27 minutes ago, Rambo_Trout said:

We bailed out on the 27th February, as our flights were booked for 6th March and the cruise was being shortened, then cancelled.

 

27 minutes ago, Rambo_Trout said:

A positive for SB, is that they did agree (without asking) to give us the 25% Future Cruise Credit, even though we cancelled prior to them cancelling the cruise.

At least you are getting (or being promised) a refund. We too cancelled on 2/27 for our cruise from 3/8 to 4/7 before they cancelled the 3/22 portion of the cruise.

We are only getting 100% FCC - no refund and no extra FCC despite asking several times.

[Rambo_Trout]

1 minute ago, Paulchili said:

 

At least you are getting (or being promised) a refund. We too cancelled on 2/27 for our cruise from 3/8 to 4/7 before they cancelled the 3/22 portion of the cruise.

We are only getting 100% FCC - no refund and no extra FCC despite asking several times.

They said that to me at first too. But I used the UK's largest Seabourn Agent (who I booked with) to try to get a refund, and SB agreed. I might just have been lucky.

[Paulchili]

12 minutes ago, Rambo_Trout said:

They said that to me at first too. But I used the UK's largest Seabourn Agent (who I booked with) to try to get a refund, and SB agreed. I might just have been lucky.

Lucky you - I should have used your agent😀

[Swaxxy]

Potentially bucking the trend other cruise lines are setting, Carnival Corp. (NYSE: CCL) still hasn't decided whether it's on board with keeping its ships in port after the 30-day cruise suspension, which began on March 13, expires. A post this morning on the company's Facebook page said that the decision is still up in the air, but promised a final answer by this Friday, March 27.  

 

Does anyone know if a decision was made?  

[SLSD]

Sad news from Holland America:  https://www.businessinsider.com/holland-american-coronavirus-covid-19-zaandam-rotterdam-2020-3?fbclid=IwAR0SKpx9nmcBjxgg9hYzS3vYncYC7P4cC609Eo5PfNcKMLbutB8XZt_8Of8

 

 

• Four passengers have died aboard Holland America Line's MS Zaandam ship, according to leaked audio from a sister ship sent to rescue stranded passengers.

Edited March 28, 2020 by SLSD

[westmount]

Four people died today on a cruise ship trying to find a port home. Please take the idea of going on a cruise in 2020 out of your minds, or you need a bit more time in quarantine. Who in their right mind wishes to go on a ship until the virus  issues are understood. 

The luxury lines have escaped any calamities so far, but they need big brother operating to pay the bills. 

  If anyone actually receives their refunds shortly, please let us know, as i can't imagine refunding passengers is at the top of the creditors list. Once they announce a Bank refinancing, then you can start dreaming of Ed McMahon showing up with the big cheque, or of course, it could be in the mail. 

[HappyFeet13]

What a nightmare!

https://www.businessinsider.com/holland-american-coronavirus-covid-19-zaandam-rotterdam-2020-3

[SLSD]

36 minutes ago, HappyFeet13 said:

What a nightmare!

https://www.businessinsider.com/holland-american-coronavirus-covid-19-zaandam-rotterdam-2020-3

Indeed.  A true nightmare.  Most of us are sheltering in place (by mandate or by choice)  and concerned about family members and friends who are far flung in varying degrees of danger.  I cannot even imagine thinking about booking a cruise at the moment.  First, we have to get through a truly daunting crisis (wherever we live) and hope for the best going forward.  Only then, and when there is a vaccine we can have administered --will we turn our sights  to leisure travel.  

Edited March 28, 2020 by SLSD