Maine ports closed

[MMDown Under]

1 hour ago, Outerdog said:

 

Honestly, how can you expect anything different? This is a cruise forum where cruisers discuss the current situation with cruise ships, which includes Covid risk.

Yes, you are right.

[HappyInVan]

3 hours ago, Potstech said:

But you say nothing about the source of the other 90% of cases .  That would be China but instead you want to place the on one cruise ship. Just goes to show how different people have different interpretations of what the facts mean.

 

I never mentioned New Zealand so why distort the discussion.

 

 

Actually, can you show the source for your claim that 90% came from China?

 

In truth, 100% of the cases come from China ultimately because patient zero was Chinese. The point here is the source of the transmission. By air or by sea? Directly from China or from Asia or Europe or USA? 

 

Did community transmission occur in town or on a ship? A third of the Aussie pax on Ruby Princess were infected.

 

The case example of NZ is important because it shows the potential for a cruise ship to spread the disease at each stop. The Ruby princess stopped off in Napier for a few hours. Two dozen infections identified. Who knows how many more hidden infections. Each one with the potential to start a new cluster.

 

NZ closed their ports to cruise ships. Only 19 dead in the country. Job well done.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by HappyInVan

[mphouston]

When will NZ re-open from their quarantine?  If they open before a vaccine/cure, then the virus will have a virgin field of hosts waiting for it.   It won't be pretty.  I wonder if they will just stay closed for 6-12 months?

 

Letting or preventing cruise ships dock will affect the timing of the infections, not the number of infections.

 

[HappyInVan]

10 minutes ago, mphouston said:

It won't be pretty.  I wonder if they will just stay closed for 6-12 months?

 

Letting or preventing cruise ships dock will affect the timing of the infections, not the number of infections.

 

 

 

Seems that the amount of testing and contact tracing makes a difference. Easy access to testing means that many early cases are detected and the patients warned to self-isolate, before they become super-spreaders.

 

I read that LA is the only city so far to offer free testing to residents!

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52492634

 

And, the discipline of the society to maintain social distancing is paramount. I have no qualms about visiting NZ because its government and people are determined to remain healthy.

 

 

 

[npcl]

46 minutes ago, HappyInVan said:

 

 

Seems that the amount of testing and contact tracing makes a difference. Easy access to testing means that many early cases are detected and the patients warned to self-isolate, before they become super-spreaders.

 

I read that LA is the only city so far to offer free testing to residents!

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-52492634

 

And, the discipline of the society to maintain social distancing is paramount. I have no qualms about visiting NZ because its government and people are determined to remain healthy.

 

 

 

However, if the NZ government continues to be smart they will not let you or anyone else visit from outside of the country as long as the virus is not well controlled in the rest of the world.

 

I suspect that NZ will resume normal activities inside the country, with foreign travel still blocked, then maybe open up to foreign travel with Australia as they demonstrate their situation is under control, but probably not with anywhere else for quite a while.

[Potstech]

Or is ot to show the situation regarding just the corona virus, from all sources, is an ongoing issue.  Agree that sadly it is not over and will not be for a longtime.

[milolii]

On 4/30/2020 at 5:09 AM, Expat Cruise said:

In the end Governors do not control port closing. In the United States it would be the USCG and the Federal Government. Maine can ask but hey can be over ruled. The same as Florida was over the last few weeks. If you remember the Governor of California said the Grand Princess could not dock, and what happen over ruled by the Federal Government.

 

The Grand Princess was a big story here in Northern California.  I don’t remember Governor Newsom opposing the docking,  The President, however, is on video opposing it.  Roughly half the passengers were Californians. He seemed to be truly focused in the wellbeing of all those in the ship, as well as, local residents.  I think his big concern was it would  be hard to dock the Grand in a controlled situating right in the middle of San Francisco.  I don’t think there was much opposition from Californians either, especially considering how many were onboard. In fact, motorists crossing the Golden Gate Bridge at the time she passed under it, got out of their cars and cheered the passengers on their balconies. 
 

It was evident that he was deeply involved in the planning along with Oakland Mayor Schaff.  I listed to the Governor’s press conference held the day before the docking(while on hold with Princess to unfortunately cancel  cruise).  He described the process in great detail.  He was very instrumental in choosing the site in Oakland, and in fact would take  “any heat for that” in his words.  But I don’t remember him ever saying the Grand could not dock.  

[capriccio]

On 4/30/2020 at 8:09 AM, Expat Cruise said:

In the end Governors do not control port closing. In the United States it would be the USCG and the Federal Government. Maine can ask but hey can be over ruled. The same as Florida was over the last few weeks.

 

The federal government did not overrule the local authorities in Florida.  Rather, the local authorities presented the cruise lines with a list of requirements developed by the Port Everglades Unified Command* and approved by the local government to be met in order to disembark passengers.  It took some days to do so but they were met.  If anyone is interested, the Zaandam and Rotterdam Plan is at https://www.porteverglades.net/hal-repatriation-plan/.

 

* members of the Unified Command:

 

• U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
• Florida Department of Health in Broward County
• U.S. Coast Guard
• U.S. Customs & Border Protection
• Broward Sheriff’s Office Departments of Law Enforcement and Fire Rescue
• Broward County Emergency Management
• Port Everglades Pilots Association
• Broward County Port Everglades Department

 

[mammajamma2013]

21 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

...I read that LA is the only city so far to offer free testing to residents!...

 

 

Las Cruces, NM has been doing this for about a month. It's testing for all in our county.

[shastatroy]

I bet the businesses in the port cities are not to happy about this.

[MMDown Under]

Our Government is encouraging testing for the virus of everyone with the slightest symptoms.  Two more people on the Gold Coast, where I live, have tested positive - one from a cruise ship and one from the community (unknown).

[HappyInVan]

On 5/2/2020 at 1:36 PM, shastatroy said:

I bet the businesses in the port cities are not to happy about this.

 The point is that the people of the port cities will have no regrets from the health POV.

 

Have you heard? Trump's valet tested positive. How can anyone be safe on a ship with 3k strangers when your white House isn't safe?

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/07/trump-meets-with-texas-gov-abbott-after-valet-tests-positive-for-coronavirus.html

 

 

 

[Potstech]

1 hour ago, HappyInVan said:

 The point is that the people of the port cities will have no regrets from the health POV.

 

Have you heard? Trump's valet tested positive. How can anyone be safe on a ship with 3k strangers when your white House isn't safe?

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/07/trump-meets-with-texas-gov-abbott-after-valet-tests-positive-for-coronavirus.html

 

 

 

So what does the "Trump" article have to do with port cities?

[npcl]

On 5/1/2020 at 12:54 PM, mphouston said:

When will NZ re-open from their quarantine?  If they open before a vaccine/cure, then the virus will have a virgin field of hosts waiting for it.   It won't be pretty.  I wonder if they will just stay closed for 6-12 months?

 

Letting or preventing cruise ships dock will affect the timing of the infections, not the number of infections.

 

40% of NZ tourist business comes from Australia.  So allowing travel between those tow would go a long way to getting economies there back on track.  While tourism would remain down, not as much as one might think.

[MMDown Under]

2 hours ago, npcl said:

40% of NZ tourist business comes from Australia.  So allowing travel between those tow would go a long way to getting economies there back on track.  While tourism would remain down, not as much as one might think.

NZ and Aust Govts have met with regard to creating a NZ/Aust bubble, which will enable tourism and business to open up between these two countries.  Many Kiwis holiday in Australia during their winter, whilst many Aussies ski in NZ.  A date hasn't been announced yet.  

[HappyInVan]

3 hours ago, Potstech said:

So what does the "Trump" article have to do with port cities?

 

 

How safe  can any place in the USA be if the White House is not? IMO, it would be foolhardy to allow cruise ships to sail into a port in the present situation.

Edited May 8, 2020 by HappyInVan

[joeyancho]

On 4/30/2020 at 7:14 PM, Potstech said:

So now you jump to Tasmania from New Zealand to distort your original Australia statement.  Where do you go next.  What facts, numbers are you referring to other than a generic 50%? I gave you actual numbers from Australia and you come back with a generic per centage. 

Tasmania is Australia.   But not according to Australians, lol.

[neverbeenhere]

https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5097/

[Potstech]

2 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

 

 

How safe  can any place in the USA be if the White House is not? IMO, it would be foolhardy to allow cruise ships to sail into a port in the present situation.

No one ever said that the White House was safe.  That is why they are tested way more than any other group in the country. Instead of just saying a White House employee tested positive for the virus you have to bring Trump into it.  Yes he was a military aid for the President but so what.

 

Never say you post about Boris Johnson getting the virus.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Potstech

[HappyInVan]

25 minutes ago, Potstech said:

No one ever said that the White House was safe.  That is why they are tested way more than any other group in the country. Instead of just saying a White House employee tested positive for the virus you have to bring Trump into it.  Yes he was a military aid for the President but so what.

 

Never say you post about Boris Johnson getting the virus.

 

How is Boris Johnson relevant???

 

The White House has gone from testing once a week to daily. Can the cruise companies do that?

 

If the White House can't insulate the commander in chief, how will a cruise ship protect pax?

 

I would think that the people of Maine ports are breathing a sigh of relief!

 

BTW, the infected person was a member of the military serving as a personal valet. Means that he accessed the living quarters of the First Couple, helped the Boss dress etc

 

 

 

[capriccio]

21 minutes ago, Potstech said:

No one ever said that the White House was safe.  That is why they are tested way more than any other group in the country. Instead of just saying a White House employee tested positive for the virus you have to bring Trump into it.  Yes he was a military aid for the President but so what.

 

The ill gentleman's job is personal valet to the President.  According to the White House, this person is a member of the U.S. military who serves the president food. (interesting description of the job of valet to be found at https://www.thecut.com/2020/05/white-house-valet-presidential-valet-coronavirus-trump.html).

 

This serves as a cautionary tale that even with frequent testing (weekly in the WH now increased to daily), it is possible to get covid-19.  Given that some, possibly many, with covid-19 are asymtomatic during part or all of the period they are infectious that has implications for all of us who are not strictly quarantined.  The more people you encounter the more likelihood of one or more being infected.

[HappyInVan]

Right! Let's get the facts right. 

 

I was watching Erin Burnett's show on CNN. Interesting tidbit. The test used by the WH has a 15% false negative!!!

 

That means that every eighth person tested negative is actually positive. That's why masks are recommended as a second line of defense. The first defense is distancing. The further you get from other people, the less chance of infecting or being infected.

 

Look at the long list of ports closed around the world. Very sensible.

 

 

 

 

Edited May 8, 2020 by HappyInVan

[MMDown Under]

1 hour ago, neverbeenhere said:

https://www.cruisecritic.com/news/5097/

These dates aren't correct, as they relate to Australia.  No dates decided for ports reopening for cruise ships. 

PM live interview today.

[npcl]

22 minutes ago, HappyInVan said:

Right! Let's get the facts right. 

 

I was watching Erin Burnett's show on CNN. Interesting tidbit. The test used by the WH has a 15% false negative!!!

 

That means that every eighth person tested negative is actually positive. That's why masks are recommended as a second line of defense. The first defense is distancing. The further you get from other people, the less chance of infecting or being infected.

 

Look at the long list of ports closed around the world. Very sensible.

 

 

 

 

A slight correction, it means that every eighth positive person will test negative.

 

Considering that a lot more people that are tested are negative, the statistics would be far different if every eighth negative test was really a positive. As in my state there have been 64000 negative tests and less than 3000 confirmed positives. Following your original statement that would mean 8000 of the 64000 were really positive.  I don't think you really meant that.

[Potstech]

9 hours ago, HappyInVan said:

 

How is Boris Johnson relevant???

 

The White House has gone from testing once a week to daily. Can the cruise companies do that?

 

If the White House can't insulate the commander in chief, how will a cruise ship protect pax?

 

I would think that the people of Maine ports are breathing a sigh of relief!

 

BTW, the infected person was a member of the military serving as a personal valet. Means that he accessed the living quarters of the First Couple, helped the Boss dress etc

 

 

 

And you know the duties of the infected person how?

Getting information from Erin Burnett as well as CNN could be your problem.

Edited May 8, 2020 by Potstech