The Virus and the Vaccine

[Trimone]

Now the great news:

With 357 million doses ordered by the Government – and 800,000 already being sent by Pfizer – it is hoped that 10 million doses will be here by the year's end, and can bring a swift end to the pandemic.

People aged 80 and over as well as care home workers will be first to receive the jab, which has been shown to be 95 per cent effective at blocking Covid-19 infection, along with NHS workers who are at higher risk

 

[Roger88]

4 minutes ago, Trimone said:

Now the great news:

With 357 million doses ordered by the Government – and 800,000 already being sent by Pfizer – it is hoped that 10 million doses will be here by the year's end, and can bring a swift end to the pandemic.

People aged 80 and over as well as care home workers will be first to receive the jab, which has been shown to be 95 per cent effective at blocking Covid-19 infection, along with NHS workers who are at higher risk

 

These numbers sound fine but how can we know what people are getting it? How can we be sure that infected people are getting it in line with healthy people? And where is a guarantee that they wont catch it again,,? 

[Trimone]

18 minutes ago, Roger88 said:

These numbers sound fine but how can we know what people are getting it? How can we be sure that infected people are getting it in line with healthy people? And where is a guarantee that they wont catch it again,,? 

Well I’ve had communication from my doctors telling me to be prepared, why would you even question it? 
it’s a game changer!

[Formula280SS]

26 minutes ago, Trimone said:

Now the great news:

With 357 million doses ordered by the Government – and 800,000 already being sent by Pfizer – it is hoped that 10 million doses will be here by the year's end, and can bring a swift end to the pandemic.

People aged 80 and over as well as care home workers will be first to receive the jab, which has been shown to be 95 per cent effective at blocking Covid-19 infection, along with NHS workers who are at higher risk

 

 

PLEASE STOP the nonsense.

 

4 hours ago, Formula280SS said:

Looks like it's going to be quite a wait for subsequent dosage shipments after 1st one.

 

"Health authorities fear the 800,000 doses of the vaccine could run out just in covering people living in nursing homes and their caregivers—groups already given top priority. And this shipment "could be the only batch we receive for some time," said an official of a National Health Service organization."

 

"The first group to receive the vaccine will be those individuals over the age of 80 living in care homes, as well as their healthcare providers. And even then, demand is expected to outstrip supply"

 

"The initial 800,000 doses promised from Pfizer won’t go far to cover the 3.2 million Brits age 80 and above and the at least 300,000 caregivers working in nursing homes. These people are slated to get the vaccine first, followed by more than 1.4 million NHS workers."

 

"The rest of the population, meaning everyone else under the age of 50, will start receiving vaccinations later in 2021."

Also looks like, after Pfizer announced 50% reduction in production and delivery estimates, and intra-country allocations, and dividing by 2 doses per person, it's going to be a really slow general population vaccination.

 

"The 800,000 doses of vaccine are being shared across the four nations that make up the United Kingdom. Scotland has already said it is receiving 65,000 doses, with Northern Ireland getting 25,000 doses."
 

The most disconcerting note of late is/was Pfizer's CEO comments on their vaccine.  😲

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-9018547/Pfizer-CEO-not-certain-covid-shot-prevents-transmission.html

 

Pfizer CEO admits he is 'not certain' their COVID-19 shot will prevent vaccinated people from spreading the virus - as the firm cuts the number of doses it will ship this year

• Asked in a Dateline interview whether Pfizer's shot prevents transmission, CEO Albert Bourla said the firm is 'not certain about that' 

 

[Trimone]

7 minutes ago, Formula280SS said:

 

PLEASE STOP the nonsense.

 

 

That so called nonsense is from the Daily Mail the news paper you quoted,

People in glass houses !!!

[Trimone]

[hamrag]

5 minutes ago, Trimone said:

That so called nonsense is from the Daily Mail the news paper you quoted,

People in glass houses !!!

 

Loving it! You do know how to put such posters on ignore....it's really simple to do it?

[Trimone]

5 minutes ago, hamrag said:

 

Loving it! You do know how to put such posters on ignore....it's really simple to do it?

It’s funny but some people write things and for days nobody responds, wonder how many people are ignored....

[Formula280SS]

16 hours ago, Trimone said:

That so called nonsense is from the Daily Mail the news paper you quoted,

People in glass houses !!!

 

Please, get a grip.  "Hoping" for "up to 10M doses" on a photograph tag line is not, well, much. 

 

Regarding the Daily Mail, this is there report ~

 

"Health chiefs yesterday revealed that the UK will receive up to four million doses of the Pfizer/BioNTech coronavirus vaccine before the end of the year as hospital hubs around the country start receiving doses.

 

Fears that people would miss out in the first wave of immunisation because of short supplies were raised last week after the Government announced just 800,000 doses of the Pfizer jab had been sent to the UK.

 

But NHS bosses looked to quash concerns yesterday, with Saffron Cordery, the deputy CEO of NHS Providers, assuring the public that the country was expecting 'up to four million doses' by the end of December."

 

Please note, "expecting up to four million doses" is 60% less than your "hoping for up to ten million doses."  I know there is an issue with math for some.

 

IMO, the UK has and is doing a great job of laying out their plan publicly.  Probably the most information and details that I've seen put forth.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9023505/Coronavirus-UK-batch-Pfizer-jab-received-Croydon-NHS-vaccine-hub.html

 

That impression and favorable assessment gets demeaned across the pond from childish and repeated jabs at others' governance, health agencies and populations for being selfish and not social distancing and wearing masks.

 

Tat, with a raging Covid count in the UK, the "Tri-Rag" 'tit doesn't hold much comparative water.

 

Oh, "glass houses?" 

 

 

 

[Laszlo]

This scientist’s decades of mRNA research led to both COVID-19 vaccines, family friend since 1985


https://nypost.com/2020/12/05/this-s...dSKvhofiqFbSZI

[GA Dave]

Pfizer’s Vaccine Offers Strong Protection After First Dose

[BirdTravels]

On 12/3/2020 at 10:24 AM, roger001 said:

Well...I personally think the virus and the mess it has created for us and NCL is pretty cruise related.  You may not think so and delete if you wish.  But, I just read the following, a lengthy article written by a Doctor at Vanderbilt who specializes in immunology. He wrote it down to a level that even an idiot like me can follow.  Now...you can certainly say, what does he actually know...I'm going to decide the value of the vaccine myself.  For me, I've got to rely on folks like the doctor, because as a retired air traffic controller, I just flat out don't have the medical background to outguess the medical folks.  Anyhow, here's the article.  No politics here, just the facts Jack as told by a doctor.  Delete if you wish.  By the way, one of our Tennessee gals, Dolly Parton, gave Vanderbilt one million dollars for vaccine development.  Way to go Dolly!  

So, for those in the US, in order to provide vaccines for the entire country, the Government spread their orders across all of the viable manufacturers. During the summer, they had no idea that the RNA vaccines from Pfizer and Moderna would be the first available. So, healthcare workers and people in long term care homes will get the current, popularized vaccines, people in the non-priority groups will likely be given the yet-to-be-proven vaccines from other manufacturers. Yes, the US has placed additional orders with Pfizer, but they are now at the end of the line after other countries that have orders being fulfilled right now. 

[david_sobe]

Cruising will resume in 2021. But it wont be until 2022 that we can cruise without masks and social distancing.  Being vaccinated does not prevent someone from spreading the virus.  So until everyone is vaccinated we wont have "normal" cruising for awhile.  And close to 40% of people say they wont get vaccinated.  So I say deny them boarding.  The fun of cruising is being free to be and go where you want.  It would impact the cruise to constantly be behind plastic and wearing masks.  I see  a very bumpy return to cruising because people are so stubborn.

[mek]

12 hours ago, david_sobe said:

Cruising will resume in 2021. But it wont be until 2022 that we can cruise without masks and social distancing.  Being vaccinated does not prevent someone from spreading the virus.  So until everyone is vaccinated we wont have "normal" cruising for awhile.  And close to 40% of people say they wont get vaccinated.  So I say deny them boarding.  The fun of cruising is being free to be and go where you want.  It would impact the cruise to constantly be behind plastic and wearing masks.  I see  a very bumpy return to cruising because people are so stubborn.

From what I understand scientists are not sure if the vaccine prevents transmission, but they have not said that it doesn't either so please don't state that as a fact.  They simply don't know because there hasn't been any testing on transmission - prevention/immunity was the only thing they studied.

Edited December 14, 2020 by mek

[david_sobe]

7 minutes ago, mek said:

From what I understand scientists are not sure if the vaccine prevents transmission, but they have not said that it doesn't either so please don't state that as a fact.  They simply don't know because there hasn't been any testing on transmission - prevention/immunity was the only thing they studied.

Wrong.  I watched a doctor on TV right before I posted this.  The vaccine may/will prevent you from getting sick but there is no proof that you cannot spread the virus.  Just because you dont get sick does not mean you cant spread the virus.  There are many people with no symptoms (the vaccine would not do them any good) yet they spread the virus.

Edited December 14, 2020 by david_sobe

[david_sobe]

Just now, david_sobe said:

 

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by david_sobe

[david_sobe]

2 minutes ago, david_sobe said:

 

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by david_sobe

[mek]

13 minutes ago, david_sobe said:

Wrong.  I watched a doctor on TV right before I posted this.  The vaccine may/will prevent you from getting sick but there is no proof that you cannot spread the virus.  Just because you dont get sick does not mean you cant spread the virus.  There are many people with no symptoms (the vaccine would not do them any good) yet they spread the virus.

And there is no proof that it won't either.  There haven't been any studies on this so the scientists simply don't know either way.

 

But I'm always willing to stand corrected if you can show me where the scientists  working on the vaccines, and not just some doctor on TV with an opinion, conducted studies on this. 

 

Edited December 14, 2020 by mek

[All-ready2cruise]

I think the problem is, and has been from the beginning, we just don't know.  Yes, I saw the same information shared as @david_sobe saw on TV, and yes, just b/c it was seen does not make it the truth; however, IMO, it was meant more as a warning than anything else.  

 

This virus of the coronavirus strain seems to have such abilities to change course that no one is certain of anything right now.   Will the vaccine eliminate the possibility to share this virus with others? We just don't know!

 

I wish everyone well, and hope we can all cruise in the near future. 

Be safe, keep your loved ones safe too, wear a mask. 

 

Cheers

[Doubt It]

The point is that no one should assume that with many people vaccinated that the virus will go away.

 

Many people believe the vaccine will stop transmission, this is not true, we have no evidence. But then neither has any so called expert or politician actually come out and stated this simple fact....nothing from anyone in high position of accountability where their comment would be spread globally. 

 

This fact of no evidence of stopping transmission is spreading informally.

 

I have no intention of cruising any time soon given this reality.

[BirdTravels]

19 hours ago, david_sobe said:

Wrong.  I watched a doctor on TV right before I posted this.  The vaccine may/will prevent you from getting sick but there is no proof that you cannot spread the virus.  Just because you dont get sick does not mean you cant spread the virus.  There are many people with no symptoms (the vaccine would not do them any good) yet they spread the virus.

So,,, you know that the talking heads make money by making provocative statements. If you simply state facts, you wouldn’t get any gigs. You can flip through all of the news stations and depending on the political slant of the station, you’ll have a paid talking head saying what they station wants. TV trolls. 

[UnorigionalName]

19 hours ago, david_sobe said:

Wrong.  I watched a doctor on TV right before I posted this.  The vaccine may/will prevent you from getting sick but there is no proof that you cannot spread the virus.  Just because you dont get sick does not mean you cant spread the virus.  There are many people with no symptoms (the vaccine would not do them any good) yet they spread the virus.

 

People with Asymptomatic COVID infections are NOT very infectious.  People with PRE-symptomatic COVID infections are very infectious.

 

There is a lot of literature for flu (as different as COVID and flu are, it perhaps provides a good model for when a subset of people are vaccinated in a disease with decent prevalence) showing that having a subset of people that are vaccinated decreases the chance of infection in the non-vaccinated people.  I.e. the herd effect exists and vaccinated people don't transmit flu to the same degree.

 

At the moment, while there is no proof vaccinated people won't spread the virus, there is also no proof that vaccinated people will spread the virus, and there is plenty of reason to hope/expect that vaccinated people, even if they can transmit the virus, will do so at a much decreased efficacy compared to non-vaccinated.

Edited December 14, 2020 by UnorigionalName

[RocketMan275]

On 12/13/2020 at 7:45 PM, david_sobe said:

Wrong.  I watched a doctor on TV right before I posted this.  The vaccine may/will prevent you from getting sick but there is no proof that you cannot spread the virus.  Just because you dont get sick does not mean you cant spread the virus.  There are many people with no symptoms (the vaccine would not do them any good) yet they spread the virus.

So what? Even if a vaccinated person could spread the disease, they can't spread it to someone who has been vaccinated.  This is even more reason to get the vaccine.

[JamieLogical]

52 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

So what? Even if a vaccinated person could spread the disease, they can't spread it to someone who has been vaccinated.  This is even more reason to get the vaccine.

 

Exactly! What are we even arguing about here? If cruise lines require passengers and staff to be vaccinated (*fingers crosssed*), then who exactly would they be spreading the virus TO, even if they could be carriers?

[nomad098]

1 hour ago, RocketMan275 said:

So what? Even if a vaccinated person could spread the disease, they can't spread it to someone who has been vaccinated.  This is even more reason to get the vaccine.

 

54 minutes ago, JamieLogical said:

 

Exactly! What are we even arguing about here? If cruise lines require passengers and staff to be vaccinated (*fingers crosssed*), then who exactly would they be spreading the virus TO, even if they could be carriers?

 

Because if you can carry and transmit the virus you can pass it on to those that are already vaccinated and all of you can pass it on to. medically unable to have the vaccine, those that have had the vaccine but due to medical reasons may still be badly affected by it, the 5% that the vaccine does not protect and anyone unvaccinated in countries you visit when travelling. Not quite as simple as just having a shot and everything is good.  

Edited December 15, 2020 by nomad098
Grammar