DeSantis is OK with NCL leaving Florida

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, CroozFanatic said:

 

Throw out the politics and imagine it's a poker game. Who do you think has the stronger hand?

 

I live in Orlando. The job market and housing market are both on fire. Frank made $34 million last year, if he gets fired, I'll bet the next best job he can get won't pay even $1 million/year.

 

Frank eats crow, but I don't know how.

The job and housing markets are on fire EVERYWHERE.  I'm in Ohio and I get at least one call a week for me to come back to work (I'm retired) in my industry.  I also get at least one call a week from real estate agents who state they can get me a check for my house for $75K more than it was evaluated 12 months ago.  That's without a buyer.  They believe their real estate firm can flip it for a quick $50K profit even at that inflated rate.  Of course, then I have to find another place to live, which is also inflated.

 

FDR....people look at the entire cruise industry and ask "how can the CEOs make that much money when the entire industry has lost so much revenue.  

 

It has been INFINITELY harder to keep NCL afloat than to keep it rolling when revenue has flowed in.  FDR had to go out and restructure ALL of their debt and find money to keep them afloat while there was no revenue.  He had to keep the ships in good working order with minimal staff.  He's had to negotiate with governments and port authorities to a) allow the empty ships to port, and b) find a way to restart a moribund company amid an entire industry that had been non-functioning for over a year.  All this needed to be done during a Global Pandemic.  Tall order.  If anything, he worked harder AND smarter in the last 18 months than he ever had.  I don't always agree with him, but kudos for a job well done.

 

That said, if he does pull the rug out from under those of us who have booked the Joy under the much ballyhooed "We're Back" marketing splash, he will have lost a customer (me) for life. 

[graphicguy]

12 hours ago, CaptainWoody said:

Absolutely!  Although, it seems like the 24 hour O'Sheehans was really more like 18.  I think I visited in the middle of the night one time and the "service" consisted of a help-yourself pot of hot coffee.

Not that I'm proud of it (well, maybe a little), but I remember stumbling into O'Sheehans on the Breakaway after the casino live "Hold'em" game broke up.  Not sure....but 3:30 a.m.?  There were 3 of us.  All of us had the drink package.  Bartender, amid his cleaning routine, swiped our cards, found out what each of us wanted to drink.  Made 3 of each, and placed them in front of us.  We were happy for an hour or so, and he got on with his cleaning routine.

 

I didn't make it to my excursion the next day, which my girlfriend, to this day, won't let me ever forget.

[BermudaBound2014]

2 hours ago, graphicguy said:

The job and housing markets are on fire EVERYWHERE.  I'm in Ohio and I get at least one call a week for me to come back to work (I'm retired) in my industry.  I also get at least one call a week from real estate agents who state they can get me a check for my house for $75K more than it was evaluated 12 months ago.  That's without a buyer.  They believe their real estate firm can flip it for a quick $50K profit even at that inflated rate.  Of course, then I have to find another place to live, which is also inflated.

 

Congratulations on living is such a desirable home. I'd be slightly irritated if I had unsolicited real estate agents calling me every single week to sell my house (that isn't even on the market).

 

I do agree that the market is on fire. Last year my renters moved out June 30. I put a FSBO in the window July 1st. Had an open house July 4 and finished the day with 5 offers over asking price. Completely closed July 17. Crazy fast. 

 

Sorry you will be leaving NCL. I know you had faith in the Joy sailing. 

[Junonia]

21 hours ago, graphicguy said:

I agree. I also think NCL will be allowed to require 100% vaccines, and Desantis will back down!

If you believe that then you don't know our Governor very well.  No deals.

 

" States’ rights are grounded in the United States Constitution under the 10th Amendment to the United States Constitution. The 10th Amendmentstates that “the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”

[CaptainWoody]

16 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

Second- I’m thinking of sailing on the Bliss in Sept or October. I’m betting prices decrease significantly from what they are today. Time will tell, but let’s make a friendly drink wager. Of course, with the drink package there isn’t much at stake 🙂

 

Hey, I just reread the thread and saw this.  We'll be on the Bliss in October!  If you respond to @texasaggiesinvite (a few posts above), it could just become an unofficial Rat Pack Cruise!!!  Sweet!!

[CaptainWoody]

6 hours ago, texasaggies said:

 

This is CaptainWoody's last command;

 

 

Yeah, but the judge let me off after a few of my drinking buddies/crew testified that I was sober "around" the time of the incident.  I really don't remember but I'm "sure" that it wasn't because I was drunk at the time.

[graphicguy]

This has nothing to do with FL or their Governor.  The cruise lines pretty much ignored Desantis and are requiring 18 or 12 year olds and up (depending on the dates) to be vaccinated to sail.  They're requiring original Federal CDC vaccine cards as proof (not even copies).  This is going to be just like a passport you have to show when boarding at check in, at least for the foreseeable future.  And, the Governor isn't stopping it.  His office just sent a letter to Royal stating FL won't stand in their way of cruising.  So much for all the bluster.

 

This has everything to do with Del Rio making a huge production of "getting back to cruising", in this case, on the Joy from Jamaica, and then pulling the crew who was supposed to staff the Joy over to the Bliss, which is sailing to Alaska and based on the fares I've seen on the Bliss, will make more money.

 

So, instead of honoring his commitment to those of us who, for over a year, kept scheduling cruises as NCL begged us not to do, and not taking a refund, in the hopes when they had a plan moving forward, as they do now, we would cruise.  Now, we don't have a cruise because NCL told us they could, and they would, sail the Joy out of Jamaica, and then left us high and dry. 

 

We have to cancel hotels, flights, fight with NCL to get our money back (no way I'm spending another single ¢ with NCL), and hope we aren't any $$$$$ because of NCL's lies.

[Von & John]

@texasaggies

Definitely sounds like the Mid-West 🤣

9 hours ago, texasaggies said:

 

I know I did. We had a "special" bar in our neighborhood that all of us high schoolers went to because they didn't card. Hmmm...maybe that's how it got started for me (the binge drinking).

 

[CaptainWoody]

15 minutes ago, Von & John said:

@texasaggies

Definitely sounds like the Mid-West 🤣

 

Yep.  Been there. Done that.  It got better....

[Até]

I think Florida may need to reconsider their position.  Today the CDC changed the rules for any sailings meeting 95% vaccination: No masks or social distancing needed anywhere, also self service buffet is okay.  I think that might change the demand for fully vaccinated sailings to the point Florida has to notice.

[skywonder]

5 hours ago, Junonia said:

If you believe that then you don't know our Governor very well.  No deals.

 

" States’ rights are grounded in the United States Constitution under the 10th Amendment to the United States Constitution. The 10th Amendmentstates that “the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”

Spot on, he will NOT stand down to the CDC just like he will not stand down to big tech and social media getting away with banning people just because they do not agree with their opinion. We the people in Florida have rights.

[skywonder]

12 hours ago, KennyFla said:

RCL has just received permission to start test cruises, which means they are not going to be totally vaccinated.

 

Again, the State of Florida has not prevented one cruise from sailing.

Well said and very true.

[oteixeira]

Celebrity just got permission to go full vaccinated out of....  wait for it....  Florida in June.   So explain that one away for those of you thinking the Governor wont back down.

[Murph269]

1 minute ago, oteixeira said:

Celebrity just got permission to go full vaccinated out of....  wait for it....  Florida in June.   So explain that one away for those of you thinking the Governor wont back down.

Link?

[oteixeira]

1 minute ago, Murph269 said:

Link?

 

[skywonder]

13 minutes ago, oteixeira said:

Celebrity just got permission to go full vaccinated out of....  wait for it....  Florida in June.   So explain that one away for those of you thinking the Governor wont back down.

He will not back down, he is letting people have options and choices which is a good thing. He already talked about this more then once on the local news, and many of us that live in Florida appreciate it and agree with his decision, not all the people of course but most I have spoken too do agree. The more choices the better for everyone to feel safe in their personal decision.

Edited May 27, 2021 by skywonder

[oteixeira]

6 minutes ago, skywonder said:

He will not back down, he is letting people have options and choices which is a good thing. He already talked about this more then once on the local news, and many of us that live in Florida appreciate it and agree with his decision, not all the people of course but most I have spoken too do agree. The more choices the better for everyone to feel safe in their personal decision.

So please explain to me how this cruise ship is sailing if he didn't back down please??  It is going fully vaccinated, from Florida, in June.  Sounds to me like he either backed down or the RCCL lawyers realize there is no way he can block them in court.

[Murph269]

13 minutes ago, oteixeira said:

So please explain to me how this cruise ship is sailing if he didn't back down please??  It is going fully vaccinated, from Florida, in June.  Sounds to me like he either backed down or the RCCL lawyers realize there is no way he can block them in court.

I really hope they’re allowed to sail, but this article makes it sound like it’s not a done deal and that pushback is likely from the governor. It’ll be interesting to see how it plays out.

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article251706998.html

[Stallion]

6 hours ago, Junonia said:

If you believe that then you don't know our Governor very well.  No deals.

 

" States’ rights are grounded in the United States Constitution under the 10th Amendment to the United States Constitution. The 10th Amendmentstates that “the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”

But the Constitution does EXPRESSLY delegate to the federal government the power to regulate interstate commerce-so the 10th Amendment CLEARLY under your own citation does not apply. There is absolutely no reasonable argument that international cruising is not governed by the interstate commerce clause

 

See citation to the US Constitution that completely disposes of your "novel" argument

 

Commerce clause, provision of the U.S. Constitution (Article I, Section   8 that authorizes Congress “to regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with Indian Tribes.” 

Edited May 27, 2021 by Stallion

[skywonder]

7 minutes ago, oteixeira said:

So please explain to me how this cruise ship is sailing if he didn't back down please??  It is going fully vaccinated, from Florida, in June.  Sounds to me like he either backed down or the RCCL lawyers realize there is no way he can block them in court.

Look I tried to explain it to you the best I could and I explained it clearly, but you do not want to here it and you just want to be right. It is good to have a Governor that looks out for the people and gives them choices. If you see something wrong with that then hey that is on you. So go ahead and feel that you are right, enjoy. I refuse to argue with you about this. It is just not worth my time. I'm going on vacation either way, by land or by sea or both, so no skin off my back.

[oteixeira]

28 minutes ago, skywonder said:

He will not back down, he is letting people have options and choices which is a good thing. He already talked about this more then once on the local news, and many of us that live in Florida appreciate it and agree with his decision, not all the people of course but most I have spoken too do agree. The more choices the better for everyone to feel safe in their personal decision.

 

2 minutes ago, skywonder said:

Look I tried to explain it to you the best I could and I explained it clearly, but you do not want to here it and you just want to be right. It is good to have a Governor that looks out for the people and gives them choices. If you see something wrong with that then hey that is on you. So go ahead and feel that you are right, enjoy. I refuse to argue with you about this. It is just not worth my time. I'm going on vacation either way, by land or by sea or both, so no skin off my back.

I am sorry but nothing you said in the past 30 minutes has been clear.   Please explain how "he is letting people have options and choices" relates to how a cruise line that will require proof of vaccine was just given permission to sail out of Florida when he has a law that say you cannot require people to show said vaccine.

I don't think I am being difficult here, I don't live in Florida, I have no idea what he is saying on local news.  Is he saying he will allow the lines to ask for vaccine so they can sail???

[At Sea At Peace]

5 minutes ago, Stallion said:

But the Constitution does EXPRESSLY delegate to the federal government the power to regulate interstate commerce-so the 10th Amendment CLEARLY under your own citation does not apply. There is absolutely no reasonable argument that international cruising is not governed by the interstate commerce clause

 

See citation to the US Constitution that completely disposes of your "novel" argument

 

Commerce clause, provision of the U.S. Constitution (Article I, Section 😎 that authorizes Congress “to regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with Indian Tribes.” 

 

If everything is so clear, why are there so many 10th (and 14th) Amendment litigations by states and individuals?  There are so many variables, unanswered questions, etc. as a result of the pandemic. In arguments just months ago such were leveled against the administration for such potential federal over reach, now polar opposite of states lack of defense.  So, how can reasonably prudent people believe such proffers are EXPRESSLY and CLEARLY "settled law?"

 

 

[Stallion]

Seriously?

 

I made the 10th Amendment argument crystal clear. In order for the 10th Amendment to apply the law must involve “the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution". Then I posted the Constitutional provision Art. 1 Sec. 8 which clearly delegates that power to federal government instead. The 10th Amendment does not apply because the Interstate Commerce Clause is a clear delegation of that power to the federal government so you never reach the issue of "powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution"

[ChutChut]

26 minutes ago, Stallion said:

But the Constitution does EXPRESSLY delegate to the federal government the power to regulate interstate commerce-so the 10th Amendment CLEARLY under your own citation does not apply. There is absolutely no reasonable argument that international cruising is not governed by the interstate commerce clause

 

See citation to the US Constitution that completely disposes of your "novel" argument

 

Commerce clause, provision of the U.S. Constitution (Article I, Section   8 that authorizes Congress “to regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with Indian Tribes.” 

Not interstate commerce when docked at a state-owned port. Once the ship departs, then fed law prevails. However, cruise lines docked in a state-owned port are governed by a combination of fed, state, and local law.

[Stallion]

Nonsense-ever heard of other travel documentation? Say a Passport. Have you read the terms of every cruise contract which clearly states that the Cruise ticket is govern by federal law except with regard to certain irrelevant and immaterial provisions. I've cited several cruise contracts on cruisecritic. You are walking the plank with this argument. We are talking about travel documentation for interstate travel