Is there a dinner option for those who do not want to dress up?

[jzopp]

46 minutes ago, PORT ROYAL said:

Those who offend the stated Cunard dress code, causing offence to the special Cunard ambiance are now requesting, only the offended British, to show restraint and not to not publicly vocalise it.

Oh, hardly, do not misunderstand! I wouldn't dream of asking 'the offended British' to show restraint, and I'm rather mortified to have been interpreted in this way. 'The offended populace' should show restraint, British or not. 

 

After all -- Class, dignity, grace, elegance...all of these things are like power: if one must talk about maintaining them, one should ponder whether one really has them.

 

That notwithstanding, you'll have to excuse me -- coincidentally, I have to go pack for my voyage. Hope my wardrobe doesn't offend. 😏

Edited December 1, 2021 by jzopp

[Victoria2]

37 minutes ago, majortom10 said:

Dont assume things that I have never said. Please tell me in any of my posts where I have said I will not cruise with Cunard in the future.

You haven't. I missed the question mark off but couldn't edit it in.

 

I presume you will cruise with Cunard in the future even if it becomes an 'expensive P&O cruise'? As I said previously, I have heard of a good report of an October QE cruise so at the moment, am not at all concerned. 

[Victoria2]

I feel I must apologise for keeping this thread going.

The truth is, I am dismayed at times by the reputation Cunard has in some quarters and I cannot abide the high handedness displayed against perceived lesser mortals who cruise some other lines, shown by some which perpetuates the total myth Cunard passengers are  'different' from other cruise line passengers.

Just as some enjoy skating rinks and climbing walls on a cruise; and some the ability to dress down and relax away from office wear of suit and tie, Cunard passengers enjoy 'Play Dress up' [LOVE the phrase].

Cunard clientele are not different people/social class/ whatever, however one or two  might like to think. 'We'  just enjoy a different aspect of being on holiday at sea.

This hasn't been undermined if we still 'dress up' and the fact others might not should have no bearing at all on personal choice.

 

So if we continue to dress for dinner the message might filter through to CCL and others, some Cunard passengers like the formality but please, can we stop being nasty and unpleasant about those who will be following guidelines but might not pass muster in the eyes of those who hanker after the 'good old days'.

 

Like it or not, they have gone forever.

[exlondoner]

Just two additional points.

 

i should have thought it was to Carnival's benefit to make their lines as different as possible to attract the widest spectrum of cunstomers, rather than aim to make them all identical, as some have suggested.

 

I'm really am not interested in clothes and, like you, am unlikely to be upset if someone takes their jacket off in the restaurant. However, I think I would feel very awkward if I turned up for a meal in evening dress and everyone else was wearing T shirts and shorts. Or vice versa. So, to a degree, I think a certain conformity brings a degree of comfort. 

 

Anyway, the OP's question has been answered. They don't need to dress up, but their choices may be restricted.

[exlondoner]

2 hours ago, majortom10 said:

Dont assume things that I have never said. Please tell me in any of my posts where I have said I will not cruise with Cunard in the future.

 

I may be wrong, but I thought you had expressed doubts about cruising with Cunard over their withdrawal of FCDs and their associated OBC benefits.

[majortom10]

1 minute ago, exlondoner said:

 

I may be wrong, but I thought you had expressed doubts about cruising with Cunard over their withdrawal of FCDs and their associated OBC benefits.

yes you are right you may be wrong. I actually said as Summer 2023 was not available on my recent cruise onboard QE and because they have removed FCDs I would not be booking with them for 2023. I never said I would never cruise with them again.

[majortom10]

1 hour ago, Victoria2 said:

You haven't. I missed the question mark off but couldn't edit it in.

 

I presume you will cruise with Cunard in the future even if it becomes an 'expensive P&O cruise'? As I said previously, I have heard of a good report of an October QE cruise so at the moment, am not at all concerned. 

Well our cruise was on QE on 1st Nov-15th Nov in PG and we were disappointed with how many wore dress shirts and polo shirts at dinner on Smart Casual and there were many more dressed the same around the ship which I presume were from Britannia MDR or spent the whole cruise eating in buffet, which of course is their right.

[majortom10]

17 minutes ago, exlondoner said:

I think I would feel very awkward if I turned up for a meal in evening dress and everyone else was wearing T shirts

That has already happened to us and is the only down side that we dont like about Princess cruises. We love sharing a table for 8 hopefully of different nationalities and differing conversation. But, and it is a big BUT, the dress code on Princess especially on Formal nights in MDR is very poor and we have shared a table for 8 dressed formally in tux and black with one male of a couple wearing a black t-shirt and black trousers and another wearing a baseball cap. It certainly made me feel uncomfortable and overdressed and that is why we love cruising with Cunard because of the well adhered to dress code by majority. What worries me is the number of, whilst still adhering to the dress code, wore shirts and polo shirts on our recent cruise where in the past they would be in the minority and majority would be in jackets. I hope Cunard are not at the start of the road that many cruise lines now follow. 

[elmsliebev]

I just thought I'd join in, keep it going a bit longer! 

My attitude is that I can never be over-dressed on a cruise so we'll certainly be dressing up for the formal nights. The other nights, if it's very hot my OH may not wear a jacket but then again he might. Neither of us will be wearing jeans in the evening.

 

The change to dining interests me, I quite like the idea of a mix of fixed dining for those who want to dine early and more flexibility later. On our last Cunard cruise we changed tables after the first night as we knew we wouldn't get on with the others, just one of those things. The downside of course is having to go through the "how many times have you cruised" rigmarole more often although we enjoy meeting lots of different people from other countries. Sometimes we'd like to dine on our own in Britannia, and that saves having to find a tablemate to tell them or leave a message with the maitre d' that might not get through (past experience!) It will be interesting to see how it goes. 

 

I've only once experienced rampant snobbery on a Cunard cruise and that was from an older couple we shared a table with at afternoon tea on a QM2 TA - and they were the worst-dressed people I'd ever seen on any cruise!

[Lakesregion]

21 hours ago, Victoria2 said:

The difference will be, in your parlance 'those that understand' will have left Cunard to those who understand life evolves but the underlying ethos of Cunard will survive and we will continue to enjoy elegant ships with fellow passengers who appreciate the lack of leviathan entertainment provided on the floating blocks which are now being built.

The term 'human detritus' has been used on this thread and combine that with the underlying  unpleasantness displayed by some to their fellow passengers who in their eyes do not/will not pass their exacting standards, then I for one will not miss their ' patronage'.

 

As I have said before, thank goodness, in hundreds of nights onboard a Cunard ship, I have never come across anyone who has these 'values'. I hope I never do.

I wonder what makes you believe that the underlying elegance of Cunard will remain. NCL20 years ago was a very elegant line as was Holland America and even as few as five years ago Carnival had linen on their tables in the dining rooms. Now many are bare tops with a modicum of flat ware ala midrange restaurant chains. Three pieces wrapped in a napkin. So as the general ambiance unwraps with a more casual approach so will the elegance you claim will remain. Very doubtful.

[navybankerteacher]

It is of little consequence to me if Cunard goes the way of NCL, HAL, et al.   I have no wish to be over-dressed at dinner, so I will follow the tone set by my tablemates (unless, of course, it falls too far below any reasonable minimum).

 

Of course, if Cunard continues following the path blazed by NCL, there will be very few tablemates with whom to break bread, since a reluctance to dine with others seems to accompany a disinclination to give a damn about what one wears.

 

There will, of course, be one less (formerly significant) reason for choosing Cunard.

[Victoria2]

6 hours ago, Lakesregion said:

I wonder what makes you believe that the underlying elegance of Cunard will remain. NCL20 years ago was a very elegant line as was Holland America and even as few as five years ago Carnival had linen on their tables in the dining rooms. Now many are bare tops with a modicum of flat ware ala midrange restaurant chains. Three pieces wrapped in a napkin. So as the general ambiance unwraps with a more casual approach so will the elegance you claim will remain. Very doubtful.

You really do have it in for Cunard's evolving dress code and those who didn't and now won't. meet your exacting levels of attire.

 

I don't possess a crystal ball, but as Cunard isn't just any other line, I have faith in the passengers that the elegance will continue albeit not up to your standards. If my determination to dress as per pre Covid is anything to go by, I have few worries Cunard is about to slip into the 'depths' you have mentioned.

[BigMac1953]

A few interesting points have been raised in this thread.

 

Personally, I’m a firm believer in keeping traditions alive. The UK is world famous for our traditions. Our armed forces are the envy of every other nation when it comes to ceremonial events, many of which have been performed for centuries, such as Trooping the Colour and the ceremony of the Keys at the Tower.

 

Same with the Royal Navy. What other country gives an order (from the Queen) to “splice the mainbrace”.

 

Sadly with the reorganisation of the army and the demise of some regiments some traditions will be lost.

 

Tradition, more than anything else, was our biggest reason for travelling with Cunard for the last 14 years and spending north of £300K. I’m sure we are not alone, just as I’m sure there are many more people that have spent much more than us in the same period and for the same reasons.

 

If the traditions, such as the dress code are being dumbed down to suit the mob that think cutting the front off a baseball hat and sewing it on the back makes them cool, then the risk becomes a choice of losing loyal customers who are not afraid to spend in favour of low spending ill mannered party animals who couldn’t even spell etiquette.

 

Unless a gentleman is a serving member of the armed forces and engaged in an official ceremony, there are no circumstances that a hat should ever be worn indoors, let alone a dinner table,

 

Two years ago at the World Club cocktail party on a Gala night we saw this clown (because that’s exactly what he looked like) wearing a brightly checked 3 piece suit with a matching trilby hat. From where do they get their ideas?

 

More recently on our 1 November trip, there was a chap in the Grill lounge with no jacket and no tie with his cuffs half rolled up his forearm. He really did look as if he was about to do the washing up.

 

If the traditions start disappearing then so will we.

 

[majortom10]

13 hours ago, elmsliebev said:

 

 

I've only once experienced rampant snobbery on a Cunard cruise and that was from an older couple we shared a table with at afternoon tea on a QM2 TA - and they were the worst-dressed people I'd ever seen on any cruise!

Funny the worst case of snobbery was our first ever cruise also a TA from New York to Southampton on the QE2 and that was also during afternoon tea in the Queens Room. The gentleman asked what I did for a living and when I told him I was a firefighter he said "oh an officer" and I said no a firefighter and he called a waiter over to carry his teacup and plate and walked off to another table with his wife following very embarrassed like a lapdog. I had never encountered anything like this before and it did make me wonder if this was the norm on cruising and whether I should cruise again thankfully 24yrs later it didnt and have never encountered anything like that since. 

[PORT ROYAL]

4 minutes ago, BigMac1953 said:

A few interesting points have been raised in this thread.

 

Personally, I’m a firm believer in keeping traditions alive. The UK is world famous for our traditions. Our armed forces are the envy of every other nation when it comes to ceremonial events, many of which have been performed for centuries, such as Trooping the Colour and the ceremony of the Keys at the Tower.

 

Same with the Royal Navy. What other country gives an order (from the Queen) to “splice the mainbrace”.

 

Sadly with the reorganisation of the army and the demise of some regiments some traditions will be lost.

 

Tradition, more than anything else, was our biggest reason for travelling with Cunard for the last 14 years and spending north of £300K. I’m sure we are not alone, just as I’m sure there are many more people that have spent much more than us in the same period and for the same reasons.

 

If the traditions, such as the dress code are being dumbed down to suit the mob that think cutting the front off a baseball hat and sewing it on the back makes them cool, then the risk becomes a choice of losing loyal customers who are not afraid to spend in favour of low spending ill mannered party animals who couldn’t even spell etiquette.

 

Unless a gentleman is a serving member of the armed forces and engaged in an official ceremony, there are no circumstances that a hat should ever be worn indoors, let alone a dinner table,

 

Two years ago at the World Club cocktail party on a Gala night we saw this clown (because that’s exactly what he looked like) wearing a brightly checked 3 piece suit with a matching trilby hat. From where do they get their ideas?

 

More recently on our 1 November trip, there was a chap in the Grill lounge with no jacket and no tie with his cuffs half rolled up his forearm. He really did look as if he was about to do the washing up.

 

If the traditions start disappearing then so will we.

 

Well said and eloquently put.

 

[Victoria2]

A question.

For those who might be forsaking Cunard in the future and wish to continue cruising, which line will they decamp to?

[Victoria2]

38 minutes ago, BigMac1953 said:

A few interesting points have been raised in this thread.

 

Personally, I’m a firm believer in keeping traditions alive. The UK is world famous for our traditions. Our armed forces are the envy of every other nation when it comes to ceremonial events, many of which have been performed for centuries, such as Trooping the Colour and the ceremony of the Keys at the Tower.

 

Same with the Royal Navy. What other country gives an order (from the Queen) to “splice the mainbrace”.

 

Sadly with the reorganisation of the army and the demise of some regiments some traditions will be lost.

 

Tradition, more than anything else, was our biggest reason for travelling with Cunard for the last 14 years and spending north of £300K. I’m sure we are not alone, just as I’m sure there are many more people that have spent much more than us in the same period and for the same reasons.

 

If the traditions, such as the dress code are being dumbed down to suit the mob that think cutting the front off a baseball hat and sewing it on the back makes them cool, then the risk becomes a choice of losing loyal customers who are not afraid to spend in favour of low spending ill mannered party animals who couldn’t even spell etiquette.

 

Unless a gentleman is a serving member of the armed forces and engaged in an official ceremony, there are no circumstances that a hat should ever be worn indoors, let alone a dinner table,

 

Two years ago at the World Club cocktail party on a Gala night we saw this clown (because that’s exactly what he looked like) wearing a brightly checked 3 piece suit with a matching trilby hat. From where do they get their ideas?

 

More recently on our 1 November trip, there was a chap in the Grill lounge with no jacket and no tie with his cuffs half rolled up his forearm. He really did look as if he was about to do the washing up.

 

If the traditions start disappearing then so will we.

 

We have seen a few similar exotic outfits worn on Formal and Gala evenings, usually on World Cruise segments.

Apart from the clothes being rather 'different' and were something which required a certain panache in the wearer, after the initial 'what?', we didn't think they detracted from  the ambiance. Different and definitely, a statement. 

[Windsurfboy]

Had dinner last night in one of my favourite restaurants, by the beach , 80 miles north of cape town. South Africa  must compete with , Australia ,New Zealand, USA for most casual dress in world. Guess what food tasted just as nice and friends company just as good . So get over dress code hang ups. 

 

I follow the dress code , like wearing my DJ , but won't cut off nose to spite face.

[Victoria2]

3 minutes ago, Victoria2 said:

 

 

 

duplicate 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Victoria2

[elmsliebev]

2 hours ago, majortom10 said:

Funny the worst case of snobbery was our first ever cruise also a TA from New York to Southampton on the QE2 and that was also during afternoon tea in the Queens Room. The gentleman asked what I did for a living and when I told him I was a firefighter he said "oh an officer" and I said no a firefighter and he called a waiter over to carry his teacup and plate and walked off to another table with his wife following very embarrassed like a lapdog. I had never encountered anything like this before and it did make me wonder if this was the norm on cruising and whether I should cruise again thankfully 24yrs later it didnt and have never encountered anything like that since. 

oh majortom, that's awful. What a horrible man and I feel for his poor wife. Glad it didn't put you off. 

[Julian88]

My first trip on QM2 was several years ago, and like the original poster intends, I took the casual option, dinner in Kings Court, etc.  I loved it.  I also discovered a cohort who were on the ship primarily for transportation (a crossing).  They did not bring formal wear.  The appeal of Cunard to me is the sea and the ship, both majestic and glorious.  But I did find the evening activities appealing, so the next year I brought a suit and a tuxedo, which added an extra dimension for me which I enjoyed.  I suspect many people who first go as casual progress in a similar way.  Also, sunset on Deck 7, dressed in formal wear, is a special experience.

 

But I still enjoy a "night off," buffet dinner, a drink in the winter garden (Carinthia lounge), relaxing in the suite.

 

The one part of the current dress code keeping me from booking is ... masks.

[naturelovergirl]

Cunard is such a beautiful and special experience because it is different from other lines… and part of that difference is the expectation of a dress code.

If Cunard chooses to homogenize and lose their uniqueness, then they will have truly lost something quite lovely…

So many cruise lines and ships to choose from… why not have a line which cherishes the traditions and beauty of classic cruising?

[Victoria2]

19 minutes ago, kohl1957 said:

So here's the deal... Cunard dumbs down the dress code. And some here think it's swell, others don't.  But can we at least agree Cunard should, at least be honest.... and get rid of the 46 big photos on every surface of their ships  showing elegantly dressed Cunard passengers in elegant surroundings aboard QUEEN MARY (36) or QUEEN ELIZABETH (40)??? Who are they kidding?  For many, it must be very off putting, for others, it's completely contrary to the direction the line is taking.  Cunard trades on its past (and boy do they ever) but believes its future is.... Carnival's Fun Ships.  It's "well I had caviar but now I think a Big Mac will do nicely."

I have been saying this for years. The brochures give an aspirational idea and not a true representation of the general dress onboard. Of course there are fabulous gowns worn by a very few, who have the figure to wear them,  the rest do their best. 

 

We were on Victoria Sept'19 when Cunard were filming/taking photographs for future publications. I complimented one model on her dress as it was absolutely to die for.

Her comment was 'This? it came from wardrobe'!

All the clothes came from 'wardrobe'. 

So I agree the brochures are misleading, but then most of the mid to upmarket cruise lines are selling a product which whilst glamorous in parts, is just that, in parts. The ordinary person like myself will fit very nicely,  without the glamour.

[Victoria2]

25 minutes ago, kohl1957 said:

Well.. small world... my wife and I were on the very same cruise!!

 

It was.. well amusing to see the nonsense. Like the lobsters for "afternoon tea" on deck.  And, vaguely insulting, the white "bellboy"model (who had to have his trousers pinned) instead of a real bellboy from the ship, all of whom are Asian.  With a backdrop of the container port of La Spezia which we were advised would just be Photoshopped out!

 

All of the "stuff" they brought was stored in a cabin right down the passageway from our PG cabin. But at least I found someone who brings more hats on a cruise than I do.

I do remember it was a hot day and some of the shade on deck 12 was cordoned off, as was part of deck 11. I assumed the triple seafood tier was plastic.

 

Bit like the 'models' and the clothes they wore.😄

 

Aspirational dressing at its best.

Edited December 2, 2021 by Victoria2

[Windsurfboy]

all advertising is aspirational and just enough truth to pass ASA. Cunard is no different.  

 

Let's just enjoy our cruises, 

 

Remember dress is superficial,  it's manners and consideration that count.