Another Problem for Canadian Cruisers

[1kaper]

11 minutes ago, AlbertaCruisers said:

 

I would be surprised if it wasn't PCR.  It seems like all the tests they are doing at the airport are PCR and it is my understanding that PCR is more accurate (I looked up the current take home tests people are randomly getting and you have to arrange for a courier to pick it up).  Also, when the Health Minister was talking about this process, he said they cannot guarantee how quick results would come back, and it could take up to 3 days, so that sounds like PCR to me.

Someone had posted this:

 

Clarification on travelers with connecting flights clarified by the Health Minister:

 

Travellers coming from non-U.S. foreign destinations need an arrival test
Once a fully vaccinated passenger arrives at a Canadian airport from a non-U.S. foreign destination, they will either be swabbed by a public health nurse or get a take-home test.

That traveller must then self-isolate at home or at their designated quarantine destination (such as a hotel) while they await the results of the test. It may take up to three days to get a result.

If that traveller gets a negative result, they're free to leave self-isolation and move about as they normally would. If the test is positive, they must stay in quarantine for 14 days.

If a passenger has a connecting flight, they get swabbed or collect a take-home test and then continue on to their final destination.

If, for example, an inbound passenger from Hong Kong arrives in Vancouver to catch a connecting flight to Kelowna, B.C., that traveller would get tested or pick up their at-home test in Vancouver before proceeding to the connecting flight. That passenger would then have to self-isolate in Kelowna while they await the results of the test.

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/arrival-testing-regime-explainer-1.6272919

I assumed since they said it usually takes a day but could take up to 72 hours to get your test back that it was a PCR test. They specifically say you may have to quarantine up to 72 hours. 

 

(I am agreeing with you)

Edited December 7, 2021 by 1kaper
clarification

[DHP1]

5 minutes ago, 1kaper said:

I assumed since they said it usually takes a day but could take up to 72 hours to get your test back that it was a PCR test. They specifically say you may have to quarantine up to 72 hours. 

 

(I am agreeing with you)

Quarantine at home, I’m assuming. 

[If only]

When we arrived back the end of Nov & went through customs Nexus line myDh was told he had been chosen to get another PCR test which was quite busy but actually only took 15 min.   It took 3 days to get results.  They still randomly check anyone they want even though he had a PCR test the day before on a cruise ship.  You cannot escape it or take off sticker as there were lots of Police there too.

Edited December 7, 2021 by If only

[1kaper]

18 minutes ago, DHP1 said:

Quarantine at home, I’m assuming. 

Me too.  Although when I travel, landing at the airport and being home is a difference of about 4 hours.  I wonder if I have to quarantine in my final airport location or if I can drive home. 

[AlbertaCruisers]

25 minutes ago, DHP1 said:

Quarantine at home, I’m assuming. 

 

The wording on the Canadian website says the below, so yes, it looks like you can quarantine at home.

 

Coming soon: Fully vaccinated travellers arriving by air or land, who have been in any country other than Canada and the United States in the 14 days prior to entry to Canada, will all be subject to arrival testing and enhanced public health measures. Travellers arriving by air may take connecting flights to their place of quarantine.

[nickiford]

If they do hand you a take home test when you come across the border I feel like that will take even longer to get the results because you will have to wait until you get home to do the test, then figure out a way to send it back while quarantining and then wait for the results!  

 

[gnome12]

1 minute ago, nickiford said:

If they do hand you a take home test when you come across the border I feel like that will take even longer to get the results because you will have to wait until you get home to do the test, then figure out a way to send it back while quarantining and then wait for the results!  

 

True.

[AlbertaCruisers]

10 minutes ago, nickiford said:

If they do hand you a take home test when you come across the border I feel like that will take even longer to get the results because you will have to wait until you get home to do the test, then figure out a way to send it back while quarantining and then wait for the results!  

 

 

Agreed! I'm hoping that if this counts for cruisers, when we come back on Jan 4 that we get the test in the airport.  I understand the airports are pushing for lots of at home tests though as they don't have the people or facilities to do all the testing the government wants.  From what I read about the current at home tests, you call to have someone assist in doing the test (maybe watch you do it, but I'm not sure) and they made it sound like they would help you to arrange for a courier to come and pick it up.

[Fouremco]

6 hours ago, nickiford said:

This issue is that when you go on a cruise you are in other countries, although I would argue that if you don't get off the ship in a foreign country have you really been there??  The on arrival test requirement is for anyone who has been in a country other than the US or Canada in the last 14 days.  My ship goes to Bahamas, Puerto Rico, St Thomas and Labadee (which I'm sure will be sustituted), if we only get off in Puerto Rico you could argue that we never left the US.

 

6 hours ago, Forecheck said:

CBP is not going to buy some of your stories ... If you go on a Cruise to the Caribbean then you have left the United States and are deemed an International Traveler ... It doesn't matter your mode of transportation of getting to the Country ( Boat - Plane - etc   ) . It also doesn't matter if you got off the ship or not in those Countries.

 

Be honest with the CBP agents and you are less likely to have issues - The rules are the Rules and no one deserves special treatment - Deal with it !    

If you fly into a country and remain in the secure zone to make a connecting flight out of that country, you are deemed not to have visited it. On the other hand, if your connecting flight is several hours later and you are processed by customs/immigration, you are deemed to have visited it, even if you were to remain in the airport.

 

With a cruise, the passenger manifest including all passport, visa or other pertinent information is provided to the country's immigration offices for processing. To simplify the administrative burden, all passengers are assumed to have debarked the ship and entered the country. And if CBSA was to contact its counterpart in the country in question to determine whether you had visited, the response would be "yes".

 

Bottom line: simply list all the countries that your cruise ship visited in the previous 14 days as required by the ArriveCAN app. 

 

6 hours ago, DHP1 said:

If you get off the ship no one will never know because you don’t have to show your Passport. 

Your passport details are provided to the immigration authorities of the country visited.

[Fouremco]

3 hours ago, DHP1 said:

Agreed. But how would they know if you got off the book.  Passport is not required in some countries the cruise line visit 

I'm stumped. What foreign countries do cruise lines visit that do not require a Canadian citizen to possess a valid passport? 

[DHP1]

Just now, Fouremco said:

I'm stumped. What foreign countries do cruise lines visit that do not require a Canadian citizen to possess a valid passport? 

You made a good point on how the cruise line accept your Passport information at check in.  Never thought of that. Your good😀

[Fouremco]

17 hours ago, Lizzzys said:

So do you think this will include those of us who have been to the Caribbean islands on a cruise as well?

Their stated intent is to test everyone who has visited a country other than the US in the preceding 14 days. There have been no exclusions indicated for either the Caribbean of cruising, so the answer is "yes", unless they reconsider.

[Magicat]

4 hours ago, nickiford said:

If they do hand you a take home test when you come across the border I feel like that will take even longer to get the results because you will have to wait until you get home to do the test, then figure out a way to send it back while quarantining and then wait for the results!  

 

When we returned to Canada this past summer and had to do the mandatory quarantine at home and the day 8 test.  We did it on line with someone watching and then left it out in the morning for someone to pick up.  My wife got her negative result in about 3 days.  I have yet to receive that test and it was done back in June. LOL

Edited December 8, 2021 by Magicat

[#55worktoplay]

3 hours ago, Fouremco said:

 

If you fly into a country and remain in the secure zone to make a connecting flight out of that country, you are deemed not to have visited it. On the other hand, if your connecting flight is several hours later and you are processed by customs/immigration, you are deemed to have visited it, even if you were to remain in the airport.

 

With a cruise, the passenger manifest including all passport, visa or other pertinent information is provided to the country's immigration offices for processing. To simplify the administrative burden, all passengers are assumed to have debarked the ship and entered the country. And if CBSA was to contact its counterpart in the country in question to determine whether you had visited, the response would be "yes".

 

Bottom line: simply list all the countries that your cruise ship visited in the previous 14 days as required by the ArriveCAN app. 

 

Your passport details are provided to the immigration authorities of the country visited.

I have been reading and reading and biting my tongue because I figured someone will have answered prior to me getting to the bottom. 
 

YES, this is the correct answer, 100% correct. Ding ding ding. 
 

[K_e_short]

9 minutes ago, #55worktoplay said:

I have been reading and reading and biting my tongue because I figured someone will have answered prior to me getting to the bottom. 
 

YES, this is the correct answer, 100% correct. Ding ding ding. 
 

 

I have been re reading this forum, Air Canada's website, ArriveCan app, and the Government website.

 

Yep. We will all have issues travelling back after a cruise.

 

I take back what I said before.

 

One section says "flying from a country other then Canada and the U.S." and another section says "Coming soon: Fully vaccinated travellers arriving by air or land, who have been in any country other than Canada and the United States in the 14 days prior to entry to Canada, will all be subject to arrival testing and enhanced public health measures. 

 

I was even thinking "what if I don't get off the cruise ship?"

[nickiford]

I understand that you are deemed to have visited that country if the ship ports there but really in terms of the point of the test and the Covid risk if you don’t get off the ship you haven’t been “in” that country.  I will list the countries and do whatever is required but I hope that everyone that is driving across and back for a cruise sooner than me has some clarity of what will be required before they go,  I have until mid Feb to get a game plan sorted.

[son3cruisers]

24 minutes ago, K_e_short said:

.

 

One section says "flying from a country other then Canada and the U.S." and another section says "Coming soon: Fully vaccinated travellers arriving by air or land, who have been in any country other than Canada and the United States in the 14 days prior to entry to Canada, will all be subject to arrival testing and enhanced public health measures. 

 

oops. Double post

 

Edited December 8, 2021 by son3cruisers

[K_e_short]

24 minutes ago, nickiford said:

I understand that you are deemed to have visited that country if the ship ports there but really in terms of the point of the test and the Covid risk if you don’t get off the ship you haven’t been “in” that country.  I will list the countries and do whatever is required but I hope that everyone that is driving across and back for a cruise sooner than me has some clarity of what will be required before they go,  I have until mid Feb to get a game plan sorted.

 

I'm flying home on January 2nd.

 

Is anyone flying home earlier and can report back?

 

Obviously those that have already come home don't count as the changes are still in the process of being finalized.

[broberts]

1 hour ago, nickiford said:

I understand that you are deemed to have visited that country if the ship ports there but really in terms of the point of the test and the Covid risk if you don’t get off the ship you haven’t been “in” that country.  I will list the countries and do whatever is required but I hope that everyone that is driving across and back for a cruise sooner than me has some clarity of what will be required before they go,  I have until mid Feb to get a game plan sorted.

 

While you may not go ashore, it's almost certain that you will interact with passengers and staff that have.

 

I don't think the point of testing arrivals is to keep out infections. I'm somewhat doubtful that it is intended to reduce spread. (If it was then why allow people to board a connecting flight before quarantine.) The cynic in me suspects it's to give the impression that something is being done. The optimist believes public health authorities are taking the opportunity to do better variant tracking.

[powderhorn]

This is a great discussion thread to highlight all the potential scenarios and issues we will be dealing with should we decide to go cruising. Seems to me that a go - no go decision should be made based on perhaps a best case scenario (zip through all this with no hassles), probabilty percentage of this happening assuming all documentation is in order, versus a worse case scenario (quarantine, missing test results, etc), risks and probability of that happening. Compare the scenarios, look for plan Bs to deal with risks, etc.  sounds like a good approach....has anyone written down such an analysis, and if so, could they share it?.....:-)

[wendycook22]

11 hours ago, K_e_short said:

 

I'm flying home on January 2nd.

 

Is anyone flying home earlier and can report back?

 

Obviously those that have already come home don't count as the changes are still in the process of being finalized.

I fly out Friday, and will be returning on the 17th and will report back what protocols and process we received on arrival.  

[1kaper]

11 hours ago, broberts said:

 

While you may not go ashore, it's almost certain that you will interact with passengers and staff that have.

 

I don't think the point of testing arrivals is to keep out infections. I'm somewhat doubtful that it is intended to reduce spread. (If it was then why allow people to board a connecting flight before quarantine.) The cynic in me suspects it's to give the impression that something is being done. The optimist believes public health authorities are taking the opportunity to do better variant tracking.

I am sorry if this pops up twice.  The website is very difficult for me to post on now.  I even tried another browser. 

This is a good point.  I would also argue that it is just easier to treat everyone returning from a  cruise as if they had gotten off the ship.  The majority of people do leave the ship.  And, as noted in this thread, it may be difficult to confirm if someone left the ship or not.  
So from an enforcement standpoint, it would be easier to treat everyone on the cruise as if they left the ship as opposed to trying to verify or taking someone at their word. 

[nickiford]

They have changed the language again on the Govt website, they have eliminated saying just those arriving by land and sea and now it says "if selected" for the test will need to quarantine until they get the results.  It will take them some weeks I imagine for this to apply to all people.

 

 

[tert333]

36 minutes ago, nickiford said:

They have changed the language again on the Govt website, they have eliminated saying just those arriving by land and sea and now it says "if selected" for the test will need to quarantine until they get the results.  It will take them some weeks I imagine for this to apply to all people.

 

 

Good catch!

 

That is probably because they can not handle the volume, so have this wording to give them the flexibility.

[K_e_short]

Thanks for posting that. I was just reading the website last night and it has changed, again.

 

So shall we make bets on whether they will ramp up to 100% by January 2nd?