Fuel surcharge

[Arizona Wildcat]

At what point does Celebrity add a fuel surcharge?  There were a bunch of surcharges in 2008.  The contract gives the right to charge up to $10 per day for new and existing bookings.

Thoughts?

Edited March 7, 2022 by Arizona Wildcat

[Algebralovr]

No one knows.  They have it listed as an option on their paperwork, but have not really added it in the past.

[WestLakeGirl]

 

[PTC DAWG]

50 minutes ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

At what point does Celebrity add a fuel surcharge?  There were a bunch of surcharges in 2008.  The contract gives the right to charge up to $10 per day for new and existing bookings.

Thoughts?

If $10 a night gave me pause, I would stay home. 

[Virginia100]

At. $130 a bbl I would expect it any minute now. $10 a day? Chump change and I can see why.

[LadySpoilt]

8 hours ago, Virginia100 said:

At. $130 a bbl I would expect it any minute now. $10 a day? Chump change and I can see why.

 I absolutely remember getting hit with it.  As a younger couple with 2 small kids at the time an extra 4 x 10 x 7=  $280.00 wasn't chump change and 25 or 30 years ago that amount stung! (I actually don't recall if it was 10 pp per day or how it was calculated...but it still stung). At the time I recall we  were on one of the first cruises that got hit with the fuel surcharge and found out about it just a couple weeks before the cruise.

 

Edited March 7, 2022 by LadySpoilt

[mfs2k]

Nobody likes unexpected surcharges and it definitely hits some people harder than others. I think we can all agree fuel costs are skyrocketing and cruise lines will only be able to absorb so much. But we all hope we won’t be the ones to pay. 

[wrk2cruise]

They hedge their fuel so it won't affect them until some time in the future (6 months?).  Hopefully things normalize before that time.

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, wrk2cruise said:

They hedge their fuel so it won't affect them until some time in the future (6 months?).  Hopefully things normalize before that time.

Yeah….this won’t be a “thing” for several months, if then.  By then, the oil markets will have leveled out.

[NutsAboutGolf]

12 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

At what point does Celebrity add a fuel surcharge?  There were a bunch of surcharges in 2008.  The contract gives the right to charge up to $10 per day for new and existing bookings.

Thoughts?

 

False.  They went to court over this last decade, if they're going to charge you a surcharge they have to charge at the time of booking.  From X's T&Cs:

 

"We reserve the right to include a fuel supplement when making a booking. The value of the supplement will be confirmed to you at the time of making a booking with us. Please note, if you are taking consecutive cruises there may be some duplication with regard to onboard programmes, meals and entertainment.  We reserve the right to make a fuel surcharge when making a booking, to reflect the cost of fuel or other power sources. We may also increase prices to reflect changes in relevant taxes, fees or foreign exchange rates."

 

https://www.celebritycruises.com/ie/booking-conditions

[leaveitallbehind]

2 hours ago, wrk2cruise said:

They hedge their fuel so it won't affect them until some time in the future (6 months?).  Hopefully things normalize before that time.

Except if they are currently negotiating their next future pricing, or over the next month or two.  At some point it likely would catch up.  It all depends on when the current hedge expires.

[grandgeezer]

1 hour ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

False.  They went to court over this last decade, if they're going to charge you a surcharge they have to charge at the time of booking.  From X's T&Cs:

 

"We reserve the right to include a fuel supplement when making a booking. The value of the supplement will be confirmed to you at the time of making a booking with us. Please note, if you are taking consecutive cruises there may be some duplication with regard to onboard programmes, meals and entertainment.  We reserve the right to make a fuel surcharge when making a booking, to reflect the cost of fuel or other power sources. We may also increase prices to reflect changes in relevant taxes, fees or foreign exchange rates."

 

https://www.celebritycruises.com/ie/booking-conditions

The terms and conditions state that the price is locked in only if final payment has been made. If not, you will be contacted, in writing, telling you what your options are and the date your response must be submitted by. If you don’t reply by then it will mean you accept it and will pay it.

[dkjretired]

7 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

The terms and conditions state that the price is locked in only if final payment has been made. If not, you will be contacted, in writing, telling you what your options are and the date your response must be submitted by. If you don’t reply by then it will mean you accept it and will pay it.

My understanding from years ago is that under that settlement they can charge you at any time up to final payment as long as it is in the contract when you book. Obviously, it has been in the contract since then.

[grandgeezer]

3 hours ago, wrk2cruise said:

They hedge their fuel so it won't affect them until some time in the future (6 months?).  Hopefully things normalize before that time.

Hedging doesn’t mean you lock in the pricing you are paying now. The negotiations are based on what the seller thinks the pricing will be at the time the buyer wants it. There might even a clause written in saying that the deal is void if the actual price at the time of purchase is a certain percentage over/under the agreed upon price. That protects both sides. The cruise contract only states there will be a surcharge if the price of oil goes up, there’s nothing that gives the cruise customer a break if it goes down??

[NutsAboutGolf]

13 minutes ago, grandgeezer said:

The terms and conditions state that the price is locked in only if final payment has been made. If not, you will be contacted, in writing, telling you what your options are and the date your response must be submitted by. If you don’t reply by then it will mean you accept it and will pay it.

 

4 minutes ago, dkjretired said:

My understanding from years ago is that under that settlement they can charge you at any time up to final payment as long as it is in the contract when you book. Obviously, it has been in the contract since then.

 

Seems like X's general website T&C and their cruise contract differ, this was in my cruise contract sent four days ago:

 

[dkjretired]

4 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

 

Seems like X's general website T&C and their cruise contract differ, this was in my cruise contract sent four days ago:

 

I’m only going by my memory but do remember what I posted as a CYA.

[kearney]

16 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

At what point does Celebrity add a fuel surcharge?  There were a bunch of surcharges in 2008.  The contract gives the right to charge up to $10 per day for new and existing bookings.

Thoughts?

Is that $10/day per person?

[sydbarrett]

Interesting, this also says it would be charged at the time of booking:

 

https://www.celebritycruises.com/ie/booking-conditions

 

I'm travelling with someone who is on a TIGHT budget so an increase in fare is going to be a big deal. Or more likely, I'll have to absorb. lol

[NutsAboutGolf]

3 minutes ago, sydbarrett said:

Interesting, this also says it would be charged at the time of booking:

 

https://www.celebritycruises.com/ie/booking-conditions

 

I'm travelling with someone who is on a TIGHT budget so an increase in fare is going to be a big deal. Or more likely, I'll have to absorb. lol

 

Your cruise contract is far more legally binding and states they can change you after final payment on existing bookings.

[sydbarrett]

2 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

 

Your cruise contract is far more legally binding and states they can change you after final payment on existing bookings.

Oh yes, you're right! I didn't even notice that I had a contract, but it does say fuel supplement can be charged for existing bookings even if already paid in full. 

[NutsAboutGolf]

6 minutes ago, sydbarrett said:

Oh yes, you're right! I didn't even notice that I had a contract, but it does say fuel supplement can be charged for existing bookings even if already paid in full. 

 

I thought the same, that will teach us for assuming Celebrity's website T&Cs are accurate and up to date.

[davekathy]

Shhh!!! 🤫

[DirtyDawg]

From Royal's press release on Feb. 4th regarding 2021 results;

"Fuel Expense

Bunker pricing net of hedging for the fourth quarter was $549 per metric ton and consumption was 303,000 metric tons.

As of December 31, 2021, the company had hedged approximately 54% and 15% of its total projected metric tons of fuel consumption for all of 2022 and 2023, respectively. For all of 2022 and 2023, the annual average cost per metric ton of the fuel swap portfolio is approximately $490, and $515, respectively. 

Based on current fuel prices, the company expects approximately $206 million of fuel expense in its first quarter 2022 at an average pricing of $615 per metric ton net of hedging."

 

I am not sure about RCL's fuel mix but the Global average bunker spot price was over $900 per metric ton last Friday, up from $654 at the start of the year. RCL's hedges are mostly swaps so, with my understanding of interest rate and currency swaps, is that the counterparties are locked-in. I'm sure the new hedging positions RCL are putting on for late 2022 and 2023 will be at higher prices than their current ones. How much more? Time will tell. 

 

Edited March 7, 2022 by DirtyDawg

[TeeRick]

18 hours ago, Arizona Wildcat said:

At what point does Celebrity add a fuel surcharge?  There were a bunch of surcharges in 2008.  The contract gives the right to charge up to $10 per day for new and existing bookings.

Thoughts?

There was a previous thread on this topic too.

 

 

[NutsAboutGolf]

18 minutes ago, TeeRick said:

There was a previous thread on this topic too.

 

 

 

Now if only these will be the last new fuel surcharge threads...lol