Westerdam = Testerdam

[CafeBruno]

I want to pass on some information that might be of interest. We are currently on the Westerdam. I was looking over the Pinnacle Grill menu before our dinner there, and it showed that now, an extra charge of $7 would be charged for a 2^nd starter (appetizer or salad). I submitted a comment in the Navigator app, expressing my displeasure, in the “Let us know” comment part of the app. That night, as we sat down in the Pinnacle for dinner, the manager she searched us out and said she saw  our comments in the app, and was very apologetic, and comped our 2^nd starter (i.e. crab cakes and salad). She said the reaction has been very negative to this change, and encouraged us to let others know that we need to pass on our displeasure to the HAL brass thru the Navigator app or in emails to HAL corporate.

 

She told me that the $7 extra appetizer charge is a test, mandated by the suits in Seattle HQ. She said the Westerdam is used to test out potential changes before they are rolled out to the entire fleet, and that the staff sometimes call the Westerdam the Testerdam, because of these experiments. She said the other main Testerdam experiment is the Have It All and More, where those on the Have It All package can order drinks over $11, and only be charged the excess.

So I hope others will let HAL know the 2^nd appetizer charge, on top of the Pinnacle cover charge, really cheapens HAL’s image and should NOT be adopted fleet wide.

 

I love the new Have It All and More change however, and I think this will result in additional revenue (however small) for people like me ordering more expensive drinks that we would not have otherwise ordered.

[oakridger]

Thank you for this timely information!

 

~Nancy

[doone]

Thanks, good to know.

[MISTER 67]

Sometimes I wonder was goes on with the minds of the bean counters with HAL. Remember when they decided to charge for a second entree in the MDR, that went over like a lead balloon.

[CruiserBruce]

 

[Hlitner]

2 hours ago, MISTER 67 said:

Sometimes I wonder was goes on with the minds of the bean counters with HAL. Remember when they decided to charge for a second entree in the MDR, that went over like a lead balloon.

I think you answered your own question in that they are simply “bean counters.”  For whatever reason they seem to have the goal f turning HAL into a budget cruise line where nickel and dimming has become the norm.

[Mary229]

We were told the same thing but the charge never appeared on our statement 

Zuiderdam, this week

[BetsyS.]

10 hours ago, CafeBruno said:

I want to pass on some information that might be of interest. We are currently on the Westerdam. I was looking over the Pinnacle Grill menu before our dinner there, and it showed that now, an extra charge of $7 would be charged for a 2^nd starter (appetizer or salad). I submitted a comment in the Navigator app, expressing my displeasure, in the “Let us know” comment part of the app. That night, as we sat down in the Pinnacle for dinner, the manager she searched us out and said she saw  our comments in the app, and was very apologetic, and comped our 2^nd starter (i.e. crab cakes and salad). She said the reaction has been very negative to this change, and encouraged us to let others know that we need to pass on our displeasure to the HAL brass thru the Navigator app or in emails to HAL corporate.

 

She told me that the $7 extra appetizer charge is a test, mandated by the suits in Seattle HQ. She said the Westerdam is used to test out potential changes before they are rolled out to the entire fleet, and that the staff sometimes call the Westerdam the Testerdam, because of these experiments. She said the other main Testerdam experiment is the Have It All and More, where those on the Have It All package can order drinks over $11, and only be charged the excess.

So I hope others will let HAL know the 2^nd appetizer charge, on top of the Pinnacle cover charge, really cheapens HAL’s image and should NOT be adopted fleet wide.

 

I love the new Have It All and More change however, and I think this will result in additional revenue (however small) for people like me ordering more expensive drinks that we would not have otherwise ordered.

Have the "suits" in Seattle HQ ever been on a cruise ship?

[Wakepatrol]

My money says the up charges stay

[Loreto]

We were on the Westerdam in June and they hadn't implemented it yet.  We like to order a clothesline bacon to share and then get another appetizer.  I guess we could share that too!

[Florida_gal_50]

5 hours ago, Mary229 said:

We were told the same thing but the charge never appeared on our statement 

Zuiderdam, this week

And yet when anyone suggested that on the other thread people got uptight and said it was only on one ship.  So much for that theory.  Hopefully it will go down in flames.

[AncientWanderer]

2 hours ago, Wakepatrol said:

My money says the up charges stay

 

I also think that in some way the upcharges will be incorporated into the menu, but I seriously doubt it'll work out the way they are doing it, with so many courses -- soup, salad and starter -- lumped together under "appetizers."  It just makes no sense.

Somebody on the other thread mentioned health reasons for not ordering an entree. I also often skip the big protein item and order more of the other things because I restrict protein in my diet.  We and probably others will be negotiating with the waiters to trade this for that and avoid the charge.  That's just takes too much time and effort for the wait staff to sort out. 

 

In short, I'm not worried about this new "test."  It's lame and I think it will fail.

[St Pete Cruiser]

Agree, this is a bad idea.  The appetizers are often the best part of our Pinnacle dinners.

 

My first cruise on the Westerdam was January 2016, when they first had the electronic pads for servers to take orders on.  I was surprised then, to find out that the Westy was their test ship for that as well. Seems they need good wifi to connect, and as most of us know, good wifi is not always possible at sea.

[rkacruiser]

10 hours ago, BetsyS. said:

Have the "suits" in Seattle HQ ever been on a cruise ship?

 

I seriously doubt it.  In the post Lanterman-Kruse era, the "suits" have been responsible for the inconsistency of experiences from ship to ship, the micro-management that I KNOW for a fact that has/is taking place, and the deterioration of the HAL cruise experience in some ways.  There was one particular "suit" who reigned supreme for decades who was responsible for entertainment.  Entertainment went South!  Maybe, by now, he has retired, because there does seem to be some glimmers of new entertainment that is worthy of HAL.  

[Florida_gal_50]

For those that order 2 appetizers rather than a main I think it would be totally shady for hal to charge.  After all the appetizers would be cheaper than the main I would think.

[Wakepatrol]

Micro managing, bean counters whatever you call them . They collect Data all day, how many people are eating in the  dining room, how many bought liquor, how many gambled, how many bought excursions, how many went to Tamarind, Canaletto, and Pinnacle. Somewhere in there was probably how many appetizers were ordered at Pinnacle. It perhaps was excessive they were losing money, so now there’s an upcharge. This just eating appetizers is odd. Do people go to Ruth Chris at home and just order potatoes au gratin and creamed spinach for dinner?

[rkacruiser]

29 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

After all the appetizers would be cheaper than the main I would think.

 

Agree.  But, someone who would order multiple dishes of Escargot (if they are offered) or Manchego Cheese and Cantaloupe (if it is offered), the bottom line cost might exceed the cost of an entree.  

[rkacruiser]

2 minutes ago, Wakepatrol said:

Do people go to Ruth Chris at home and just order potatoes au gratin and creamed spinach for dinner?

 

No.  But, when I am a patron of Fleming's, I will order Fleming Potatoes and Caesar Salad with no intention of consuming all of these in the restaurant.  

[Florida_gal_50]

20 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Agree.  But, someone who would order multiple dishes of Escargot (if they are offered) or Manchego Cheese and Cantaloupe (if it is offered), the bottom line cost might exceed the cost of an entree.  

True.

[fatcat04]

23 hours ago, CafeBruno said:

She told me that the $7 extra appetizer charge is a test, mandated by the suits in Seattle HQ. She said the Westerdam is used to test out potential changes before they are rolled out to the entire fleet, and that the staff sometimes call the Westerdam the Testerdam, because of these experiments. She said the other main Testerdam experiment is the Have It All and More, where those on the Have It All package can order drinks over $11, and only be charged the excess.

So I hope others will let HAL know the 2^nd appetizer charge, on top of the Pinnacle cover charge, really cheapens HAL’s image and should NOT be adopted fleet wide.

 

I love the new Have It All and More change however, and I think this will result in additional revenue (however small) for people like me ordering more expensive drinks that we would not have otherwise ordered.

Show of hands who had not figured that out. (yep, none, I thought so) The suits... who may or may have never even been on a cruise ship.. need to study their market a heck of a lot better. I would sooner the cost of the specialties be raised AND the QUALITY be maintained with the unlimited starter options etc than this nickely dimey stuff. Who likes that? Interesting info about the Westerdam/Testerdam though. I love the "Have It All and More" drink package excess upcharge for drinks over the pkg $$ limit though. I would so do that for wines.  Makes it easier for me to give them more of my money.. which should be the Cardinal rule of all retail and service industry businesses. Thanks for the heads up! I will send them my thoughts. 

[julia]

This silly crap is yet another example of "those who ruin it for all".  Think about it... in Pinnacle Grill, there's always those who simply must TRY everything regardless, and the cost (and waste) adds up.  And yet, those of us sensible "let's not order more than we can eat" folks are now paying the price.  Sad. 

[Florida_gal_50]

8 hours ago, julia said:

This silly crap is yet another example of "those who ruin it for all".  Think about it... in Pinnacle Grill, there's always those who simply must TRY everything regardless, and the cost (and waste) adds up.  And yet, those of us sensible "let's not order more than we can eat" folks are now paying the price.  Sad. 

I’m one of those people that never takes more than they’ll eat.  As a matter of fact if I have a bigger lunch let’s say pizza I won’t be going to the pinnacle for dinner.  While I haven’t dined with everyone that ever set foot in the pinnacle I’ve never seen anyone that has piles of uneaten food on their table.  Let’s be honest here.  It’s a cash grab just like the failed extra entree charge was.

 

As far as raising the price to maintain quality I’ll be taking a pass on that one.  About the only time I ever go to the pinnacle is for my 5 star freebie and usually I pick another restaurant for that.

Edited September 8, 2022 by Florida_gal_50

[DaveOKC]

These operational consultants can ruin a good business.  In the wholesale grocery business one of our competitors hired a high priced consulting group (big name) who recommended some operational and billing changes.  It sounded quite logical on paper and the company implemented it.  In the real world however it was a major disaster and the company lost ALOT of business (made us competitors very happy though).

So, what sounds good sitting in the office planning often does not work in the real world. 

[oaktreerb]

6 hours ago, DaveOKC said:

These operational consultants can ruin a good business.  In the wholesale grocery business one of our competitors hired a high priced consulting group (big name) who recommended some operational and billing changes.  It sounded quite logical on paper and the company implemented it.  In the real world however it was a major disaster and the company lost ALOT of business (made us competitors very happy though).

So, what sounds good sitting in the office planning often does not work in the real world. 

So, that’s why the Westerdam is the Testerdam.  

[Wakepatrol]

6 hours ago, DaveOKC said:

These operational consultants can ruin a good business.  In the wholesale grocery business one of our competitors hired a high priced consulting group (big name) who recommended some operational and billing changes.  It sounded quite logical on paper and the company implemented it.  In the real world however it was a major disaster and the company lost ALOT of business (made us competitors very happy though).

So, what sounds good sitting in the office planning often does not work in the real world. 

Remember when people used to take numerous suitcases on planes for free. Then the airlines started to charge for baggage. 
Where are we now with this plan?