6 month passport rule? Help!

[sparks1093]

10 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

But the contract is the legally binding provision, while the website is basically marketing. And to make things worse, they basically say it's your responsibility, don't count on us for an answer.

 

Maybe the best thing is to go by what experiences other passengers have had with this question. 

Yes, and no. The website does contain a lot of marketing, but no cruise line is going to put on their website something that will keep a passenger from boarding. They want you onboard and will do everything they can to make that happen (and even with Royal's language regarding 6 months validity they might waive that on a case by case basis anyway since it is only their requirement and not the legal requirement. I personally wouldn't want to count on that, but it's still a consideration.).

 

First source of info- government websites related to the issue; second source of info- the carrier's requirements as outlined in their documentation (usually the website FAQ); third source of info- the experiences of others. 

[ontheweb]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Yes, and no. The website does contain a lot of marketing, but no cruise line is going to put on their website something that will keep a passenger from boarding. They want you onboard and will do everything they can to make that happen (and even with Royal's language regarding 6 months validity they might waive that on a case by case basis anyway since it is only their requirement and not the legal requirement. I personally wouldn't want to count on that, but it's still a consideration.).

 

First source of info- government websites related to the issue; second source of info- the carrier's requirements as outlined in their documentation (usually the website FAQ); third source of info- the experiences of others. 

What about the experience of the people doing the checking at the dock like @Ferry_Watcher? Granted her knowledge is limited to Canada, but she does deal with Royal Caribbean among other lines?

[BeasleysMom66]

3 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

What about the experience of the people doing the checking at the dock like @Ferry_Watcher? Granted her knowledge is limited to Canada, but she does deal with Royal Caribbean among other lines?

 

 While the experience is helpful information it in no way guarantees the same experience at every port on any given day.  It could even change at her port if she is off and someone bent on the rules is working.  The major problem the OP has is if they don't have it renewed in time there is a very real risk that the son is denied boarding based on the passport date and they would have no recourse.  All the discussion is irrelevant because it takes one CSR and their supervisor determined to stick to the "rule" and it is game over.

[ontheweb]

1 minute ago, BeasleysMom66 said:

 

 While the experience is helpful information it in no way guarantees the same experience at every port on any given day.  It could even change at her port if she is off and someone bent on the rules is working.  The major problem the OP has is if they don't have it renewed in time there is a very real risk that the son is denied boarding based on the passport date and they would have no recourse.  All the discussion is irrelevant because it takes one CSR and their supervisor determined to stick to the "rule" and it is game over.

I would hope that at all ports, it is the same as @Ferry_Watcher described---they are looking to allow you to board. She would have first hand knowledge of whether Royal Caribbean insists on 6 months left for a passport (at least for Canada). It may be different if there is a country being visited that has a 6 month rule.

[sparks1093]

16 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

What about the experience of the people doing the checking at the dock like @Ferry_Watcher? Granted her knowledge is limited to Canada, but she does deal with Royal Caribbean among other lines?

Yes, her information is very helpful.

[Ferry_Watcher]

In the closed loop Seattle - Alaska market, we have never denied boarding to a passenger that presented a passport that was expiring in less than 6 months from the day of embarkation.  In fact, as long as the passport is still valid on the day the passenger disembarks the ship, we will accept it (closed loop).  I personally have embarked a passenger whose passport expired the day after their cruise ended without any problems.

 

Now, for other types of cruises like the end of the season repositioning cruises that leave Seattle and sail off to Japan or Australia, there is a entirely different set of travel documents requirements - including having at least 6 months remaining on your passport from the date that the cruise is scheduled to end.  In these cases, we follow the requirements for the various  countries that the ship will visit or end up in.

[sparks1093]

6 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I would hope that at all ports, it is the same as @Ferry_Watcher described---they are looking to allow you to board. She would have first hand knowledge of whether Royal Caribbean insists on 6 months left for a passport (at least for Canada). It may be different if there is a country being visited that has a 6 month rule.

I'm sure that every cruise line wants all of the passengers boarded as long as they meet the minimum requirements. And while they may make an exception to the rule for one passenger it doesn't necessarily follow that they will for the next. Personally I wouldn't want to chance it, even if there was firm evidence that it's allowed in every instance.

[ontheweb]

1 minute ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

In the closed loop Seattle - Alaska market, we have never denied boarding to a passenger that presented a passport that was expiring in less than 6 months from the day of embarkation.  In fact, as long as the passport is still valid on the day the passenger disembarks the ship, we will accept it (closed loop).  I personally have embarked a passenger whose passport expired the day after their cruise ended without any problems.

 

Now, for other types of cruises like the end of the season repositioning cruises that leave Seattle and sail off to Japan or Australia, there is a entirely different set of travel documents requirements - including having at least 6 months remaining on your passport from the date that the cruise is scheduled to end.  In these cases, we follow the requirements for the various  countries that the ship will visit or end up in.

If I am reading you correctly, it is the rule of the country that matters, not of the cruise lines that you deal with. (And I do realize that there are cruise lines that you do not deal with that do have passport requirements even for closed loop cruises and might have a 6 month rule.)

[GeezerCouple]

16 minutes ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

In the closed loop Seattle - Alaska market, we have never denied boarding to a passenger that presented a passport that was expiring in less than 6 months from the day of embarkation.  In fact, as long as the passport is still valid on the day the passenger disembarks the ship, we will accept it (closed loop).  I personally have embarked a passenger whose passport expired the day after their cruise ended without any problems.

 

Now, for other types of cruises like the end of the season repositioning cruises that leave Seattle and sail off to Japan or Australia, there is a entirely different set of travel documents requirements - including having at least 6 months remaining on your passport from the date that the cruise is scheduled to end.  In these cases, we follow the requirements for the various  countries that the ship will visit or end up in.

 

Thanks.  You are the "real deal" here!

 

When you wrote:

"...we follow the requirements for the various  countries that the ship will visit or end up in."

 

Where do you/you associates/etc., get this information?

And is that source (or sources) available to the general public?

 

Thanks again!

 

GC

[Ferry_Watcher]

7 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

If I am reading you correctly, it is the rule of the country that matters, not of the cruise lines that you deal with. (And I do realize that there are cruise lines that you do not deal with that do have passport requirements even for closed loop cruises and might have a 6 month rule.)

 

Generally, yes.  

For example, this year the Canadian gov't has decided that all Mexican passport holders now need a Canadian visa to enter Canada (or to sail on ships that will enter a Canadian port-of-call).  The US gov't is more relaxed about Mexican passport holders - in prior years, these these folks just need their Mexican passport, and either a simple visitor visa and/or a Border Crossing Card, or just a SENTRI card (like a NEXUS trusted traveler card) in order to board a closed loop Alaska bound ship. 

Now, because of the new Canadian requirements, if we have a Mexican passport holder standing in front of us at check-in, and if that passport doesn't have the now required Canadian visa, then that Mexican passport holder will be denied boarding.  Last season (2023) there was no requirement, but this year they need the Canadian visa, and we have to follow the Canadian requirements.

[Mary229]

4 hours ago, ontheweb said:

But the contract is the legally binding provision, while the website is basically marketing. And to make things worse, they basically say it's your responsibility, don't count on us for an answer.

 

Maybe the best thing is to go by what experiences other passengers have had with this question. 

I think it is foolhardy to give or take legal advice on a social media website.  The person should be directed to the cruise line and the contract.  
This is different than giving an opinion on a flight, hotel, shore excursion or cabin, this is a request for legal advice.  

[Ferry_Watcher]

7 minutes ago, GeezerCouple said:

Where do you/you associates/etc., get this information?

And is that source (or sources) available to the general public?

 

We have lots of training just before the cruise season starts.  In fact, we will have two days of training this week.  We are taught not to guess about the use of a document, and encouraged to ask about the validity of a document.  If we make a mistake, then it could lead to a passenger being disembarked before their cruise was to end.   Luckily, with the check-in systems, there are all sorts of checks and balance measures to catch any mistakes (or questionable situations) before the ship sails. 

 

 

For the end of the season repositioning cruises, due to the various document requirements, there is special training for those days, and  the Brand will send support staff from corporate to help support the check-in team.  Everything has to be done correctly, and by the book.

 

[puckliny]

Hi folks.   I see lots of opinions and I believe the ones who say it’s down to the ship is correct.  The countries may not need it but a cruise personnel could be a stickler especially with the open loop issue.  I’ve made an appointment at a Passport Agency hopefully they can crank it out same day.  RC won’t say anything other than 6 months citing from the “book”.  If it goes to a contract reading I’m sure they will have themselves covered.   My question is really has anyone been on this route with this particular problem and know what happens.   In any case if I get the passports tomorrow it’s all moot.  Thanks everyone.  

[Ferry_Watcher]

5 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I think it is foolhardy to give or take legal advice on a social media website.  The person should be directed to the cruise line and the contract.  

 

You are correct that people must do their own due diligence.

 

If a representative from a cruise line gave inaccurate information to a booked passenger, and this passenger showed up without the correct documents, it would not matter what the cruise line rep had said (even if the rep put it in an email).  If that passenger didn't have the required documents, then they would be denied boarding.

 

Let me give you an example:  During the restart of the post pandemic Alaska season (July 2021), Canada was refusing to allow the typical large cruise ship to visit/stop at Canadian ports.  And as you know. all these ships have to stop at a foreign port (US law).  But, to save tourism in Alaska, and to help save the cruise industry, the US Senate voted to suspend that required foreign stop. So now we had ships allowed to sail from Seattle to Alaska without stopping in Canada. 

 

However, passengers still needed their passports or birth certificates.  But, many passengers were arriving at the pier without these documents, having been told they didn't need them because the ship wasn't going to Canada.  It didn't matter that they were given incorrect information - they still needed the proof of citizenship documents.  Many were able to get copies of their US gov't issued birth certificates sent to the port, but if they couldn't, they were denied boarding.  No doubt they received a refund from the cruise line - especially if the incorrect info came from a cruise rep, but they didn't sail. 

 

I remember that 2021 season (especially early in the season) as the worst year for document issues - so many people arrived without passports and/or their birth certificates.  It was a mess.

[capriccio]

3 minutes ago, puckliny said:

Hi folks.   I see lots of opinions and I believe the ones who say it’s down to the ship is correct.  The countries may not need it but a cruise personnel could be a stickler especially with the open loop issue.  I’ve made an appointment at a Passport Agency hopefully they can crank it out same day.  RC won’t say anything other than 6 months citing from the “book”.  If it goes to a contract reading I’m sure they will have themselves covered.   My question is really has anyone been on this route with this particular problem and know what happens.   In any case if I get the passports tomorrow it’s all moot.  Thanks everyone.  

A wise decision.  Best wishes to you and your family and I hope you all have a wonderful cruise!

[Ferry_Watcher]

@puckliny, please be sure to keep us updated.

[sparks1093]

53 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I think it is foolhardy to give or take legal advice on a social media website.  The person should be directed to the cruise line and the contract.  
This is different than giving an opinion on a flight, hotel, shore excursion or cabin, this is a request for legal advice.  

As I recall (I don't have time to go back and look) virtually all of the initial responses included something to the effect of "check with the cruise line". And no, it's not legal advice because it's not coming from a lawyer nor does it involve a court of law. And yet once more, with feeling, the contract is NOT the place to refer anyone to because it doesn't discuss the topic at all.

[Mary229]

45 minutes ago, puckliny said:

Hi folks.   I see lots of opinions and I believe the ones who say it’s down to the ship is correct.  The countries may not need it but a cruise personnel could be a stickler especially with the open loop issue.  I’ve made an appointment at a Passport Agency hopefully they can crank it out same day.  RC won’t say anything other than 6 months citing from the “book”.  If it goes to a contract reading I’m sure they will have themselves covered.   My question is really has anyone been on this route with this particular problem and know what happens.   In any case if I get the passports tomorrow it’s all moot.  Thanks everyone.  

Excellent choice 

[Mary229]

42 minutes ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

 

You are correct that people must do their own due diligence.

 

If a representative from a cruise line gave inaccurate information to a booked passenger, and this passenger showed up without the correct documents, it would not matter what the cruise line rep had said (even if the rep put it in an email).  If that passenger didn't have the required documents, then they would be denied boarding.

 

Let me give you an example:  During the restart of the post pandemic Alaska season (July 2021), Canada was refusing to allow the typical large cruise ship to visit/stop at Canadian ports.  And as you know. all these ships have to stop at a foreign port (US law).  But, to save tourism in Alaska, and to help save the cruise industry, the US Senate voted to suspend that required foreign stop. So now we had ships allowed to sail from Seattle to Alaska without stopping in Canada. 

 

However, passengers still needed their passports or birth certificates.  But, many passengers were arriving at the pier without these documents, having been told they didn't need them because the ship wasn't going to Canada.  It didn't matter that they were given incorrect information - they still needed the proof of citizenship documents.  Many were able to get copies of their US gov't issued birth certificates sent to the port, but if they couldn't, they were denied boarding.  No doubt they received a refund from the cruise line - especially if the incorrect info came from a cruise rep, but they didn't sail. 

 

I remember that 2021 season (especially early in the season) as the worst year for document issues - so many people arrived without passports and/or their birth certificates.  It was a mess.

I don’t think it is a good fit to give legal advice on a social media platform, not good for the person asking not good for the website’s integrity.  I am a firm believer in pointing someone to a higher authority and leaving it at that.  

[ontheweb]

47 minutes ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

 

You are correct that people must do their own due diligence.

 

If a representative from a cruise line gave inaccurate information to a booked passenger, and this passenger showed up without the correct documents, it would not matter what the cruise line rep had said (even if the rep put it in an email).  If that passenger didn't have the required documents, then they would be denied boarding.

 

Let me give you an example:  During the restart of the post pandemic Alaska season (July 2021), Canada was refusing to allow the typical large cruise ship to visit/stop at Canadian ports.  And as you know. all these ships have to stop at a foreign port (US law).  But, to save tourism in Alaska, and to help save the cruise industry, the US Senate voted to suspend that required foreign stop. So now we had ships allowed to sail from Seattle to Alaska without stopping in Canada. 

 

However, passengers still needed their passports or birth certificates.  But, many passengers were arriving at the pier without these documents, having been told they didn't need them because the ship wasn't going to Canada.  It didn't matter that they were given incorrect information - they still needed the proof of citizenship documents.  Many were able to get copies of their US gov't issued birth certificates sent to the port, but if they couldn't, they were denied boarding.  No doubt they received a refund from the cruise line - especially if the incorrect info came from a cruise rep, but they didn't sail. 

 

I remember that 2021 season (especially early in the season) as the worst year for document issues - so many people arrived without passports and/or their birth certificates.  It was a mess.

I hope when that denial of boarding occurred somewhat regularly in that time frame, you and your colleagues were not routinely yelled at. 

[sparks1093]

38 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

I hope when that denial of boarding occurred somewhat regularly in that time frame, you and your colleagues were not routinely yelled at. 

Human nature suggests that would not be the case. Unfortunately.

[Ferry_Watcher]

Denied passengers experience an accelerated passage thru the Stages of Grief:

Denial; Anger; Bargaining; Depression; & Acceptance

 

It depends on the denial circumstances.  If it is a US born citizen who showed up without documents for a closed loop cruise, there is still a real possibility that they can sail, if they get a copy of their US issued birth certificate..  These folks will either have hours to fix the situation (get their US BC), or deal with the possibility that they may not sail, giving them time to absorb the situation, and move thru the stages of grief.

 

If it is a foreign national who needs a Canadian Visa to board a ship to Alaska, and doesn't have one, then it is a full stop denial.  Sadly, there is no exceptions, or options for these people.  It is often times these people who will verbally lash out, usually out of frustration, that they didn't know about the visa requirement.

 

We have seen it before, we ae sympathetic, but it still isn't fun to be yelled at, or cursed at.  It happens daily, and every effort is made to calm the situation.  It's mostly the Documentation Team members who take the brunt of the lashing out, and if it gets too difficult, they can request security assistance.  The denial situation can intensify because, not only has the passenger been denied, but they are usually sitting in the waiting area while their luggage is being looked for on the ship, so it can be returned back to the passenger.  This can take hours, and while most denied passengers are calm, others can be very loud with their frustration. 

[ldubs]

3 hours ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

 

You are correct that people must do their own due diligence.

 

If a representative from a cruise line gave inaccurate information to a booked passenger, and this passenger showed up without the correct documents, it would not matter what the cruise line rep had said (even if the rep put it in an email).  If that passenger didn't have the required documents, then they would be denied boarding.

 

Let me give you an example:  During the restart of the post pandemic Alaska season (July 2021), Canada was refusing to allow the typical large cruise ship to visit/stop at Canadian ports.  And as you know. all these ships have to stop at a foreign port (US law).  But, to save tourism in Alaska, and to help save the cruise industry, the US Senate voted to suspend that required foreign stop. So now we had ships allowed to sail from Seattle to Alaska without stopping in Canada. 

 

However, passengers still needed their passports or birth certificates.  But, many passengers were arriving at the pier without these documents, having been told they didn't need them because the ship wasn't going to Canada.  It didn't matter that they were given incorrect information - they still needed the proof of citizenship documents.  Many were able to get copies of their US gov't issued birth certificates sent to the port, but if they couldn't, they were denied boarding.  No doubt they received a refund from the cruise line - especially if the incorrect info came from a cruise rep, but they didn't sail. 

 

I remember that 2021 season (especially early in the season) as the worst year for document issues - so many people arrived without passports and/or their birth certificates.  It was a mess.

 

Thanks for sharing this.   I can see how folks would make the mistake.  I mean, domestic travel, like a domestic flight, doesn't require a passport or BC -- yet.   

[ontheweb]

4 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

Human nature suggests that would not be the case. Unfortunately.

Yes, I have seen that. On our second cruise, we had a hurricane and got into Fort Lauderdale 2 days late. We were put on standby and luckily were the last ones called on the next flight. (We knew as the list got smaller that even if we did not make that flight, we were sure to be on the next one and get home that day. However, there were people not so lucky. As we waited to get to the airline representative, we heard passengers who were told they would not get a flight until the next day scream at the airline representative as if that would magically make flights available to them.

[CDNPolar]

16 hours ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

Denied passengers experience an accelerated passage thru the Stages of Grief:

Denial; Anger; Bargaining; Depression; & Acceptance

 

It depends on the denial circumstances.  If it is a US born citizen who showed up without documents for a closed loop cruise, there is still a real possibility that they can sail, if they get a copy of their US issued birth certificate..  These folks will either have hours to fix the situation (get their US BC), or deal with the possibility that they may not sail, giving them time to absorb the situation, and move thru the stages of grief.

 

If it is a foreign national who needs a Canadian Visa to board a ship to Alaska, and doesn't have one, then it is a full stop denial.  Sadly, there is no exceptions, or options for these people.  It is often times these people who will verbally lash out, usually out of frustration, that they didn't know about the visa requirement.

 

We have seen it before, we ae sympathetic, but it still isn't fun to be yelled at, or cursed at.  It happens daily, and every effort is made to calm the situation.  It's mostly the Documentation Team members who take the brunt of the lashing out, and if it gets too difficult, they can request security assistance.  The denial situation can intensify because, not only has the passenger been denied, but they are usually sitting in the waiting area while their luggage is being looked for on the ship, so it can be returned back to the passenger.  This can take hours, and while most denied passengers are calm, others can be very loud with their frustration. 

 

We have cruised now to most regions around the world.

 

When we do our research and prep for the cruise, we look to the Canadian government site and also the country specific sites (We avoid Visa sellers and look for country government sites that we can verify as trustworthy) that we are travelling to and we STUDY the passport and visa requirements.  If there are requirements for either, we note them and then start the process of logging dates in the calendar to get the appropriate paperwork done in time.  We were recently faced with needing Visas for both Cambodia and Vietnam.  The process was different and the timeline of the Visa validity was different for both countries but we figured out how to get both in advance and that would meet the requirements.

 

We never rely on the cruise ship site or the cruise reservation folks because this is not their job.  We do this ourselves and if we are denied boarding then it was because we failed in our own research.

 

We realize that it is our responsibility to understand and comply with passport and visa requirements.

 

We only renew our passports for 10 years to reduce the number of times we have to worry about our passports.  Our passports expire in Feb of 2026 and we have already logged in our calendars to renew after our first travel in 2025 so that we don't run out of time.  We have also logged a travel blackout period in the calendar to allow for us to get our passports renewed.  

 

 

Edited April 16 by CDNPolar