What does the future hold for Azamara

[dln929]

 

The main change with Azamara, which particularly bothers me, is that most activities in 'Pursuits' are now revenue based. There are now far fewer 'free' activities than there were twelve months ago and the wretched art auctions have raised their ugly head.

 

Will you explain the basis for saying that "most" activities are "now" revenue-based? Like specific examples. I looked over Pursuits from my cruises on both the Quest and Journey looking for activities that charged a fee and came up pretty well empty-handed. On the seven night Journey cruise that you were most recently on, for example, bingo games turned up on two days only. Every day offered trivia games (free), some kind of fitness classes (free), bridge game (free), golf activity (free), etc. etc. Of course there were the spa seminars which do have products for sale, but it's free to attend the seminars and there's no requirement to purchase anything. And lastly let's not forget the excellent lecture series offered on three days and the complimentary AzAmazing Evening that was hosted for us in Malta.

 

I am perplexed why you claim that the majority of activities are revenue-based.

[English Tim]

Will you explain the basis for saying that "most" activities are "now" revenue-based? Like specific examples. I looked over Pursuits from my cruises on both the Quest and Journey looking for activities that charged a fee and came up pretty well empty-handed. On the seven night Journey cruise that you were most recently on, for example, bingo games turned up on two days only. Every day offered trivia games (free), some kind of fitness classes (free), bridge game (free), golf activity (free), etc. etc. Of course there were the spa seminars which do have products for sale, but it's free to attend the seminars and there's no requirement to purchase anything. And lastly let's not forget the excellent lecture series offered on three days and the complimentary AzAmazing Evening that was hosted for us in Malta.

 

I am perplexed why you claim that the majority of activities are revenue-based.

 

You'll always be perplexed at my posts, Deidre.

 

Bridge etc, wasn't organised, it was just on the list for anyone to meet up and join in.

 

Yes, there were fitness classes, but no longer daily at set times, but often when people may we be ashore. I used to go to stretch or tums and bums every morning. Yes the seminars are free, but their sole aim is to sell products.

 

Art auctions, bingo, casino tournaments, Ipad seminars, etc.

 

I have been looking back through last season's Pursuits and they bear out my theory. I believe there used to be two fitness instructors, now only one.

 

It comes as no surprise that as soon as anyone criticises anything Azamara, it's cheerleaders disagree.

 

We love Azamara, but things are changing and not for the better. One night I asked for filter coffee after dinner and was told I could get it at Mosaic. That wouldn't have happened in the past.

[uktog]

You'll always be perplexed at my posts, Deidre.

 

Bridge etc, wasn't organised, it was just on the list for anyone to meet up and join in.

 

Yes, there were fitness classes, but no longer daily at set times, but often when people may we be ashore. I used to go to stretch or tums and bums every morning. Yes the seminars are free, but their sole aim is to sell products.

 

Art auctions, bingo, casino tournaments, Ipad seminars, etc.

 

I have been looking back through last season's Pursuits and they bear out my theory. I believe there used to be two fitness instructors, now only one.

 

It comes as no surprise that as soon as anyone criticises anything Azamara, it's cheerleaders disagree.

 

We love Azamara, but things are changing and not for the better. One night I asked for filter coffee after dinner and was told I could get it at Mosaic. That wouldn't have happened in the past.

 

I am not a cheerleader, but I believe in accuracy and most activities are NOT charged for. I wish you would stop accusing me of being a cheerleader

 

You must have been unlucky, every night waiters wherever we were got us and surrounding tables coffees from Mosaic without question. The only time they did not was when the coffee machine broke down for 24 hrs, the state of emergency was declared by some officers ;) not guests.

 

I think if it's your take that the changes in Azamara (yes there are changes in emphasis all of which reflect what a destination cruiseline should offer) are not for the better, maybe you've come near the end of your line with Azamara

[Emdee]

I see some people are comparing cruising to land based vacations in terms of price. If you do visit one island and R & R there I agree the pricing is significantly less. IMO the real advantage about cruising is that you do not have to pack and unpack and take flights or trains from one destination to the next. Naturally since the ship takes you from port to port pricing would be higher than if the ship stayed in one particular spot.

 

I am just back from a land based vacation in France and Spain. I dont believe the prices we paid for hotels and meals were much less than the per diem of an Azamara cruise in a basic balcony cabin. Our next trip would be a cruise to Tahiti and I can guarantee that the cost of dining and travelling between the islands would be much more than what the cruise will cost.

 

All I can say is that value is in the eye of the beholder and money has no intrinsic value other than what you ascribe to it. So if you feel you are better served in going on a land based vacation then that is precisely what you should do. I am not an Azamara cheerleader though I have a couple of cruises on her under my belt. I find it a very good value for what is charged even with the increased prices. The only disadvantage to me are the small rooms.

[English Tim]

When we go to a hotel, it's like getting on a ship, but with a bigger room and we only unpack once, as we have our favourites and stick with them.

 

My wife and I have enjoyed all three Azamara cruises and will doubtless enjoy some more, as we have enjoyed many on other lines, which is maybe why I can be a little critical, as I see the best and worst of various products.

 

I had a fabulous cruise on Celebrity Reflection, where they gave me free drinks and the Sommelier treated me with great kindness. I drank far nicer wines than I did on Azamara, all for free.

 

There is no such thing as a bad cruise, as they are what you make them to be, but if I perceive standards to be dropping, then I'll say so, as after all this is Cruise Critic.

 

There are many who seem to just highlight the good thinks and gloss over the indifferent, which doesn't help new cruisers looking for balanced opinion.

[dln929]

When we go to a hotel, it's like getting on a ship, but with a bigger room and we only unpack once, as we have our favourites and stick with them.

 

My wife and I have enjoyed all three Azamara cruises and will doubtless enjoy some more, as we have enjoyed many on other lines, which is maybe why I can be a little critical, as I see the best and worst of various products.

 

I had a fabulous cruise on Celebrity Reflection, where they gave me free drinks and the Sommelier treated me with great kindness. I drank far nicer wines than I did on Azamara, all for free.

 

There is no such thing as a bad cruise, as they are what you make them to be, but if I perceive standards to be dropping, then I'll say so, as after all this is Cruise Critic.

There are many who seem to just highlight the good thinks and gloss over the indifferent, which doesn't help new cruisers looking for balanced opinion.

 

Trying to correct the inaccuracies that you put out should not brand anyone as a "cheerleader." That's really condescending and does nothing to support your statement that your views are the balanced ones (and by default, others are not).

 

For you to say something like the fitness classes, for example, were not at set times and that furthermore were held when people tended to be not on the ship--well, not entirely true. On the last cruise you were on there were classes every afternoon at 4:00 or 4:30 pm (conveniently before cocktail hour) and most mornings at 8:30 am. There were only two mornings when the classes weren't held, the first being Santorini where we anchored at 7 am with tendering shortly thereafter, and Friday at Giardini Naxos where tendering was at 8 am approximately. How these facts translate into your interpretation that classes were held both randomly and at awkward hours I do not know. I will agree with you, however, that there were less fitness classes than I experienced on the Quest in the Caribbean, but then again, this Mediterranean cruise was extremely port intensive and more people spent time off ship than on. By design. ;)

[English Tim]

Trying to correct the inaccuracies that you put out should not brand anyone as a "cheerleader." That's really condescending and does nothing to support your statement that your views are the balanced ones (and by default, others are not).

 

For you to say something like the fitness classes, for example, were not at set times and that furthermore were held when people tended to be not on the ship--well, not entirely true. On the last cruise you were on there were classes every afternoon at 4:00 or 4:30 pm (conveniently before cocktail hour) and most mornings at 8:30 am. There were only two mornings when the classes weren't held, the first being Santorini where we anchored at 7 am with tendering shortly thereafter, and Friday at Giardini Naxos where tendering was at 8 am approximately. How these facts translate into your interpretation that classes were held both randomly and at awkward hours I do not know. I will agree with you, however, that there were less fitness classes than I experienced on the Quest in the Caribbean, but then again, this Mediterranean cruise was extremely port intensive and more people spent time off ship than on. By design. ;)

 

All three of my Azamara cruises have been port-intensive and I usually go the free classes at 07.00 and 07.30. On this cruise there were very few morning classes. Most people like to have a class just after getting up, judging by how popular they always are.

 

Just after boarding I checked the list of classes and was encouraged that my best option was to pay for a personal trainer (Big Bucks). At the CC M&G, I raised my frustrations with Heike (Hotel Director). She telephoned the fitness guy, who assured her the regular morning classes would take place. They did not.

 

I wish I had kept the Pursuits, to prove / disprove my point.

[marinaro44]

Unless there is a sea change (sorry for the pun) at the leadership and marketing level at Azamara this is all wishful thinking. They are and have been targeting the luxury cruiser. I do not think they are succeeding and I do not think luxury cruisers are going to want to sail on old ships with small cabins. Luxury cruisers don't even want to sail on the O ships in the small cabins even with the refurbishment. They opt for the newer larger ships with much larger cabins.

 

As you know these boards are not instrument for effecting change at the highest levels -- did you get the harpists back? are land discoveries discounted? has the beverage package been changed based on all the comments? I could go on. They run the show. You either book a cruise or vote with your wallet.

 

Azamara does not seem to listen. The fate of the cruise line is in their hands and none of us knows what will happen in the future. All we have are the facts. No refurbishment. No new builds. Higher prices. The chips will fall as they always do.

You don't pay attention to "the facts." Both Quest and Journey were refurbished less than two years ago, and will be refurbished again in late 2015 and early 2016, respectively. Your incessant negativity here grows old.

[TillyTheGreat]

1st June 2014

It will be interesting to see how we value this trip having been so cruise orientated recently. Certainly the bathroom, bedroom and balcony will be much bigger and we'll have lovely mountain views. Service will be top notch, so little difference there.

 

I follow what you say, English Tim, and the point I want to make concerns the Solo Traveller... Yes, land-based hotels provide magnificent service/facilities for the cost - for a couple. However, for a solo traveller such as myself, I consider myself very fortunate if I have a chance conversation with another guest at a 4* hotel, let alone be invited to join their table for dinner.

Cruising, particularly for the solo-woman, provides the perfect environment to socialise . . . "without appearing forward" or pushy.

This is where the concerns over the future of Azamara alarm me. In order to cruise (and due to poor health), I need small ships and 'luxury-lite' at a reasonable price. Thank you for reading...

[English Tim]

I follow what you say, English Tim, and the point I want to make concerns the Solo Traveller... Yes, land-based hotels provide magnificent service/facilities for the cost - for a couple. However, for a solo traveller such as myself, I consider myself very fortunate if I have a chance conversation with another guest at a 4* hotel, let alone be invited to join their table for dinner.

Cruising, particularly for the solo-woman, provides the perfect environment to socialise . . . "without appearing forward" or pushy.

This is where the concerns over the future of Azamara alarm me. In order to cruise (and due to poor health), I need small ships and 'luxury-lite' at a reasonable price. Thank you for reading...

 

Absolutely, cruising is a wonderful environment for singles. We once dined at a table for 10, including some singles and we all had a wonderful time.

[cruzsnooze]

I sailed on Azamara before they had the alcohol included in the fare. The prices were much different. I don't drink but one maybe two drinks in a whole week so this extra they have you paying for caused us NOT to book Azamara. I refuse to pay for alcohol I won't drink. The other extras they now include like transportation to the city is something everyone can enjoy. The Azamara evenings are something everyone can enjoy.

If Azamara reads these boards then they need to know we refuse to pay about $50 -$75 per day extra for drinks. That is the amount most cruise lines are currently charging for thei drink packages. It's too bad for us because we like the Azamara small ship experience.

[nordski]

I sailed on Azamara before they had the alcohol included in the fare. The prices were much different. I don't drink but one maybe two drinks in a whole week so this extra they have you paying for caused us NOT to book Azamara. I refuse to pay for alcohol I won't drink. The other extras they now include like transportation to the city is something everyone can enjoy. The Azamara evenings are something everyone can enjoy.

If Azamara reads these boards then they need to know we refuse to pay about $50 -$75 per day extra for drinks. That is the amount most cruise lines are currently charging for thei drink packages. It's too bad for us because we like the Azamara small ship experience.

 

You are correct. There was a correlation between the "more inclusive" alcohol policy and the rise of cruise fares.

 

However, in the heated discussion that ensued on this forum, if I remember correctly, both Larry P. and Bill L. insisted that the new policy was not the sole nor primary driving force in the new prices. Furthermore, as one who sailed prior to the change in the alcohol programme, it was clear to me that ACC could not provide their quality experience at the prices we were paying. Thus some increase was inevitable and the "more inclusive" policy an attempt to make that increase more acceptable to some of their market.

 

As well, drink packages may indeed cost $50. to $75. per day on cruise lines, but I doubt that constitutes their real cost to the ship. Thus, the actual impact of this programme on the cruise fares would be difficult to tease out without insider knowledge.

 

Since you enjoyed the ACC experience, perhaps some of the recent sales, such as on the altered Black Sea itinerary, might attract your interest and appear good value.

[Bloodaxe]

There's something else I thought about and I don't think it's been mentioned on this thread, but I feel is an important factor when talking about Azamara going forward. It's the crew. I have only been sailing Azamara since 2011, but it' is amazing how many of the staff still on the ships have worked there since day 1, either from other cruise lines or Celebrity. Loyalty and depth of service are strengths of the line that have been discussed many times here.

 

Whilst in no way am I oblivious to the needs of the business as a whole this exhibition of loyalty and passion for the brand has to be a very positive thing.

 

Phil

 

Phil makes a very good point, many of the crew have been with the line since the very start in 2007.

We have seen some of them deservedly promoted through the ranks over the years & regard many has our friends.

Edited June 5, 2014 by Bloodaxe

[marinaro44]

You are correct. There was a correlation between the "more inclusive" alcohol policy and the rise of cruise fares.

 

However, in the heated discussion that ensued on this forum, if I remember correctly, both Larry P. and Bill L. insisted that the new policy was not the sole nor primary driving force in the new prices. Furthermore, as one who sailed prior to the change in the alcohol programme, it was clear to me that ACC could not provide their quality experience at the prices we were paying. Thus some increase was inevitable and the "more inclusive" policy an attempt to make that increase more acceptable to some of their market.

 

As well, drink packages may indeed cost $50. to $75. per day on cruise lines, but I doubt that constitutes their real cost to the ship. Thus, the actual impact of this programme on the cruise fares would be difficult to tease out without insider knowledge.

 

Since you enjoyed the ACC experience, perhaps some of the recent sales, such as on the altered Black Sea itinerary, might attract your interest and appear good value.

I know the cost per day for Azamara to provide included liquors. It is a small fraction of the numbers asserted above. If it were subtracted from cruise fares, you wouldn't notice.

[English Tim]

One Carnival cruise, I organised two cocktail parties for over 100 people. We each paid around $12 for an hour's unlimited drinking. Carnival make a profit from such events, showing what low costs there are for tax free liquor.

 

A revenue director on Celebrity told me that liquor sales provide a huge part of onboard revenue, so it would seem an excellent move by Azamara to hike prices and include some drinks.

[Jade13]

I sailed on Azamara before they had the alcohol included in the fare. The prices were much different. I don't drink but one maybe two drinks in a whole week so this extra they have you paying for caused us NOT to book Azamara. I refuse to pay for alcohol I won't drink. The other extras they now include like transportation to the city is something everyone can enjoy. The Azamara evenings are something everyone can enjoy.

If Azamara reads these boards then they need to know we refuse to pay about $50 -$75 per day extra for drinks. That is the amount most cruise lines are currently charging for thei drink packages. It's too bad for us because we like the Azamara small ship experience.

 

Prices have increased at least 300%. The alcohol is just a throw-in. It is obvious they were not profitable at the old rates. I am still not clear if they turned a profit yet, although our last cruise was sold out many months in advance.

[HudandPug]

Prices have increased at least 300%. The alcohol is just a throw-in. It is obvious they were not profitable at the old rates. I am still not clear if they turned a profit yet, although our last cruise was sold out many months in advance.

 

No hit on you Jade13.

 

 

I don't know what they were, but by golly they are very good value now if you shop around. Especially if you come from the USA.

 

In my opinion because I am still happy from my last Azamara.

 

We are currently considering another Celebrity cruise, waiting for the quote from our favourite TA, but wish it was an Azamara! The price is not that different, certainly no different if you use an American TA. ;)

 

So all this discussion is relative to what you normally expect to pay when you book various deals and promotions etc. Pointless unless everyone starts saying what they actually paid and what they got!

 

We have had two fantastic cruises with Azamara, that were significantly less in overall cost and benefit than a similar cruise on at least 3 other cruise lines.

 

So its subjective unless we all want to be open and honest, which is extremely unlikely because we would have nothing to complain about. On another note have any of you who think Azamara is out to get you, looked at the other CL boards? I doubt it, if you want your favourite to grow and survive, because that is what business is, it's surviving, then stop having a pop at stuff that is not proved relatively! Have a go at the support before and the follow up after, but not the cruise and cost.

 

 

Oh my God I have become an Aza-mary. Bloomin right I am!

 

We want to live on the quest :)

 

Yvonne and Andy

[dln929]

No hit on you Jade13.

 

 

I don't know what they were, but by golly they are very good value now if you shop around. Especially if you come from the USA.

 

In my opinion because I am still happy from my last Azamara.

 

We are currently considering another Celebrity cruise, waiting for the quote from our favourite TA, but wish it was an Azamara! The price is not that different, certainly no different if you use an American TA. ;)

 

So all this discussion is relative to what you normally expect to pay when you book various deals and promotions etc. Pointless unless everyone starts saying what they actually paid and what they got!

 

We have had two fantastic cruises with Azamara, that were significantly less in overall cost and benefit than a similar cruise on at least 3 other cruise lines.

 

So its subjective unless we all want to be open and honest, which is extremely unlikely because we would have nothing to complain about. On another note have any of you who think Azamara is out to get you, looked at the other CL boards? I doubt it, if you want your favourite to grow and survive, because that is what business is, it's surviving, then stop having a pop at stuff that is not proved relatively! Have a go at the support before and the follow up after, but not the cruise and cost.

 

 

Oh my God I have become an Aza-mary. Bloomin right I am!

 

We want to live on the quest :)

 

Yvonne and Andy

And Rob and I want to be your cabin neighbors. We enjoyed our cruise on the Journey--I mean, seriously how could you not enjoy Azamara--but as they say on the Quest, "QUEST IS BEST" and I agree. I loved the bold artwork of the Quest and Captain Jose is my hero forever. I will never turn down Azamara but if someone asked me who is my favorite son, I would have to say "It's my first. QUEST."

[cruzsnooze]

 

A revenue director on Celebrity told me that liquor sales provide a huge part of onboard revenue, so it would seem an excellent move by Azamara to hike prices and include some drinks.

Exactly, and they are making it up in the fare with the all inclusive alcohol. For those of us that aren't drinkers it's a big turn off to pay the hiked up fare to include this lost revenue. We thoroughly enjoyed Lindblad (National Geographic) who runs similar prices without alcohol but boy do they have the itineraries and much smaller ships. All excursions are included too so we have gravitated towards them.

[Spursgirl]

And Rob and I want to be your cabin neighbors. We enjoyed our cruise on the Journey--I mean, seriously how could you not enjoy Azamara--but as they say on the Quest, "QUEST IS BEST" and I agree. I loved the bold artwork of the Quest and Captain Jose is my hero forever. I will never turn down Azamara but if someone asked me who is my favorite son, I would have to say "It's my first. QUEST."

 

Hi Deirdre,

 

And perhaps we could be your and Hudnpug's other neighbours. Yes our recent Journey cruise was wonderful but Quest is best!

 

Haven't had the pleasure yet of sailing with Captain Jose and look forward to it. But sailing with Captain Carl is off the scale. Hope you get the chance to discover his unique English charm soon.

 

Hazel

[excitedofharpenden]

I follow what you say, English Tim, and the point I want to make concerns the Solo Traveller... Yes, land-based hotels provide magnificent service/facilities for the cost - for a couple. However, for a solo traveller such as myself, I consider myself very fortunate if I have a chance conversation with another guest at a 4* hotel, let alone be invited to join their table for dinner.

Cruising, particularly for the solo-woman, provides the perfect environment to socialise . . . "without appearing forward" or pushy.

This is where the concerns over the future of Azamara alarm me. In order to cruise (and due to poor health), I need small ships and 'luxury-lite' at a reasonable price. Thank you for reading...

And don't forget the 125% single supplement deals that makes a huge difference if you can pick your cruises to coincide. I try to, but also get caught up in the moment and pay double on others, but for me I know what I'm comfortable paying and for the experience with the old saying "life's too short" am happy with that. I've yet to come away from an Azamara cruise thinking that I've been had.

 

Phil

[dln929]

The OP to this thread asked So what do loyal Azamara passengers consider need to be improved, if anything to which I would reply

1) offer one free shore excursion at every port. The upcoming Viking Oceans Cruises offers one--usually it's a city walking tour but sometimes it's a coach tour. If anyone wants to upgrade to a better quality of tour it's their choice to pay for it, but there's at least there's always one complimentary option. I'd sacrifice the AzAmazing Evening for that. Or (even better) bring back the 50% off any shore excursion if booked before boarding.

2) revamp the alcohol packages to simplify. I think Celebrity does a good job of it in that if you want drinks costing up to a certain price point, you buy the appropriate package. One look at the menu drink price instantly tells you if the drink is included in your package or not. Simple.

[Redtravel]

My precruise experience for my upcoming cruise has been a struggle. I used to praise Azamara for excellent cruise experience and wonderful service before and during the cruise. This time, the reps in Guatemala have not been helpful. Azamara needs to take a look at their system. Train the reps about the product so that they can give guests accurate service. Also, some are gracious. Some need charm school.

[norn iron]

Sadly I think that Azamara will disappear in 2 or 3 years.

I am a great Azamara fan BUT there are lots of problems /issues

 

1: Azamara is 1% of RCI business. (1300 beds vs RCI group 120,500)

The overheads of Azamara in each country are crippling.

Do you think that Larry’s Remuneration is 1/100 of RCI Richard Fain president?

Brits apparently are 10% of Azamara clientele i.e 130 beds per week.

UK marketing office will be costing £400,000 per year alone.

Do you think Azamara MD gets 1/100 of his equivalent at RCI UK.

 

2: It will be easy to get rid as they are obviously NOT planning any refurb/refit until 2017 at earliest.

 

3:They are between a rock and a hard place.

If you are a cruiser new to luxury will you choose a 15 year old ship or a nice new Viking Cruise.

Will you choose a 140 sq.ft. with a really small bathroom.

 

4::Pricing has got out of line with reality.

We have had a permanent 2 upgrade policy for months.

All that happens is lower grades are upgraded and then nearer departure interior will be flogged off cheaply.

 

5: Azamara repeat customers are diminishing at rate of 5% per year as we ALL get older and Azamara demographic is relatively older than mainstream where RCI is concentrating.

Look at moves into China etc.

 

6: Despite their work they still manage monumental foul ups.

Allowing their partners to advertise 6 Star all inclusive (a RCI owned subsidiary) and have still not given an answers to Open certificates!!!

 

I am sure there are other reasons and I really feel for crew and on board operations as we all know how hard they work

 

After the shocking news this week concerning the remodelling of LCV I think Procter may well be right and Azamara will disappear in the next 2 - 3 years.

If they are still around they may well be a Charter line only.

[Dylandude]

After the shocking news this week concerning the remodelling of LCV I think Procter may well be right and Azamara will disappear in the next 2 - 3 years.

If they are still around they may well be a Charter line only.

 

I suspect we are seeing the beginning of the end were Azamara are concerned.

What is they say about vermin abandoning a sinking ship?