Out of all the cut backs over the years, what is the one thing ...

[sail7seas]

Baby Boomers, now in the 53-71 yr. old age bracket, are the biggest age cohort with the most disposable income to spend on activities such as cruising. I would think this would be HAL's target audience.

 

Roz

 

 

From casual, unprofessional obsevations, it seems to me, HAL is trying hard to get the maximum on board spending. They rather that than those who spend a lot on their choice of cabin.

[iancal]

I think that they are going for both!

[innlady1]

Baby Boomers, now in the 53-71 yr. old age bracket, are the biggest age cohort with the most disposable income to spend on activities such as cruising. I would think this would be HAL's target audience.

 

 

 

Roz

 

 

I would, too. And they have another 10 to 30 years of cruising with this age group. Doesn't make sense.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[kazu]

It will stay as long as Ashford is at the top:(. HAL had my loyalty, but now I have 2 booked cruises on Oceania myself.

 

I truly hope you enjoy them.

 

DH and I tried O once and sadly, it was not the best two weeks of their product. I hope your experience is much better than ours and you have a great time.

 

Me? I'll go back to the P'dam again where there is still some semblance of what HAL was and still can be ;)

[iancal]

We are in that group. To be honest, HAL is not doing very much to rope us in as customers. We don't really care about all the events/attributes from years ago. We have different tastes, different travel priorities going forward. There is so much to choose from today. We see so little variance between HAL and Princess or Celebrity in terms of on board service etc. The only difference to us is the ship. All three are heading at the same pace to the lowest common denominator.

[sail7seas]

I think that they are going for both!

 

That would make the most sense. :)

[sail7seas]

There are two very active posters here who tried O and both were disappointed. That has influenced my lack of willingness to try "

 

 

 

:o I just saw the post Kazu made

Edited October 12, 2017 by sail7seas

[rkacruiser]

I truly hope you enjoy them.

 

DH and I tried O once and sadly, it was not the best two weeks of their product. I hope your experience is much better than ours and you have a great time.

 

Me? I'll go back to the P'dam again where there is still some semblance of what HAL was and still can be ;)

 

From reports from HAL world cruise friends who also have friends who have sailed on both HAL and Oceania world cruises, the service experience from the Oceania crews pales in comparison with HAL's crews.

[Krazy Kruizers]

OP asked for ONE cutback that we would like to see come back.

Why did so many people list so many things???

I listed one but did mention that I had a list.

Yikes people -- just answer the question.

[Aquahound]

OP asked for ONE cutback that we would like to see come back.

Why did so many people list so many things???

I listed one but did mention that I had a list.

Yikes people -- just answer the question.

 

You do realize that the OP named 2 things, right?

[sammiedawg]

HAL was never premium but it was a lovely mass market option. It went downmarket and became a value cruise line, an inexpensive way to see the world.

Any product with current pricing just as cheap or cheaper than 10-20 years ago cannot maintain the original quality.

HAL is dumping inventory like crazy on internet web sites. I used to see verandah cabins dumped at $100 per day. Now I'm seeing OV dumped at 60 bucks a day and verandah cabins for $75. Food, service levels, ship maintenance will continue to slip.

I don't care about the elimination of fake "librarians", cruise logs or yum yum guys wearing funny hats.

[Sea girl 23]

HAL was never premium but it was a lovely mass market option. It went downmarket and became a value cruise line, an inexpensive way to see the world.

Any product with current pricing just as cheap or cheaper than 10-20 years ago cannot maintain the original quality.

HAL is dumping inventory like crazy on internet web sites. I used to see verandah cabins dumped at $100 per day. Now I'm seeing OV dumped at 60 bucks a day and verandah cabins for $75. Food, service levels, ship maintenance will continue to slip.

I don't care about the elimination of fake "librarians", cruise logs or yum yum guys wearing funny hats.

 

I cruise once a year(my treat to myself!) and HAL's value for me is what keeps me coming back,so my opinion probably doesn't matter much..

 

I could save up for years and go on Cunard or Disney, or cruise with HAL and be able to go once a year.

[RuthC]

From reports from HAL world cruise friends who also have friends who have sailed on both HAL and Oceania world cruises, the service experience from the Oceania crews pales in comparison with HAL's crews.

I couldn't agree more with your friends' friends. I can think of three exceptions to the consistently horrible service on Oceania: my cabin steward (who happened to be Indonesian), one cocktail waitress I saw twice on a 14-day cruise, and a dinner at Privée (which costs $250 for up to 10 people, so service should be good).

Other than that, just awful service all around.

[kazu]

There are two very active posters here who tried O and both were disappointed. That has influenced my lack of willingness to try "

 

 

 

:o I just saw the post Kazu made

 

Sail, I do know a number of former (and current) HAL cruisers that appear to be VERY happy with Oceania. We might have been unlucky but once bitten.....

 

Please don't let my post deter you from trying O.

 

the cabins are very nice but, for us, in a nutshell, the cruise was all looks and no substance.

[Krazy Kruizers]

You do realize that the OP named 2 things, right?

 

 

Yes

But I do try to follow what is asked of us.

Maybe in a couple of days I will post my list -- don't count on it.

I am not like some people here who take over threads -- JMO.

[sammiedawg]

We've done a double digit number of Oceania cruises and have more booked. While not perfect we think the service is wonderful, we've yet to have a serious issue. Food quality and restaurant choices are completely at another level. The ship comfort is divine and the ships are in pristine condition. We've been irritated with them a few times, nothing is perfect.

 

Some have sailed other lines besides Holland America and were not happy. Maybe they were not the targeted customer?? I say try multiple lines until you find something right for you and don't spend all your time comparing the new one to how Holland America does things.

[erewhon]

At a recent HAL Senior Management Conference, Orlando Ashford more or less admitted that he had been assigned to dramatically increase HAL's Revenues and Profits.

He outlined a very simple plan to accomplish this.

 

First he showed the results of a Marketing Study commissioned By HAL, identifying the current HAL passenger demographics:

 

-Elderly passengers

-Many on fixed incomes

-Very high numbers of repeat cruisers who spend correspondingly little money onboard.

-Low utilization of shore excursion programs

-Low casino utilization

 

Then he identified HAL's target customer:

-45 to 65 years old.

-Advanced university degree.

-Home and 2 cars with no mortgages.

-Business / First class air travelers.

-Suite cruisers.

-"Adventurous" travelers who will pay a premium for unique shore experiences.

-People who do not mind paying extra for a special night out, with special wines and food.

 

He admitted that these target passengers are currently sailing with the likes of Celebrity, Azamara, Oceania, and the other higher end lines.

He was unable to explain how HAL planned to lure those people away from the luxury lines to sail on HAL ships.

 

He did point out that HAL must continue to court the existing passengers until they were able to offer something that would allow their replacement with the target group.

 

If you find HAL's marketing decisions to be a bit confusing and counter-productive, it may be that they are trying to appeal to two entirely different groups at the same time.

 

Thank you for posting this information.

[kazu]

At a recent HAL Senior Management Conference, Orlando Ashford more or less admitted that he had been assigned to dramatically increase HAL's Revenues and Profits.

He outlined a very simple plan to accomplish this.

 

First he showed the results of a Marketing Study commissioned By HAL, identifying the current HAL passenger demographics:

 

-Elderly passengers

-Many on fixed incomes

-Very high numbers of repeat cruisers who spend correspondingly little money onboard.

-Low utilization of shore excursion programs

-Low casino utilization

 

Then he identified HAL's target customer:

-45 to 65 years old.

-Advanced university degree.

-Home and 2 cars with no mortgages.

-Business / First class air travelers.

-Suite cruisers.

-"Adventurous" travelers who will pay a premium for unique shore experiences.

-People who do not mind paying extra for a special night out, with special wines and food.

 

He admitted that these target passengers are currently sailing with the likes of Celebrity, Azamara, Oceania, and the other higher end lines.

He was unable to explain how HAL planned to lure those people away from the luxury lines to sail on HAL ships.

 

He did point out that HAL must continue to court the existing passengers until they were able to offer something that would allow their replacement with the target group.

 

If you find HAL's marketing decisions to be a bit confusing and counter-productive, it may be that they are trying to appeal to two entirely different groups at the same time.

 

Very interesting and informative post. Thank you.

 

They may have had more of their target market than they realized. Still do, but some have left for other lines.

 

I bolded part of the target market points. Our unique shore excursions have mostly been done privately as HAL doesn't offer them often. HAL needs to offer some unique shore excursions in order to have people sign up for them.

 

Pretty hard to sign up for a special night out (other than regular specialty dining) when there was no Master Chef Table/Chef Rudi dinner or a Cellar Master Dinner offered on our last cruise. If it isn't offered, (and yes, I asked), it's pretty hard for any target market to pay extra for a special night ;)

 

If it's not offered, they can't expect the "target market" to spend the $ on it. JMO.

[Stevanb]

If you have cruised in the past looked at what you paid per day and look what you are paying now is there much of an increase. We looked not much at all sometimes it is less. Wonder why they cut back . There is a old saying pay more get more.

[3rdGenCunarder]

At a recent HAL Senior Management Conference, Orlando Ashford more or less admitted that he had been assigned to dramatically increase HAL's Revenues and Profits.

He outlined a very simple plan to accomplish this.

 

First he showed the results of a Marketing Study commissioned By HAL, identifying the current HAL passenger demographics:

 

-Elderly passengers

-Many on fixed incomes

-Very high numbers of repeat cruisers who spend correspondingly little money onboard.

-Low utilization of shore excursion programs

-Low casino utilization

 

Then he identified HAL's target customer:

-45 to 65 years old.

-Advanced university degree.

-Home and 2 cars with no mortgages.

-Business / First class air travelers.

-Suite cruisers.

-"Adventurous" travelers who will pay a premium for unique shore experiences.

-People who do not mind paying extra for a special night out, with special wines and food.

 

He admitted that these target passengers are currently sailing with the likes of Celebrity, Azamara, Oceania, and the other higher end lines.

He was unable to explain how HAL planned to lure those people away from the luxury lines to sail on HAL ships.

 

He did point out that HAL must continue to court the existing passengers until they were able to offer something that would allow their replacement with the target group.

 

If you find HAL's marketing decisions to be a bit confusing and counter-productive, it may be that they are trying to appeal to two entirely different groups at the same time.

 

I bolded two things. First, how many people do they expect to find in the lower end of that age bracket who own a home (and 2 cars) and don't have a mortgage? And do they really think people who usually fly first class will have HAL as their first thought when they consider a cruise?

 

I agree completely with your last sentence. They're trying to work on two very different corporate images, a strategy that IMO is unlikely to work.

[Sage]

I love HAL, but I'm not happy with some of the changes over the years, but I realize everything changes. I was not happy with all the add on items last cruise. The final cost was not that much difference between HAL and Crystal where it is all inclusive.

[Roz]

I bolded two things. First, how many people do they expect to find in the lower end of that age bracket who own a home (and 2 cars) and don't have a mortgage? And do they really think people who usually fly first class will have HAL as their first thought when they consider a cruise?

 

I agree completely with your last sentence. They're trying to work on two very different corporate images, a strategy that IMO is unlikely to work.

 

A lot of people in the 45-60 age range are putting children thru college at this stage in their life. I'm puzzled by "suite travelers", because each ship has a limited number of suites. There are more non-suites than suites. Given HAL's criteria, to me there would seem to only be a very small number/percentage of travelers interested in cruising that they're targeting.

 

Roz

[RuthC]

I always chuckle at that term "fixed income", said as if it is some sort of negative. It certainly doesn't have to be, and for those of us who can afford to cruise, it isn't. What we spend on cruising is disposable income.

 

I know when I worked I was on a "fixed income" for many consecutive years because there were no raises whatsoever. At least in retirement I get a cost of living raise. While working, I had to save for retirement, but now that I'm there---I can spend! (that was a very hard adjustment!).

 

Orlando Ashford seems to have a disdain for those of us who are older, been around HAL for a while, and want to keep sailing the line. Sounds as if he just wants to use us until he can move to something better, then send us off on an ice floe---never to be heard from again.

I do hope I am hearing this incorrectly.

[Roz]

Ruth,

 

I know exactly what you're talking about. Many years I don't get a raise at my state government job. However, the legislature has never failed to give state pension fund retirees a COLA, and the same is often true of SS recipients. Makes you wonder who's actually living on a fixed income. :confused:

 

Roz

[3rdGenCunarder]

A lot of people in the 45-60 age range are putting children thru college at this stage in their life. I'm puzzled by "suite travelers", because each ship has a limited number of suites. There are more non-suites than suites. Given HAL's criteria, to me there would seem to only be a very small number/percentage of travelers interested in cruising that they're targeting.

 

Roz

 

Yes, paying for college definitely impacts the cash flow in many households of that age range.

 

I agree that there are far more nonsuite accommodations than suites. Perhaps if Mr Ashford had toured all of HAL's various classes of ship, he might have a better idea of what it is he's selling. I always thought the number one rule of sales is know your product.