Shame on Carnival as thousands stand on the pier

[FSHLOT]

CCL's downward spiral continues!!!

 

That really sucks for those passengers. The suits are wayyyy more important then the paying customer....Sad

[Lottacruises]

I'm beginning to think the OP is a lawyer.... but still, I agree completely...

 

 

[wytygr8]

No one here has provided any reason to believe that Carnival knew this would happen. So it happened before. So what? They likely changed how they handled things because of that and thought they had the problems fixed.

[jimbo5544]

1 hour ago, FSHLOT said:

CCL's downward spiral continues!!!

 

That really sucks for those passengers. The suits are wayyyy more important then the paying customer....Sad

LOL, comedy hour is in session, we must be in full downward spiral now....

[Chyna3032]

11 hours ago, jimbo5544 said:

Who the heck is Tom Joyner

He is a highly respected radio DJ that has been doing a cruise for 20 years to raise scholarship money for HBCU's.  

[Chyna3032]

I was on the April 7th sailing of the Carnival Magic for the Tom Joyner Fantastic Voyage.  And guess what, our boarding was delayed as well.  People that were at the port to board during their scheduled boarding time text and called many of us that had later boarding times telling us not to come because they were standing outside in a line that wasn't even moving.  I had never seen a line so long when I got there.  And guess what we got, $0 onboard credit.  Another thing that Carnival is failing to mention is that our ship had returned back way ahead of schedule because we had a medical emergency on board so we had been in the port since at least around 3 or 4 am!  The people that got off the ship early had no problems and many were at the airport by 8 am, literally.  What caused the issue was the bridge becoming detached from the ship.  Now tell me, how many times does the bridge get attached to the ship for embarkation and disembarkation...every time right?  Well someone didn't do their job and it could have ended in an absolute tragedy.  They had to stop disembarkation for over an hour and they also stopped everyone from getting off because of the luggage debacle.  The luggage tag numbers were not in their appropriate groups.  3's were with 20's etc.  Many of us came off and had to look in luggage that was all piled together that was in no order and also had to check the belt.  Many people were delayed and missed flights because there was no organization to the luggage.  Again, not our fault.  But I will say this, they do book this cruise each year because it's guaranteed money for them. Over a million that they receive up front!  They should definitely take the necessary steps to make sure that things run smoothly for us as well as the passengers that are boarding after we get off the ship.  In this case because of the issues they had with the bridge, they new early enough that there would be delays in boarding of their next guests. 

[Joebucks]

Just curious, did all of these people who showed up at 11 am have an 11 am checkin window or did they just go on because "they know you can" get on that early? I get the excitement of wanting to get onboard early and start vacation, but this is one of many reasons I don't. I don't know that there's going to be a big suit against Carnival because of a delay of a few hours. How many businesses are obligated to refund a portion of the service due to a delay?

[sanmarcosman]

4 minutes ago, Chyna3032 said:

I was on the April 7th sailing of the Carnival Magic for the Tom Joyner Fantastic Voyage.  And guess what, our boarding was delayed as well.  People that were at the port to board during their scheduled boarding time text and called many of us that had later boarding times telling us not to come because they were standing outside in a line that wasn't even moving.  I had never seen a line so long when I got there.  And guess what we got, $0 onboard credit.  Another thing that Carnival is failing to mention is that our ship had returned back way ahead of schedule because we had a medical emergency on board so we had been in the port since at least around 3 or 4 am!  The people that got off the ship early had no problems and many were at the airport by 8 am, literally.  What caused the issue was the bridge becoming detached from the ship.  Now tell me, how many times does the bridge get attached to the ship for embarkation and disembarkation...every time right?  Well someone didn't do their job and it could have ended in an absolute tragedy.  They had to stop disembarkation for over an hour and they also stopped everyone from getting off because of the luggage debacle.  The luggage tag numbers were not in their appropriate groups.  3's were with 20's etc.  Many of us came off and had to look in luggage that was all piled together that was in no order and also had to check the belt.  Many people were delayed and missed flights because there was no organization to the luggage.  Again, not our fault.  But I will say this, they do book this cruise each year because it's guaranteed money for them. Over a million that they receive up front!  They should definitely take the necessary steps to make sure that things run smoothly for us as well as the passengers that are boarding after we get off the ship.  In this case because of the issues they had with the bridge, they new early enough that there would be delays in boarding of their next guests. 

The bridge is the area where the ship is commanded from. Perhaps you are referring to the gangway. Regardless, what a mess.

[Elaine5715]

10 hours ago, Squadleader said:

You're actually making my point. Everybody knows cruises start boarding around 11am, so that's when everyone shows up. No one shows up earlier because there's no point. 

 

If Carnival had said we've got a charter cruise prior to this and we won't begin boarding until 5pm, those people would not have been on that pier since 11am. If there was a strike, or a security issue, or a mechanical failure, yes, I agree it's not Carnivals fault. 

 

But in this case Carnival knew the boarding was going to be hours late and rather than tarnish the April 14th cruise with an announced late start, they chose to pretend they didn't know and put thousands of people on the pier for hours.

 

It was cheaper to allow this to happen and then pay some onboard credits than take the hit on tarnishing the cruise, or starting the cruise the next day. Carnival deliberately deceived those passengers into standing on that pier knowing full well embarkation would be hours late, and Carnival knew that months in advance.

 

 

People show up at 8 am to board.  

[Chyna3032]

1 minute ago, sanmarcosman said:

The bridge is the area where the ship is commanded from. Perhaps you are referring to the gangway. Regardless, what a mess.

Gang way, bridge...but yes.  Pardon my misuse of terms. 

[Chyna3032]

Also, our delay in disembarkation started around 9:00 am.  Carnival had plenty of time to tell the passengers about the boarding delay because they couldn't get us off. 

[Keys2Heaven]

OP: Thanks for your detailed analysis, but what do you want us to do about it?

 

Do you want us to be as equally upset as you are?

Do you want us to stop cruising Carnival?

Do you want us to continue to rant against Carnival in your thread?

I rarely see the value of posts such as this.

 

 

[TNcruising02]

1 minute ago, Keys2Heaven said:

OP: Thanks for your detailed analysis, but what do you want us to do about it?

 

Do you want us to be as equally upset as you are?

Do you want us to stop cruising Carnival?

Do you want us to continue to rant against Carnival in your thread?

I rarely see the value of posts such as this.

 

 

 I think the value of the original post is to let people know that there is a risk booking the week after a cruise like this.  I am glad to know.

[Doggielover68]

Fun fact: Florida has sun and people have to be outside sometimes. No one forced you to continue standing in line for hours. 

 

If you can't tolerate warm temperatures, why are you going on a Caribbean cruise anyway?

[Keys2Heaven]

5 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

 I think the value of the original post is to let people know that there is a risk booking the week after a cruise like this.  I am glad to know.

 

But how many actually KNOW that there is a cruise like this the week before??? I doubt many knew of this at all. The OP even eluded to as much by stating that Carnival didn't want to cut a night off of the cruise.

 

Edited April 18, 2019 by Keys2Heaven

[TNcruising02]

1 minute ago, Keys2Heaven said:

 

But how many actually KNOW that there is a cruise like this the week before??? I doubt many knew of this at all. The OP even eluded to as much by not cutting a night off of the cruise.

Isn't this cruise done every year?  Looking into special cruises the previous week before my possible vacation week might be something I need to consider before booking.

[schazzy]

4 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Isn't this cruise done every year?  Looking into special cruises the previous week before my possible vacation week might be something I need to consider before booking.

 

Here's one place to check

 

https://carnivalcruisecharters.com/

[Joebucks]

19 minutes ago, Keys2Heaven said:

 

But how many actually KNOW that there is a cruise like this the week before??? I doubt many knew of this at all. The OP even eluded to as much by stating that Carnival didn't want to cut a night off of the cruise.

 

 

Or even easier, understand that things happen. Any cruise ship can be delayed during embarkation or debarkation. Weather, medical emergencies, security, and more, it happens. Either plan for that, or learn to deal with it when it does happen. No amount of a cruise line "doing something about it" can prevent it from happening completely. Don't expect to show up and board at the earliest possible time and get mad when that doesn't happen.

 

Maybe I'm looking at it wrong. At 11 am I can still be on vacation without having to be on the boat asap. At that time, I am usually in my hotel still, pool, or enjoying the port. My room isn't even ready then and I'm not paying extra to get to a room two hours early during chaos time.

[Keys2Heaven]

16 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

 

Or even easier, understand that things happen. Any cruise ship can be delayed during embarkation or debarkation. Weather, medical emergencies, security, and more, it happens. Either plan for that, or learn to deal with it when it does happen. No amount of a cruise line "doing something about it" can prevent it from happening completely. Don't expect to show up and board at the earliest possible time and get mad when that doesn't happen.

 

Maybe I'm looking at it wrong. At 11 am I can still be on vacation without having to be on the boat asap. At that time, I am usually in my hotel still, pool, or enjoying the port. My room isn't even ready then and I'm not paying extra to get to a room two hours early during chaos time.

 

I feel ya. I get that the OP was upset (even though indirectly), but just spouting off here does what exactly? If the goal is to bring awareness to charter cruises and the potential issues that surround them, that's fine. But, if the goal is to rant and expect everyone else to join in, then why? I guess this is the "critic" part of Cruise Critic, huh? May I suggest to the OP that if they are that troubled by this to channel that into a letter to corporate as well.

I guess I'm a "fixer." When I hear people spout off on issue, I'm hoping they've thought it through enough to suggest possible solutions. When they don't present any, then I make the assumption they want me (as a reader) to fix it for them. I don't see how I or anyone else can in this case, unless every single person going on a cruise does their due diligence and knows which cruises are charters and, as a result, know that this can be an issue when embarking.

[ProgRockCruiser]

55 minutes ago, schazzy said:

 

Here's one place to check

 

https://carnivalcruisecharters.com/

 

Some good info about some charter cruises, but as already mentioned, the Tom Joyner Fantastic Voyage is apparently booked for next year already, and possibly the year after, but aren't listed on that site.  So anyone looking to book the week after wouldn't be able to discern that their embarkation may be delayed.

 

Obviously Carnival doesn't want to wait a whole day between these types of cruises because it will cost them revenue and extra port fees.  But I do think, for the cruise immediately following, they should automatically schedule embarkation later, say 3pm start instead of 11am, departing the port at 8pm or something, with a slightly discounted fare.  That way everyone knows what they are getting into, even if the reason isn't obvious.

Edited April 18, 2019 by ProgRockCruiser

[Cruiser_1977]

I had a whole post written with a bunch of points. However, it's over and done and none of it really matters.

 

My biggest question: There was free transportation offered beginning at 12pm to the Bayside Mall. WHY did people not get on the buses? From that point it was a CHOICE (personal responsibility) to stand there.

Edited April 18, 2019 by JennyB1977

[schazzy]

7 minutes ago, JennyB1977 said:

I had a whole post written with a bunch of points. However, it's over and done and none of it really matters.

 

This has been me on a few different occasions.

 

10 minutes ago, JennyB1977 said:

My biggest question: There was free transportation offered beginning at 12pm to the Bayside Mall. WHY did people not get on the buses? From that point it was a CHOICE (personal responsibility) to stand there.

 

I'm with you on this, if I had to guess, it was because they had a really good place in line and didn't want to miss crowding into the terminal as soon as they started boarding. If my DH and I had been in this situation, we'd gone to where there was AC and refreshments and waited it out. I understand wanting to get on ASAP, but sometimes it ain't worth it. 

[Squadleader]

I'm a practical person, I fully understand and accept when you're unloading and loading thousands of people in a four hour window every single week, things can occasionally go wrong. My family and I love cruising and we accept that. 

 

What makes this case different is Carnival knew this was going to happen the moment Tom Joyner chartered the ship. 

 

It's a very tough job to turn a ship around every week, and they have it down to a science, and don't waste a single minute. 

 

When you book a charter that has stages, sound equipment and all the other special things this charter had, Carnival knew from the get go this turnaround was going to be several hours late. 

 

Carnival used the get out of jail card that covers unforseen circumstances, to knowingly sell the April 14 cruise as normal, when they were fully aware it was not going to be normal. 

 

That's all I'm talking about, they knowingly defrauded all the passengers who booked the April 14th sailing, then tried to put that that fraud in the category of unforseen events.

 

It's Carnivals ship, they had to to approve all the extra equipment being added to the ship, they were entirely involved in the process. They were fully aware of the delays it was going to cause, they're experts, the largest cruise line in the world with over a hundred ships under their different brands. 

 

As one of the April 7th passengers noted, even they were delayed several hours on embarking because of the equipment work. 

 

My thought is all an attorney would have to show is these delays were known to Carnival from the beginning, which removes it from the purview of unforseen events. 

 

As to the purpose of this post, how can it help? 

 

Carnival did this because they've done it before and got away with it. They'll continue to do it until they're called out on it. 

 

In my line of work, if I knowingly misrepresent something to you and sell it to you, I'm liable. 

 

Perhaps it's naive of me to even make this post, perhaps it's useless, but I think when someone knowingly defrauds another person they should be punished. Not so much to compensate those passengers on the pier, but to change a policy that allows Carnival to use the reasonable unforseen clause, to cover up the willful fraud of selling a cruise as normal, when they knew all along it was going to be hours late embarking. 

 

What really goads me, is that to use the unforseen clause to cover up this fraud, it requires Carnival to act surprised when it happens, which means corporate has to let all those people stand on the pier for hours so they can say "oh goodness, how unexpected all this is!". They actually used the people they defrauded as props to their "oh what a surprise defence". If Carnival had announced that morning, or sent an email the week before saying "oh by the way, we had a charter last week, and we're going to be six hours late embarking", it would remove the fraud from the protection of the unforseen events clause. 

 

I am not an attorney, but I understand motivation, and I've been in business my whole life, and this is a clear case of a foreseen event being labeled unforeseen. 

 

I haven't done the research, that's why those passengers should get a lawyer, but I've got a feeling this happens every time there's a charter that involves more than just people, like in this case, stages and sound equipment. 

 

This isn't the end of the world, but it's so willful and blatant, that I think after all these years, a stop should be put to his practice. 

 

A lawyer should drag them into court and let Carnival explain this practice to a judge, or better yet, Carnival should man up and say in the past we've misjudged turnarounds on charters and starting today that stops. Any known embarkation delay will be noted in the booking information, so passengers have the right to decide for themselves if they want to book that particular cruise. 

 

I dare say there's not a single one of us that would not agree that if you're going to sell me a cruise, that you know has some unusual aspect to it, it should be disclosed, that's only fair. 

 

The only reason not to disclose it is because you recognize you're not offering the normal value to me you usually do, and you intend to make me pay a price I would not, if I knew the facts. The fact you don't want to tell me proves that point. It's true a truncated cruise would have to be discounted to sell it, but again, that proves the motivation for the fraud. 

 

The best possible outcome to this is that the passengers currently on the Magic hear about this, and find a lawyer to represent them. Just one energetic passenger who lives in South Florida could ramrod shopping this to attorneys in South Florida, and seeing if they could find an attorney to take it on a contingency basis, so all the aggrieved passengers could sign up to the case for free. This isn't about the money, the injury is too small, it's about stopping this fraudulent policy at Carnival and other lines as well.

 

If those passengers were able to share their contact information either right now on the cruise, or even here after returning, that would make holding Carnival accountable possible. 

 

If a cruise line knows, or should have known, a significant scheduling event will affect a cruise, they should be required to disclose it. 

 

My guess is that if no one has ever called them out on this before, it'll be very easy to prove they knew this was going to happen because they've probably been very sloppy about the cover-up, since they haven't been challenged before. 

 

In this case, the Tom Joyner charter, they've been doing this charter for years. On another thread, a person said their 2015 cruise after the Tom Joyner charter also had the same kind of delay as the this year. My guess is it happens every year. 

 

I hope someone on the current April 14th cruise gets wind of this, and runs with the ball! It'll be a blessing to all future passengers. 

 

[ray98]

LOL....why does society try to spin everything that doesn't go perfect into the worst thing ever?  Drama queens.

[JaniceB]

Thanks for the link