Guaranteed cabin and rci have downgraded us

[FionaMG]

5 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Don’t book a guarantee cabin and you’ll have nothing to worry about. 

On the three occasions we have booked a guarantee it's been because it was the only option available for the type of cabin we wanted on the date we were able to travel. Not necessarily the case for the OP,  but sometimes you just can't avoid them.

I'm glad to report that we had no issues with our guarantee bookings.

[chrisb74]

8 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Don’t book a guarantee cabin and you’ll have nothing to worry about. 

 

Seriously. Guarantee is right there in the name - it's not hard to expect it be honoured. 

 

 

[cruisinfanatic]

14 minutes ago, chrisb74 said:

 

Seriously. Guarantee is right there in the name - it's not hard to expect it be honoured. 

 

 

See post 97

[Biker19]

9 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Don’t book a guarantee cabin and you’ll have nothing to worry about. 

As was mentioned a couple times in this thread, booking a cabin directly does not totally eliminate the remote possibility of being bumped - OP having a GTY booking probably had little bearing on why they were bumped.

[Starry Eyes]

15 hours ago, mayleeman said:

 

An issue ignored by almost everyone is that the OP booked the GTY OV last October. How many believe that theirs was the last booking in that category? 

 

So, knowing whether or not RCI acted in bad faith would depend on knowing how many others selected GTY OV, how many of these booked after the OP did, and how RCI went about assigning GTY OV cabins during the 7 months before the OP ended up shunted to an IC. 

 

The fact that they ended up last in the game of musical cabins is inconsistent, it seems, with when they booked if it was indeed an overbooking issue. Overbooking should have resulted in the last booked GTY being the one left out in the cold. It is far more likely that RCI overlooked their booking deliberately (OP has no C&A status, after all) or inadvertently--only RCI knows, of course. And when the omission was found, sure, chalk it up to overbooking, the catchall that excuses glaring mistakes, ignored bookings, and, I think, intentional lies.

The contract seems to indicate they can downgrade anybody.  As I have previously expressed, I believe they should seek volunteers.  Alas, the cruiseline did not do so, they picked the OP.  I see nothing that says they are obligated to pick the last booking.  

In this case they seem to have selected the last booking to be assigned a cabin.  So in this case holding the last unassigned gty booking turned out poorly for the OP (since they disliked the compensation package offered).  Most times, being the last unassigned booking turns out, OK, as one gets exactly what is promised.  Once in a while, though, being the last unassigned gty booking is great as one gets an upgrade when the promised category is sold out and a better category is available.

 

I have been on many cruises, including plenty of gty bookings, all without a hitch.  Even after this thread I will continue to be willing to book gty if need be.  When I do, I will be perfectly happy to be the last one assigned, knowing it increases my odds of an upgrade.  And even if I do not get an upgrade, due to the the Royal Up bidding program, some very nice cabins are among those reassigned at the last minute, not just picked over poor cabins.

[Biker19]

Just now, Starry Eyes said:

 As I have previously expressed, I believe they should seek volunteers.  

They usually do - we have reports of calls like that.

[Ourusualbeach]

2 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

They usually do - we have reports of calls like that.

I can personally vouch for that. 

[mayleeman]

2 hours ago, Biker19 said:

They usually do - we have reports of calls like that.

Very encouraging, @Biker19.  But no tagline at the end, Biker, "who always adds a pithy and amusing tag on the subject"? 

[nelblu]

4 hours ago, Starry Eyes said:

The contract seems to indicate they can downgrade anybody.  As I have previously expressed, I believe they should seek volunteers.  Alas, the cruiseline did not do so, they picked the OP.  I see nothing that says they are obligated to pick the last booking.  

In this case they seem to have selected the last booking to be assigned a cabin.  So in this case holding the last unassigned gty booking turned out poorly for the OP (since they disliked the compensation package offered).  Most times, being the last unassigned booking turns out, OK, as one gets exactly what is promised.  Once in a while, though, being the last unassigned gty booking is great as one gets an upgrade when the promised category is sold out and a better category is available.

 

 

How do we know that the Op was the last unassigned booking.  As intimated in my earlier post, could RCL show preferential treatment to those that booked directly with them.

Edited May 25, 2019 by nelblu

[legaljen1969]

14 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Don’t book a guarantee cabin and you’ll have nothing to worry about. 

I won’t. No worries here. 

 

[Starry Eyes]

1 hour ago, nelblu said:

How do we know that the Op was the last unassigned booking.  As intimated in my earlier post, could RCL show preferential treatment to those that booked directly with them.

Perhaps “one of or the last gty bookings still not assigned a cabin number” would have been a more accurate (though longer) phrase since the roster is unknown to all of us.  Again, the point of my post is that is is often advantageous to be among the last gty passengers to be assigned a cabin....not that I have a choice, but I’ll happily wait until last for my assignment, thank you, as I believe the odds of an upgrade are better closer to sailing than many weeks out.  And, as a flexible person, I am willing to listen to reasonable compensation offers if something did go awry at the last minute.

 

Hypothetically they could show preferential treatment to any group...maybe those who book before 10am are treated better than those who book after 2 pm.   I see no advantage for the cruiseline would select a TA booked guest specifically for this treatment over a directly booked guest.  The cruiseline risks not only upsetting the guest but also upsetting the TA...if that happens, the agent may tell the story to other clients, steering them to other cruiselines or trips. More business is apt to be at risk by displacing a TA affiliated guest than an independent guest.

Edited May 25, 2019 by Starry Eyes

[Mdepfl]

On 5/24/2019 at 9:00 AM, fscool said:

According to the RCL UK site (where the OP booked, I believe) what RCL has done is violate their own marketing and advertising program.

 

https://www.royalcaribbean.co.uk/discover-cruise-holidays/guarantee-rooms/

 

RCL is not being truthful with how they are operating.  You cannot bait and switch like this.  

 

Excellent find!  “You’re always guaranteed a room in your category” right there for all to see. Two words:  ALWAYS, and GUARANTEED. Unambiguous, and I don’t give a d*mn about some pdf somewhere. 

 

Royal sells guarantees at a discount to give itself flexibility. You give up choice for some money. Its an agreement. 

 

Royal (who I love) has decided they want BOTH the flexibility AND full price for the cabin you guaranteed.  “Yes, we sold you the guarantee but John and Mary are here now and will pay full price for that last cabin.  Shouldn’t have trusted us, we have way too many MBA’s around here. “

 

C’mon, even the RCCL cheerleaders here should see that. 

 

 

[little britain]

I hope the OP comes back and tells us how it panned out.....?

[Starry Eyes]

1 hour ago, Mdepfl said:

 

 

Royal sells guarantees at a discount to give itself flexibility. You give up choice for some money. Its an agreement. 

 

Royal (who I love) has decided they want BOTH the flexibility AND full price for the cabin you guaranteed.  “Yes, we sold you the guarantee but John and Mary are here now and will pay full price for that last cabin.  Shouldn’t have trusted us, we have way too many MBA’s around here. “

 

C’mon, even the RCCL cheerleaders here should see that. 

 

 

Must you presume a wicked motive and create evil quotations for a company you love?   Could you consider instead the possibility that this was inadvertent (such as a mechanical issue suddenly rendering one or more cabins unusable or a computer glitch caught too late)?  We certainly do not know that the OP paid the lowest fare of all the OV booking; shear odds make it unlikely the OP hit fare low point 8 months out.  And if the company were doing as you suggest on any substantial scale, wouldn’t we be reading about it here constantly?  Tens of thousands of people sail with RCI every single week, so the number of opportunities for the revenue enhancements you suggest are vast...and the guests would be dismayed enough to search the internet for information, to reach out for advice, and to post complaints somewhere....this is a popular forum, yet we see such threads only rarely.  Overbooked airplane announcements are very common; overbooked RCI cruise or category complaints seem uncommon.

[TravelerThom]

1 hour ago, Mdepfl said:

 

Excellent find!  “You’re always guaranteed a room in your category” right there for all to see. Two words:  ALWAYS, and GUARANTEED. Unambiguous, and I don’t give a d*mn about some pdf somewhere. 

 

30 minutes ago, Starry Eyes said:

Must you presume a wicked motive and create evil quotations for a company you love?   Could you consider instead the possibility that this was inadvertent (such as a mechanical issue suddenly rendering one or more cabins unusable or a computer glitch caught too late)?  We certainly do not know that the OP paid the lowest fare of all the OV booking; shear odds make it unlikely the OP hit fare low point 8 months out.  And if the company were doing as you suggest on any substantial scale, wouldn’t we be reading about it here constantly?  Tens of thousands of people sail with RCI every single week, so the number of opportunities for the revenue enhancements you suggest are vast...and the guests would be dismayed enough to search the internet for information, to reach out for advice, and to post complaints somewhere....this is a popular forum, yet we see such threads only rarely.  Overbooked airplane announcements are very common; overbooked RCI cruise or category complaints seem uncommon.

I can guarantee that companies can find volunteers IF they give SUFFICIENT compensation. Companies HATE additional government regulation. Obviously the OP did not consider their compensation sufficient, but RCI’s position was “too bad”. Screw your customers enough and eventually some government regulator is going to step in (ask the US and EU airlines). I have no sympathy for companies that whine about government regulation they brought on themselves. 

[Mdepfl]

7 hours ago, Starry Eyes said:

And if the company were doing as you suggest on any substantial scale, wouldn’t we be reading about it here constantly?

 

Here’s the thing:  I fear they’re just getting started.  

 

Just think of the investment involved in their current/future fleet.  It wasn’t a plugged toilet, it was greed - choosing to maximize revenue over p1ssing off a customer who, by the way, has prepaid likely without any recourse other than sail or lose the money!  And it wasn’t the person in the cabin assignment office either, that person was following policies set on the top floor. 

 

Do you truly believe Royal just innocently ran out of the guaranteed cabins?

 

Yes I love Royal. Started in 1986 on the Song of Norway. You’re never safer on the water than when sailing with Norwegians.

[Biker19]

29 minutes ago, Mdepfl said:

Do you truly believe Royal just innocently ran out of the guaranteed cabins?

Do you believe they would intentionally bump someone which costs them $500 and a bunch of ill will?

[TravelerThom]

46 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

Do you believe they would intentionally bump someone which costs them $500 and a bunch of ill will?

Short answer: YES

Longer answer: I don’t think it is costing RCI $500; the downgrade refund was paid for (and perhaps a lot more) by the people who did get the cabin; and unless the OBC is allowed too be cashed out and is cashed out it is costing RCI way less than $300. As long as RCI keeps their occupancy rate above 100% they don’t care about ill will as it is not affecting their bottom line. 

[Biker19]

2 hours ago, TravelerThom said:

Short answer: YES

Longer answer: I don’t think it is costing RCI $500; the downgrade refund was paid for (and perhaps a lot more) by the people who did get the cabin; and unless the OBC is allowed too be cashed out and is cashed out it is costing RCI way less than $300. As long as RCI keeps their occupancy rate above 100% they don’t care about ill will as it is not affecting their bottom line. 

This assumes someone is actually in some OV meant for the OP - what if that cabin is simply not available (for mechanical reasons)?

Also, OBC given in situations like this is typically refundable. 

 

[TravelerThom]

31 minutes ago, Biker19 said:

This assumes someone is actually in some OV meant for the OP - what if that cabin is simply not available (for mechanical reasons)?

Also, OBC given in situations like this is typically refundable. 

Your question was:

3 hours ago, Biker19 said:

Do you believe they would intentionally bump someone which costs them $500 and a bunch of ill will?

My answer remains YES. A company that accepts non-refundable deposits and then turns around and charters the ship out from under you, would most certainly intentionally bump passengers. Until it impacts their bottom line they will do whatever they want. When US regulators finally step in with EU type regulations RCCL will whine big time but still refuse to acknowledge that the industry brought it on themselves by not treating customers right. 

[Biker19]

14 minutes ago, TravelerThom said:

When US regulators finally step in with EU type regulations RCCL will whine big time but still refuse to acknowledge that the industry brought it on themselves by not treating customers right. 

And at that point US customers will end up with EU T&C and prices. 

 

Biker, who would prefer taking chances with being bumped vs being forced into EU  rules and prices. 

[notladjr]

I know one thing, this thread has discouraged me from ever wanting to book a guarantee cabin if the cruise lines can bump people down from whatever catagory cabin they supposedly havea guarantee for. Scary.

 

I was offered a free cruise last month on a different cruise line if I booked an inside cabin guarantee. We had just gotten off a cruise a couple of months before and have a big European cruise and vacation coming up in a few months so we took them up on this free offer. My first ever guarantee cabin. I was nervous as all get out and then about 10 days before our cruise we were assinged a midship handicap accessible cabin. Perfectly located where I would have picked a cabin. My biggest fear had been the cabin would be below one of the very loud music venues that was active until late at night.

 

When we got there the cabin was very large, almost like a suite. We loved it. We got settled in then that night the phone rang and guest services said that after boarding some guests had informed them they needed a handicap accessible cabin and they wanted to know if we needed one. I told them no but that we were very pleased with the location of the cabin and the extra space. I then asked him how in the world someone could wait until they actually boarded the ship to decide they needed an accessible cabin. He said he didn't know, that he was just trying to accomodate the customer. He said they would put us in an UPGRADED cabin, an oceanview one. He name the deck (below the water line - something I avoid) and i instantly knew he was talking about a cabin directly underneath the music venue as I had feared we would get. Sure enough that was the case. Clearly the last cabins someone with any knowledge would book. I told guest services I did not want to be on deck 1 or 2 or beneath a music venue. I was hoping maybe they would come back with a decend location / cabin in which case I would have been cooperative. I did not tell him that though as I wanted that to come from them voluntarily. I also want to point out that if he had given me a good explanation of why at the lst minute, hours after boarding, someone needed our cabin I would have given it up. They said they would check into some alternatives and get back with me. I never heard from them again the entire cruise.

Edited May 27, 2019 by notladjr

[Ourusualbeach]

10 hours ago, TravelerThom said:

Your question was:

My answer remains YES. A company that accepts non-refundable deposits and then turns around and charters the ship out from under you, would most certainly intentionally bump passengers. Until it impacts their bottom line they will do whatever they want. When US regulators finally step in with EU type regulations RCCL will whine big time but still refuse to acknowledge that the industry brought it on themselves by not treating customers right. 

The OP was from the UK.  Looks like the EU rules and regulations didn’t help them.  

[shopaholic6]

5 hours ago, notladjr said:

I know one thing, this thread has discouraged me from ever wanting to book a guarantee cabin if the cruise lines can bump people down from whatever catagory cabin they supposedly havea guarantee for. Scary.

 

I was offered a free cruise last month on a different cruise line if I booked an inside cabin guarantee. We had just gotten off a cruise a couple of months before and have a big European cruise and vacation coming up in a few months so we took them up on this free offer. My first ever guarantee cabin. I was nervous as all get out and then about 10 days before our cruise we were assinged a midship handicap accessible cabin. Perfectly located where I would have picked a cabin. My biggest fear had been the cabin would be below one of the very loud music venues that was active until late at night.

 

When we got there the cabin was very large, almost like a suite. We loved it. We got settled in then that night the phone rang and guest services said that after boarding some guests had informed them they needed a handicap accessible cabin and they wanted to know if we needed one. I told them no but that we were very pleased with the location of the cabin and the extra space. I then asked him how in the world someone could wait until they actually boarded the ship to decide they needed an accessible cabin. He said he didn't know, that he was just trying to accomodate the customer. He said they would put us in an UPGRADED cabin, an oceanview one. He name the deck (below the water line - something I avoid) and i instantly knew he was talking about a cabin directly underneath the music venue as I had feared we would get. Sure enough that was the case. Clearly the last cabins someone with any knowledge would book. I told guest services I did not want to be on deck 1 or 2 or beneath a music venue. I was hoping maybe they would come back with a decend location / cabin in which case I would have been cooperative. I did not tell him that though as I wanted that to come from them voluntarily. I also want to point out that if he had given me a good explanation of why at the lst minute, hours after boarding, someone needed our cabin I would have given it up. They said they would check into some alternatives and get back with me. I never heard from them again the entire cruise.

 Wow - which ship and deck has ocean view cabins below the water line?

[Saab4444]

This is one case, funny how it develops into a big Royal strategy discussion...