Family's statement on toddler's cruise death

[nafanny29]

So tragically someone threw their gran-daughter off the ship, out of a high open window, all be it "as claimed" by a big accident, and somehow its the cruise lines fault.  ***** seriously!!! 

 

 

[zqvol]

Tragic event, but let's put the blame where it really lies - on the grndfather, he put the child there and should have been able to tell that there was no glass. This is in no way RCCL's fault.

[cruise52]

44 minutes ago, nafanny29 said:

So tragically someone threw their gran-daughter off the ship, out of a high open window, all be it "as claimed" by a big accident, and somehow its the cruise lines fault.  ***** seriously!!! 

 

 

Seriously?  No one knows if the grandfather has vision issues.  Maybe he couldn't easily discern that it was an open window or see it as well as you or me.  Maybe they were all so excited and distracted getting on the cruise that he wasn't as attentive as he should have been.  Maybe an attorney was hired because grandpa was worried he could be prosecuted for dropping his grand daughter to her death.  I don't believe the cruise line was negligent, but I also don't believe this family is making up a story or that they are now trying to profit from this tragedy.  Accidents happen and We all make mistakes from time to time.  I truly feel for this family, but I'm shocked at how cold and judgmental people are that have no idea what actually occurred.  Who knows what details were first provided or by whom and if they were just plain wrong.  

[Maya1234]

As an attorney I was surprised that they had an attorney making these kind of statements so quickly. But then one of my partners pointed out that Puerto Rico authorities had been quoted as saying the grandfather was under investigation. My partner used to be a criminal defense attorney and said that under the circumstances here he might advise someone like the grandfather to hire a civil attorney too to try to make a strong argument that he was not at fault and thus even if the family had no interest in a civil lawsuit against Royal Caribbean this was a smart move from a criminal defense standpoint. 

[NLH Arizona]

13 minutes ago, cruise52 said:

 Maybe an attorney was hired because grandpa was worried he could be prosecuted for dropping his grand daughter to her death.  

I seriously doubt they would hire a maritime lawyer for the Grandfather; it would be a regular criminal attorney.

[cruise52]

And maybe they didn't go in search of hiring an attorney but he offered his services.  Attorneys are known to do just that.  Some sit and wait for a tragic event.  Would you turn legal representation away in a situation as horrible as this if offered?

 

My point was none of us know the full story and many are rushing to judgment and speculating. All we really know is that a young toddler fell to her death and the family is surely devastated.  

Edited July 10, 2019 by cruise52
Spelling

[nextcruiseis]

13 minutes ago, NLH Arizona said:

I seriously doubt they would hire a maritime lawyer for the Grandfather; it would be a regular criminal attorney.

 

 

The attorney said they do exclusively civil litigation & maritime law.  One of the (unseen) reporters asked very good questions.

 

https://www.metro.pr/pr/noticias/2019/07/09/abogado-de-nina-que-murio-en-crucero-asegura-que-el-abuelo-no-la-dejo-caer.html

 

Edited July 10, 2019 by nextcruiseis
Added information

[Outerdog]

45 minutes ago, cruise52 said:

Seriously?  No one knows if the grandfather has vision issues

 

Yep. I always give my baby to her blind grandfather whenever we're around fall hazards.

[cruise52]

2 minutes ago, Outerdog said:

 

Yep. I always give my baby to her blind grandfather whenever we're around fall hazards.

I didn't say he was blind, only suggested that his vision might be such that he didn't easily notice the window open.  Maybe he had sunglasses on and this impacted his ability to see the tinted glass wasn't there. (Window opened)  Again, no one knows exactly what happened.  

[MCAT48]

I read that they are now looking to prosecute the grandfather for the child’s death. So sad however it ends up. 

[Maya1234]

2 hours ago, NLH Arizona said:

I seriously doubt they would hire a maritime lawyer for the Grandfather; it would be a regular criminal attorney.

The criminal attorney I know suspects that they did hire a criminal attorney who recommended that they also hire a maritime attorney to make the argument from a civil perspective that the cruise line was at fault. Not because they really expect that suit to be successful but to bolster the position in the criminal investigation. 

Edited July 10, 2019 by Maya1234

[dexddd]

12 hours ago, david_sobe said:

Horrible story.  I could not even begin to imagine the grief.

I don't understand exactly what happened and have not seen the railing or open window.  But I don't understand the weak analogy of the lawyer comparing a cruise ship with a hockey arena and admitting the baby was placed in a dangerous place claiming a visual that is not there.  Its just not logical.    I thought the other car had a stop sign (but its not there).

The lawyer is using the analogy that the child banged on glass at hockey rink to doing it on the ship was normal.  I'd not say weak but angle to sue.  Heck, they dug up that video pretty quick of hockey rink to show on Today show.

[newmexicoNita]

14 hours ago, mizLORInj said:

Yes I saw this in the news.  Heartbreaking.  I cannot imagine how they feel.   Makes me want to cry.  

Me too and I only saw it at the bottom of the screen on our TV. I was wanting to hear the details. I wonder if we will ever have all the details. Just think of how the entire family must feel. 😢

[newmexicoNita]

11 hours ago, Birdie And Sue said:

ON the news today the mother was complaining that it was the cruise liens fault since there were no warning signs.  Seriously?  A warning sign that  saying "do not put your infant on a ledge 150' above a concrete pier'...  Of course some sleaze ball lawyer will take the case to try to put money hie pocket off of someone else's misery. 

and we all know, regardless of what happened the family will end up winning a case against Royal Caribbean. This whole thing is just too sad for words. 

[RedwingHockeyFan]

11 hours ago, PTC DAWG said:

Me, I don’t see a cruise as a place for a toddler, much less a baby....fire away of you wish. 

 

I took my son on his first cruise when he was 2, so a bit bigger than a toddler.  If you like taking your kids on cruises it is fine but you have to be smart.

[Peachypooh]

I have been on a sister ship of the one these people were on. It was very evident when one of

those windows were opened for ventilation. This is a terrible horrible thing to have happened. 
 

[TSUmom]

My heart goes out to the family but to pass the blame on the cruise line is wrong.  It is so sad that people cast blame on everything else but themselves.  I understand they are probably traumatized by what has happened and the poor grandfather will live with this the rest of his life but to put a baby up on a ship railing and not realizing the window was open.....I can not figure that one out.

[Jasonmom]

10 hours ago, cruise52 said:

Seriously?  No one knows if the grandfather has vision issues.  Maybe he couldn't easily discern that it was an open window or see it as well as you or me.  Maybe they were all so excited and distracted getting on the cruise that he wasn't as attentive as he should have been.  Maybe an attorney was hired because grandpa was worried he could be prosecuted for dropping his grand daughter to her death.  I don't believe the cruise line was negligent, but I also don't believe this family is making up a story or that they are now trying to profit from this tragedy.  Accidents happen and We all make mistakes from time to time.  I truly feel for this family, but I'm shocked at how cold and judgmental people are that have no idea what actually occurred.  Who knows what details were first provided or by whom and if they were just plain wrong.  

 

Well said.

[pe4all]

What a terrible tragedy, and my thoughts go out to the family suffering this loss.  It is apparent from the video/pictures posted that you can see the glass is tinted blue and not clear as was stated in some of the reports I read. Placing a child on a railing is dangerous in any circumstance.  The family's lawyer stating the child wanted to bang on the glass as she does at her brother's hockey games seems to be a stretch to me.  However, we live in a society that loves to place blame on everyone else, and sue at the drop of the hat.  I only hope the family (especially the grandfather, who must be suffering from incredible guilt) finds peace in the future.

[graphicguy]

13 hours ago, david_sobe said:

That is still a fairly high railing even if all of them have glass backing.  No place for a child to sit even if held on the railing.  A railing is NOT a seat. Why not find a chair or something.  An adult sitting there would be so inappropriate even with the glass backing.  Its a cruise ship railing.

Yeah...this is tragic.  Why the family is employing a lawyer is well beyond my comprehension, however.

 

Based on the statement the lawyers released, Grandpa is the one to blame here.  At the very least, he didn’t exercise an ounce of common sense.  You want to balance a baby on a thin edge of glass (which can’t be comfortable to begin with) in the hopes there is another glass panel (which the baby would fall through if the baby fell?) to catch the baby?  I cannot even make that in any way credible.

 

This almost makes the Grandfather sound like he is mentally challenged in some way, which would make this tragedy even sadder.

Edited July 10, 2019 by graphicguy

[Kingkonig]

30 minutes ago, graphicguy said:

Yeah...this is tragic.  Why the family is employing a lawyer is well beyond my comprehension, however.

 

I’m no lawyer, but I would assume that hiring a civil attorney to sue the cruise line would help his case in a criminal manslaughter/child endangerment case.  At least to some members of the jury.

[ZandZ]

12 hours ago, cruise52 said:

Seriously?  No one knows if the grandfather has vision issues.  Maybe he couldn't easily discern that it was an open window or see it as well as you or me.  Maybe they were all so excited and distracted getting on the cruise that he wasn't as attentive as he should have been.  Maybe an attorney was hired because grandpa was worried he could be prosecuted for dropping his grand daughter to her death.  I don't believe the cruise line was negligent, but I also don't believe this family is making up a story or that they are now trying to profit from this tragedy.  Accidents happen and We all make mistakes from time to time.  I truly feel for this family, but I'm shocked at how cold and judgmental people are that have no idea what actually occurred.  Who knows what details were first provided or by whom and if they were just plain wrong.  

 

11 hours ago, Maya1234 said:

As an attorney I was surprised that they had an attorney making these kind of statements so quickly. But then one of my partners pointed out that Puerto Rico authorities had been quoted as saying the grandfather was under investigation. My partner used to be a criminal defense attorney and said that under the circumstances here he might advise someone like the grandfather to hire a civil attorney too to try to make a strong argument that he was not at fault and thus even if the family had no interest in a civil lawsuit against Royal Caribbean this was a smart move from a criminal defense standpoint. 

This and This and thank you!  The local paper DID say they were looking into possible charges. 

Its an absolute tragedy.   I imagine part of trying to reconcile what just took place is trying to rationalize - not necessarily placing blame.  Having said that, I cannot imagine not seeing that the window is open, but then again, I am not an elderly person.  

 

There are cameras everywhere - we will know exactly what happened eventually..

 

[GA Dave]

1 hour ago, pe4all said:

What a terrible tragedy, and my thoughts go out to the family suffering this loss.  It is apparent from the video/pictures posted that you can see the glass is tinted blue and not clear as was stated in some of the reports I read. Placing a child on a railing is dangerous in any circumstance.  The family's lawyer stating the child wanted to bang on the glass as she does at her brother's hockey games seems to be a stretch to me.  However, we live in a society that loves to place blame on everyone else, and sue at the drop of the hat.  I only hope the family (especially the grandfather, who must be suffering from incredible guilt) finds peace in the future.

In all our trips to themeparks over the years, it amazed me how many people still put their children up on their shoulders in a crowded park.  All it takes is one bump, or even just a parent's sweaty hands, for that child's head to become a watermelon hitting the sidewalk.  And there were a few cases of people suing Disney over the years for behavior like this.  Very sad situation.

[chengkp75]

4 hours ago, dexddd said:

The lawyer is using the analogy that the child banged on glass at hockey rink to doing it on the ship was normal.  I'd not say weak but angle to sue.  Heck, they dug up that video pretty quick of hockey rink to show on Today show.

This is the part that really gets to me, from the lawyer.  Yes, a child standing on the floor banging on glass at a hockey rink is normal, and safe.  Placing a child on a 39" high 4" wide wood railing to bang on the glass is not the smartest thing to do.  Obviously, letting go of the child, while balanced on the railing, even if the window was closed, is even dumber.  For the lawyer to say that it isn't safe to have opening windows in an area where children play would be correct, if the windows were at floor height.  Vision issues, or issues of impairment aside, why would you let go of a child balancing on a railing over 3 feet above a hard deck surface?

[ZandZ]

Great point!!!!  

 

this brought back a memory.  When my now teen was a baby/toddler, my MIL sat him on a balcony railing (second floor).  I saw this, i remember that feeling, when the bottom drops under you...  I had a complete meltdown.  She complied with my wishes (at least when I was around lol), but never understood what my issue was as she "was holding him tight".  She was a wonderful woman, may she RIP,  a caregiver for my kids and I consider them to be very lucky to have known her.  She was one of the most interesting, caring and compassionate human beings I have ever met.  Who made some bad judgement calls, clearly.