Helicopter taking off on the walkway in Labadee

[bobabooey]

No room for error https://youtu.be/qc80QrHEj10

[Capt_BJ]

WOW

 

that's the first time I've seen a helo anywhere NEAR there that wasn't USCG

 

and I never noticed a 'helo landing zone' marking on the pier b4.

[Ourusualbeach]

 Not the first.  If you search you tube for Labadee and helicopter you find many landings 

[ReneeFLL]

I don't think there is a hilo pad marking, at least I didn't see one. A good pilot can pretty much put one down exactly where he/she wants it.

 

Hope they are ok.

Edited July 28, 2019 by ReneeFLL

[cb at sea]

Helicopters don't need much room...it's good that there is an exit plan from Labadee, if needed!

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

Very surprised what the pilot did. When you take off in a helicopter picture  this. You are on the top of a ball of which you can slide off of very easy. It is about the height of the width of the blades. He should of increased his height before turning or moving forward. Notice when he did a 360 he lost altitude when doing so. He was OK once he started moving forward which causes the helo to climb.

[FPP777]

I wonder what city they take people on a medical evac from there.

[WeMissSeaView]

1 hour ago, Capt_BJ said:

WOW

 

that's the first time I've seen a helo anywhere NEAR there that wasn't USCG

 

and I never noticed a 'helo landing zone' marking on the pier b4.

There is not any marking on the overwater walkway to the pier.  I was on the pier a few months ago when they closed off the walkway and a helo landed.  After the helo left and the walkway reopened, I went looking for markings.  There were not any.

[goneclear]

I have not seen the video but we witnessed a helicopter landing on the pier in Labadee to pick up someone who needed urgent medical attention.  It was a couple years ago and we were on Allure. Later on the cruise an officer told me the person was flown to Dominica Republic. 

[Jimbo]

10 minutes ago, goneclear said:

I have not seen the video but we witnessed a helicopter landing on the pier in Labadee to pick up someone who needed urgent medical attention.  It was a couple years ago and we were on Allure. Later on the cruise an officer told me the person was flown to Dominica Republic. 

Just a black screen on my youtube also, not sure why we couldn't see it?

[fscool]

2 hours ago, WeMissSeaView said:

There is not any marking on the overwater walkway to the pier.  I was on the pier a few months ago when they closed off the walkway and a helo landed.  After the helo left and the walkway reopened, I went looking for markings.  There were not any.

 

It was there this past week when I was there.  Looked nicely freshly painted.

[gatour]

To me landing the helicopter on the pier would be more difficult that actually taking off.  You would have to take into cross winds etc, to put the helo down on the narrow pier.  While taking off may not be a piece of cake, but in a relatively open area, I am guessing taking off  is easier than landing on a narrow pier.  Helicopter pilots correct me if I am wrong.

[ReneeFLL]

Not a helicopter pilot, but fixed wing. Taking off is always easier to do, but crosswinds come into play either way. More accidents happen during landings than takeoffs, at least for fixed wings. I would assume it would be the same for helicopters also.

[SRF]

On 7/28/2019 at 6:54 PM, twodaywonder said:

Very surprised what the pilot did. When you take off in a helicopter picture  this. You are on the top of a ball of which you can slide off of very easy. It is about the height of the width of the blades. He should of increased his height before turning or moving forward. Notice when he did a 360 he lost altitude when doing so. He was OK once he started moving forward which causes the helo to climb.

 

It seems you know just enough to be dangerous. 😄

 

You are trying to discuss ground effect, but it is not like a ball, it is just where the cushion of air creates more lift. 

And no, he should not have increased his altitude during his 180 (a 360 would leave him pointing the same direction he started).  To do so would have taken him in the "grey area" of the height-velocity chart, where he would have crashed if the engine quit (too high to do a hovering auto).  

 

Moving forward does not "make" the helicopter climb.  It does generate more lift (called translational lift) and you use that to climb.  Also, because there is a "grey area" when low with forward speed, where you cannot safely autorotate.

 

Multi engine helicopters do climb in place, but they have a second or even third engine, in case of engine failure.  Single engine helicopters should never climb in a hover, close to the ground.

 

Also, the helicopter did not lose altitude during his 180 pedal turn.  He did move, as he pivoted around the nose, not the mast.  So it looks like his altitude changed.

 

BTW, I hold a Commercial License Rotorcraft Helicopter, and also a Certified Flight Instructor, Rotorcraft Helicopter ratings.

[SRF]

On 7/28/2019 at 6:33 PM, ReneeFLL said:

I don't think there is a hilo pad marking, at least I didn't see one. A good pilot can pretty much put one down exactly where he/she wants it.

 

Hope they are ok.

 

In the video, there is a H in a circle from where he took off.

 

Look again. 😄

 

[SRF]

On 7/29/2019 at 5:16 AM, ReneeFLL said:

Not a helicopter pilot, but fixed wing. Taking off is always easier to do, but crosswinds come into play either way. More accidents happen during landings than takeoffs, at least for fixed wings. I would assume it would be the same for helicopters also.

 

Helicopters are slightly different. 😄

 

Since you can fly at virtually the same speed in any direction, it is slightly different.  And once you lift off into a hover, you are flying, so you don't have to deal with cross wind the same.  It is just like just flying down the runway in a crosswind, without touching down.  

[SRF]

On 7/28/2019 at 10:18 PM, gatour said:

To me landing the helicopter on the pier would be more difficult that actually taking off.  You would have to take into cross winds etc, to put the helo down on the narrow pier.  While taking off may not be a piece of cake, but in a relatively open area, I am guessing taking off  is easier than landing on a narrow pier.  Helicopter pilots correct me if I am wrong.

 

The narrowness of the pier is no big deal.  A good pilot can set down in a hole with 3 foot rotor tip clearance.  And for a lot of operations, you take off and land from a pad on wheels that is just barely larger than the skids.  This is so the helicopter can be easily moved in or out of a hangar.

 

My second flight in a helicopter, I spend the entire flight (with gusting winds) in about a 20 foot square box (marked by cones).  If I could do that my second flight, thing about a multi thousand hour pilot. 

 

The issue with landing, and taking off, from a pier would depend on the direction you pick.  If he arrived that same way he departed, along the pier, no big deal.  But if he had to approach and depart an a steep angle, that would be what would be considered a pinnacle operation.  This adds some complexity as ground effect comes and goes as you abruptly change from a higher to lower or lower to higher altitude as you cross the edge.  Nothing that a trained pilot cannot handle, but a consideration.

 

 

Edited July 31, 2019 by SRF

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

1 hour ago, SRF said:

 

It seems you know just enough to be dangerous. 😄

 

You are trying to discuss ground effect, but it is not like a ball, it is just where the cushion of air creates more lift. 

And no, he should not have increased his altitude during his 180 (a 360 would leave him pointing the same direction he started).  To do so would have taken him in the "grey area" of the height-velocity chart, where he would have crashed if the engine quit (too high to do a hovering auto).  

 

Moving forward does not "make" the helicopter climb.  It does generate more lift (called translational lift) and you use that to climb.  Also, because there is a "grey area" when low with forward speed, where you cannot safely autorotate.

 

Multi engine helicopters do climb in place, but they have a second or even third engine, in case of engine failure.  Single engine helicopters should never climb in a hover, close to the ground.

 

Also, the helicopter did not lose altitude during his 180 pedal turn.  He did move, as he pivoted around the nose, not the mast.  So it looks like his altitude changed.

 

BTW, I hold a Commercial License Rotorcraft Helicopter, and also a Certified Flight Instructor, Rotorcraft Helicopter ratings.

Yup wrong about the 180 mistake. Foreword is generates lift you use it to climb.  Transitional lift getting away from the ground effect. Come on. You are getting very picky. Also over the walk and the water changed the lift. I fly a copter also and am just trying to point out without getting into a super precise explanation of this. Good for you. You may never heard of the ball. I have, many years ago in training. So guess you need to just check on that.

[SRF]

22 hours ago, twodaywonder said:

Yup wrong about the 180 mistake. Foreword is generates lift you use it to climb.  Transitional lift getting away from the ground effect. Come on. You are getting very picky. Also over the walk and the water changed the lift. I fly a copter also and am just trying to point out without getting into a super precise explanation of this. Good for you. You may never heard of the ball. I have, many years ago in training. So guess you need to just check on that.

 

Forward motion generates transitional lift.  You can use it to climb or not.  You do not HAVE to climb.  But you want to do so.

 

Notice, he did took off along the pier, so no change in surface underneath.  Which only applies in ground effect.  Out of ground effect, the surface does not matter.

 

If you want to describe ground effect as a ball, fine, but the ball moves with you.  You do this all the time when hover taxiing.

[heatherb1958]

We had a crew member medical emergency on Indie in Labadee  in 2015. I was returning to the ship and was one of the last to cross the walkway before they closed it off in both directions to clear it for the helicopter to land.

It was very interesting to watch. I asked an officer why they didn’t land on the ship helipad , he said it was quicker to land on the walkway as they did not have to take down all the barriers on the ship. 

[jamestown478]

They had the helipad painted on the pier when I went in September

[Zach1213]

On 7/28/2019 at 5:55 PM, FPP777 said:

I wonder what city they take people on a medical evac from there.

 

Could be taking them to a waiting plane in Cap-Haitien or P-a-P which then transports them somewhere else.

[mattpro]

The pier is the take off point for medi vac back to Miami for the low, low price of 50K 😂

[gatour]

On 7/31/2019 at 3:05 PM, SRF said:

The issue with landing, and taking off, from a pier would depend on the direction you pick.  If he arrived that same way he departed, along the pier, no big deal.  But if he had to approach and depart an a steep angle, that would be what would be considered a pinnacle operation.  This adds some complexity as ground effect comes and goes as you abruptly change from a higher to lower or lower to higher altitude as you cross the edge.  Nothing that a trained pilot cannot handle, but a consideration.

 

 

SRF,

 

Please bear with me, as I am trying to use this as a learning experience..

 

Let's say you have a mile long pier running north to south.  The helicopter during its approach flies over the south end of the pier and continues north over the pier to the mid point (.5 miles) and sets down.  Upon take off, it continues north following the pier until it reaches a certain height and then goes  any direction it wants

 

The harder part would be if it wanted to take off from the pier and while low, immediately go east or west,  In this case the downward thrust of the blades would suddenly go from the pier surface to the ocean surface and needed to be taken in account.

 

Is this correct?  Or are you laughing your head off in my naive summation.  I can take it.  🙂

[ReneeFLL]

17 hours ago, SRF said:

 

In the video, there is a H in a circle from where he took off.

 

Look again. 😄

 

 

I did and this time I used my lap top instead of my phone. I see it now.  😀