Carnival Corp to retire 6 ships in next 90 days

[cmukid87]

Keep in mind this is across all of Carnival Corp.  This includes Carnival, Princess, Cunard, Costa, Aida, Holland America, P&O, and Seabourn.

 

Pure speculation but I would imagine at most 2 Carnival ships retiring but will probably just be one.  

[drsel]

Indeed.
 
And the major ship breakers are in India and Pakistan so very interesting that those were the ships chosen to repatriate crew from that area.

Do you mean that these 2 ships will not be returning to the Caribbean?
but there are sailings available to be booked for the Caribbean on these two ships

[jimbo5544]

21 minutes ago, Saint Greg said:

 

Ah that's true. It's the entire corporation. Not just CCL. So this probably isn't total wipeout of the fantasy class. Maybe just getting rid of a couple of the older ones.

I was going to see the start dates, but got off track.

[K&RCurt]

4 minutes ago, drsel said:

Do you mean that these 2 ships will not be returning to the Caribbean?
but there are sailings available to be booked for the Caribbean on these two ships

 

Arnold already said 6 ships will be gone over the next 90 days.  All those ships have cruises currently booked and are accepting bookings.  Once the papers are signed they will deal with moving those booked on the subject ships to another cruise.  In the meantime, Carnival corp will accept your money, as no one in the reservations groups likely has any more idea of what ships are going than we do.

 

That these two ships are amongst those leaving is pure speculation.  But as they are older and convieniently located near the major ship breakers, it make sence to me.

[drsel]

 
Arnold already said 6 ships will be gone over the next 90 days.  All those ships have cruises currently booked and are accepting bookings.  Once the papers are signed they will deal with moving those booked on the subject ships to another cruise.  In the meantime, Carnival corp will accept your money, as no one in the reservations groups likely has any more idea of what ships are going than we do.
 
That these two ships are amongst those leaving is pure speculation.  But as they are older and convieniently located near the major ship breakers, it make sence to me.

What about PO Oceana

[Stick93]

Casualties of covid 19. 
There is nothing that is spared - 

I loved my cruise on the fascination. Wonder how many fantasy ships won’t make it after this. They will start with 6 but who knows where this will end up if the current situation doesn’t get a bit better or if g-d forbid it gets worse again.  

[K&RCurt]

5 minutes ago, drsel said:

What about PO Oceana

 

As Carnival Corp has not said what ships are going, your guess is as good as anyone else's.

[jetsfan58]

What about the US cruise ports that have to utilize the smaller class ships due to the bridges that they sail under being height restricted? The larger ships will not make it under these bridges? Will they be forced to build new ports to accommodate?  

[Tapi]

Most of my Carnival cruises have been on Fantasy class ships. Great memories, specially from my younger years. But the reality is that the ships in that class are well past their prime. The writing has been on the wall for a while. All that Covid did was accelerate the inevitable.

 

With that said , I don’t think that all 6 ships leaving Carnival Corp will be Fantasy class. Maybe 1-2. They still serve the purpose of offering short, cheap, casual cruises from smaller ports (Jacksonville, Mobile, etc), and with them gone, so will cruises from these ports.
 

So I believe that, unless Carnival is planning on scrapping those ports, some Fantasy class ships will stick around. 

Edited June 18, 2020 by Tapi

[jimbo5544]

13 minutes ago, jetsfan58 said:

What about the US cruise ports that have to utilize the smaller class ships due to the bridges that they sail under being height restricted? The larger ships will not make it under these bridges? Will they be forced to build new ports to accommodate?  

They understand their ships and the home port restrictions.  Carnival has the highest number of home ports in the US, it is possible that some will not end up with a ship (or hat they could roll one between a couple of ports.  That said, total speculation as we have no idea, which if any of CCL ships will be part of the shuttered ships.   

[asalligo]

Darn, that does not help me get $14 a day cruise prices. I need more ships, not less. 

[Essiesmom]

As has been mantioned bafore on this thread, this is not just about Carnival Cruise Line, but about Carnival Corp.  So, let's look at the other lines in the family.  

Costa:  Victoria (1996) already sold?

              neoRomantica - 1993

              neoRiviera - 1999

 

AIDA:     AIDAcara, smallest and oldest @ 34,000, 1996

 

HAL:      Maasdam - 1993

               Veendam - 1996

               Rotterdam - 1996

               Volendam & Zaandam - 1999

 

P&O-AUS:  Pacific Dawn - 1991

                Pacific Aria - 1994

                Pacific Explorer - 1997

 

Carnival Cruise Lines:   Fantasy - 1990

                 Ecstasy - 1991

                 Sensation - 1993

                  Fascination - 1994

                  Imagination - 1995

                  Inspiration - 1996

                  Destiny (Sunshine) 1996

                  Elation - 1998

                  Paradise - 1998

                   Triumph (Sunshine) - 1999

                   Victory - 2000

 

Princess:  Sun Princess - 1995

                   Sea Princess - 1998

 

So, where this lead us?  Some ships in very different sizes.  And not having sailed most of the ships and some of the lines, I don't know what the interiors are like.  Victory is the newest on the list, but she reportedly had some demo done on her crossing to Cadiz, and maybe might be ripe for someone wanting a ship to refurbish.  AIDAcara might be a good fit for someone who wants a smaller ship for exotic voyages.  P&O-AU:  Their ships are all hand-me-downs.  they are due to get Golden and Star Princess ships.  But those are ship transfers, not sales.  HAL is likely looking to sell Maasdam, if not the other two.  As for Carnival, I would look for Fantasy to go first as the oldest, with no balconies.  Imagination and Inspiration also, though not the oldest in the class, they never got the balconies.  Elation and Paradise to go last, as they got the most recent renovations.  

This is just my opinion with no inside or outside knowledge.  EM

[Joebucks]

They own over 100 ships. My guess is the oldest and/or lowest demand are on the chopping block.

 

I can't imagine anyone wants ships at this time. Especially older and less exciting ones.

[jimbo5544]

4 minutes ago, asalligo said:

Darn, that does not help me get $14 a day cruise prices. I need more ships, not less. 

Most cruise lines did away with the bargain basement pricing a while a go.  With cruise lines going with the start slow, this will give them the best chance at being profitable as the virus wanes and cruise line demand grows.  If that happens, pricing will probably be a premium, you might disagree, but that is the best case scenario for everybody.    

[BlerkOne]

"In connection with its capacity optimization strategy, the company intends to accelerate the removal of ships in fiscal 2020 which were previously expected to be sold over the ensuing years. The company already has preliminary agreements for the disposal of six ships which are expected to leave the fleet in the next 90 days and is currently working toward additional agreements."

 

I wouldn't assume all Fantasy.

 

 

"In addition, the company has $8.8 billion of committed export credit facilities that are available to fund ship deliveries originally planned through 2023."

 

and replacements could be coming.

 

[jimbo5544]

1 minute ago, BlerkOne said:

"In connection with its capacity optimization strategy, the company intends to accelerate the removal of ships in fiscal 2020 which were previously expected to be sold over the ensuing years. The company already has preliminary agreements for the disposal of six ships which are expected to leave the fleet in the next 90 days and is currently working toward additional agreements."

 

I wouldn't assume all Fantasy.

 

 

"In addition, the company has $8.8 billion of committed export credit facilities that are available to fund ship deliveries originally planned through 2023."

 

and replacements could be coming.

 

Replacements from other lines, as in acquisition?

 

[SeagullsTravels]

15 minutes ago, Essiesmom said:

P&O-AUS:  Pacific Dawn - 1991

Pacific Dawn is heading to Cruise & Maritime Voyages as the Amy Johnson, maiden voyage set for April 14th of next year. I only know this because I have been looking at her over the last few weeks. 
 

Great list and likely to see at least a few on your list go, simply due to age. 
 

I do hope Carnival Victory is not one of them as I have been eyeballing her Carnival Radiance cruises, too. 
 

Edited to add: Pacific Aria has also been planned to leave the fleet shortly after Pacific Dawn. This is unrelated to the off-loading of ships.

Edited June 18, 2020 by SeagullsTravels
To add information.

[BlerkOne]

2 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Replacements from other lines, as in acquisition?

 

 

I was thinking the new builds. It's going to take time to ramp up anyway.

[jimbo5544]

1 minute ago, BlerkOne said:

 

I was thinking the new builds. It's going to take time to ramp up anyway.

Do you think they will be pressured by the builders to take possession?

[Essiesmom]

Another train of thought.  Everything has been shaken up.  Noone knows when they can do anything.  So why not use the opportunity to rearrange everything.  People are always griping about the same old itineraries.  They could work toward a more upscale experience.  Do some longer, open jaw cruises.  Sail from Mobile/Galveston/NOLA on a 8-10 day cruise and return to one of the other ports, having visited Cartagena or one of the ABC islands to make it legal.  then do another longer cruise from that return port visiting different islands/ports, making a possibility of more than two weeks of cruising.  Expend on the Journeys cruising...  This would not be just Carnival, maybe HAL too.  EM

[Essiesmom]

13 minutes ago, SeagullsTravels said:

Pacific Dawn is heading to Cruise & Maritime Voyages as the Amy Johnson, maiden voyage set for April 14th of next year. I only know this because I have been looking at her over the last few weeks. 
 

Great list and likely to see at least a few on your list go, simply due to age. 
 

I do hope Carnival Victory is not one of them as I have been eyeballing her Carnival Radiance cruises, too. 

Thanks for that reminder.  I think I remember Pacic Aria,  also headed to CMV to be named Ida Pfeiffer.  EM

Edited June 18, 2020 by Essiesmom

[BlerkOne]

3 minutes ago, Essiesmom said:

Another train of thought.  Everything has been shaken up.  Noone knows when they can do anything.  So why not use the opportunity to rearrange everything.  People are always griping about the same old itineraries.  They could work toward a more upscale experience.  Do some longer, open jaw cruises.  Sail from Mobile/Galveston/NOLA on a 8-10 day cruise and return to one of the other ports, having visited Cartagena or one of the ABC islands to make it legal.  then do another longer cruise from that return port visiting different islands/ports, making a possibility of more than two weeks of cruising.  Expend on the Journeys cruising...  This would not be just Carnival, maybe HAL too.  EM

 

Shorter cruises are more likely. If there is a virus outbreak you won't be in the middle of no where or stuck on a ship for an eternity. Short cruises tend to be more profitable, commanding higher per diems. There is pent up demand for cruises, don't take unnecessary risks.

 

HAL and Princess already do a number of longer cruises.

[BlerkOne]

I don't see Corp sacrificing a cruise line - otherwise they would have sold one. Victims will be picked from the various lines under the Carnival umbrella.

[Essiesmom]

1 hour ago, jimbo5544 said:

I was going to see the start dates, but got off track.

My list on another thread here:

 

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Posted 32 minutes ago

As has been mantioned bafore on this thread, this is not just about Carnival Cruise Line, but about Carnival Corp.  So, let's look at the other lines in the family.  

Costa:  Victoria (1996) already sold?

              neoRomantica - 1993

              neoRiviera - 1999

 

AIDA:     AIDAcara, smallest and oldest @ 34,000, 1996

 

HAL:      Maasdam - 1993

               Veendam - 1996

               Rotterdam - 1996

               Volendam & Zaandam - 1999

 

P&O-AUS:  Pacific Dawn - 1991

                Pacific Aria - 1994

                Pacific Explorer - 1997

 

Carnival Cruise Lines:   Fantasy - 1990

                 Ecstasy - 1991

                 Sensation - 1993

                  Fascination - 1994

                  Imagination - 1995

                  Inspiration - 1996

                  Destiny (Sunshine) 1996

                  Elation - 1998

                  Paradise - 1998

                   Triumph (Sunshine) - 1999

                   Victory - 2000

 

Princess:  Sun Princess - 1995

                   Sea Princess - 1998

 

I didn't include Seabourn because their oldest ship is from 2009.  EM

Edited June 18, 2020 by Essiesmom

[BlerkOne]

17 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Do you think they will be pressured by the builders to take possession?

 

I would think some of the financing could be coming from the builders.