Oxford Astra Zeneca Covid 19 Vaccine Shows Promising Signs For The Elderly

[Aus Traveller]

17 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

Possum52 and Docker123

 

Seems like a pin has burst the balloon regarding AstraZeneca here in the US.  Now there is much concern with Astra Zeneca's reliability.   The  NYTimes had an article "Astra Zeneca Faces Difficult Questions About It's Vaccine After Admitting Mistake". 

Yes. They admitted that the protocol of administering a half dose followed by a full dose four weeks later had come about because of a mistake. (A fortuitous mistake I say.)

 

I wonder if there has been more criticism of the Astra Zeneca (Oxford) vaccine in the US than elsewhere because of possible competition with the American Pfizer one. Although the Pfizer vaccine was invented in Germany, it is probably perceived as American.

Edited November 28, 2020 by Aus Traveller

[OzKiwiJJ]

10 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

Possum52 and Docker123

 

Seems like a pin has burst the balloon regarding AstraZeneca here in the US.  Now there is much concern with Astra Zeneca's reliability.   The  NYTimes had an article "Astra Zeneca Faces Difficult Questions About It's Vaccine After Admitting Mistake". 

Yes, we've seen that news here as well. It will depend on how Astra Zenica handle it from here on. The accidental half-dose which gave better results needs to be tested more fully but many good things have come from accidental discoveries so it doesn't pay to discount it totally.

 

One of the articles I read made a pointed mention of the other two vaccines (Pfizer and ?? which I believe are being developed in the US) which made me wonder how biased that article was.

[BRANDEE]

35 minutes ago, OzKiwiJJ said:

Yes, we've seen that news here as well. It will depend on how Astra Zenica handle it from here on. The accidental half-dose which gave better results needs to be tested more fully but many good things have come from accidental discoveries so it doesn't pay to discount it totally.

 

One of the articles I read made a pointed mention of the other two vaccines (Pfizer and ?? which I believe are being developed in the US) which made me wonder how biased that article was.

The other company is Modera.  That vaccine does not have to be stored at -70C but around regular refrigerator temperature.  The US has 300miliion doses of Astra Zeneca on reserve and was expecting to start the end of December with some groups.  I think Modera is a smaller company and can not produce as many doses as the other two companies.  

[possum52]

1 hour ago, BRANDEE said:

Possum52 and Docker123

 

Seems like a pin has burst the balloon regarding AstraZeneca here in the US.  Now there is much concern with Astra Zeneca's reliability.   The  NYTimes had an article "Astra Zeneca Faces Difficult Questions About It's Vaccine After Admitting Mistake". 

Brandee, if broader trials are conducted with the half dose regime and have similar results, I will be happy with that. I tend to agree with Aus Traveller and OzKiwiJJ that the article in the NY Times could be a little biased and pushing the vaccines that are being talked about in the US. It sounds like the Pfizer vaccine will not be suitable for a fair percentage of the ppulation who are the ones who really need it - the elderly, those with pre-exisitng illnesses, pregnant women and children and Australian authorities will not us have it until it is proven it is safe for all age groups.

 

Leigh

 

 

[possum52]

Duplicate post.

 

 

Edited November 28, 2020 by possum52

[BRANDEE]

8 minutes ago, possum52 said:

Brandee, if broader trials are conducted with the half dose regime and have similar results, I will be happy with that. I tend to agree with Aus Traveller and OzKiwiJJ that the article in the NY Times could be a little biased and pushing the vaccines that are being talked about in the US. It sounds like the Pfizer vaccine will not be suitable for a fair percentage of the ppulation who are the ones who really need it - the elderly, those with pre-exisitng illnesses, pregnant women and children and Australian authorities will not us have it until it is proven it is safe for all age groups.

 

Leigh

 

 

Either the Astra Zeneca or Modera sound more logistical to be available for the majority of the world.  The Pfizer vaccine would have to be administered at a hospital due to the temperature control. So many people are talking about not getting the vaccine at all due to the lack of trust and all the politics.  I'm not sure what percentage of population have to get the vaccine for it to be effective in controlling/eradicating covid world wide.

 

At Thanksgiving Dinner this past Thursday my  daughter in law' (researcher) said that my husband and I would be at the back of the line due to the fact that we already had it and probably have immunity to the current strain. My older son and his wife and twins all had it too.  They all have high antibodies even though they got it early/mid March.(only my son got ill)  Both the Pfizer and Modera vaccine is based on introducing covid recreated cells into the body to build up antibodies should a person come in contact. Similar to flu, pneumonia and many other immunizations. I asked her if they were going to administer a antibody test before giving a vaccine?  She said it was being considered.

 

She was very impressed with all the current research and results , but not happy about the lack  of time being given for clinical trials.  Goes against her training and belief and she is very torn about giving the vaccine to her children.  

[LittleFish1976]

7 hours ago, BRANDEE said:

Either the Astra Zeneca or Modera sound more logistical to be available for the majority of the world.  The Pfizer vaccine would have to be administered at a hospital due to the temperature control. So many people are talking about not getting the vaccine at all due to the lack of trust and all the politics.  I'm not sure what percentage of population have to get the vaccine for it to be effective in controlling/eradicating covid world wide.

 

At Thanksgiving Dinner this past Thursday my  daughter in law' (researcher) said that my husband and I would be at the back of the line due to the fact that we already had it and probably have immunity to the current strain. My older son and his wife and twins all had it too.  They all have high antibodies even though they got it early/mid March.(only my son got ill)  Both the Pfizer and Modera vaccine is based on introducing covid recreated cells into the body to build up antibodies should a person come in contact. Similar to flu, pneumonia and many other immunizations. I asked her if they were going to administer a antibody test before giving a vaccine?  She said it was being considered.

 

She was very impressed with all the current research and results , but not happy about the lack  of time being given for clinical trials.  Goes against her training and belief and she is very torn about giving the vaccine to her children.  

 

From what I've read, the antibodies to covid exposure don't last very long - a matter of weeks or a few months so would only offer protection for that length of time. It is another part of the immune system that takes over from antibodies and gives longer lasting protection. They don't know yet whether this level of protection is afforded by viral exposure or if it can only be gained by vaccination.

 

 

[LittleFish1976]

8 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

Yes. They admitted that the protocol of administering a half dose followed by a full dose four weeks later had come about because of a mistake. (A fortuitous mistake I say.)

 

I wonder if there has been more criticism of the Astra Zeneca (Oxford) vaccine in the US than elsewhere because of possible competition with the American Pfizer one. Although the Pfizer vaccine was invented in Germany, it is probably perceived as American.

 

I'm pretty cynical about the amount of criticism I've seen in the US media about the Astra Zeneca/Oxford vaccine (despite the unfortunate nature of the difference in doses).

 

It's worth noting that neither Moderna nor Pfizer have signed up to the push (I think the WHO one) to provide vaccines without profit to poorer countries while the pandemic is still going. They haven't undertaken to sell the vaccine without profit during the pandemic.

Astra Zeneca on the other hand has signed up to that agreement and has been signing contracts to sell the vaccine much more cheaply than the two US-promoted ones.

 

The abc on-line news published an article on Saturday quoted an Australian 'vaccine expert' who lives New York who actually accused Astra Zeneca of 'embellishing the data'. That's a big accusation. But I see he works for an investment bank that funds the development of things like vaccines. Don't know if he has some skin in the game?

I think we're going to have to be cynical about what we read - there's a lot of background agendas to some of this publicity.

 

Also, just another piece of information - Astra Zeneca were testing at least one large group of participants weekly for covid whereas the other two (Moderna and Pfizer) only tested people who had symptoms sufficient to suspect they may have covid. Astra Zeneca therefore have data about whether their vaccine can halt the transmission of the virus and not just minimise the severity of illness/symptoms. This is really important because ideally we need to halt the spread so that the very vulnerable, who can't be vaccinated, are protected from getting it as we'll be able to one day wipe it out.

 

Sorry to go on - I'm really enjoying all the detail that's out there about all this stuff.

 

 

[Kiwi Kruzer]

As well as vaccine research , progress is being made in treatment..

NZ research helps make major breakthrough in Covid treatment

 

NZ research helps make major breakthrough in Covid treatment

 

https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/mike-hosking-breakfast/audio/dr-colin-mcarthur-nz-research-helps-make-major-breakthrough-in-covid-treatment/

[By The Bay]

Is this to quick?🤔

 

"Britain is set to approve the COVID-19 vaccine developed by BioNTech SE and Pfizer Inc next week and deliveries would begin within hours of the authorisation, the Financial Times reported on Saturday.

The first immunisations using the BioNTech and Pfizer vaccine could take place from December 7, the FT said, citing unnamed sources." Source: SMH today.

[MMDown Under]

42 minutes ago, By The Bay said:

Is this to quick?🤔

 

"Britain is set to approve the COVID-19 vaccine developed by BioNTech SE and Pfizer Inc next week and deliveries would begin within hours of the authorisation, the Financial Times reported on Saturday.

The first immunisations using the BioNTech and Pfizer vaccine could take place from December 7, the FT said, citing unnamed sources." Source: SMH today.

In my opinion, yes. 

[BRANDEE]

9 hours ago, LittleFish1976 said:

 

From what I've read, the antibodies to covid exposure don't last very long - a matter of weeks or a few months so would only offer protection for that length of time. It is another part of the immune system that takes over from antibodies and gives longer lasting protection. They don't know yet whether this level of protection is afforded by viral exposure or if it can only be gained by vaccination.

 

 

After nine months, both my husband and I still have antibodies from our Covid in Mar/April.  So do my 12 yr old grandsons..nine months and counting.  We are all surprised considering what is being written in the papers.

[OzKiwiJJ]

1 hour ago, BRANDEE said:

After nine months, both my husband and I still have antibodies from our Covid in Mar/April.  So do my 12 yr old grandsons..nine months and counting.  We are all surprised considering what is being written in the papers.

Once upon a time you could believe what was written in the papers. These days not so much. 

[LittleFish1976]

On 11/29/2020 at 10:37 AM, BRANDEE said:

After nine months, both my husband and I still have antibodies from our Covid in Mar/April.  So do my 12 yr old grandsons..nine months and counting.  We are all surprised considering what is being written in the papers.

Read recently that people re-develop anti-bodies after re-exposure to the virus - given there's been so much of it in the States, perhaps this has happened with your family? It'll be many years before they unlock all the secrets of this virus. Hope your vaccine roll-outs happen smoothly over there.

[BRANDEE]

30 minutes ago, LittleFish1976 said:

Read recently that people re-develop anti-bodies after re-exposure to the virus - given there's been so much of it in the States, perhaps this has happened with your family? It'll be many years before they unlock all the secrets of this virus. Hope your vaccine roll-outs happen smoothly over there.

You are right stating the mysteries of this disease.  So confusing for the medical profession. 

 

Looks like Moderna is ready to roll out a vaccine as soon as it is approved by CDA, but our governor still wants to have a panel of "experts" look at it first..  Still not 100% sure who will get it first, second etc. 

 

The NYBlood Bank tests us every time we give plasma and so far always negative and always asked to hurry on back to give more.  Wish more would donate..so easy. 

 

Pretty much in isolation for 9 months and living in an area no longer considered a hot spot, but certainly could have been re exposed, if we were than we do have immunity.  If you are exposed to a virus and your body produces antibodies to fight it so you do not get sick..it is immunity..almost like a vaccine.  Our doctor said more and more people who had covid still have anti bodies for a much longer time than first thought..not sure why.  I still won't take any chances, haven't eaten in a restaurant or shopped at a mall store since February. Can't believe they opened up gyms..but closed schools??

 

Just hoping the Thanksgiving weekend did not set NY back too much, there were plenty of people not following protocol. We have too many idiots who believe it is against their constitutional right to have to wear a mask.

[LittleFish1976]

3 minutes ago, BRANDEE said:

You are right stating the mysteries of this disease.  So confusing for the medical profession. 

 

Looks like Moderna is ready to roll out a vaccine as soon as it is approved by CDA, but our governor still wants to have a panel of "experts" look at it first..  Still not 100% sure who will get it first, second etc. 

 

The NYBlood Bank tests us every time we give plasma and so far always negative and always asked to hurry on back to give more.  Wish more would donate..so easy. 

 

Pretty much in isolation for 9 months and living in an area no longer considered a hot spot, but certainly could have been re exposed, if we were than we do have immunity.  If you are exposed to a virus and your body produces antibodies to fight it so you do not get sick..it is immunity..almost like a vaccine.  Our doctor said more and more people who had covid still have anti bodies for a much longer time than first thought..not sure why.  I still won't take any chances, haven't eaten in a restaurant or shopped at a mall store since February. Can't believe they opened up gyms..but closed schools??

 

Just hoping the Thanksgiving weekend did not set NY back too much, there were plenty of people not following protocol. We have too many idiots who believe it is against their constitutional right to have to wear a mask.

Yes, you're right about the immunity after exposure. What I've read is that people can develop T cell response to the virus after infection, which is the longer-lasting immune system response. Apparently the T cells spark the production of antibodies all over again if one is exposed to the virus again. As you say, just like a vaccine but I'm not sure if this always happens or only in some people (given the whole 'herd immunity by letting the virus run rampant' theory has been debunked by medical experts).

 

I see millions of Americans travelled, many by plane, during your holiday weekend. It would be a miracle if infection rates don't rise but I wish you well in NY.

 

Most places seem keen to vaccinate front-line medical staff first, as well as aged-care residents and staff - makes sense. Most of us will be well down the queue but as long as the vaccine is getting out into the community somehow and minimising the opportunities the virus has to take hold, the better.

 

 

[BRANDEE]

14 minutes ago, LittleFish1976 said:

Yes, you're right about the immunity after exposure. What I've read is that people can develop T cell response to the virus after infection, which is the longer-lasting immune system response. Apparently the T cells spark the production of antibodies all over again if one is exposed to the virus again. As you say, just like a vaccine but I'm not sure if this always happens or only in some people (given the whole 'herd immunity by letting the virus run rampant' theory has been debunked by medical experts).

 

I see millions of Americans travelled, many by plane, during your holiday weekend. It would be a miracle if infection rates don't rise but I wish you well in NY.

 

Most places seem keen to vaccinate front-line medical staff first, as well as aged-care residents and staff - makes sense. Most of us will be well down the queue but as long as the vaccine is getting out into the community somehow and minimising the opportunities the virus has to take hold, the better.

 

 

The airports were packed during the Thanksgiving Weekend.  A surge is expected in 10 days.  Disgusting is all I can say.  

 

Tonight on the news, they said the first group of seniors, 80 and over, would be in the first group of people who get the vaccine with health care workers.  Each state governor can make their own rules..  I think that is going to cause problems..50 different minds that do not think alike..at all!

[Aus Traveller]

3 hours ago, BRANDEE said:

The airports were packed during the Thanksgiving Weekend.  A surge is expected in 10 days.  Disgusting is all I can say.  

 

Tonight on the news, they said the first group of seniors, 80 and over, would be in the first group of people who get the vaccine with health care workers.  Each state governor can make their own rules..  I think that is going to cause problems..50 different minds that do not think alike..at all!

In Australia, the decisions on which vaccine will be used and who get the vaccination first, will be made by the Federal government. Therefore it will be consistent.

[pully8]

Whatever is decided hope it will be soon. 

[BRANDEE]

7 hours ago, Aus Traveller said:

In Australia, the decisions on which vaccine will be used and who get the vaccination first, will be made by the Federal government. Therefore it will be consistent.

Well... the surge from Thanksgiving weekend is starting to happen..only 5 days and a big uptick is beginning here in NY. Local hospitals are beginning to get "full" again and that means some elective surgeries are being cancelled till ???  Asking people over 65 and at risk to stay in place.

 

This mornings newspapers article outlined a "possible" roll out of the vaccine in phases for NY.

(Our federal government will issue a guideline but the state governors have the last say to tweek the guidelines.)

Phase 1..Health care workers providing patient care and emergency services.  Long term care facility workers and at risk long term care facility patients.

Phase 2..Police, firemen, national guard first responders.  teachers, school staff and child care providers. Public health workers and workers who interact with public (pharmacists, grocery and transit workers.  Other long term care patients and General population with high risk conditions.

Phase 3..People over 65  and people under 65 with health risks.

Phase 4..All other essential workers.

Phase 5..Healthy adults and children.

Also: The state's sequence could be suspended by new federal guidelines or updated data on vaccine side effects and levels of protection afforded to subgroups such as senior citizens.

 

Getting 330 million Americans over 3.8 million square miles to get vaccinated is going to be one of the greatest undertaking this country has ever seen. And considering we are a divided country..with our leader in denial...we sure have a big uphill battle.   

[NSWP]

I have to relate this story, funny if it were not serious. On a social media site frequented by Princess Elite Cruisers, re priority in receiving the vaccine.

 

Quote: Princess Elite cruisers should get the vaccine first so as they can get back to cruising.

 

Alarming, I think the poster meant it.

Edited December 1, 2020 by NSWP

[Docker123]

British authorities have approved the Pfizer vaccine for immediate implementation.

 

I would not be first in line with that sort of speed.

 

https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/health/uk-to-get-covid-vaccine-next-week/news-story/8e81665c6bcf4699acc5672d4eaf3871

 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Docker123

[LittleFish1976]

4 hours ago, Docker123 said:

British authorities have approved the Pfizer vaccine for immediate implementation.

 

I would not be first in line with that sort of speed.

 

https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/health/uk-to-get-covid-vaccine-next-week/news-story/8e81665c6bcf4699acc5672d4eaf3871

 

I'm sure they're as safe as any vaccine - in other words, there will surely be some risks along the way but given the risk of infection and pressure on hospitals in both UK and US, I think the benefits outweigh any risks.

 

I'd have one tomorrow (preferably the AZ one but I wouldn't say no to this one.)

 

[Docker123]

 

The expedited approval of the Pzifer vaccine is being questioned in Europe, and even commented upon by Dr Fauci.  Basically concern of insufficient examination of the data.

 

Of course, one really big question to be addressed is are there any longer term — more than 3 months — consequences.  Many meds are fine initially, but take time to develop negative side effects.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/03/europe-us-experts-question-uk-fast-track-covid-vaccine

 

[NSWP]

Over 80's are in the priority group for vaccination in England. Stocks of vaccine already on way from the manufacturer in Belgium, vaxxing starts next week, according to uk media.