Face Masks and Cruising

[Tippyton]

1 hour ago, coffeebean said:

I'm in Central Florida in the largest retirement golf cart community in the world. The restaurants in my area still request masking when not seated and, because we are a large population of older folks, most (my guestimation is 95%) people still mask. I'm very thankful for that. Most of us are vaccinated here but we still mask up per the CDC guidelines. All restaurant employees mask up too as per their restaurant policy.

What is the science or logic behind masking up after vaccination?  Seriously?  [Feeling better is emotion, not fact BTW]

[lenquixote66]

3 hours ago, coffeebean said:

Good for you. Hope you let them know why you were going to walk out.

I did

[coffeebean]

1 hour ago, Tippyton said:

What is the science or logic behind masking up after vaccination?  Seriously?  [Feeling better is emotion, not fact BTW]

The simple answer is it is not known if vaccinated people can transmit the virus to others. Until it has been determined there is no chance vaccinated people can transmit the virus, vaccinated people are requested to mask up to protect others who have not been vaccinated yet.

[harkinmr]

8 hours ago, A&L_Ont said:

Yes they would be good friends as always and forever.  
 

I wish PM Trudeau would reach out to President Biden and come to an arrangement.  They both say we have a great relationship, and if they are sitting idle in that plant they would certainly be used here or anywhere else for that matter.  Canadians would certainly send our excess doses to others that would need them, that’s what we do.
 

The faster we are vaccinated the sooner our neighbours to the south can come and visit Canada again.  Maybe Alaska 2022 cruises can happen.🙂

Biden and Trudeau talked today about the US sending additional AZ doses from our supply to Canada beyond the doses sent last month.  Nothing finalized yet.  I also saw that the EU is passing on 300M AZ and J&J doses.  Any chance of you folks securing any of those?

 

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/we-hope-to-help-a-little-more-biden-says-he-spoke-to-trudeau-about-more-vaccines-1.5396620

 

 

Edited April 22, 2021 by harkinmr

[D C]

6 hours ago, TheMastodon said:

It’s not a race against time for us - we are doing just fine getting shots in arms.   Just saying if other countries have approved Astra then give it to them.  We have a steady flow of Moderna and Pfizer... 

 

 

We could just list them on eBay and see what kind of offers we get. 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

8 hours ago, Shorewalk Holmes said:

 

'Debunked from unreputable sources'?  What about your fellow Texan (an actual virologist) talking about this paper:

 

"This is a list of generally discredited hypotheses that have been tested and disproved," said Benjamin Neuman, biology professor at Texas A&M University and chief virologist of the university’s Global Health Research Complex. "This seems to be a piece of deceptive writing from what appears to be a non-expert. It isn't science."

 

By the way, I've read the paper and commented on in Post #114 in case you missed it.  I don't know enough to critique the 'mask dangers' part in detail, but the mask efficacy part is misleading, in my opinion. 

 

Also, it appears to be a 'pay-to-publish' article.  For a mere $1850, you or I could maybe get our own 'scientific' paper!

 

 

and for free, ($0) Benjamin Neuman got nothing for you mentioning is critique. My point is, 'science' is comes at a price. A cost. Somebody pays for science. It's funded. And that somebody generally gets the data & report to lean their way. Believe me, Neuman is making bank. He's an instructor. A teacher. Albeit a Professor but still a teacher. A wonder what was his last laboratory testing and who funding it. 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

5 hours ago, coffeebean said:

I will always believe the science over conspiracy theories and unreliable sources.

 

Well coffeebean, your science that you believe in is and has been lying to you.  You have a right to beleive as you wish though! 

 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

5 hours ago, coffeebean said:

I'm in Central Florida in the largest retirement golf cart community in the world. The restaurants in my area still request masking when not seated and, because we are a large population of older folks, most (my guestimation is 95%) people still mask. I'm very thankful for that. Most of us are vaccinated here but we still mask up per the CDC guidelines. All restaurant employees mask up too as per their restaurant policy.

 

That's a shame. Those folks deserve better in their retirment years. 

[Merion_Mom]

57 minutes ago, Goodtime Cruizin said:

 

Well coffeebean, your science that you believe in is and has been lying to you.  You have a right to beleive as you wish though! 

 

 

 

[Coralc]

22 hours ago, ReneeFLL said:

Thanks. Sometimes people get a kick out of shocking others. Not sure if that was what he wanted or if he was up to something else. After laughing I walked fast back into the mall. I didn’t want him to get near me.

I'm not sure why this is relevant to anything, but I was about 10 and paddling my little put put boat around the island in a lake near our house.  And there was some guy playing with himself on the far side of the island. I paddled back to my mom and told her. 

 

My mom said, "Oh, that's just a pervert, honey.  Are you ready to go now? ". 

 

She was so calm about it, it sort of sounded like birdwatching. 

Edited April 22, 2021 by Coralc

[vacationlover_mn]

On 4/20/2021 at 9:21 AM, harkinmr said:

The sheer nonsense posted in that article has already been called for what it is: an unscientific article with no real basis in fact.  Already been disproven by the many real experts in the field.  I don't have to do that.  "Cosmetic theater".  Really?  I live in Florida.  I wear a mask.  And believe me, it's not "theater".  I understand and abide by the science and the guidance stemming therefrom.  I'll tell you what "theater" is.  It's the anti-mask crowd wandering around mask less to prove some ill-conceived, misinformed point and then sneering at those that do.  Now THAT"S theater.

Do you have a link to one of the articles that debunk that dumb one?  I’d like to share it with my antimasking friend who posted a link to the dumb article on Facebook, with a big post talking about- see!  I told you masks don’t work.  Sigh.  I tried to google around a bit for the debunking article, but couldn’t find it 😞

Edited April 22, 2021 by vacationlover_mn

[Ocean Boy]

9 hours ago, coffeebean said:

The simple answer is it is not known if vaccinated people can transmit the virus to others. Until it has been determined there is no chance vaccinated people can transmit the virus, vaccinated people are requested to mask up to protect others who have not been vaccinated yet.

And for how long should the vaccinated mask up in order to protect those who refuse to be vaccinated? Those people better start looking for a way to protect themselves.

[FSHLOT]

16 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

And for how long should the vaccinated mask up in order to protect those who refuse to be vaccinated? Those people better start looking for a way to protect themselves.

As long as it takes. Lots of people realize it is a 99% recovery, So there is that little bit of science. Not everyone lives life walking on egg shells. So if you feel you might get covid, stay home, or just do whatever you want (Except cruising 😀) .

 

No matter how many words people type or try and convince others what is right or wrong, People believe what they want. Some think science is good, others not so much. 

[harkinmr]

1 hour ago, vacationlover_mn said:

Do you have a link to one of the articles that debunk that dumb one?  I’d like to share it with my antimasking friend who posted a link to the dumb article on Facebook, with a big post talking about- see!  I told you masks don’t work.  Sigh.  I tried to google around a bit for the debunking article, but couldn’t find it 😞

Here you go. 
 

https://apnews.com/article/fact-checking-629043235973

This is just one of the studies I found supporting the effectiveness of face masks in reducing spread you can share with your friends. 
 

https://files.fast.ai/papers/masks_lit_review.pdf

 

Lots of articles as well that speak to the efficacy of masks. But honestly, many people who just don’t want to wear a mask will latch on to any nonsense that they thinks supports their desire.  It may be a losing battle at this point. 

 

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/coronavirus/in-depth/coronavirus-mask/art-20485449

 

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02801-8

 

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/the-simple-science-behind-why-masks-work

[xpcdoojk]

23 minutes ago, FSHLOT said:

No matter how many words people type or try and convince others what is right or wrong, People believe what they want. Some think science is good, others not so much. 

I think at least a part of that statement is a complete fallacy.  I think most people even anti-Vax and anti-mask, people believe in Science.  The problem is we are dealing with very imprecise science.  So, when one side says you have to believe or do something, about half are going to react to that alone.  Has nothing to do with science, has everything to do with liberty.  The science that is being discussed are studies that none of us know exactly how they operated.  Most of them are funded so that the “scientists” are supposed to find a certain result.  This is the opposite of true scientific method, and thus skepticism abounds about the “science”.  

 

 

[Ocean Boy]

13 minutes ago, FSHLOT said:

As long as it takes. Lots of people realize it is a 99% recovery, So there is that little bit of science. Not everyone lives life walking on egg shells. So if you feel you might get covid, stay home, or just do whatever you want (Except cruising 😀) .

 

No matter how many words people type or try and convince others what is right or wrong, People believe what they want. Some think science is good, others not so much. 

To expect the vaccinated to wear masks for "as long as it takes" in order to protect the refusers is unrealistic. The vaccine supply is quickly getting to the point where anyone who wants it can get it. If these people continue to refuse vaccination then it is on them to protect themselves in what ever way they choose. They can wear masks, they can distance, they can stay home. They can also take no precautions if they so choose. They, however, should have no expectation that the vaccinated world will continue to alter its life in order to protect them. Nor should they whine if certain businesses decide it us in their best interest not to welcome their patronage.

[Keksie]

10 hours ago, coffeebean said:

The simple answer is it is not known if vaccinated people can transmit the virus to others. Until it has been determined there is no chance vaccinated people can transmit the virus, vaccinated people are requested to mask up to protect others who have not been vaccinated yet.

However, the CDC does not think that a vaccinated person is that much of a risk as evidenced by their guidance that:

1.   Fully vaccinated people can resume domestic travel and do not need to get tested before or after travel or self-quarantine after travel.

2.  Visit with unvaccinated people from a single household who are at low risk for severe COVID-19 disease indoors without wearing masks or physical distancing

3.  Refrain from quarantine and testing following a known exposure if asymptomatic

 

Why would they give the above guidance if they thought that a vaccinated person was that contagious?

Edited April 22, 2021 by Keksie

[Ocean Boy]

4 minutes ago, xpcdoojk said:

I think at least a part of that statement is a complete fallacy.  I think most people even anti-Vax and anti-mask, people believe in Science.  The problem is we are dealing with very imprecise science.  So, when one side says you have to believe or do something, about half are going to react to that alone.  Has nothing to do with science, has everything to do with liberty.  The science that is being discussed are studies that none of us know exactly how they operated.  Most of them are funded so that the “scientists” are supposed to find a certain result.  This is the opposite of true scientific method, and thus skepticism abounds about the “science”.  

 

 

Couple that possibly faulty system  that people question with the information that many people get coming from politicians and the media. Both groups which, completely through their own fault, have zero credibility with a lot if the U.S. population. That leaves the non-sheep people wirh very strong and differing opinions on many aspects of the issues.

[Keksie]

2 minutes ago, Ocean Boy said:

Couple that possibly faulty system  that people question with the information that many people get coming from politicians and the media. Both groups which, completely through their own fault, have zero credibility with a lot if the U.S. population. That leaves the non-sheep people wirh very strong and differing opinions on many aspects of the issues.

Especially if you can do math.

[Ocean Boy]

1 minute ago, Keksie said:

Especially if you can do math.

And that does not unclude the way that RCI does math.

[TheMastodon]

13 hours ago, coffeebean said:

I'm in Central Florida in the largest retirement golf cart community in the world. The restaurants in my area still request masking when not seated and, because we are a large population of older folks, most (my guestimation is 95%) people still mask. I'm very thankful for that. Most of us are vaccinated here but we still mask up per the CDC guidelines. All restaurant employees mask up too as per their restaurant policy.

 

Wow, that place is my dream.  I've seen pictures and it looks fantastic!  Good for you!

 

Follow the science?  What if the science is different than what you are being sold?

 

Wearing a mask after vaccination is essentially anti science.  And again, Covid doesn't go away just because you are eating a steak.  Masks in restaurants are 100% cosmetic theatre.   

 

 

 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

8 hours ago, Merion_Mom said:

 

 

 

Can't read. But no big deal. Looks like just a typical FB meme post.

[Tippyton]

11 hours ago, coffeebean said:

The simple answer is it is not known if vaccinated people can transmit the virus to others. Until it has been determined there is no chance vaccinated people can transmit the virus, vaccinated people are requested to mask up to protect others who have not been vaccinated yet.

If one knows anything about science and normal distribution, one would understand the pursuit of zero is a fools errand.  Absolute vacuum?  Only on paper.  Absolute zero?  Only on paper.  100% certainty?  Only on paper. 

 

Do I know for certain?  No, but I'm pretty sure.

 

https://youtu.be/XhphakcHHA4

 

[A&L_Ont]

10 hours ago, harkinmr said:

Biden and Trudeau talked today about the US sending additional AZ doses from our supply to Canada beyond the doses sent last month.  Nothing finalized yet.  I also saw that the EU is passing on 300M AZ and J&J doses.  Any chance of you folks securing any of those?

 

https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/we-hope-to-help-a-little-more-biden-says-he-spoke-to-trudeau-about-more-vaccines-1.5396620

 

 

 

It was said that they won't be shipped until President Biden feels comfortable in releasing them.  

 

From what I read and heard on the news US might send 15-20 million AZ doses to Canada in the 2nd or 3rd quarter. We are already in the 2nd Q so hopefully it is soon.  When they aren't approved for the US for emergency use, hopefully that day is sooner than later.  We could have used them weeks ago if not months.

 

I'm not sure if the EU would allow them to leave unless all EU countries pass on them.  They may even be sent to other EU off shoot nations.  For example France might want theirs to go to the French side of Saint Martin. 

[Goodtime Cruizin]

14 hours ago, coffeebean said:

I will always believe the science over conspiracy theories and unreliable sources.

 

Science? Here's some science for you. Since Texas removed the mask mandate and opened up 100%..... Covid hospitalizations. is down 58%, ICU down 48%. FACT.