CDC gives Celebrity the approval to start in June

[lv2cruisgrl]

47 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

If I reveal my inside source, I'll likely not get any more information.  You'll just need to trust me. 😉

So does your magic ball also have any idea when Odyssey will be released for July or August!??

[C-Dragons]

44 minutes ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

The source of that conversation is the Celebrity SVP of Sales and Trade Support and a CLIA rep. 

I'll second that.

[graphicguy]

1 hour ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

If I reveal my inside source, I'll likely not get any more information.  You'll just need to trust me. 😉

I like it.  Keep bringing it and protect your sources.

[ipeeinthepool]

52 minutes ago, lovrccl said:

So does your magic ball also have any idea when Odyssey will be released for July or August!??

 

Dave&Kathy have the Magic 8-ball, maybe they'll tell us.

[ipeeinthepool]

1 hour ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

The source of that conversation is the Celebrity SVP of Sales and Trade Support and a CLIA rep. 

 

Shhh

[Ken the cruiser]

Robert Kritzman, a partner at Lewis Brisbois with extensive experience in maritime law and, specifically, the cruise industry, thinks Florida's vaccination passport ban as applied to international cruises is unconstitutional.

Commerce Clause

In Kritzman's view, it violates the Commerce Clause, which gives Congress primary authority to regulate interstate and international commerce and limits a state's ability to interfere in such activity.

 

Florida vaccine passport ban for cruises unconstitutional: attorney (seatrade-cruise.com)

 

[ipeeinthepool]

1 hour ago, Jeremiah1212 said:

The source of that conversation is the Celebrity SVP of Sales and Trade Support and a CLIA rep. 

 

Actually the Celebrity SVP was even more certain in her statement this past Thursday.

[ipeeinthepool]

5 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Robert Kritzman, a partner at Lewis Brisbois with extensive experience in maritime law and, specifically, the cruise industry, thinks Florida's vaccination passport ban as applied to international cruises is unconstitutional.

Commerce Clause

In Kritzman's view, it violates the Commerce Clause, which gives Congress primary authority to regulate interstate and international commerce and limits a state's ability to interfere in such activity.

 

Florida vaccine passport ban for cruises unconstitutional: attorney (seatrade-cruise.com)

 

 

There are always lawyers available to argue both sides of an issue.   Some may say that that the vaccine passport limits are within the limits of the state's authority.  Cruise lines are able to sail, they just can't ask about vaccination status.  In fact the cruise lines are sailing in other parts of the world without asking about vaccination status.  Doesn't seem like it's limiting commerce to me.

[Ken the cruiser]

3 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

There are always lawyers available to argue both sides of an issue.   Some may say that that the vaccine passport limits are within the limits of the state's authority.  Cruise lines are able to sail, they just can't ask about vaccination status.  In fact the cruise lines are sailing in other parts of the world without asking about vaccination status.  Doesn't seem like it's limiting commerce to me.

As I posted on another thread, this is the paragraph in the Florida state law that has always caught our eye. Doesn't it give the cruise lines the "overriding" capability to implement screening protocols to verify passengers have been vaccinated to protect public health while onboard their ships as defined in the CDC's CSO Technical Instructions?

 

(1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry upon, or service from the business operations in this state. This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

[ipeeinthepool]

7 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

As I posted on another thread, this is the paragraph in the Florida state law that has always caught our eye. Doesn't it give the cruise lines the "overriding" capability to implement screening protocols to verify passengers have been vaccinated to protect public health while onboard their ships as defined in the CDC's CSO Technical Instructions?

 

(1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry upon, or service from the business operations in this state. This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

 

This works for me.

[MrCoachRentz]

1 hour ago, MarkWiltonM said:

Regardless of what happens in the short-term with the cruise lines vs Governor DeSantis in re the vaccine requirement, I bet in the long-term you are going to see cruise lines building out additional port capacity outside of Florida and perhaps outside of other red states (Texas, for example) in the event other issues become politicized in the future. For Caribbean cruises, the problem is you have to go all the way up to Virginia to reach a blue state. On the other hand, the governments of Georgia and the Carolinas may welcome additional cruise lines sailings at the expense of Florida. Bad for me because I'm three miles from Port Everglades. 

LOL not a chance.  Red states = less oversight and red tape + lower fees.  

[cscurlock]

12 minutes ago, MrCoachRentz said:

LOL not a chance.  Red states = less oversight and red tape + lower fees.  

Georgia would be a really good choice.  The 4th biggest port in the US is in Savanah.  They could easily set up a nice cruise port there and sail to the Caribbean and the state is purple 🙂

[jj39]

Since RCCL already has a presence in Galveston it would be nice to see Celebrity join them with at least one ship

[nocl]

2 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Robert Kritzman, a partner at Lewis Brisbois with extensive experience in maritime law and, specifically, the cruise industry, thinks Florida's vaccination passport ban as applied to international cruises is unconstitutional.

Commerce Clause

In Kritzman's view, it violates the Commerce Clause, which gives Congress primary authority to regulate interstate and international commerce and limits a state's ability to interfere in such activity.

 

Florida vaccine passport ban for cruises unconstitutional: attorney (seatrade-cruise.com)

 

The only problem is that it will take a court to make a ruling to render the law unenforceable.

[ipeeinthepool]

9 minutes ago, nocl said:

The only problem is that it will take a court to make a ruling to render the law unenforceable.

 

Won't be necessary.

[Ken the cruiser]

8 minutes ago, nocl said:

The only problem is that it will take a court to make a ruling to render the law unenforceable.

Of course, we're all hoping the only court case associated with this whole weird ordeal is the "temporary injunction" going on right now and that all of this will become a moot point if @ipeeinthepoolis right and a thumbs up announcement is coming shortly. 😎

[Homosassa]

2 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

As I posted on another thread, this is the paragraph in the Florida state law that has always caught our eye. Doesn't it give the cruise lines the "overriding" capability to implement screening protocols to verify passengers have been vaccinated to protect public health while onboard their ships as defined in the CDC's CSO Technical Instructions?

 

(1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry upon, or service from the business operations in this state. This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

Bingo! You found one of those language loopholes I keep referring to.

 

The same or similar language is found in the Executive Order (section 9) and elsewhere in the Florida law section on Covid 19.

 

In spite of DeSantis' temper tantrum about the CDC, the CDC does have the authority to regulate cruise ships. An example is the Vessel Sanitation Program . In addition, the Public Health Service of which the CDC is part, started back in the 1700's to take care of the health of seamen. 

 

Edited May 29, 2021 by Homosassa

[ipeeinthepool]

35 minutes ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Of course, we're all hoping the only court case associated with this whole weird ordeal is the "temporary injunction" going on right now and that all of this will become a moot point if @ipeeinthepoolis right and a thumbs up announcement is coming shortly. 😎

 

I know there are some Desantis haters out there, but do most of us really care how it happens as long as they give Celebrity a thumbs up to check vaccination status and sail close to 100% vaccinated?

 

They can use whatever loophole they want, just allow Celebrity and other cruise lines to check vaccination status.

[CruiserFromMaine]

3 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry upon, or service from the business operations in this state. This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

I hope this is the way forward but it certainly hasn’t gotten much play yet. That makes me wonder. 

[ipeeinthepool]

30 minutes ago, CruiserFromMaine said:

I hope this is the way forward but it certainly hasn’t gotten much play yet. That makes me wonder. 

 

Maybe all of the reporters aren't doing their job and looking into all of the details.

[riredsox]

4 hours ago, MrCoachRentz said:

LOL not a chance.  Red states = less oversight and red tape + lower fees.  

Ahh but not here in Florida.  The governor is in everybody’s business telling us what is best for us.  I hope the cruise lines pick another state to cruise from.  I don’t mind the drive,  it just adds to the vacation!

[Host Jazzbeau]

12 minutes ago, ipeeinthepool said:

 

Maybe all of the reporters aren't doing their job and looking into all of the details.

That would be a shock!!!  [not]

[Pratique]

5 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

As I posted on another thread, this is the paragraph in the Florida state law that has always caught our eye. Doesn't it give the cruise lines the "overriding" capability to implement screening protocols to verify passengers have been vaccinated to protect public health while onboard their ships as defined in the CDC's CSO Technical Instructions?

 

(1) A business entity, as defined in s. 768.38 to include any business operating in this state, may not require patrons or customers to provide any documentation certifying COVID-19 vaccination or post-infection recovery to gain access to, entry upon, or service from the business operations in this state. This subsection does not otherwise restrict businesses from instituting screening protocols consistent with authoritative or controlling government-issued guidance to protect public health.

The word “otherwise” suggests anything other than proof of vaccination is ok.

[D C]

6 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Robert Kritzman, a partner at Lewis Brisbois with extensive experience in maritime law and, specifically, the cruise industry, thinks Florida's vaccination passport ban as applied to international cruises is unconstitutional.

Commerce Clause

In Kritzman's view, it violates the Commerce Clause, which gives Congress primary authority to regulate interstate and international commerce and limits a state's ability to interfere in such activity.

 

Florida vaccine passport ban for cruises unconstitutional: attorney (seatrade-cruise.com)

 

As with every unconstitutional law on the books it takes a lawsuit and the legal system to put the final nail in the statute's coffin. 

[Ken the cruiser]

45 minutes ago, Pratique said:

The word “otherwise” suggests anything other than proof of vaccination is ok.

So what you're suggesting with regards to paragraph (1) is that, for example, as long as the cruise line just has you sign a legal document stating, in part, that you have been fully vaccinated for at least 2 weeks with an approved COVID vaccine, but without requiring you to show physical proof, the cruise lines should be good to go. 

 

Makes sense. But, in that case I would hope the signed document includes verbiage with regards to who is liable for what if it is later discovered the passenger lied on the signed document about being fully vaccinated.