Dogs on the ship

[Jim Avery]

16 minutes ago, Hobson1754 said:

My concern is how can Viking tell passengers they cannot bring dogs onboard if Karina Hagen travels with hers - no matter how well they behave?

Their ships, their rules.  I just want to see some other rules "for the rest of us" and have them enforced.  I want to know what to expect on future cruises.  

[tobique33040]

I emailed a few days ago when this began! I got a call pretty soon after. I’m guessing that so many people are emailing now ( hopefully) that they want to get to the bottom of the reason the dogs got permission and then address it with a change in policy. I was told that esa were not allowed though, and I told the caller to look on this website and she could see the photos. Following is the email I sent. 
I’m shocked to hear that dogs will be allowed on your cruises. If this is the case, I’ll opt to do land tours from now on. Service dogs are one thing, but the emotional support scam that many people use to get a free trip for their pet, is an insult to those of us who hire petsitters to care for our pets when we travel. And dogs in the restaurant! Someone will get sick and sue the line for allowing animals in an eating area. Please change your policy re “ emotional support “ animals or you will lose a lot more clients than you gain. 

[Azulann]

7 hours ago, uktog said:

I’m glad it looks like it’s getting sorted. I believe the dogs weren’t very happy onboard 

OMG,  I am laughing so hard I cannot finish the rest of my coffee. 

This made my day. Thank you.

[Lady Meer]

What would happen if the dog owner is off-loaded due to illness / emergency?  Where would the dog go? Who would take responsibility for it if the passenger was travelling solo? .  
 

 

 

 

[tobique33040]

I hope everyone who reads this will write to Viking so that Viking knows this won’t go away. 

[LHT28]

talk with your wallet

Once people start cancelling & want their money back   they  will have to do something about  the "pets"  onboard

[Level six]

7 minutes ago, tobique33040 said:

I hope everyone who reads this will write to Viking so that Viking knows this won’t go away. 

And all cruise lines.  If one makes a rule against dogs onboard, others will follow. 

[biggerbearmom]

49 minutes ago, gincolo said:

The French Polynesia cruise on Orion originated in Los Angeles.

Then it would seem that as TayanaLorna pointed out, this is happening on cruises that originate in the U.S.

[Heidi13]

2 hours ago, Travelingwithstyle said:

What email address do you have for Basel?  I emailed three days ago with my concerns since Im on board right now and had complained to the front desk manager about the dogs sitting on the chairs in the World Cafe, etc very early into the cruise.... and nothing had changed.  No one from where I emailed my concerns has reached out. 

 

I too did three months on the World Cruise you were on....never had the pleasure of meeting you.  Followed your wonderful blog once you couldnt get back home.

Funny how you get a reply sitting in Canada with your amazing beautiful big truck and Im currently on the cruise and hear chirp chirp chirp. 👌👍😊

 

My apologies, but I don't share this address, as it was provided to me when we were aboard the Viking Sun on the World Cruise. I respect his position and am careful to limit any requests or issues I forward.

[photopro2]

2 hours ago, Travelingwithstyle said:

complained to the front desk manager about the dogs sitting on the chairs in the World Cafe, etc very early into the cruise.... and nothing had changed. 

I am really sorry that you are having to deal with this and very much appreciate that @florafun and yourself have brought this issue to everyones attention.

 

If I was in your position my next step would be to email the ship (as I recall, the address is in the dailies, or you can get it from guest services) and title the message "For the attention of the General Manager" You could CC the message to the Tellus address too.

 

You don't want to be wasting too much of your time when you're supposed to be enjoying your vacation, and could maybe speed things up by cutting and pasting some of your posts to this board into the message? However by stating the problem in writing in this way, you have a record to show exactly what you brought to the manager's attention and that, apparently, no significant action was taken as a result.

 

It will also be a matter of record as to whether the GM takes the trouble to respond promptly to your email.....or not!

 

Despite all this, I very much hope that you have an otherwise enjoyable cruise.

 

[Heidi13]

24 minutes ago, Lady Meer said:

What would happen if the dog owner is off-loaded due to illness / emergency?  Where would the dog go? Who would take responsibility for it if the passenger was travelling solo? .  

 

Another consideration is what happens in the highly unlikely event of a vessel evacuation. I dealt with this issue daily as a Master, as although we only permitted certified "Guide" dogs on the pax decks, we had numerous pets remaining in cars on the vehicle decks.

 

Personally, as Master I would have done everything possible to save a guide dog and keep them with the blind person, but the pets were unfortunately a different case. The almost 2,000 pax and crew were my primary concerns. If these dogs are truly emotional support dogs, if the ship is evacuated, the pax will have all sorts of emotions, while the dog remains aboard a stricken ship.

 

Further proof that if pax need a pet for emotional support, a cruise is not a suitable holiday choice. 

[Jim Avery]

38 minutes ago, Lady Meer said:

What would happen if the dog owner is off-loaded due to illness / emergency?  Where would the dog go? Who would take responsibility for it if the passenger was travelling solo? .  
 

 

 

 

More likely, where will the dog be left when the pet owner is not allowed to take it ashore.  Likely in most overseas countries.  Of course the dog will be left in the cabin to howl all day.  Hope you don't get one for a neighbor or have to occupy that cabin on the next cruise.

[Vineyard View]

Just sent my second email to tellus. I understand that they may not get back to everyone individually, although I believe that they should,  but Viking needs to respond collectively to this issue in my opinion. They need to respond to those on board who have these dogs and put in place actions immediately. They also need to respond to passengers currently on board to assure them that this is being handled, and in writing to the public how they will manage this moving forward. If they can legally say no one under 18, and I totally agree with this policy btw, they sure as heck should be able to say no pets on board. For oh so many reasons! 
 

[Iloveketo]

Curious… is this being discussed on any other Viking sites?

Also, does anyone think that the emotional support dogs should be allowed?

Just curious… 

 

[Jim Avery]

I know it’s on FB.

[Peregrina651]

11 minutes ago, Vineyard View said:

Viking needs to respond collectively to this issue in my opinion.

 

Viking has a long history of not responding collectively or publicly  to any of these issues. The only way that we will know that our concerns have been heard is when we stop seeing animals aboard the ships -- or when someone complains on social media that they were refused boarding because they failed to inform the cruise line in advance or were told that they could not bring the animal when they did fill out the proper forms.

[Twitchly]

2 hours ago, Haworth said:

On the Viking Mars maiden voyage, Karine Hagen had her 2 very well behaved Labradors, Finse and Charlie with her 

“Look, honey, dogs on Viking! Let’s bring Pookie-Ookums!” 

[Jim Avery]

Just for information, there is a dog friendly ship.  Queen Mary 2 advertises as the only kennels at sea and are probably right.  Best I can tell is Viking only has a "poopie pad" on deck.  Queen Mary 2 has dedicated staff to exercise, clean up after and otherwise take care of your doggie while you have a drink.  Cunard advertises this often.  The catch.......  Dogs are not allowed anywhere other than the kennel deck.  Oh yes, they also pay a passage ticket to be in the kennels.  From what I hear these are heavily used on Transatlantic Crossings.  

[philw1776]

1 hour ago, Level six said:

And all cruise lines.  If one makes a rule against dogs onboard, others will follow. 

Yesterday I posted a link to a page that listed many cruise lines' policies on pets. Every cruise line Except Viking listed along with their policy. All prohibit pets and of course allow legit service animals. The post was blocked by mods. I realized that a page from a perceived rival to CC must be verboten. 
But the bottom line is that viking and it looks like Viking in USA is the outlier. Still no response to Tuesday's tellus. 

Edited March 31, 2023 by philw1776

[chengkp75]

46 minutes ago, Heidi13 said:

Personally, as Master I would have done everything possible to save a guide dog and keep them with the blind person, but the pets were unfortunately a different case. The almost 2,000 pax and crew were my primary concerns. If these dogs are truly emotional support dogs, if the ship is evacuated, the pax will have all sorts of emotions, while the dog remains aboard a stricken ship.

I basically agree with you, Andy.  But, triage would dictate whether or not a service animal made it into a lifeboat (and certainly not a raft), as my duty as On Scene Commander would be, as you say, to the humans first, and then only if there is aa whole lot of room would I allow a dog in the boat.  The amount of frightened energy in a lifeboat from over a hundred non-mariners would send even the best trained service animal into a frenzy, and in an enclosed boat, that is not a good place to have a panicked dog.

[chengkp75]

3 minutes ago, philw1776 said:

But the bottom line is that viking and it looks like Viking in USA is the outlier. Still no response to Tuesday's tellus.

If you think that Viking is the outlier with regards to having "pets" onboard masquerading as service animals, you haven't read any of the other forums here on CC, as I have responded to threads about dogs in strollers, zebra striped poodles, and the like, on every single major (and some minor) cruise line forum.  It is an industry wide problem (with cruises from the US), and stems from poor training of employees in the limits of the ADA. 

[donaldsc]

I come back to my standard emotional support response.  Can I bring my large emotional support snake?  What about an emotional support rat - people do keep them as pets.  Also at one time I believe that they also allowed emotional support miniature horses on airplanes.  Or are dogs the only animals that are allowed to be emotional support species?

 

DON 

Edited March 31, 2023 by donaldsc

[Sunflower & The Scientist]

For anyone interested....here is the email I have sent to tellus. 

 

 

To: Viking Cruise Line

 

As a previous owner of a service dog, I would like to express my concerns over the recent problems occurring on Viking cruises with respect to dogs that are not essential service dogs.

 

My daughter who has now passed away relied on a service dog for her safety. I was the dog’s handler, as she was unable to physically care for the dog that served her. I am requesting you consider the following facts regarding service dogs and dogs that are people’s pets that are being brought on board falsely  claiming to be assistance-type dogs.

 

Individuals who have service dogs receive extensive training and are required to demonstrate proper care and handling of the service dog. We are responsible for handling the dogs in accordance with protocols given to us by trained professionals.

 

Service dogs are working dogs. There are increasing issues with non-service dogs interfering with service dogs carrying out their duties. I have personally experienced “emotional support” dogs barking and lunging at my service dog. In the US, some states are putting laws in place to protect service dogs.

 

Here are a few facts about service dogs that distinguish them from pets being used as “emotional support” dogs.

 

*Service dogs would never be left unattended in a room. They remain with the person they serve.

 

*Service dogs are not allowed to eat table food, scraps off the floor, or eat under or at the table where humans are eating.

 

*Service dogs are not allowed to approach people. Their attention is given solely to the one they are serving.

 

*Service dogs do not bark or disturb others.

 

*Service dogs are never allowed to sit on furniture.

 

There are a number of concerns for dogs who are on board a cruise ship, who are not legitimate essential service dogs. Although service dogs could encounter some of these same issues, owners of service dogs are far more aware of these issues and have training in what to do in various circumstances.

 

*If the dog was not allowed to leave the ship in the port, they would have to remain alone in their room if their owner left the ship. This could be cause for concern.

 

*Leaving the ship on the gangway or getting on to a tender boat is not something individuals with service dogs should do without special training. There are surfaces and gaps in surfaces intended for humans that could pose a danger to a dog.

 

*What would happen to a dog if its owner was removed from the ship to seek medical treatment? The dog would not be allowed in a medical setting. Does Viking then assume responsibility for the animal?

 

*In the event of evacuation from the ship, what would happen to the animal? Would the owner be willing to leave their dog on board while they were evacuated, or would the animal occupy a space that should be reserved for human life?

 

*Dogs, like humans, suffer from motion sickness. Humans can take medication to help with motion sickness. A dog would not have that option, and if it did, it would be incapacitated and rendered helpless. Animals, unlike humans, vomit where they are rather than using proper means of disposing of vomit.

 

*Service dogs typically carry proof of vaccinations, although not legally necessary in some places. It would be possible for a dog to board a ship and pass illness in the common feces and urine relief area. Dogs, unlike humans, when ill, are not able to make it to a relief area and relieve themselves where they are. There have been issues noted on Viking with dogs stepping in their feces and tracking it across the deck. It is not uncommon for a dog to feel ill and have diarrhea, especially when traveling. How does Viking deal with properly cleaning this in staterooms and common areas when this happens?  Gastroenteritis is a common and highly contagious illness that spreads quickly from saliva, vomit, and feces, in dogs.  

 

*Viking provides medical care for humans who are ill or injured. What would happen in the event a dog is injured or becomes ill?

 

There is no question that an individual who requires a service dog for safety reasons, such as those with visual impairments, should be allowed to bring their dog on a cruise. That is not the question. As I have stated, service dog owners have specialized training to deal with issues that arise.

 

Viking has created an atmosphere on their ships that is different from other cruise ships. Not having casinos and children onboard provides an atmosphere that is attractive to a large population. Now we are dealing with ill-behaved pets that individuals are allowed to bring onboard.

 

 I respectfully ask Viking to reconsider allowing dogs, other than legitimate essential service dogs required for an individual’s safety, to be onboard Viking ships.

 

 

[tobique33040]

31 minutes ago, Sunflower & The Scientist said:

For anyone interested....here is the email I have sent to tellus. 

 

 

To: Viking Cruise Line

 

As a previous owner of a service dog, I would like to express my concerns over the recent problems occurring on Viking cruises with respect to dogs that are not essential service dogs.

 

My daughter who has now passed away relied on a service dog for her safety. I was the dog’s handler, as she was unable to physically care for the dog that served her. I am requesting you consider the following facts regarding service dogs and dogs that are people’s pets that are being brought on board falsely  claiming to be assistance-type dogs.

 

Individuals who have service dogs receive extensive training and are required to demonstrate proper care and handling of the service dog. We are responsible for handling the dogs in accordance with protocols given to us by trained professionals.

 

Service dogs are working dogs. There are increasing issues with non-service dogs interfering with service dogs carrying out their duties. I have personally experienced “emotional support” dogs barking and lunging at my service dog. In the US, some states are putting laws in place to protect service dogs.

 

Here are a few facts about service dogs that distinguish them from pets being used as “emotional support” dogs.

 

*Service dogs would never be left unattended in a room. They remain with the person they serve.

 

*Service dogs are not allowed to eat table food, scraps off the floor, or eat under or at the table where humans are eating.

 

*Service dogs are not allowed to approach people. Their attention is given solely to the one they are serving.

 

*Service dogs do not bark or disturb others.

 

*Service dogs are never allowed to sit on furniture.

 

There are a number of concerns for dogs who are on board a cruise ship, who are not legitimate essential service dogs. Although service dogs could encounter some of these same issues, owners of service dogs are far more aware of these issues and have training in what to do in various circumstances.

 

*If the dog was not allowed to leave the ship in the port, they would have to remain alone in their room if their owner left the ship. This could be cause for concern.

 

*Leaving the ship on the gangway or getting on to a tender boat is not something individuals with service dogs should do without special training. There are surfaces and gaps in surfaces intended for humans that could pose a danger to a dog.

 

*What would happen to a dog if its owner was removed from the ship to seek medical treatment? The dog would not be allowed in a medical setting. Does Viking then assume responsibility for the animal?

 

*In the event of evacuation from the ship, what would happen to the animal? Would the owner be willing to leave their dog on board while they were evacuated, or would the animal occupy a space that should be reserved for human life?

 

*Dogs, like humans, suffer from motion sickness. Humans can take medication to help with motion sickness. A dog would not have that option, and if it did, it would be incapacitated and rendered helpless. Animals, unlike humans, vomit where they are rather than using proper means of disposing of vomit.

 

*Service dogs typically carry proof of vaccinations, although not legally necessary in some places. It would be possible for a dog to board a ship and pass illness in the common feces and urine relief area. Dogs, unlike humans, when ill, are not able to make it to a relief area and relieve themselves where they are. There have been issues noted on Viking with dogs stepping in their feces and tracking it across the deck. It is not uncommon for a dog to feel ill and have diarrhea, especially when traveling. How does Viking deal with properly cleaning this in staterooms and common areas when this happens?  Gastroenteritis is a common and highly contagious illness that spreads quickly from saliva, vomit, and feces, in dogs.  

 

*Viking provides medical care for humans who are ill or injured. What would happen in the event a dog is injured or becomes ill?

 

There is no question that an individual who requires a service dog for safety reasons, such as those with visual impairments, should be allowed to bring their dog on a cruise. That is not the question. As I have stated, service dog owners have specialized training to deal with issues that arise.

 

Viking has created an atmosphere on their ships that is different from other cruise ships. Not having casinos and children onboard provides an atmosphere that is attractive to a large population. Now we are dealing with ill-behaved pets that individuals are allowed to bring onboard.

 

 I respectfully ask Viking to reconsider allowing dogs, other than legitimate essential service dogs required for an individual’s safety, to be onboard Viking ships.

 

 

Wow! Hopefully that will get Vikings attention. Really excellently presented. 🙏 thank you. 

[longterm]

On 3/28/2023 at 2:46 PM, florafun said:

I just saw 2 of the dogs in the last hour. These are the smallest dogs, the other two are a bit larger.

Emotional support or regular service dogs.....I have no idea.

 

 

Emotional support my a**.

 

This is really irritating. 

Some people are so inconsiderate; anyone who owns a dog or a cat (we have both) knows that they almost always plant themselves on the bed. That we allow it at home is one thing--but we wouldn't think of bringing one of our pets to someone's home without permission, much less a cruise ship.

I wrote a letter to Viking; it'll be a pleasant surprise if I get a response.