Is there any penalty for pier runners?

[Thrak]

As far as penalties go... Imagine being the husband or the wife who is responsible for missing the ship. Yes, sometimes it might be a mutual thing but other times it will be one or the other who caused the issue either by drinking too much or shopping too long or something of that sort. I shudder to think of the "penalty" that would be suffered by the responsible party. 💀

[Shmoo here]

1 hour ago, rkacruiser said:

I have wondered when this situation happens and the "stranded" guests lack their passport, what "hoops" must then be gone through to get them to wherever they need to go.  Does the cruise line's Port Agent in that port have any responsibility to assist these people?

If you leave your passport in the safe on a ship, the ship's security will enter your room, open the safe, look for passports and other ID papers, to be handed over to the Port Agent.  I don't think the Port Agent is a cruise ship crew member, they are assigned to the port.

[rkacruiser]

2 minutes ago, Shmoo here said:

I don't think the Port Agent is a cruise ship crew member, they are assigned to the port.

 

Yes, the Port Agent is a contracted agent of the cruise line.  

 

Are they under any obligation to help these wayward cruise guests to get to wherever they need to go?

[Shmoo here]

3 minutes ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Yes, the Port Agent is a contracted agent of the cruise line.  

 

Are they under any obligation to help these wayward cruise guests to get to wherever they need to go?

I found Chengkp75 (our resident authority on ship stuff) answered this question a number of years ago.  I can't post a direct link to the post, but here's what he said:

 

Yes, port agents are neither cruise line employees or port officials or employees. Their company provides similar services to many shipping companies and many ships, and are third party service agencies. Their contract with the shipping company makes them the lines' representative, and gives them the legal right to make decisions and represent the line in the local port.

 

There are usually "husbanding" charges, which are a fixed amount, to handle the customs and immigration paperwork, port entry fees, tugs and pilots, mail, etc. Other services are "a la carte". It would depend on the wording of the specific contract with an agency as to what is covered regarding medically disembarked passengers. I have not seen the references to payments being required, and without knowing the details, it may be that the passengers were requesting something that would be expected in the US, but that is extraordinary in the country in question, so that would be an extra charge. I'm not a maritime lawyer, so I don't know the exact liability of the cruise line under international law to the passenger when off the ship. I know they will deal with crew completely, handling hospital, room and board, and travel, but crew are company employees and covered by different laws with respect to both their care and immigration status.

[rkacruiser]

4 minutes ago, Shmoo here said:

I found Chengkp75 (our resident authority on ship stuff) answered this question a number of years ago.  I can't post a direct link to the post, but here's what he said:

 

Yes, port agents are neither cruise line employees or port officials or employees. Their company provides similar services to many shipping companies and many ships, and are third party service agencies. Their contract with the shipping company makes them the lines' representative, and gives them the legal right to make decisions and represent the line in the local port.

 

There are usually "husbanding" charges, which are a fixed amount, to handle the customs and immigration paperwork, port entry fees, tugs and pilots, mail, etc. Other services are "a la carte". It would depend on the wording of the specific contract with an agency as to what is covered regarding medically disembarked passengers. I have not seen the references to payments being required, and without knowing the details, it may be that the passengers were requesting something that would be expected in the US, but that is extraordinary in the country in question, so that would be an extra charge. I'm not a maritime lawyer, so I don't know the exact liability of the cruise line under international law to the passenger when off the ship. I know they will deal with crew completely, handling hospital, room and board, and travel, but crew are company employees and covered by different laws with respect to both their care and immigration status.

 

Thanks for that information!  I would interpret that to say that the guests are "on their own" when they are stranded.  

[dkjretired]

There was a woman a couple of years back who was running late to get back to the ship so she called them to tell them to wait. They didn’t wait so she sued Celebrity, never heard the outcome.

[Heidi13]

2 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

I have wondered when this situation happens and the "stranded" guests lack their passport, what "hoops" must then be gone through to get them to wherever they need to go.  Does the cruise line's Port Agent in that port have any responsibility to assist these people?

Where pax miss the ship, the staff will endeavour to conduct a cursory cabin search for passports, which if found are provided to the Ship's Agent.

 

Although not obligated, the Ship's Agent may assist with making arrangements for transportation to the next port, etc. However, all costs are responsibility of the pax missing the ship.

Edited March 1, 2019 by Heidi13

[rkacruiser]

8 minutes ago, Heidi13 said:

Although not obligated, the Ship's Agent may assist with making arrangements for transportation to the next port, etc. 

 

Thanks!  The key words there are "may assist".  I surely would not want to be ever asking someone who does not speak my language in such a situation:  "Will you help me?" 

[Hlitner]

13 minutes ago, dkjretired said:

There was a woman a couple of years back who was running late to get back to the ship so she called them to tell them to wait. They didn’t wait so she sued Celebrity, never heard the outcome.

The suit was likely "tossed" for lack of legal merit.  And one would hope that the cruise line (and other cruise lines) simply added the lady to their "do not cruise" list.  

[Shmoo here]

13 minutes ago, Heidi13 said:

Where pax miss the ship, the staff will endeavour to conduct a cursory cabin search for passports, which if found are provided to the Ship's Agent.

 

Although not obligated, the Ship's Agent may assist with making arrangements for transportation to the next port, etc. However, all costs are responsibility of the pax missing the ship.

Thanks, Heidi13 (another of our resident authorities).

[GUT2407]

38 minutes ago, dkjretired said:

There was a woman a couple of years back who was running late to get back to the ship so she called them to tell them to wait. They didn’t wait so she sued Celebrity, never heard the outcome.

I think I can guess. Hope the attorney didn’t take it on on a contingency fee.

[SantaFeFan]

1 hour ago, Shmoo here said:

Thanks, Heidi13 (another of our resident authorities).

 

There is a poster who trolls passport threads who will reject the expert information generously provided by these resident authorities. He is just a passenger, so of course he knows better than those experts, and will always fervidly discredit the search-the-safe-for-passport process as "not guaranteed".  

 

I have observed this process while watching departure proceedings from my balcony. People were late. Passports were transferred. I can only deduce that the process works as promised. 

Edited March 1, 2019 by SantaFeFan

[Lucky TGO]

1 hour ago, rkacruiser said:

 

Thanks for that information!  I would interpret that to say that the guests are "on their own" when they are stranded.  

 

1 hour ago, Shmoo here said:

I found Chengkp75 (our resident authority on ship stuff) answered this question a number of years ago.  I can't post a direct link to the post, but here's what he said:

 

Yes, port agents are neither cruise line employees or port officials or employees. Their company provides similar services to many shipping companies and many ships, and are third party service agencies. Their contract with the shipping company makes them the lines' representative, and gives them the legal right to make decisions and represent the line in the local port.

 

There are usually "husbanding" charges, which are a fixed amount, to handle the customs and immigration paperwork, port entry fees, tugs and pilots, mail, etc. Other services are "a la carte". It would depend on the wording of the specific contract with an agency as to what is covered regarding medically disembarked passengers. I have not seen the references to payments being required, and without knowing the details, it may be that the passengers were requesting something that would be expected in the US, but that is extraordinary in the country in question, so that would be an extra charge. I'm not a maritime lawyer, so I don't know the exact liability of the cruise line under international law to the passenger when off the ship. I know they will deal with crew completely, handling hospital, room and board, and travel, but crew are company employees and covered by different laws with respect to both their care and immigration status.

I just like to tell everyone about the worst port agent!!  My wife got sick on the Emerald Princess and we had to get off the ship in Grenada to go to the hospital. This guy had our  passports and would not even take them to the hospital a ten  minute walk from the port. I walked back to port from the hospital and he gave me my luggage and  passports

and  wouldn’t even drive me back to hospital. He told me he didn’t want to put my luggage in his car. It was a nightmare. I told Princess about him. They said we are so sorry. He doesn’t work for princess  and there was nothing they could do. 

I like to say the people at the Hospital and the shuttled driver Ronnie were Great and sooooo nice to me and my wife.

Tony

 

 

[AL3XCruise]

A penalty would be applied to either recoup an expense or deter a behavior.  Unless the cruise line engages in an expensive search or delays the ship, I would think the cost to them would be negligible.  I also feel like the expense, inconvenience, and lost vacation time would be a sufficient motivator to most people.  

 

I'm sure there are scenarios where we'd all be sympathetic to the late arrivals and situations where we'd all be happy to see them getting what they deserved.  

 

38 minutes ago, SantaFeFan said:

here is a poster who trolls passport threads who will reject the expert information generously provided by these resident authorities. He is just a passenger, so of course he knows better than those experts, and will always fervidly discredit the search-the-safe-for-passport process as "not guaranteed".  

 

Not sure who, but I found a recent thread about ship damage quite entertaining.  Not only was the expert refuted, but so were pictures, videos, and eyewitness accounts of the damage.  I also think they may have had an issue with a dictionary at one point...

[donaldsc]

14 hours ago, Pickels said:

THAT'S WHY IT'S A BETTER CHOICE TO SELECT AN EXCURSION FROM THE CRUISE LINE.  THEY WILL ALWAYS GET YOU BACK TO THE SHIP ON TIME.  OF COURSE, SHXT HAPPENS BUT, YOU HAVE A BETTER CHANCE GETTING BACK WITH THE CRUISE SPONCERED EXCURSION.  AS FOR GETTING BACK; IT'S YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO GET TO THE NEXT PORT, FLIGHT, SMALL BOAT, SWIM!

 

Are you YELLING to try to convince us that your horrible advice is correct and not horrible?

 

DON

Edited March 1, 2019 by donaldsc

[PTMary]

5 hours ago, SantaFeFan said:

 

There is a poster who trolls passport threads who will reject the expert information generously provided by these resident authorities. He is just a passenger, so of course he knows better than those experts, and will always fervidly discredit the search-the-safe-for-passport process as "not guaranteed".  

 

I have observed this process while watching departure proceedings from my balcony. People were late. Passports were transferred. I can only deduce that the process works as promised. 

 

5 hours ago, AL3XCruise said:

Not sure who, but I found a recent thread about ship damage quite entertaining.  Not only was the expert refuted, but so were pictures, videos, and eyewitness accounts of the damage.  I also think they may have had an issue with a dictionary at one point...

 

I think I know who that poster is. He responded to this thread earlier on with a similar "no guarantee" warning about the ship not waiting for one of their excursions if it was running late. He seems to have a profound distrust in people, and always expects the worst scenario in every situation. On EVERY passport thread, if someone recommends leaving passports in the safe, he ends up predicting that the ship's staff won't look for them like they promise. 🙄

Edited March 1, 2019 by PTMary

[Pickels]

7 hours ago, donaldsc said:

 

Are you YELLING to try to convince us that your horrible advice is correct and not horrible?

 

DON

No, no, absolutely not yelling---another poster said that font was easy to read, I forgot CAPS indicates yelling, me bad! Sorry!

[Pickels]

21 hours ago, CruiserBruce said:

 Posting in all caps is considered yelling, and is against Cruise Critic rules.

 

I think if you really dig into the situations involved, you would find almost none of the people who missed their ship are on private excursions. Private tour vendors risk everything if they make you late for your ship. Rather they are on their own. May have alcohol involved.

 

And, no, cruise line excursions will not always get you back on time. They can be late as well, and the ship will make every effort to wait. But they aren't "always" on time.

I will never do that again ☹️

[SRF]

13 hours ago, Shmoo here said:

If you leave your passport in the safe on a ship, the ship's security MAY enter your room, open the safe, look for passports and other ID papers, to be handed over to the Port Agent.  I don't think the Port Agent is a cruise ship crew member, they are assigned to the port.

 

FTFY.

 

It is not guaranteed.

 

Port agent is contracted by the cruise line, but does not work for the cruise line.

[SRF]

6 hours ago, PTMary said:

 

 

I think I know who that poster is. He responded to this thread earlier on with a similar "no guarantee" warning about the ship not waiting for one of their excursions if it was running late. He seems to have a profound distrust in people, and always expects the worst scenario in every situation. On EVERY passport thread, if someone recommends leaving passports in the safe, he ends up predicting that the ship's staff won't look for them like they promise. 🙄

 

So will you back up your guarantee with a personal guarantee to pay the costs if the passports are not retrieved by the officers and given to the port agent?

 

No?

 

I thought so.

 

And about the ship not waiting, there are threads here about ship's excursions being late and the ship not waiting.  But the cruise line WILL cover costs and arrangements to get those passengers back on the ship as soon as possible.

 

There are times when the ship just cannot wait.  

[SRF]

15 hours ago, rkacruiser said:

I have wondered when this situation happens and the "stranded" guests lack their passport, what "hoops" must then be gone through to get them to wherever they need to go.  Does the cruise line's Port Agent in that port have any responsibility to assist these people?

 

The port agents will assist.  There is a thread on CC about a person who got stranded, IIRC, mainly due to miscommunications.

 

The port agent assisted them in getting a hotel room, and getting around to get a replacement passport.  However, they will not pay for anything.

 

My experience with a port agent (my mother had a medical issue and my dad and I got off with her, was superb.  He waited with me for a taxi, when one did not show up, he drove me to the hospital.  He did not just drop me off, he parked, went in with me, and stayed until I hooked up with my dad.  And made sure I had hotel arrangements and then gave me his cell number if I needed any other assistance.

[SantaFeFan]

2 hours ago, SRF said:

 

FTFY.

 

It is not guaranteed.

 

Port agent is contracted by the cruise line, but does not work for the cruise line.

 

And right on cue, here is that poster.

 

And, this time he has even copied another person's post and doctored it by changing the word "will" to "MAY" to support his argument. Isn't it unethical to quote a comment by another person and change the words to make it mean something they did not actually say? 🙄

Edited March 1, 2019 by SantaFeFan

[Heidi13]

16 hours ago, AL3XCruise said:

Unless the cruise line engages in an expensive search or delays the ship, I would think the cost to them would be negligible.  

While a search at sea causes delays and significant costs, depending on the circumstances, even short delays departing a berth will incur extra expenses, which at times can be of several thousands of dollars.

 

Shore based line handlers, pilots and where required tugs are hired based on the schedule. In some ports, delayed departure may incur overtime rates and also higher fuel costs from the higher speed required. The overtime costs vary by local contract. I recall many occasions where the Captain held the ship alongside, while we waited for a specific time to send lines ashore. Sending lines ashore 1 min early would have incurred significant costs. Have also seen the same at departure, where we released lines and remained alongside completing pre-departue tasks.

[Kmkub]

Pier runners are great entertainment for the rest of us who managed to get back in time. We once saw a couple, who were clearly not in shape, doing their best to make the long run down the pier. They kept having to stop and bend over, panting, to catch their breath, all while listening to the crew yell, "hurry up! you are out of time!"

 

Good times.

 

 

[Essiesmom]

What are they looking at?

 

A VERY lucky couple who arrived back after they had pulled in the gangway:

 

 

Grenada Nov. 2010