Cruise Lines Should Reimburse You 100%, Not To Cruise

[gerryuk]

It seems to me that any cruise passenger who has viruses like influenza should be able to contact the cruise line, even if its on the day of boarding, and cancel their cruise, and the cruise line should reimburse them their total ticket cost, no questions asked.

Is it not better for the cruise lines in the short term to loose money on a few empty cabins, than have viruses spread because many passengers will not cancel their cruises due to the huge financial implications of doing so, no matter what they are going to bring and spread on board? Also all cruise passengers must and be able to prove that they have travel insurance when buying their tickets so that they are insured for things like flights etc, so they have even more incentive to cancel.

Now you can say that this is unfair on the cruise lines, and it is, but at the moment we are living in dangerous times, and all bets are off. How much will it cost the cruise line if one of their ships is quarantined?

Loosing thousands of pounds / dollars does not give anyone the incentive to cancel their travel plans if they are ill, getting their money back will.

Cruise lines in major ports in America and Europe should adopt a turn up and go wait list. So many cruises out of these ports are always sold out. If you can turn up on cruise day with all relevant travel documents and the cruise you are interested in, has cabins available due to last minute cancellations, you should be able purchase the cabin, there and then. If you are the only turn up and goer for that particular cruise, the cruise line should tell you how much the cabin cost the person who cancelled, then you should be allowed to make a reasonable offer to purchase said cabin, its then down to the cruise line to accept your offer and make some money back, or decline and make a loss on that cabin. If there are more turn up and goers than cabins available, then the cruise lines should auction off the cabin with sealed bids, then and there, who knows the cruise line could actually make more money for that cabin, than they originally sold it for. Just a thought.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Flatbush Flyer]

14 minutes ago, gerryuk said:

It seems to me that any cruise passenger who has viruses like influenza should be able to contact the cruise line, even if its on the day of boarding, and cancel their cruise, and the cruise line should reimburse them their total ticket cost, no questions asked.

Is it not better for the cruise lines in the short term to loose money on a few empty cabins, than have viruses spread because many passengers will not cancel their cruises due to the huge financial implications of doing so, no matter what they are going to bring and spread on board? Also all cruise passengers must and be able to prove that they have travel insurance when buying their tickets so that they are insured for things like flights etc, so they have even more incentive to cancel.

Now you can say that this is unfair on the cruise lines, and it is, but at the moment we are living in dangerous times, and all bets are off. How much will it cost the cruise line if one of their ships is quarantined?

Loosing thousands of pounds / dollars does not give anyone the incentive to cancel their travel plans if they are ill, getting their money back will.

Cruise lines in major ports in America and Europe should adopt a turn up and go wait list. So many cruises out of these ports are always sold out. If you can turn up on cruise day with all relevant travel documents and the cruise you are interested in, has cabins available due to last minute cancellations, you should be able purchase the cabin, there and then. If you are the only turn up and goer for that particular cruise, the cruise line should tell you how much the cabin cost the person who cancelled, then you should be allowed to make a reasonable offer to purchase said cabin, its then down to the cruise line to accept your offer and make some money back, or decline and make a loss on that cabin. If there are more turn up and goers than cabins available, then the cruise lines should auction off the cabin with sealed bids, then and there, who knows the cruise line could actually make more money for that cabin, than they originally sold it for. Just a thought.

Glad it's only "a thought."

[Roger88]

If you have flue and you are extremely ill WHY would you even consider going on board in the first place? This is being selfish. I am sure that when you buy the ticket you can purchase an additional insurance to avoid such instances. And then they will reimburse (refund) you 100%. Just saying 

[Markanddonna]

This might be a great idea in a world of honest, nice, and law abiding people. The cruise lines now have to worry about terrorism, sexual predators, and contagious passengers.

[Joebucks]

For every "great idea" some customer has, a business has 10 proven reasons why it's not a good idea. What you're advocating basically nullifies travel insurance, early saver rates, current pricing model, etc.

 

For as noble as this sounds, there are many other people who will still go on their cruise with a virus, because they don't want to miss out.

[gerryuk]

1 hour ago, Roger88 said:

If you have flue and you are extremely ill WHY would you even consider going on board in the first place? This is being selfish. 

Totally agree, but in the real word of me ,me, me, it doesn't work like that.

 

1 hour ago, Markanddonna said:

This might be a great idea in a world of honest, nice, and law abiding people. 

Totally agree, but we don't live in a ideal world, we never have.

 

30 minutes ago, Joebucks said:

For as noble as this sounds, there are many other people who will still go on their cruise with a virus, because they don't want to miss out.

That's my whole point, they are missing out and its the financial implications they will miss the most. For many people going on a cruise, it takes months if not years to save up the money, just to purchase the ticket. If they have a virus just before the cruise starts they are not going to cancel and loose thousands of dollars by being good, proper citizens, human nature is going to kick in, whether we like it or not.  However if they can cancel and get their money back, they are most likely to do that and rebook at a later stage when they are better. 

[mjkacmom]

I’m sure the professionals have crunched the numbers and are making policies that make financial sense. Travel insurance is what people need to purchase if they are worried about getting ill and needing to cancel. In this time of post 9/11, folks can’t just show up at the pier. If you don’t want to LOSE your money, buy insurance. We do.

[compozer]

That is why I purchase insurance the day I book.

[gerryuk]

26 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

Travel insurance is what people need to purchase if they are worried about getting ill and needing to cancel. 

Totally agree, however for many people travel insurance is a cost to much. I keep reading on these boards that if you can afford to cruise, you can afford this, that and the other. But in the real world it doesn't work like that. For many young families buying a cruise ticket is a hardship, but they will save and go without for months just to get their dream holiday. Travel insurance, medical insurance and the like wont come into it for many of them, whether we like it or not. As they get older, wiser and have more disposable income, then insurance will become part of their plans.

 

34 minutes ago, mjkacmom said:

In this time of post 9/11, folks can’t just show up at the pier. 

Why not?, I can turn up and buy a ticket for immediate travel at any train station, I am sure I can turn up at JFK or Heathrow and buy a immediate airline ticket to Las Palmas, Gran Canaria, or New Delhi, if there are seats available. Why should it be any different with the cruise industry? 

[leaveitallbehind]

I think one potential pitfall would be that it would open up a door for those - and you read of many of them on these boards - who have a late change in plans with a traveling partner, or legitimate illness, other issue that would force a change in travel plans, who don't have insurance who would claim to be sick so as to avoid the cancellation charges.

Edited February 24, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[Cruiser_1977]

@gerryuk To your first point in post #9. Part of the savings for the vacation should include the cost of travel insurance. When pricing out the cost of a cruise folks shouldn't simply take the cost of the fare. The total cost is travel to/from embarkation/debarkation, hotel if needed, parking, in-transit food, tips and insurance. If one is scraping by to afford just the fare...there will be issues.

 

To your second point, airlines have the infrastructure in place (No Fly lists, CPB/TSA/Homeland onsite, etc.) to screen last minute travelers. I can't speak for train travel.

Edited February 24, 2020 by JennyB1977

[mjkacmom]

14 minutes ago, gerryuk said:

Totally agree, however for many people travel insurance is a cost to much. I keep reading on these boards that if you can afford to cruise, you can afford this, that and the other. But in the real world it doesn't work like that. For many young families buying a cruise ticket is a hardship, but they will save and go without for months just to get their dream holiday. Travel insurance, medical insurance and the like wont come into it for many of them, whether we like it or not. As they get older, wiser and have more disposable income, then insurance will become part of their plans.

 

Why not?, I can turn up and buy a ticket for immediate travel at any train station, I am sure I can turn up at JFK or Heathrow and buy a immediate airline ticket to Las Palmas, Gran Canaria, or New Delhi, if there are seats available. Why should it be any different with the cruise industry? 

We have 5 kids, the cost for insurance was under $300, our cruises are usually close to $7000, all in. If I knew that I’d get a full refund just by showing up to urgent care and claim I had a stomach bug, I wouldn’t bother with insurance. You can’t show up to a port the day of and get on a cruise.

 

ETA, if folks can’t afford the insurance, they certainly can’t afford a medical situation on the trip, where your health insurance won’t be accepted. Even if you have travel insurance you will most likely have to pay OOP initially.

Edited February 24, 2020 by mjkacmom

[BlueRiband]

1 hour ago, gerryuk said:

... For many people going on a cruise, it takes months if not years to save up the money, just to purchase the ticket....

If money is so tight that it all goes to the cruise ticket with nothing left for travel insurance or emergencies then those people are not in a financial position to travel or should take a less extravagant vacation.  How would they deal with getting sick after they boarded and need to be disembarked and repatriated back home?  Do you advocate a prorated cruise fare refund and free flight tickets as "incentive" to leave the ship? 

 

As for maintaining wait lists: Cruise ships are not airlines.  Airlines can offer standby tickets because travel time is measured in hours rather than days or weeks.  The last minute passenger pool for a cruise line is limited to those without regular jobs and don't need visas. 

 

What you propose would put cruise lines out of business or cause them to massively raise fares to recover their losses.

Edited February 24, 2020 by BlueRiband

[Donald]

3 hours ago, gerryuk said:

It seems to me that any cruise passenger who has viruses like influenza should be able to contact the cruise line, even if its on the day of boarding, and cancel their cruise, and the cruise line should reimburse them their total ticket cost, no questions asked.

Is it not better for the cruise lines in the short term to loose money on a few empty cabins, than have viruses spread because many passengers will not cancel their cruises due to the huge financial implications of doing so, no matter what they are going to bring and spread on board? Also all cruise passengers must and be able to prove that they have travel insurance when buying their tickets so that they are insured for things like flights etc, so they have even more incentive to cancel.

Now you can say that this is unfair on the cruise lines, and it is, but at the moment we are living in dangerous times, and all bets are off. How much will it cost the cruise line if one of their ships is quarantined?

Loosing thousands of pounds / dollars does not give anyone the incentive to cancel their travel plans if they are ill, getting their money back will.

Cruise lines in major ports in America and Europe should adopt a turn up and go wait list. So many cruises out of these ports are always sold out. If you can turn up on cruise day with all relevant travel documents and the cruise you are interested in, has cabins available due to last minute cancellations, you should be able purchase the cabin, there and then. If you are the only turn up and goer for that particular cruise, the cruise line should tell you how much the cabin cost the person who cancelled, then you should be allowed to make a reasonable offer to purchase said cabin, its then down to the cruise line to accept your offer and make some money back, or decline and make a loss on that cabin. If there are more turn up and goers than cabins available, then the cruise lines should auction off the cabin with sealed bids, then and there, who knows the cruise line could actually make more money for that cabin, than they originally sold it for. Just a thought.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Gerry,

Don't quit your day job just yet.

Your budding career as cruise line consultant may not work out as planned.

 

In most countries, cruise lines are not allowed to add passengers the day of sailing. Immigration and Police authorities require advance booking reports in order to vett all passengers.

 

If a family or passenger cannot afford travel insurance, they also cannot afford to spend the budgeted daily revenue onboard. In that case, the cruise line really does not want them anyway. Mass market cruise lines make zero profit selling cruises. They only make profit from passengers who can afford to spend money onboard their ships.

The people who previously booked cruises at the pier on the day of sailing were bargain hunters who would not spend any money on board. The cruise lines do not want these people.

 

Most cruise passengers have the attention span of a gnat. A quarantined cruise ship is quickly forgotten and fully booked in no time. Three months after the sinking of Costa Concordia, Costa's business was better than ever.

 

Cruise lines do not have the staffing or facilities to sell cruises. They much prefer to have the travel agents do the legwork. The commission they pay is far less costly than hiring many more sales employees.

 

[John Bull]

A worthy thought, OP.

But I'm afraid a naive one, cos the world doesn't work like that.

 

It means we can all skip travel insurance (and cancellation is the most expensive part of travel insurance) and if we want / need to cancel for any reason we can simply claim to have a sniffle.

One of the (in the UK un-insurable) reasons why a cruiser might want to cancel is the risk of being exposed to the virus,  another is the greatly-increased risk of missed ports, yet another is the risk of being quarantined. But of course they're not going to be the reason they're going to give, are they?

 

A big part of the answer lies in the number of folk who cancel before final-balance day. A figure that we don't know and the industry is unlikely to tell us. But I'll wager it'll be a massive number. And that'll be repeated in the percentage of passengers past final-payment day who''d cancel now if it were penalty-free. 

 

JB  

[leaveitallbehind]

2 hours ago, gerryuk said:

That's my whole point, they are missing out and its the financial implications they will miss the most. For many people going on a cruise, it takes months if not years to save up the money, just to purchase the ticket. If they have a virus just before the cruise starts they are not going to cancel and loose thousands of dollars by being good, proper citizens, human nature is going to kick in, whether we like it or not.  However if they can cancel and get their money back, they are most likely to do that and rebook at a later stage when they are better. 

 

Why not?, I can turn up and buy a ticket for immediate travel at any train station, I am sure I can turn up at JFK or Heathrow and buy a immediate airline ticket to Las Palmas, Gran Canaria, or New Delhi, if there are seats available. Why should it be any different with the cruise industry? 

 

 

To your first comment, the simple solution is travel insurance.  That is one of the primary purposes for which it exists.  And also as others have suggested, this should be part of the initial budget planning in purchasing a cruise IMO.

 

To your second point, cruises are not like other forms of one way or destination travel.  As others have mentioned, US Department of Immigration requires a final manifest typically 24 hours (possibly more) prior to sailing to be submitted for review.  Much of this is post 911 and as a result the scenario your suggest would not be possible.

Edited February 24, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[evandbob]

1 hour ago, mjkacmom said:

I’m sure the professionals have crunched the numbers and are making policies that make financial sense. Travel insurance is what people need to purchase if they are worried about getting ill and needing to cancel. In this time of post 9/11, folks can’t just show up at the pier. If you don’t want to LOSE your money, buy insurance. We do.

 

 

This Feb 7 I booked a week long cruise on line and boarded the ship on Feb 8.  ( about 20 hours after I booked.)  Not quite trying to book at the cruiseport, but close enough.

 

We purchase an annual travel policy that covers medical, evac, cancellations, etc. since we travel often.  At this moment I am more concerned about the flu and noro than the coronavirus, and take precautions and preventative measures to hopefully thwart infection.  One of the immunizations we needed to do a few months ago was for typhus, since we are spending 2 weeks in Egypt soon with 4 days cruising the Nile.

[RocketMan275]

4 hours ago, gerryuk said:

It seems to me that any cruise passenger who has viruses like influenza should be able to contact the cruise line, even if its on the day of boarding, and cancel their cruise, and the cruise line should reimburse them their total ticket cost, no questions asked.

In effect,  you're proposing the cruise offer, at no charge, cancellation insurance for any reason.

4 hours ago, gerryuk said:

Is it not better for the cruise lines in the short term to loose money on a few empty cabins, than have viruses spread because many passengers will not cancel their cruises due to the huge financial implications of doing so, no matter what they are going to bring and spread on board? Also all cruise passengers must and be able to prove that they have travel insurance when buying their tickets so that they are insured for things like flights etc, so they have even more incentive to cancel.

I suppose  you'd support incorporating the cost of insurance into all cruise line fares?   How would that affect those young families saving for the cruise? 

4 hours ago, gerryuk said:

Cruise lines in major ports in America and Europe should adopt a turn up and go wait list. So many cruises out of these ports are always sold out. If you can turn up on cruise day with all relevant travel documents and the cruise you are interested in, has cabins available due to last minute cancellations, you should be able purchase the cabin, there and then. If you are the only turn up and goer for that particular cruise, the cruise line should tell you how much the cabin cost the person who cancelled, then you should be allowed to make a reasonable offer to purchase said cabin, its then down to the cruise line to accept your offer and make some money back, or decline and make a loss on that cabin. If there are more turn up and goers than cabins available, then the cruise lines should auction off the cabin with sealed bids, then and there, who knows the cruise line could actually make more money for that cabin, than they originally sold it for. Just a thought.

You do realize that would take hours to accomplish?  Do you want to spend hours sitting in the terminal waiting for those sealed bids?

[gerryuk]

I don't get this argument that nobody can purchase a cruise ticket and board on the day of sailing. Surely the facilities, other than the money transactions are available at most, if not all major ports in the USA / Europe?

All major ports have immigration and police officers on duty 24 hours a day, Will they care if people are buying their tickets for immediate travel, as long as they have the correct travel documents and are not intending to brake any laws. To be blunt is it any of their business when customers purchase their tickets?

As for the cruise lines themselves, at many ports if you miss the ship after a day doing your own excursion, cant you fly off to the next port and board the ship there after going through immigration? So technically speaking, it already happens.

 

 

 

 

 

[leaveitallbehind]

17 minutes ago, gerryuk said:

I don't get this argument that nobody can purchase a cruise ticket and board on the day of sailing. Surely the facilities, other than the money transactions are available at most, if not all major ports in the USA / Europe?

All major ports have immigration and police officers on duty 24 hours a day, Will they care if people are buying their tickets for immediate travel, as long as they have the correct travel documents and are not intending to brake any laws. To be blunt is it any of their business when customers purchase their tickets?

As for the cruise lines themselves, at many ports if you miss the ship after a day doing your own excursion, cant you fly off to the next port and board the ship there after going through immigration? So technically speaking, it already happens.

 

 

 

 

 

Whether you get it or not, the fact remains that in the US (at least) final manifests are submitted 24 hours or more by regulation for their review and confirmation and "walk on's" are not possible.  It has nothing to do with them caring about when you purchase a ticket.

 

And with your example the final manifest would have already been submitted and you have already been on the ship in transit, so flying to the next port is fine.

Edited February 24, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[Joebucks]

2 hours ago, gerryuk said:

That's my whole point, they are missing out and its the financial implications they will miss the most. For many people going on a cruise, it takes months if not years to save up the money, just to purchase the ticket. If they have a virus just before the cruise starts they are not going to cancel and loose thousands of dollars by being good, proper citizens, human nature is going to kick in, whether we like it or not.  However if they can cancel and get their money back, they are most likely to do that and rebook at a later stage when they are better. 

 

I think that's a big assumption that it's the financial implications they will miss the most. The money has already left. To the average person, they waited a long time for this. They took time off of work. They were excited. Then comes a bug that they think isn't that serious (and very likely may not be). Not going on that cruise is not always going to be their ideal option.

[leaveitallbehind]

The thing I fail to to see with this entire conversation is that travel insurance would make this entire point moot.  The cruise lines recommend including it, travel agents recommend including it, and most travelers recommend including it. It should be considered as part of the cost in your travel budget. For a nominal fee (that can be included directly in the cruise cost) insurance coverage that would reimburse all of the costs in the example of this thread can be added.  Want to avoid cancellation charges?  Buy travelers insurance!

Edited February 24, 2020 by leaveitallbehind

[sanger727]

5 hours ago, gerryuk said:

It seems to me that any cruise passenger who has viruses like influenza should be able to contact the cruise line, even if its on the day of boarding, and cancel their cruise, and the cruise line should reimburse them their total ticket cost, no questions asked.

 

 Also all cruise passengers must and be able to prove that they have travel insurance when buying their tickets so that they are insured for things like flights etc, so they have even more incentive to cancel.

 

 

 

I'm confused by these arguments. If you think that all passengers must purchase and be able to prove that they have travel insurance that protects against cancellations; then why should the cruise line reimburse their ticket when the travel insurance will?

 

Of course the first idea that the cruise line should allow a passenger to cancel their cruise on the day of, no questions asked would never be financially feasible. Anyone who for any reason didn't feel like taking the cruise could claim they were sick and get a full refund if "no questions asked".

[gerryuk]

16 minutes ago, leaveitallbehind said:

Whether you get it or not, the fact remains that in the US (at least) final manifests are submitted 24 hours or more by regulation for their review and confirmation and "walk on's" are not possible.  It has nothing to do with them caring about when you purchase a ticket.

 

And with your example the final manifest would have already been submitted and you have already been on the ship in transit, so flying to the next port is fine.

I get it, from the US viewpoint at least. Before you're Homeland Security came into force, could Americans turn up and purchase tickets at the port on the day of the ships departure, or was there similar rules then, as well?

I don't see why people travelling by cruise ships are not treated the same as those travelling by air. In this day and age with so many millions of people travelling, all these checks are automatically done by computer, when you upload your passport number. No doubt a red flag will be raised by the computer if you are known to the authorities. Due to the numbers involved,  there can be very little human involvement outside the Airports and Cruise Terminals in checking passports, so all travellers should be treated the same.

[BlueRiband]

18 minutes ago, gerryuk said:

...

I don't see why people travelling by cruise ships are not treated the same as those travelling by air. In this day and age with so many millions of people travelling, all these checks are automatically done by computer, when you upload your passport number...

Cruise lines don't determine this.  It's decided for them by their country's immigration authorities.