Schengen Visa Question

[pobox1067]

I have been all over the Internet and cannot find an answer to this specific situation.  We are booked on a cruise that hits several Schengen countries but also visits non-Schengen countries in between, including Israel, Morocco, Turkey. The cruise starts in Italy and ends in the United States.  I have a U.S. passport.  As a U.S. citizen, am I required to obtain a multiple entry Schengen Visa?  Interestingly, in the past we were on a cruise from the U.S. to London that involved stopping in Morocco sandwiched in between two Schengen countries.  They cancelled the Morocco stop but I don't remember any of this coming up at that time?

 

Thank you.

[sanger727]

I’ve never heard of a situation where US citizens need visas to enter the Schengen area. What causes you to think you do? This website (no idea if it’s validity) indicates that the newest rules include an ETIAS authorization but that’s not until late this year.

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/us-citizens/

 

 

[LHT28]

The ETIAS   has been in the works for several years   looks like Nov 2023 is when it comes into effect

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/1-4-billion-people-will-have-to-apply-for-an-etias-authorization-before-travelling-to-eu-from-november-2023/

 

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/etias/who-needs-etias/

[ilikeanswers]

If you are travelling after November the ETIAS will be valid for three years and you can enter as often as you like for a 90 day period in a 180 day block. So unless your cruise is over 90 days you really should have nothing to worry about. 

Understanding the ETIAS Validity Period and Expiry Date

[pobox1067]

4 hours ago, pobox1067 said:

 

Sanger, as I said, this involves leaving a Schengen country, going to a non-Schengen country, and then returning to a Schengen country.  As your own reference states:

 

• "On the other hand, US residents coming from countries that have not established a visa-free regime with the EU will have to apply for a Schengen visa in the US, in order to be able to enter any of these countries."

Also, the info sent from the cruise company states, "A multiple entry visa will be required if a non-Schengen country is visited in between visits to Schengen countries. (Example: depart from Italy, visit Turkey, arrive in Spain)."  My situation exactly.

 

This will be a deal-breaker for us.  But I just can't believe that thousands of other people on the ship are going to do this.  And I go back to my example where we were all set to go to from Spain to Morocco back to Spain last year and none of this came up.

 

BTW, this is an entirely separate issue from the ETIAS authorization, which is not a big problem for me.  The multiple entry visa, on the other hand, involves a fee of $90 X 2, providing bank statements, submitting passport photos, and obtaining insurance, apparently over and above what the cruise line provides.

Edited February 9, 2023 by pobox1067

[mom says]

I've never heard of that situation for anyone who holds a passport from any of the current visa exempt countries.  Ships have been sailing between Italy and Turkey for years and a visa has never been required on the return to Italy ( for pax with US or similarly exempt passports). What cruise line is requiring this? 

 

ETA. OP I just read the link you referred to. I think what that section was  preferring to were US residents (not US citizens) whose country of origin is not amongst the visa exempt countries - THEY need a visa. Regular US citizens, with a valid US passport would not.

Edited February 9, 2023 by mom says

[ilikeanswers]

1 hour ago, pobox1067 said:

Sanger, as I said, this involves leaving a Schengen country, going to a non-Schengen country, and then returning to a Schengen country.  As your own reference states:

 

• "On the other hand, US residents coming from countries that have not established a visa-free regime with the EU will have to apply for a Schengen visa in the US, in order to be able to enter any of these countries."

Also, the info sent from the cruise company states, "A multiple entry visa will be required if a non-Schengen country is visited in between visits to Schengen countries. (Example: depart from Italy, visit Turkey, arrive in Spain)."  My situation exactly.

 

This will be a deal-breaker for us.  But I just can't believe that thousands of other people on the ship are going to do this.  And I go back to my example where we were all set to go to from Spain to Morocco back to Spain last year and none of this came up.

 

BTW, this is an entirely separate issue from the ETIAS authorization, which is not a big problem for me.  The multiple entry visa, on the other hand, involves a fee of $90 X 2, providing bank statements, submitting passport photos, and obtaining insurance, apparently over and above what the cruise line provides.

I feel there maybe some misinterpretation going on because that is simply not right. This is from the EU affiliate Europa site:

Who must apply for a visa

No mention of having to apply for a multi entry visa because you are travelling between Schengen and non Schengen countries

 

And from USA State Department:

US Travellers in Europe

Which again makes no mention of such a requirement. 

 

Anecdotally I have travelled between Schengen and non Schengen countries (via land though not ship) and was never asked for a visa. I just got my passport stamped in and out. And people I know who have cruised the Mediterranean has never said they had to apply for a Schengen Visa. 

Edited February 9, 2023 by ilikeanswers

[hallasm]

For citizens who do not need a Schengen Visa, there are no additional requirements if the cruise departs and re-arrives in a Schengen country - as an American citizen, there is no requirement for a Schengen visa - only a valid passport .

For citizens who need a Schengen Visa, a multi-entry visa is necessary.  
As previously mentioned, the situation will change when ETIAS comes into force in November 2023.

[ontheweb]

19 minutes ago, hallasm said:

For citizens who do not need a Schengen Visa, there are no additional requirements if the cruise departs and re-arrives in a Schengen country - as an American citizen, there is no requirement for a Schengen visa - only a valid passport .

For citizens who need a Schengen Visa, a multi-entry visa is necessary.  
As previously mentioned, the situation will change when ETIAS comes into force in November 2023.

That should read IF the ETIAS comes into force in November 2023. They keep putting the effective date off. We have a cruise that includes both Schengen countries and non-Schengen countries prior to November, and was worried about this until the last time they moved the effective date.

[John Bull]

28 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

That should read IF the ETIAS comes into force in November 2023. They keep putting the effective date off. We have a cruise that includes both Schengen countries and non-Schengen countries prior to November, and was worried about this until the last time they moved the effective date.

 

Yes, it keeps being postponed - I think that's for technical reasons rather than political decisions.

But for citizens of the US and other qualifying countries there's no need to be concerned about it when it does come - the process will be inexpensive and quick & easy on-line, except for those with a murky past who might be refused. 

Not a lot different to the United States ESTA, required for citizens of qualifying countries like the UK & most of Europe.

 

No worries

 

JB 🙂

 

 

[ontheweb]

13 minutes ago, John Bull said:

 

Yes, it keeps being postponed - I think that's for technical reasons rather than political decisions.

But for citizens of the US and other qualifying countries there's no need to be concerned about it when it does come - the process will be inexpensive and quick & easy on-line, except for those with a murky past who might be refused. 

Not a lot different to the United States ESTA, required for citizens of qualifying countries like the UK & most of Europe.

 

No worries

 

JB 🙂

 

 

When before the last postponement I thought this would apply to us, I had the following conversation with our TA.

 

I asked about it, and he said no worries this would be like Australia, and it would be taken care of by the airline before flying. I then pointed out we were flying into the UK, not a Schengen country before the cruise went to some in that zone. He then said he would have to research it. And soon afte, they postponed again making it moot.

[John Bull]

8 hours ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Who must apply for a visa

No mention of having to apply for a multi entry visa because you are travelling between Schengen and non Schengen countries

 

And from USA State Department:

US Travellers in Europe

Which again makes no mention of such a requirement. 

 

Anecdotally I have travelled between Schengen and non Schengen countries (via land though not ship) and was never asked for a visa. I just got my passport stamped in and out. And people I know who have cruised the Mediterranean has never said they had to apply for a Schengen Visa. 

 

 

Just to clarify.....

Assuming you are an Aussie citizen you don't need a Schengen visa, ditto those cruisers you've talked to. Same for citizens of most countries, including UK  & USA. For those folk, only a passport needed to enter from a non-Schengen country or return to a Schengen country - in due course an ETIAS will be needed  but even a passport is usually not needed for travel between Schengen countries - the border between Schengen counties is usually just a "Welcome to xxxx."  sign.

 

But those who DO need a Schengen visa will most definitely need a multi-entry visa if they leave the Schengen area and want to return.

There have been instances of cruise passengers in the Baltic who held only a single-entry visa having to disembark at the Schengen port before St Petersburg & make their own way to the Schengen port after St Petersburg in order to comply with their single-entry visa.

 

JB 🙂

 

Edited February 9, 2023 by John Bull

[John Bull]

8 minutes ago, ontheweb said:

When before the last postponement I thought this would apply to us, I had the following conversation with our TA.

 

I asked about it, and he said no worries this would be like Australia, and it would be taken care of by the airline before flying. I then pointed out we were flying into the UK, not a Schengen country before the cruise went to some in that zone. He then said he would have to research it. And soon afte, they postponed again making it moot.

 

Airlines (& cruiselines) don't take care of ESTAs & I'm 99.9% sure it'll be the same with  ETIAs.

It makes no difference whether you enter Schengen from the US or the UK, it's your nationality which matters.

No doubt that TA will be up to speed when eventually an ETIA is required.😏

 

JB 🙂

[sanger727]

11 hours ago, pobox1067 said:

Sanger, as I said, this involves leaving a Schengen country, going to a non-Schengen country, and then returning to a Schengen country.  As your own reference states:

 

• "On the other hand, US residents coming from countries that have not established a visa-free regime with the EU will have to apply for a Schengen visa in the US, in order to be able to enter any of these countries."

 

 

This is for US residents who are citizens of countries that have no established visa-free regime with the EU. Not US citizens traveling in from a non-schengen country.

[Zach1213]

16 hours ago, sanger727 said:

I’ve never heard of a situation where US citizens need visas to enter the Schengen area

 

 

While tourism or business do not require Schengen visas for short term travel, there are times when US citizens do need visas. Work visas still come from individual countries (i.e. a German work visa, not an EU/Schengen work visa) and are required by US citizens with plans of working (not just doing business travel) in the Schengen zone. I believe long-term student visas also come from the individual countries. Obviously neither of these apply to OP, but there are still cases where Americans (and other visa-exempt countries) do still need visas. 

[ilikeanswers]

11 hours ago, ontheweb said:

I asked about it, and he said no worries this would be like Australia, and it would be taken care of by the airline before flying. 

 

Being Australian I obviously never applied for our visa waiver but I have never experienced an airline that has filled out any entry requirements into a country before. Which airline was this? Are you sure you didn't misunderstand and it was the travel agent who did this for you? 

[ontheweb]

18 minutes ago, ilikeanswers said:

 

Being Australian I obviously never applied for our visa waiver but I have never experienced an airline that has filled out any entry requirements into a country before. Which airline was this? Are you sure you didn't misunderstand and it was the travel agent who did this for you? 

Could be. maybe he meant he took care of it with the airline and that set it up for the rest of the trip.

[gnome12]

ETIAS has been delayed again until 2024 (no specific date mentioned).

[txjim09]

Another link that explains the process for US citizens pretty clearly

https://etias.com/etias-requirements/etias-for-american-citizens

[njhorseman]

28 minutes ago, txjim09 said:

Another link that explains the process for US citizens pretty clearly

https://etias.com/etias-requirements/etias-for-american-citizens

This isn't an official EU or US government site and you shouldn't assume it's a valid source of information .

[pdmlynek]

On 2/8/2023 at 10:55 PM, pobox1067 said:

Sanger, as I said, this involves leaving a Schengen country, going to a non-Schengen country, and then returning to a Schengen country.  As your own reference states:

 

• "On the other hand, US residents coming from countries that have not established a visa-free regime with the EU will have to apply for a Schengen visa in the US, in order to be able to enter any of these countries."

Also, the info sent from the cruise company states, "A multiple entry visa will be required if a non-Schengen country is visited in between visits to Schengen countries. (Example: depart from Italy, visit Turkey, arrive in Spain)."  My situation exactly.

 

This will be a deal-breaker for us.  But I just can't believe that thousands of other people on the ship are going to do this.  And I go back to my example where we were all set to go to from Spain to Morocco back to Spain last year and none of this came up.

 

BTW, this is an entirely separate issue from the ETIAS authorization, which is not a big problem for me.  The multiple entry visa, on the other hand, involves a fee of $90 X 2, providing bank statements, submitting passport photos, and obtaining insurance, apparently over and above what the cruise line provides.

What passport are you traveling under that you are having such a problem?

[pobox1067]

11 hours ago, pdmlynek said:

What passport are you traveling under that you are having such a problem?

USA

[txjim09]

18 hours ago, njhorseman said:

This isn't an official EU or US government site and you shouldn't assume it's a valid source of information .

Does it contradict any official information?

[njhorseman]

Just now, txjim09 said:

Does it contradict any official information?

 

I don't waste my time reading the details of websites like this.

 

Similar to many other unofficial sites purporting to provide passport or visa information it was probably created in anticipation of becoming a visa "service" that would "assist" you in applying for the ETIAS when it is implemented for a fee that is far greater than you would pay when applying directly through the official ETIAS website. 

 

There are certainly legitimate visa and passport services, but not for documents similar to ETIAS, which typically have simple applications and nominal fees. Applications for ETIAS and similar should only be made on the official government websites created for that purpose.

[txjim09]

If you did not read the info, why do you feel compelled to strongly imply that I posted false information?